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Is School of Trade legitimate? (www.schooloftrade.com)
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Is School of Trade legitimate? (www.schooloftrade.com)

  #11 (permalink)
Elite Member
USA
 
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The only point I wish to make is I do not care if I see bad information on the web about trading room. Trading is about people and our way to see market.
What I care about is how room is operated, can moderator follow rules, can I can see what he/she is trading and how and where they are going into and out of the trade. The most important to me is how much risk they would take on any trade and if I can take the same risk with my account size. If my account is not big enough to trade the same set ups, or take the same risk I would not continue with the room.
I took 30 days of free time in the room. I traded just about every trade moderator took in the room and I could not make it work for me.
I think moderator was doing OK job in educationg people in the room but I do not think he could follow his own rules and I did not like it.
After my 30 days I was offered very high one time price that I did not feel I could recover any time soon.

I would recomnd to you to review some posts at BMF I think was written by Jaguar. He made some great points about how to evaluate room/sIn fact I used points from his post to evaluate SOT room.
I hope this would help

TickVix/Gregory
.

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  #12 (permalink)
 Vendor: www.traderwerks.com 
Taipei Taiwan
 
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PiCoTrader View Post

Only a Newbie trader would expect the Time/Sell to display the 4 contract order used by JJ.
Come on Lloyd, you should know that orders are sent to the broker 'Mirus' and Mirus order book is sent to the market then Zenfire gets the market data back to our time/Sell window.
No individual is connected to the CBOT.

Not to be off topic, but all orders at some point are reflected on the T&S. You may have a consolidated feed, but all trades are there.

And there are individuals directly connected to the CME ( By the way, the CBOT was bought by the CME )

Let's not go around calling others newbies with out cause. We were all newbies at some point.

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  #13 (permalink)
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After watching and listening to JJ for some time it is clear that something is not quite right. I watched him trade the ES one day as he was trying to make 4 ticks. He was in the trade for several minutes. When the Market finally reached his target it filled his target on the first touch. All sorts of red lights went off when I saw that. There is no way an order is going to be filled on the first touch- not on the ES. While the Market does not have to go through an order to be filled it does have to trade at it for some time in order to get filled if it doesn't go through it.
I found his daily recaps suspect as well. What he says he is doing and what the Market did and the way he demonstrates it on his charts are inconsistent. He says that, "the Market puts in a swing low and then we wait for it to break below that low." Where he says he got in is inconsistent with what he just said. His order is not below the low but on the bounce off of it. He gets in before it breaks below the low. The problem is people are waiting for the Market to trade below the low to get in. When JJ says he got in, people hear that and try to get in also. Where they get in is a tick or two above the low. It trades one tick below the low and then bounces back up. JJ made his money and counts it as a winning trade while others lost money and are left wondering what happened and what they did wrong. The fact is, JJ didn't do what he said he was doing. He said he was waiting for it to break below the low and then got in before it breaks the low. If people managed to get in on that one tick below the low they lost as well. But JJ counts it as a winning trade. Later when it actually does break the low during the Daily Recap JJ glosses over the whole interplay of the bounces that the Market takes. With his marker draws the low and repeats the same verbiage, "the Market puts in a swing low and then we wait for it to break below that low" as he draws where the Market actually does break below the low insinuating that's what he did and where he took the trade- which it is not. A person would never know what actually happened unless they could compare what happened in the room and at what point he actually took the trade and then compared that with what he says on his Daily Recap. What he says he did (wait for it to break...) and what he actually did (got in on the bounce off the low) are very inconsistent and suspect.

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  #14 (permalink)
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Hi Aragorn,

I've been following SOT for over a year and never saw JJ trade the ES so you probably caught an old video.

All the entries that are not PASS the break is probably caused by the "Trap Entry" available to members only.

It is very difficult for JJ to post a video and not talk about it.
It is also confusing to viewers on YouTube because he teaches where his ideal entries are and sometimes he gets a better fill.
I myself could never get the same fill, so I suspect he has better reflex and more experiences with HIS system. The point is to learn and become a trader with OUR edge....not shadow trade him.

Just remember that JJ is always looking for a reason NOT to enter a trade. He knows damn well that patterns may not always work on his time frame. and this "retenue" is confusing many.

I used to teach for many years myself and I wouldn't do much better teaching in a Live market.
This is way harder than EOD "end of day" teaching you would get at any seminar sold for thousands of bucks.

We got everything here at bigmiketrading.com to develop OUR skill, OUR edge but SchoolOfTrade.com has something unique also.

If anybody has any doubt or any question about SOT......why not simply email him at JJ@schooloftrade.com
or wait for SOT members like me to post some comment and facts.

Hope it helps!

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  #15 (permalink)
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Futures Edge on FIO
PICO

Did u take part in the trading session of 5 November. I saw jj's video on his blog that sounds too good to be true. could u gimme your insights. how does it work for u. Do u need many months of simtradign to be successful. how do u know if jj trades on a live acct?




PiCoTrader View Post
Hi Aragorn,

I've been following SOT for over a year and never saw JJ trade the ES so you probably caught an old video.

All the entries that are not PASS the break is probably caused by the "Trap Entry" available to members only.

It is very difficult for JJ to post a video and not talk about it.
It is also confusing to viewers on YouTube because he teaches where his ideal entries are and sometimes he gets a better fill.
I myself could never get the same fill, so I suspect he has better reflex and more experiences with HIS system. The point is to learn and become a trader with OUR edge....not shadow trade him.

Just remember that JJ is always looking for a reason NOT to enter a trade. He knows damn well that patterns may not always work on his time frame. and this "retenue" is confusing many.

I used to teach for many years myself and I wouldn't do much better teaching in a Live market.
This is way harder than EOD "end of day" teaching you would get at any seminar sold for thousands of bucks.

We got everything here at bigmiketrading.com to develop OUR skill, OUR edge but SchoolOfTrade.com has something unique also.

If anybody has any doubt or any question about SOT......why not simply email him at JJ@schooloftrade.com
or wait for SOT members like me to post some comment and facts.

Hope it helps!


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  #16 (permalink)
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the mystical trap entry and the superior skill of the master.....

hmmmm.....

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  #17 (permalink)
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london uk
 
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nqcruiser View Post
PICO

Did u take part in the trading session of 5 November. I saw jj's video on his blog that sounds too good to be true. could u gimme your insights. how does it work for u. Do u need many months of simtradign to be successful. how do u know if jj trades on a live acct?

nqcruiser, this is from the terms and conditions from SOT website:

Trading Signals
... Note that the alerts discussed in the Signal Performance record are for hypothetical use only and may or may not have been actually traded, they are for educational use only.

... The chat room is for online educational purposes only. It is not to be misunderstood as a trading room. Such as a room giving signals for trading real money. We request that our students follow our trades using a simulator as we do when we recognize trading opportunities. Please do not misunderstand our services. We are here to educate students using actual real-time charts and simulated trades.

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  #18 (permalink)
Trading Apprentice
Montreal
 
Futures Experience: Advanced
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Broker/Data: CannonTrading /
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PiCoTrader's Avatar
 
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nqcruiser View Post
PICO

Did u take part in the trading session of 5 November. I saw jj's video on his blog that sounds too good to be true. could u gimme your insights. how does it work for u. Do u need many months of simtradign to be successful. how do u know if jj trades on a live acct?


Hi NQCruiser,

You got good questions here so I guess you are serious about your trading and that's good.

Did u take part in the trading session of 5 November? NO, I didn't log in the SOT room at all last week.
I sometimes log in during the pre-market to see JJ's insight for the day ahead but after a year of hearing non stop talking...I just can't
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I watched the 11-05-2010 video from the blog and don't see what is too good to be true earning 320 ticks on 4 contract trades. I know many people earning over 500 ticks daily and I made myself 101 ticks on 1 contract scalps this Friday. I only traded the Russell2000.

could u gimme your insights. how does it work for u?
I used JJ's teaching but trusting our-self with somebody else method and real money is very hard.
I used JJ's personal mentoring to improve my trust, and time had to do its work. Joe is always available to help you out.
"I am studying the market reaction AND my reaction to the market" every day from 6am to 6pm
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I developed my own method....my edge...as would say BigMike....because I never could trade JJ's way using the time/sell windows and I always feel that the Breaker setup is coming from too far to succeed..... even when it does succeed.
I'm getting better at trading my hedge every day so it goes pretty well since I'm constantly improving.

Do u need many months of simtrading to be successful? Joe watch 4 commodities and a newbie can only focus on a single one. Let's say you're watching Crude, Joe could have been trading 2 CL trades and you missed both trades as it happens too fast.
He would be drawing trend lines on Gold then suddenly he's in a Crude trade he called before...always alert he says.
He could take his next trades on Gold before finishing the day but you are on Crude.
You thought you could shadow trade him watching CL....not much chance to follow him!

Better learn his technique and apply it yourself because you won't get more chances at shadow trading him the next day either and that's what JJ wants you to do....do your own trade.

It takes so long just to trust yourself that YES it takes many months to be successful. Even many years!

I subscribed to SOT because JJ was saying during Christmas 2009 “Lets start making money today” or “membership could pay for itself within 3 weeks”. I thought, with my stock trading experience, that I could shadow trade him but I was wrong!
Future was new to me and SOT taught me all I know about the Future market, so it was really worth it anyways!

how do u know if jj trades on a live acct? We don't! As we don't know from any vendor!
To me, its not of importance as it is not putting cash in MY trading account.
His teaching is great so I don't see why he would fake it....but I may still be a naive newbie.

Assumption of being profitable quickly was sadly not fulfilled but.....
I see value in his teaching, his trade room, his proprietary indicators. All at a price I could afford.


Hope it helps!

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  #19 (permalink)
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PiCoTrader View Post
....but I may still be a naive newbie.

I'm curious, who would you learn from on how to trade:

A. An individual lecturer with several academic credentials, but NEVER traded in his/her life or couldn't trade if his/her life depended on it.

B. A silver tongue slick sales man that knows how the market functions but DOESN'T know how to trade it live for a REAL profit...and only POSTS bogus profits.

C. neither A or B

"Faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen." --- "Therefore, I Believe it and I will see it. And every day and in every way, I am healthier, wealthier, and wiser."
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  #20 (permalink)
Trading Apprentice
Manchester
 
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SOT & Pico Trader


Pico Trader,

You question my video regarding time & sales, since making that video SOT have updated their own terms & conditions to confirm exactly what my video was trying to establish, whether JJ traded in SIM or not and if he was lying to us when he maintained he traded a live account in his trade room! An extract from these terms was posted by tellytub on November 7th 2010.

I since made a further video containing an example of how JJ hides his losing trades. This is the major element of his scam nowadays since he has stopped pretending to trade a live account. JJ's publicised profit results are complete fabrication and if they included all his losses the results would not be profits like he pretends.

You say you are a SOT member since 2010 so you joined just after me in December 2009. I see your refer to the trap entry in one of your posts which means you must have taken a full advanced course membership like me (approx $3600) right?. You later say you don't login to SOT much any more because you cannot bear the non stop talking. So let's git this right, you paid a lot of money to join and you say you never made anything back and you also don't use the trading room any more. So the upshot is SOT did not working for you and yet you still say you love it?

You also mentioned you have now developed your own method so I take this as good evidence the SOT methods did not work for you either.

I understand from plenty of experienced traders who posted on the trade to win thread that most, if not all of the stuff that JJ wraps around his scam school can be found freely on the internet. So I fail to see why you are trying to present value in JJ teaching methods, especially considering the evidence against him?

Quite a few good reviews exists form users who have studied SOT methods on the pissed consumer consumer review site, worth a look.

I would post some direct links in here but I do not have authority yet as I only just started using Big Mikes Trading forum.

best regards
Lloyd Hopkins

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