@fourtiwinks, sorry to give you the real news about Ed. Most of the people who paid for Ed didn' t want a gold paved road, but only that he held up his part; to trade live or sim and tell us. The key is trading in the room so we could fully understand and see how a trader who trades at 80% plus, handles the changing market day to day.
We all knew it was our job to develop the system that fit each of us, but also practice the 10K hours needed, and measure that practice. The main draw was the "Look over my shoulder", literally never happened on an consistant basis for whatever the many reasons described above in other posts. So with that said I leave everyone with this:
I just wonder, why all these guys complying about what's happening in Ed's room didn't took the trial: 50 bucks for one month and see what's all about in the room ?
I assume this trial was not available at the time they subscribed, or as a character in "American Hustler" said : " Everyone believes what he wants to believe ".
I, myself, was ready to subscribe to his mentoring but at his advice (I have to admit this) I took the trial for 50$ and decided I don't like what I saw so after 2 weeks I ceased returning to the room.
Anyway, let me give you a hint about all these paid trials many of you may not know :
Paying for trials is a hook because if you then make another payment (for bigger, much bigger, amount in many cases) you will not receive a refund from your credit card company upon your request without the payment receiver approval. The credit card company will inform the supplier about the refund request and the supplier will make known you made past payments to him for same purpose and since you know what you will receive for your money your complain is false.
Last edited by Cristian; October 26th, 2014 at 03:26 PM.
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i took a few trials at ED`s room. A trial doesnt even cost 50 Dollars. You can take free trials every second week and so you can see what is going on in the room.
ED is a friendly person who talks a lot about charts, patters, why he trades like he does etc. He is nobody who tries to sell agressive his system, he will quite want you to take your time to decide if it is the right thing for you.
I think i will never unterstand his style of trading. The patterns seems to be clear but i think i can trade 2 cars with a a target of 4 Ticks taking a stop at 8 Ticks. There seem to be no clear rules when to take a full stop loss or when to get out earlier. This is just what i saw, i may be wrong.
Also i saw some days, as he traded (live oder sim??) and had 2-4 losses in a row. Ed then stops trading and says he already made his money earlier in the morning and closes then the room. I never saw these losses in the statements he post in his blog. And this is what makes me say: no, i have no confidence with Ed and no, i can not pay to someone who is not 100% honest.
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@Cristian, to answer a few questions:
Some of the ones that have commented on here that are members in Ed’s room. Ed just started the $50 this last year. Most of us have been in his room much longer than that.
He would open 1 day a month for guests, basically so no one could really get a handle on what he was doing. Most of his business came from newly signup that recommend friends, family, etc.
Now, it looks like Dean Handley is helping. I know someone who emailed Handley about Ed bogus logs and Dean did nothing. I think he wanted to talk to that person, but he had the doctored logs and still did nothing. He kept Ed on the recommend list. So I wonder what skin he has in Ed’s game?
Everyone believes what he wants...well true, but when you read on futures.io (formerly BMT) that NO ONE has any negative comments (for over 3 plus years) about Ed and you see the daily logs, making about 1000-6k a day you would think that they could in fact be true. Ed was on futures.io (formerly BMT) from near the start, so one could assume there was some truth to the logs. Considering how futures.io (formerly BMT) traders rip trainers apart, when they find someone out right lying.
Notice, how Ed sighs, when he reads a stupid question according to him, he does that when someone takes the mic, when he watches a person trade. You never fully saw 100% how he trades (remember look over my shoulder), it was like he was always holding something back. Like he was the smartest kid in the room, and he played the game to make that happen.
I found this suspicious when he would only take about 2-5 trades the in the room and make someone else take the mic. (You see his daily log with at time 30 to 50 trades after the room is closed).
Concerning the mic, he said the pressure of others seeing make you a better trader. The problem is he would sit there and pick apart people, sigh, say I took the trade against your entry. Now, how is that for positive reinforcement?
Now on his site he states that he will not be showing his daily logs. If no other proof then that shows he is faking some or part or all his logs I have no idea what does. If it was me, I sure would want to prove that my logs are legit, so brokers statements would be the only way here on out since he cannot be trusted.
As someone stated above, we should ask for our money back, since we based our signing up on his logs, that he could trade and make serious money, but in fact that is not the case. I think we need to rise up and fight this.
Does anyone have any idea where do you start to what federal agency that has any jurisdiction over what Ed is doing? If anything a class action suit, but the lawyers make all the bank on that one.
Last edited by tradermark2009; October 28th, 2014 at 12:39 AM.
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Sorry to continue this but if I was any of you I would take the mike in Ed's room and state my concerns there in front of his new prospects and old fellows:
1. Dear Ed I did not paid 3k usd to see these new guys trading, I did pay this to see YOU but you show me nothing these years.
2. Because of "this" and "this" I belive your posted trades log is false and you can't come here in front of all of us , day after day, to tell us you finished your trading day and not be able to prove these trades logs but only mess with us who paid you to teach us.
If he bans you from the room for these would be the ultimate prove he is a fraud.
If not and nothing happens maybe next day another guy will repeat these statements in front of the whole room.
And about Dean Handley I have also some concerns he is a some kind of fraud and this because he was for a month in a trading room I was too and the way how he treated the owner of this room(a very open and honest guy) was not how I expected to be treated a trader with very good results (including that month Dean was there) and also providing near 2 years of trading logs and possibility to contact any of the traders in the room.
Last edited by Cristian; October 28th, 2014 at 08:47 AM.
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I think this sorry tale tells you that if a trading coach is not willing to show you brokerage statements, then he is probably trying to hide something. Any trading coach wanting large sums up front should be treated with caution
Last edited by pvlee; October 28th, 2014 at 09:08 AM.
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Ed, who runs the Jaguar Trading Club, recorded a presentation on October 24th. I attended the live presentation. Towards the end of the presentation, Ed stated he would no longer be taking any new clients. Within a few minutes, Ed had changed his mind and was already making an exception for a new client. Ed’s boldness tells me one thing; he has convinced himself that his trades are real and that he will not stop marketing his “services”. My only motivation for posting to this thread is to publicly come forward and share more information.
I visited his blog yesterday and noticed he has stopped posting pictures of his trades and now has a link to view the trades. Why he has stopped posting trades on his blog is anyone’s guess. I clicked the link and looked at the last picture of the day (OCT 31st). First, the 6E trades #4 & 5 are in a sequence in which Ed has decided to “average against” a position by 5 ticks (trade #4) and 7 ticks (trade #5). I will leave it to the reader of this thread to decide if that is a smart thing to do. I then decided to look at the ES trades. At first glance, the trades are “possible” if you look at a chart. I then decided to drill a little deeper and look at the trades with replay data:
1) The trades I am referring to are numbered 12 & 13 and trades 14 & 15 and are highlighted in the first attached picture (entries only)
2) Trade #12 for 4 lots at 2010.75 at 6:05:24 and the second 4 lot entry (trade #13) at 2010.75 at 6:05:26 never printed (there are no T&S prints corresponding to these trades)
3) Trades 14 & 15 at 2011.75 at 6:07:03 never printed (there are no T&S prints corresponding to these trades)
4) At the time of these trades, assuming Ed was trading cash as he claims (or even if he was trading SIM), it was impossible to get filled at the price as posted
I did not look at the exits. I picked these two sequences of trades randomly. I made a few assumptions:
1) The replay data is accurate and is based on unfiltered data - I did verify the data is unfiltered
2) If Ed’s computer time was incorrect on this particular date, I allowed +/- 15 seconds for his trades to print
3) I assume that Ed’s computer clock is correct because I have seen firsthand numerous times where a client has pointed out a price bar and Ed’s charts were directly in sync with mine to the second – my computer time is set to MIT’s nuclear time
4) If Ed is trading SIM, then I allowed for NinjaTrader’s algorithm to fill at the offer (selling) - for his short position to be executed
5) If Ed is trading cash, I also allowed for excellent queue positioning and his fills occurring at the offer - for his short position to be executed
6) Since Ed has the “Group trades by ATM strategy” checked and enabled I was looking for prints that were any multiple of 4 lots - e.g. 4 (1 lot) prints, a 1 lot and a 3 lot, (1) 4 lot print etc.
7) My T&S is unfiltered (The size filter is zero) - I get all the prints that replay gives me (1 lot or a 50 lot - I see them all)
8) I assume that Ed does not have access to “dark pools of liquidity” where the CME is broadcasting more than one set of prices – I am making no inference. I have no idea if anything like that could, or is happening. I assume that the price that is quoted by the CME is accurate and is delivered to anyone/everyone who has access to live market data and no one is getting or paying for “better data”
9) I assume Ed is utilizing a broadband connection
I am not a “finance forensic specialist”. I am looking at things with an open mind and allowing for a variety of conditions that actually favor Ed. I realize my findings are from a tiny sample size. Maybe someone who is considering wasting $3,500 will do some additional work before committing capital to Ed’s “services”. I would be very interested in the results. If I cannot see any prints at the price and time that is on Ed’s summary of trades, how was he able execute the trades? Something does not add up. I have posted pictures of Ed’s trades as well as pictures of the T&S. The first T&S picture relates to trades 12 & 13. The 2nd and third picture relates to trades 14 & 15.
I challenged Ed to trade profitably for 3 days. I have heard nothing from Ed regarding this challenge. Ed continues to open the room up AFTER he has finished his trading. This omission of transparency is so glaring and raises so many red flags it’s almost comedic.
I hope the debate continues regarding the validity of Ed’s results (good or bad). I appreciate everyone’s contribution to the thread when on topic. Questioning why a current or former client signed up for Ed’s “service” is irrelevant to the thread and most traders who have any level of experience know that reading several books and “working really hard” does not always (or ever) make a person a profitable trader. If that were the case, a lot of us who are smart, well read and hard working would all be extracting 500 ticks daily.
If Ed wants to show an audited broker statement outlining any of the last year’s trades, I welcome the opportunity to view them.
Hopefully Ed finally is able to muster the courage to admit what he has been doing and refund the money for clients that entrusted him for his assistance.
Last edited by opentrdr; November 1st, 2014 at 08:48 PM.
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I was not in Ed's room. I just like the guy, I have seen a lots of video from him, during his mentoring, I have read his blog, about the S/L zones, because it was interesting. I was planing to learn from him, but not right now maybe later. I do believe he is doing a good stuff, but that is my view and forcuneatly we are not here to share the same view every time.
But, BUT, and maybe I am not right, but really! I dont see any problem with this 2 trades what you have been posting AT ALL! It is totally aligned with his methadology, these are an easy to take trades, he he got the worst fill ever what he could get at trade #12, #13. Maybe I am not right, than correct me, but if I am right, than please post a sorry or correction about your post!
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Based on my understanding what he is doing (once again. I have no connection with him, simply I was checking videos from his screencast and youtube library). He is playing S/L zones. He is ready to go trade with 2:1 R:R. Meaning his SL could be 12 tick (I've put it to 8 tick) to get profit after 6 tick. If u would be in the room you would happy to take these kind of trade, easy to fill, easy to understand (oke oke, u have to take the heat as well)