Now let me break down what you said just so that the facts remain facts rather than distortions based on your assumptions and conclusions.
1. I'm not selling anything. The Alchemy strategy was developed by others. I simply did a lot of due diligence over the last 2 years with these guys and Stage 5 is making it available at a low initial capital requirement as an automated trading strategy for anyone who is interested. Clearly you are not, so great. Don't be. The strategy has been trading and has been out there. The fact that it is now available at S5 is offending you in some way. It is not mandatory that you participate in it and it doesn't change one bit of my vision, values and goals for what I do. I'm really amused by how offensive you find it despite the fact that you know nothing about it.
2. It was brought up in the context of automated trading strategies. That was the subject of the webinar. A topic that has been in demand for years and I know the experts interviewed enough to feel comfortable to put them on.
3. You state that there is a limit of 300 people to create scarcity. Thanks for that assumption but your facts don't reflect what was said. I said that the strategy has a 300 UNIT limit because it is a market order strategy. Above this threshold, the slippage becomes too large and impact performance. 300 units is 600 contract market orders. It appears to me that it is not your intent to be factual (a requirement for trading) and to process what is being said objectively.
4. The regulations require S5 to provide the performance as shown. That was what was approved by the regulators and that's what I could show at the webinar. The results of S5's own live house account are definitely real and live, but I didn't want to show something that was not approved by Compliance. Again, I'm assuming you are not an expert on futures compliance, so I will disregard your snarky comments regarding me being kidnapped by someone.
5. These guys didn't have to make the program available. The program is exclusive to S5. They are running their fund and CTA just fine. The auto-trading strategy is not exactly the same as the fund's automated strategy. Here again, you didn't bother to get the facts. Clearly facts are not a priority. Red Ivy can stop providing signals to S5 at will and I'm sure they would if it impacted their CTA.
6. What nonsense? Who is pushing what? Did S5 send Ivan and Igor to break your knee caps if you don't trade the strategy? If so, please let me know so we can fix the situation.
7. So here again, the Webinar was ONE HOUR AND 33 MINUTES long. The Alchemy strategy announcement by S5 and discussion of it was probably 7 mins. If you think the session was not about Automated Trading, then you must have been listening to something else.
8. I don't have to prove anything works and I certainly wouldn't try with someone who is flinging noise while not actually listening to what was being said. Sorry. In trading, nobody has to prove anything to you. Again, let me know if Ivan and Igor are still there and are forcing you to trade the strategy.
9. Thanks for predicting the future of what this strategy will do. Contrary to the way you see facts, I have been watching it trading live on a real house account for over a month. It has lost and it has won. Just like a trade or any strategy does. Overall, as of the close of yesterday, it was up around 10% from May 4th to June 16th (past performance is not indicative of future results). Now, if it goes into a drawdown from here, then so be it. But given my history of watching prop traders and now retail traders trade, I personally feel comfortable with this strategy as it is. After all, it is a TRADING strategy and not an investment program. The volatility is inherent here.
10. I'm glad you have decided to unsubscribe. I would too with the amount of stress you have caused yourself based on your prejudices.
So based on this person's logic, if I bring on someone who trades using an order flow tool and that tool somehow doesn't work out for someone, then I have lost my values and soul.
If there is one thing that I have learned from trading and about trading, it is that I have to keep an open mind. Many things won't work for me and many things have. Some things are not for me and I don't participate at all. However, I don't approach everything with criticism and suspicion and neither should those who watched the Automated Trading webinar. If you are working on automation, then there were many nuggets in there. If you have considered it, then you know better what to prepare for. If you don't want to do your own but want to trade a system, then one was provided.
Pick your poison....otherwise, go ahead....unsubscribe.
PS: That's a lot of posts for a guy who just joined 2 days ago.
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.... and i thought it looked pretty good. In fact i thought it looked so good, i thought it was too good. This was a week or two ago. i thought ... ah Morad is using this as a psych tool...like do you really think this is possible via computer c'mon, use your head...the real results are between your ears.
I tested many systems over the years. some were profitable for 6 weeks or 6 months, sometimes years, depending on your goals and objectives. i kept developing and searching cuz i naively thought they had to be profitable all the time. then I read a book and found out the funds regularly turned them on and off at will depending on the kind of market that was trading at the time. That made a lot of sense to me. Sometimes the market trends nicely and sometimes it channels etc. Certainly the summer months are different than Jan to March.
Anyways I have to finish my house reno asap and get back to trading. In the interim i have to listen to this webinar...even if red ivy is only discussed for 7 minutes.
I used to develop systems just with indicators, but then i realized a real system would take into account
- the current weeks news releases
- the day of the month,
- daily atr,
- recent volumes,
- other market influences eg oil, gold, bonds, USD
1, you are selling something. Everyone with an account with you that makes a trade will make you commissions. Whether Red Ivy give you a kickback or not remains a mystery.
2, No webinar is a one hour sales pitch. There is the carrot and then the pitch.
3, 600 units will slip. Real liquidity is nowhere near that.
4, There is no long term live performance statistics.
5, They did not have to make the program available. They decided that at 300 subscribers, they would make more money leasing the system to retail traders than trading it themselves. Or are you implying that this is an altruistic venture?
6, For each trade this system makes, you take a commission. Some of those commissions will be from people that would not be confident to make their own trades but now let the system make trades for them. So definite conflict of interest.
7, No sales pitch looks like a sales pitch throughout. Carrot first.
8, Yes. You DO have to prove things work or you should not push them. Certainly for automated systems but I'll give you a free pass on your "Volume Profile" related discretionary trading as that is a skill.
9, You can only give hypothetical long term results.
10, Nobody has unsubscribed from anything.
Bottom line is there is no proof it works and there is no reason that a 600 contract system that makes money would be leased to retail traders paying retail commissions UNLESS leasing it to them makes more money than trading it themselves.
As for everyone else that thinks Morad is a god. Remember nobody is infallible. Red Ivy could have hoodwinked FT71. He could well believe what he is telling us but that does not make it true.
It appears you have been irked by this particular webinar. I have not watched it so I cannot comment on the merits.
However your latest replies to FT71's points are consistent with trolling.
Please note, I'm not saying you are a troll, but some points are consistent with trolling. Example:
You don't appear to have taken onboard the fact you initially mentioned 300 people as opposed to 300 units. You just used that as a springboard to talk about something else. That is consistent with trolling.
This too is consistent with trolling.
There are other points that to me are consistent with trolling, although I don't have either the time or the inclination to point them out.
Last edited by xplorer; June 22nd, 2016 at 12:24 PM.
I have not been irked by this specific webinar. More by the direction Morad has taken the FT71 persona. For instance he's done a few scalping webinars but the only one he ever showed a profit on was the one he did on replay.
No man can trade every way. FT71 is a longer term day trader and to think he can just casually switch to another style is ludicrous. That is not how this business works. It is a business of skill and specialization.
I am not a troll. The 300 people is the amount of subscribers they were looking for. The 600 units is from FT71s last post. So perhaps one person can subscribe a few times to trade more contracts or perhaps it's 2 contracts per subscriber. That really missus the crux of the issue. It is not relevant.
What is relevant is that a retailer will have to pay Red Ivy AND Pay S5 commissions and still come out ahead. Their commissions are far from cheap. Yet if Red Ivy traded the 600 contracts themselves, they would be paying far less in terms of commissions on a per contract basis, yet they will make more money by leasing the system out.
If anyone other than Morad was pushing this system, they would be questioned. As it is, the personality he has built has caused people to suspend common sense and attack someone that questions him. And that is all I have done here, to question him.
I'm not intending to assail your character. You are simply wrong according to my beliefs.
I appreciate that every future contract is entered into with 2 parties having diametrically opposite views of future prices, so analogously I don't see you as a bad person, just one I disagree with.
I also don't fault your cynicism, within reason. I love trading, but the one thing I hate about it is that the promise [mirage, actually] of easy money brings a--h---s out of the woodwork. And yeah, I've seen a lot of them. Have a look at some of my other posts; I'm not afraid to call b------t when I see it.
But FT isn't a charlatan, in fact quite the opposite. He has done more for my trading career than anyone else. All for the princely sum of zero dollars and zero cents. I have said here and on Twitter that I wouldn't trade anywhere else.
I could care less if you choose to agree with me or remain skeptical, but that's how I see things and intend to move forward.
Best of luck.
Last edited by bob7123; June 23rd, 2016 at 05:45 AM.
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