I bought MTP EOD and Real Time add ons for Ninja about four years ago. I don't use the software as I can't stand sitting through the pretty major drawdowns waiting for the home run. But as far as vanishing signals, that is not correct. Signals only vanish if they are invalidated prior to a trade stop-entry order being filled and losing trades are permanently marked on the chart.
The following 2 users say Thank You to jswin for this post:
Favorite Futures: US E-mini's, Currency Futures, Forex
Posts: 31 since Sep 2009
Thanks: 6 given,
I own both the standalone platform and the NT Add-ons, and quite frankly, MTP is really the primary tool that I use these days for all of my trading- and yes, if you put in the time and effort to really master it and leverage it for what it is, which is a professional charting and analysis platform for identifying risk-controlled, quality favorable risk/reward trade setups, then yes- it delivers above and beyond.
On top of that, they have phenomenal support and a ton of excellent free education, including a new trade room where the developer (and expert trader) Steve Griffiths provides real time analysis and education- particularly on how to do the advanced analysis that the software is designed for. Before committing to buy, I'd already spent more money than I will freely admit on indicators, systems, platforms and other garbage- so I am well aware of what's out there. If nothing else, the value they deliver for the money is second to none.
I had a good amount of experience and a strong education and background coming in, so for me, the learning curve was probably shorter than for some. I bought it specifically for the more advanced analysis, so I was never really evaluating whether I could trade a purely mechanical approach with the automatic signals.
As for the "automatic set ups", they're not "black box" at all- they're just automatic methods of more easily identifying certain patterns of price action representing high quality trade opportunities with a favorable risk/reward- all of which can be indentified manually using the software tools or even the naked eye. Furthermore, the basic "standard trade guidelines" are just that- they're very basic "training wheels" to help get more inexperienced traders used to approaching trading in the right way, which is with a sound approach to risk/reward, position sizing, and trade management.
The bottom line is that like anything in trading, it needs to fit your personality and psychological makeup. With my background and core beliefs about trading, risk, and money management, it was a natural fit and I haven't looked back. Even then, it's really helped me fully "break through" some remaining psychological issues that I was still struggling with in my own trading despite all of the education and other training. So, all in all, it was worth every penny for me.
The absolute best thing one can do to evaluate the approach is to read the trading course written by the developer, the first part of which is free. It will give the philosophy behind the methodology and help to understand the approach to see if what he's suggesting "resonates" with you. Personally, I read that a couple of times, and followed the blog for a couple of months before buying- not to mention looking at everything I could on their site and forum.
To really excel using the this approach requires experience, effort, patience, and skill- but it's well worth it. It's very much a "leading" form of analysis, rather than the typical "lagging" indicators, so in turn it has the tools to nail some amazing trades. The challenge is learning to "trust" the techniques, as they often involve entering trades that very often end up nailing exact turning points in markets- something "conventional" trading wisdom vehemently warns against.
The people who are probably not the best candidates for MTP are the ones looking for a mechanical system or set of indicators that doesn't require much thought, skill, or discretion on the part of the trader.
Hope this helps-
The following 15 users say Thank You to sdonahue for this post:
I have used Mtp for about 4 years now.
Understand that the signals are just that ...signals - and you then have to apply your own analysis of whether it's a valid setup in your opinion.
The previous forum user outlined that you have to learn how to trust the signals as this software can highlight THE turning points - but traditionally it is the last place you would enter.
It will take you 6m- 1 year to learn how to become proficient at it (IMHO).
I have analysed over 5000 trades with this software so I know the ones that generally work and the few that don't - what does change is how well the trade works - some signals have a much higher expectancy than others... but of course that also depends on how you manage the trade. So you have to find your own way with that.
It is interesting to note however that the signals that are 'poor' generally end up being flat - so for instance I have done 103 trades on one particular signal and lost $235 in total.
Am I a good trader? - no - still learning, but having confidence in the signals is for me a very important step.
Please register on futures.io to view futures trading content such as post attachment(s), image(s), and screenshot(s).
The following 7 users say Thank You to Mindset for this post:
"This guy" does not believe in commenting. I have nothing to teach (who am to I teach anyone?), to sell or convince others of....I had this up because after 4years.....I wanted to show it can be done for average folks with right combination of effort, luck and perseverance. MTP is just a tool - as good as any, or as bad as any.
My opinion is just as bad as the next one.
It's true edge its it's treatment of risk and position sizing and how it forces you think about risk first, second and last and not care about returns. Once I thought of that as a habit, it didn't t matter what MTP showed or indicated.
It was all about taking risk controlled behaviour. I suspect with enough time spent you can find your edge. BTW, there is more than enough on that blog for people to make their own decisions. MTP can fail for several people, it did for me for over 3years. I read everything with trading, had rules, golden nuggets and still kept failing. Nothing worked.
Slowly over time (hard to pinpoint a turnaround day) when I was close to giving up; I tried to see what what Van Tharp said (it couldn't hurt after all, to try one last thing) - practice low risk. I still wasn't making any money, but no matter how many mistakes i made (and still keep making), I was not blowing up my 4th account (previous 3 went the way of the dodo). That feeling of keeping risk low generated a momentum that is hard to teach and hard to make others believe in.
Unless you experience it yourself. Traders who have the opportunity to survive that long may have that chance, but unless it's self generated there is not much of chance of people surviving in the long term.
I used to have lists on rules and all that, now I have torn up all lists and rules. I practive low risk behavour that is a results of all those rules. It works for me
Other than that, not much else to say
The following 22 users say Thank You to Deucalion for this post:
Just finished my 30 day demo of MTP... My refund was promptly processed minus the $250 look fee. Here is what I found.
The Brit who seems to be in charge, thinks he is the best trainer and has the best materials available,, he just doesn't have a coherent method of instruction(I'm a visual learner and not much of a reader).. He has a 300 page PDF manual (which he pointed out took him 20yrs of experience)..........Problem is using these materials would take me 20yrs to sort out the information, kinda like the bible..
The live "training sessions" are not recorded and its a "pity"(the Brits word) if u miss them.
Would be nice if MTP had a coherent strategy for delivering education, got a little u tube here, recording there when they feel like it and lots of written rather the video (a picture is worth a thousand words) jumbled through their web site.. No one bothered to tell me about these extras until my demo was almost over and I stumbled across them.
Needs a whole market live session training on the use of the manual tools, because if u want more action, u gotta set it up ur self..
Since this is an international company they spend half of the training on the foreign markets,, but that did nothing for me since I only trade day session Eminis.. Each market has it own personality, so who cares about the DAX.. The auto trades were already on the screen, no education presented as to why this auto trade appeared most of the time.. They were great at creating S/R points that a pivot occurs(Decision Point), but if u click enough something works and if that one doesn't hold the next one will, u know the story.
Found the software did generate auto winners for the month I followed(25% return) , though some days there were no trades and only a few trades a day, 11:00 to late in the session EST.
Wow 25%, I should have my head examined for not keeping on with this,, guess I was interested more in the education then the black box returns, the education part was going nowhere for me.
The risk reward tool was the best part of the software and most educational.. Course was the only one I learned how to use..
BTTF is still the best educational company out there..
The following 2 users say Thank You to gg80108 for this post:
You ONLY made 25% in a month.
What's your goal?
I am an MTP user and I agree with about 95% of what you say - except that I don't quite make 25% a month!
The live trading sessions are a waste of time (IMHO) because MTP is a tool ( well, a tool and a signal generator) and of course every one uses it differently. BUT they are very good at seeing the different uses one tool can be put to!!
The following 2 users say Thank You to Mindset for this post: