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DTS Indicatorwarehouse
Started:June 13th, 2012 (06:53 PM) by BarOne Views / Replies:16,679 / 41
Last Reply:October 10th, 2016 (07:22 AM) Attachments:2

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DTS Indicatorwarehouse

Old May 24th, 2014, 05:37 PM   #21 (permalink)
Elite Member
Lehrte, Germany
 
Futures Experience: Advanced
Platform: NinjaTrader
Broker/Data: Optimus Trading Group / Rithmic
Favorite Futures: CL, NQ
 
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tracer888 View Post
I've been looking at this system forever, really on the fence about it. The price tag is gigantic, would love to know if anyone who actually bought it (around 4k) actually made that back.

Ray seems nice, and Erich in the rooms but I'll widen it further, anyone even make half that investment (2k) from the DTS 4 or DTS 5?

Well, I'd like to approach your question this way...I already own all three DTS birds quite a long time, and since I've tried many systems during my 'career' as a part-time trader (like many others before), I have to state that DTS has been the first system / method which managed to prevent me from LOOSING money over the long haul.

Having that said, I have to admit that I didn't make $4k as of now but definitely banked more than $2k so far, which made up for some of the losses I had to suffer from when I was using other systems or vendor's stuff.

But IMHO there are a few other important things in DTS which makes it very valuable for ME and MY personal trading (style):

If you consider DTS solely as a pure 'signal generator' and follow every single signal on the charts, you will certainly fail without any doubt and blow your account on a single trading day...and although the charts are clean and look like 'esay to follow', you need to spend a lot of time to LEARN not only to select the 'right' signals but look at the CONTEXT like PA, support and resistance, swing levels, other time frames and maybe even VWAP (like I do). And Erich does a really great job in the room by patiently explaining and repeating these essentials over and over again.

So, bottom line I would summarize the value of DTS for MY PERSONAL USE that DTS helps me to visualize market state / conditions best and gives me some very high potential signals for trade entries, but much more important for ME is that it very often shows me when NOT to take a trade...but that's only me, and for me DTS fits best to my trading style and comfort zone.


BTW, and just for the records, I'm NOT in any way affiliated to Indicator Warehouse, and I don't get paid for stating my personal opinion of DTS here either.

"If you don't design your own life plan, chances are you'll fall into someone else's plan. And guess what they have planned for you? Not much." - Jim Rohn
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Old May 24th, 2014, 06:03 PM   #22 (permalink)
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Daytrader999 View Post
...
If you consider DTS solely as a pure 'signal generator' and follow every single signal on the charts, you will certainly fail without any doubt and blow your account on a single trading day...

So if i read you correctly, the signals do not provide an edge. All signals are equal in this regard, right?


Daytrader999 View Post
... you need to spend a lot of time to LEARN not only to select the 'right' signals but look at the CONTEXT like PA, support and resistance, swing levels, other time frames and maybe even VWAP (like I do).

Is the VWAP part of their package?

How is the software helping you in interpreting market CONTEXT?
Is this the place where their visual system shines the most? Can you elaborate on this aspect?


Daytrader999 View Post
...
So, bottom line I would summarize the value of DTS for MY PERSONAL USE that DTS helps me to visualize market state / conditions best and gives me some very high potential signals for trade entries, but much more important for ME is that it very often shows me when NOT to take a trade...but that's only me, and for me DTS fits best to my trading style and comfort zone.

I am confused here as you wrote we should not consider DTS solely as a pure 'signal generator' but then you imply the system gives you some very high potential signals for trade entries. How does the system identify these high potential signals for you?

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Old May 24th, 2014, 07:12 PM   #23 (permalink)
Elite Member
Lehrte, Germany
 
Futures Experience: Advanced
Platform: NinjaTrader
Broker/Data: Optimus Trading Group / Rithmic
Favorite Futures: CL, NQ
 
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Posts: 1,157 since Sep 2011
Thanks: 1,135 given, 1,536 received



trendisyourfriend View Post
So if i read you correctly, the signals do not provide an edge. All signals are equal in this regard, right?

Well, of course not every signal provides an edge, there's still a good portion of discretion left in your trading decision. Each bird has some higher probability signals as well as signals that you should not take. This depends on how you interpret current market state compared with the higher time frames.

For example, if you see the market retrace only a few ticks after a huge move and after apparently picking up the trend again you should be very cautious because this particular pullback might be not enough, and the market will possibly test the 'extreme' once again before the trend continues.
Another example could be a trend change on the Hawk (lower time frame). which suddenly stops at the 'hard edge' of the Eagle (higher time frame), so I would not take the signal of the Hawk because most often this move will come to an end and test the other side before it possibly breaks this particular support.


Quoting 
Is the VWAP part of their package?

How is the software helping you in interpreting market CONTEXT?
Is this the place where their visual system shines the most? Can you elaborate on this aspect?

VWAP is not part of DTS, I'm using Fat Tails' Session VWAP on the Eagle.

As I mentioned before, if a trade setup presents itself on one of the birds, I look at the other two birds in order to find confirmation for entering the trade. If all three birds are in confluence I'll take the trade.


Quoting 
I am confused here as you wrote we should not consider DTS solely as a pure 'signal generator' but then you imply the system gives you some very high potential signals for trade entries. How does the system identify these high potential signals for you?

If you watch the system in real time you will find out that every market has its own characteristics regarding how to interpret the signals. While CL usually responds very well to the hard edge of the Eagle and continues with the trend, NQ usually tends to turn and reverse, which results in a 'red bar buy' or 'green bar sell' signal.

If you are not familiar with DTS, I'd highly recommend to watch one of Erich Senft's recordings of his trading sessions in order to get an idea of how he identifies these high probability trades. This helped me a lot to get a better understanding of how the three birds work together and how to avoid lower probability signals.

Of course, like ANY other system or method this doesn't work all the time, but if you strictly stick to the rules of DTS and have the ability to patiently wait for the 'right setups', you'll definitely make some money.
But let me state this again, it certainly takes more time than you might expect, it's NOT THE HOLY GRAIL and NO 'out of the box' system that you can use without taking your time to LEARN everything about it.

Hope this helps...

"If you don't design your own life plan, chances are you'll fall into someone else's plan. And guess what they have planned for you? Not much." - Jim Rohn

Last edited by Daytrader999; May 24th, 2014 at 07:22 PM.
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Old May 24th, 2014, 07:38 PM   #24 (permalink)
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Daytrader999 View Post
Well, of course not every signal provides an edge, there's still a good portion of discretion left in your trading decision. Each bird has some higher probability signals as well as signals that you should not take. This depends on how you interpret current market state compared with the higher time frames.

For example, if you see the market retrace only a few ticks after a huge move and after apparently picking up the trend again you should be very cautious because this particular pullback might be not enough, and the market will possibly test the 'extreme' once again before the trend continues.
Another example could be a trend change on the Hawk (lower time frame). which suddenly stops at the 'hard edge' of the Eagle (higher time frame), so I would not take the signal of the Hawk because most often this move will come to an end and test the other side before it possibly breaks this particular support.



VWAP is not part of DTS, I'm using Fat Tails' Session VWAP on the Eagle.

As I mentioned before, if a trade setup presents itself on one of the birds, I look at the other two birds in order to find confirmation for entering the trade. If all three birds are in confluence I'll take the trade.



If you watch the system in real time you will find out that every market has its own characteristics regarding how to interpret the signals. While CL usually responds very well to the hard edge of the Eagle and continues with the trend, NQ usually tends to turn and reverse, which results in a 'red bar buy' or 'green bar sell' signal.

If you are not familiar with DTS, I'd highly recommend to watch one of Erich Senft's recordings of his trading sessions in order to get an idea of how he identifies these high probability trades. This helped me a lot to get a better understanding of how the three birds work together and how to avoid lower probability signals.

Of course, like ANY other system or method this doesn't work all the time, but if you strictly stick to the rules of DTS and have the ability to patiently wait for the 'right setups', you'll definitely make some money.
But let me state this again, it certainly takes more time than you might expect, it's NOT THE HOLY GRAIL and NO 'out of the box' system that you can use without taking your time to LEARN everything about it.

Hope this helps...

Now I am really confused. Didn't you try to sell your DTS system because you no longer use it (according to the following post earlier in this thread).


Daytrader999 View Post
Hi all,

Since I purchased the DTS System a long time ago but won't use it anymore, I'd like to offer my licenses of my complete DTS System to anybody who might be interested.

This offer includes the Hawk Micro Scalper, the Falcon Swing Trader, the Eagle Trend Trader and the Trade Manager as well as the Mean Renko bars, the Omni Timer and the Logi Counter.

There are also DTS licenses available for a second machine id which includes the Hawk Micro Scalper, the Falcon Swing Trader, the Eagle Trend Trader and the Trade Manager .

The transfer of any of these licenses to another person has been officially approved by IW, so everything will be strictly official and legal.

Please PM me if you are interested in this offer, or taking anything into consideration.


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Old May 24th, 2014, 07:51 PM   #25 (permalink)
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BeachTrader View Post
Now I am really confused. Didn't you try to sell your DTS system because you no longer use it (according to the following post earlier in this thread).

No need to be confused, I tried to sell DTS because at this time I seriously thought about giving up completely on trading since I was just too busy with my regular day job with literally NO time left for ANYTHING.

But thank God sometimes things can change to the good, so as I've got more time now I'm glad I didn't sell it.

"If you don't design your own life plan, chances are you'll fall into someone else's plan. And guess what they have planned for you? Not much." - Jim Rohn
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Old May 24th, 2014, 07:58 PM   #26 (permalink)
TonyL
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Daytrader999 View Post
If you consider DTS solely as a pure 'signal generator' and follow every single signal on the charts, you will certainly fail without any doubt and blow your account on a single trading day

Were you to take only the best probability or chance of success signals where all three birds are in total agreement/sync/alignment with each other then how is it possible to blow up an account especially when using in combination the Trade Manager to curve against taking on too much risk to begin with? Unless of course every trade is a loosing one? Really?

To say a system is 100% successful is misleading but any system that can generate more than a 50% chance of success per trade is a winner in my book. Even the algos aren't always that accurate. So please don't mind me for being a bit confused with the above statement.

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Old May 24th, 2014, 08:26 PM   #27 (permalink)
Elite Member
Lehrte, Germany
 
Futures Experience: Advanced
Platform: NinjaTrader
Broker/Data: Optimus Trading Group / Rithmic
Favorite Futures: CL, NQ
 
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Posts: 1,157 since Sep 2011
Thanks: 1,135 given, 1,536 received


tlopez51 View Post
Were you to take only the best probability or chance of success signals where all three birds are in total agreement/sync/alignment with each other then how is it possible to blow up an account especially when using in combination the Trade Manager to curve against taking on too much risk to begin with? Unless of course every trade is a loosing one? Really?

To say a system is 100% successful is misleading but any system that can generate more than a 50% chance of success per trade is a winner in my book. Even the algos aren't always that accurate. So please don't mind me for being a bit confused with the above statement.

Well, as I mentioned before DTS IS NOT THE HOLY GRAIL and of course you can have loosing trades even if all three birds are in sync as e.g. you can always be a victim of a deeper retracement which will eventually stop you out...that's trading.
And if I remember correctly, I didn't mention the use of Trade Manager, which of course will prevent you from blowing your acount if your risk parameters are set correctly, especially since TM was not part of the originally DTS system.
But if you lack the necessary discipline you might also be tempted to increase your risk percentage and wipe out your account...so it's all up to you.

My statistics on DTS don't go back long enough to make a solid statement, but if you focus on only a few high probability signals your win percentage will be >50% for sure.

And as for any other system or methodology, if anyone is interested to learn more about DTS you should check it out for yourself if this is for you...

"If you don't design your own life plan, chances are you'll fall into someone else's plan. And guess what they have planned for you? Not much." - Jim Rohn
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Old May 24th, 2014, 09:02 PM   #28 (permalink)
TonyL
Clifton, NJ/USA
 
Futures Experience: Advanced
Platform: TradeStation, NinjaTrader
Broker/Data: TradeStation, NinjaTraderBrokerage, CQG, IQ-DTN
Favorite Futures: ES, NQ, YM, TF, CL, GC, ZB, IWM, FXE, SPY, UVXY, USO, TLT, TBT, QQQ, GLD, JNK
 
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Daytrader999 View Post
Well, as I mentioned before DTS IS NOT THE HOLY GRAIL and of course you can have loosing trades even if all three birds are in sync as e.g. you can always be a victim of a deeper retracement which will eventually stop you out...that's trading.
And if I remember correctly, I didn't mention the use of Trade Manager, which of course will prevent you from blowing your acount if your risk parameters are set correctly, especially since TM was not part of the originally DTS system.
But if you lack the necessary discipline you might also be tempted to increase your risk percentage and wipe out your account...so it's all up to you.

My statistics on DTS don't go back long enough to make a solid statement, but if you focus on only a few high probability signals your win percentage will be >50% for sure.

And as for any other system or methodology, if anyone is interested to learn more about DTS you should check it out for yourself if this is for you...

So if I am reading the tea leaves correctly the suggestion is to just simply opt out of any trading system because . . . and stick to plain ole charts analysis, TPO, Fibo, MACD, etc., or perhaps join a trade room which is about the only thing I can think of is left. Forget about any of the free tools available here too because if used/not used as intended it's a 50/50 crap shoot anyhow. TastyTrade? Rob Hoffman? Todd Mitchell? Many others. Which?


Last edited by tlopez51; May 24th, 2014 at 09:41 PM.
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Old May 25th, 2014, 08:26 AM   #29 (permalink)
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tlopez51 View Post
So if I am reading the tea leaves correctly the suggestion is to just simply opt out of any trading system because . . . and stick to plain ole charts analysis, TPO, Fibo, MACD, etc., or perhaps join a trade room which is about the only thing I can think of is left. Forget about any of the free tools available here too because if used/not used as intended it's a 50/50 crap shoot anyhow. TastyTrade? Rob Hoffman? Todd Mitchell? Many others. Which?

Your comment seems needlessly sarcastic.

I think Daytrader999 has made it very clear (with a number of posts). It is his just personal opinion and experience that DTS is useful to his trading, but each of us have to do our own due diligence for each trading system if we want to explore further.

Every trading systems can work for someone but no trading system will work for everyone.

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Old May 25th, 2014, 11:06 AM   #30 (permalink)
TonyL
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fourtiwinks View Post
Your comment seems needlessly sarcastic.

No. Not at all. I am not here to bash/flame on anyone or any one thing. Don't have the time or desire for that sort of nonsense. Just pointing to the fact that tools are what you make of them. If something works, then stick with it. If it doesn't, then it's time to either look for something different but realize too that poor results could be in the way you are using those tools.


Last edited by tlopez51; May 25th, 2014 at 11:16 AM.
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