I always find the whole 'vendor' thing so interesting.
I have no doubts that these guys are making money. But what 'makes' a vendor?
It is such a stretch for my mind to charge money for something if the market is truly an ATM to withdraw cash at anytime?
Is it EGO?
Is it wanting to do things the hard way?
Love of money?
What causes a person or group of people who supposedly can pull out thousands of dollars DAILY from the market to then go through the trouble of writing an e-book and starting a chat room/forum?
I have heard:
"Trading can be lonely"
"I love helping people and unless I charge them then they won't appreciate it"
"I don't want to lose my edge by opening it up to everyone"
"Not enough liquidity on the product" (forex isn't an issue)
I realize this should be its own thread, but in the back of my mind I am always wondering why guru's do the things they do.....
To this day I have not met one Vendor who will show a financial statement. Let's see.... Reasons...
"My ex-wife will sue me for more money"
"IRS will get me..."
"If you don't believe me then you will never be a successful trader"
"I don't need to and Jesus Christ knows what I do..."
If they do have an edge (which I am not saying they do not!) then why would you exploit it with 'users' and not just throw some serious cash behind the system for a year or so and then walk away and do something that will truly help people?
Teaching middle class Americans to trade is hardly in my opinion a charitable effort although most will argue. I guess because I can't understand it then I will never be a successful 'VENDOR/GURU'?
This system sounds smart, but not any better than any of the thousands of other systems. I think it comes down to a nice voice on the other side of the chat room (an actual teacher) and the confidence one gets from 'hanging' out with the rest of the bunch instead of trading alone. I know I have lost thousands in chat rooms because of those two magical combinations and my 'hope' and 'wishing' to create more wealth from as little effort as possible! haha...
The following 3 users say Thank You to bluemele for this post:
I understand where you're coming from but if I had a system that's consistantly profitable I would print a book,sell the system and open a trading room for a charge... Here's why. My system is now bringing nearly double the income, one from trading the other from sales and the room.
Regarding losing the edge making it public, I'll depend on human nature to cause them to change the paramenters etc or move on when they have a few losing trades. There's is one thing that I'll do different. If my system no longer works I'll inform the room, return the current month fee and still leave the book for sale but add the note it no longer works.
An honest reputation means everything.
The following 3 users say Thank You to ideaman for this post:
ideaman has the right idea, man. No matter what you trade and how you trade you are always going to lose money. If you are a vendor of some sort you will have some (pocket change in my case) additional money that you won't lose. So, if you have a bad day, week or month you should have some kind of income to fall back on. Also if a vendor wants to take a few days off and can't trade, he/she might still generate some income. I'm not sure about a trading room. If that vendor is losing money then the room is also losing and he will lose people and some of that guaranteed income. Likewise taking time off would be hard unless there was a fill in.
The following user says Thank You to eDanny for this post:
Well, thanks. I do understand 'income' but I guess I am a purist in the sense and always have been.
Or maybe living off of < than 10K per month is normal for myself, so the concept of needing so much more 'additional' income is confusing if you can pull 10K per day out of a market somewhat consistently.
Something you all said really sparked my interest though as with the strategy I currently do goes through very tough patches, but overall profitable, but it is the tough patches where I tend to 'change' my trading style and then the market comes back and voila I am even more perplexed. haha...
I think the big thing for me would be to teach as it always makes you a better trader to give others the information as you learn so much in the process.
A perfect example would be the now famous 'Turtle Traders". Each traders were taught the exact method with same rules. Yet each trader yielded different results.
I've personally witnessed exactly the same thing.
Adding to that: I think the zero sum game mentality of hording one's ideas for fear of rendering them useless over-rated for these very reasons.
I sincerely doubt the successful traders that have shared setups on BIG MIKE are losing sleep over it.
I'm certain some that purchased this setup will succeed with flying colors, while others will fail.
Humans, unlike computers are complex with different personalities that affect trading performance.
I think its no accident that the most successful Turtle was a young kid with a computer programming background.
He just followed the rules to a letter and won. (Harder said then done of course.)
The following user says Thank You to Turtrend for this post:
Like you said, everyone is different, however, why would one not just trade others money instead of the headaches involved with students? I do like teaching, so there is a bit of that, and of course the EGO feed, so I guess I answered my own questions, but why would you not just be a successful CTA and make duckets that way?
I guess this is good for me, because it is enlightening me to see how others think. It still seems confusing, but that is due to my background and experiences.