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Apologize but cannot find topic on this. (Maybe I am searching it wrong?)
How would a person juggle between working full-time and (intending to) trade full-time at the same time (in the same time zone per say) as well?
This becomes hard if you are on East coast because pretty much all the business opens up when the markets open as well and the best volatility is there too.
Understandable, the afternoon session is there as well to trade, but if someone is working, let's say 9 to 5, then trading just remains a dream?
I've known many to try what you describe, and few to succeed (=P.C. for "I know of none, but maybe there's one out there") .
Remember: ultimately, to succeed, you need an edge - an advantage. If you are juggling, you are starting at a handicap - a disadvantage - making it that much harder to succeed. There's no use being the LEAST focused participant in the game because you are juggling.
There are a zillion different ways to play the market. You should seek a trading style and strategy that fit your life style and circumstances, not the other way around.
There's no rule you have to trade certain time frames or hours.
Personally, I've traded for years holding a 12-hr-a-day management career and know of many others who have done so. It's very possible using the appropriate strategies and time frames - definitely not intraday.
Best of luck!
This might sound contradictory but people I know who are "claiming" to have great amount of success or at least better luck are actually almost all full time job or business holders.
Now if you talk about "juggling", you really shouldn't, if you have to ask this then it's clear that your nature of job is not suitable to have a side gig with the markets or tbh with anything that requires you to hold an independent computer screen.
Usually these so called people I'm talking about are working in IT industry or have high end managerial level jobs which allow them to have their own separate computers "for the job", which also comes in use for their side gig.
Some people try to automate signal generation process, but that requires quite a lot of effort and time investment, which again not a regular job holder is usually willing to put in, again IT industry people have advantage as they often "program their way" to have hard fast solutions, which may or may not last long.
Also, there is actually a very good way to trade without watching screen whole day, and its called swing trading or even better long term investing.
Then there is again not so easy option, of options selling, which is complex enough that most people never end up trying or even if they do its usually when they really shouldn't have, so it leaves a bad taste or really bad dent in bank account. BUT, its usually a good idea to learn about straddles, strangles, butterflies and volatility based trading.
Just food for thought and just my own view, I'm no expert or intelligent person for that matter.
A lot of this comes down to timezone and your drive to trade.
You’ll need to adapt your style to only trade a few hours.
I’m in Australia, work a 9-5, and for half the year the RTH starts at 1:30am. I can either get up early to trade the close or trade the European open at 7pm.
The other half of the year RTH starts at 11:30pm, these days I’ll stay up late.
When I’m in Asia, the US RTH hours are a bit more agreeable 8-9pm start.
I know several US based traders who simply trade the Asian session because that’s the only time they can.
Don't try to trade while distracted by anything else, work included. You will lose consistently.
Also, don't try to work while distracted by anything else, trading included. They will probably fire you.
Find a market and/or a time period where there are opportunities for your preferred trading style without there being a conflict with your work hours.
You are not chained to ES only during "regular" (US) trading hours. You are also not chained to ES. So look around. But if you really insist on trying to split your attention during work hours, you will have an unnecessarily hard path ahead of you. Trading is hard enough without making it nearly impossible by adding on additional obstacles.
Have you looked at the European session in ES? Beginning about 3:00 AM US ET (I know, very early), things start to heat up as the European traders come into the US markets (for that matter, that time period will be the "regular" hours for European markets, which you can also trade. There are other markets where the "early" Europeans create significant price movements.) And you don't have to start that early, just find a block of time when some market is reasonably active and where you can give it your attention. There are also Asian markets, which are active in the US evening hours.
You can find a good time/market/instrument, but you will have to give up something to have it. See what you can stretch to make it happen.
Bob.
When one door closes, another opens.
-- Cervantes, Don Quixote
I am sorry I should have been more clear than using the word 'juggle' - I meant how would we 'balance' between working full-time and trading full-time at the same time.
Anyways, thanks for all the responses. Very helpful.
And no one mentioned this topic before? I was hesitating to create this since months and months now, thinking it's obviously been discussed a while back, but responses seem to be otherwise.
It's a good topic. I'm pretty sure that it has been touched on many times in different ways, because obviously it's going to come up (for example, in the trading journals of people trying to find exactly that balance.) I don't know if there's a dedicated thread on it, and anyway, it provides food for thought and discussion, a good thing to do.
Bob.
When one door closes, another opens.
-- Cervantes, Don Quixote
Some of the responses I see here that are against trading while working seem a little dogmatic, but I understand where they are coming from.
I don't believe this is a black-and-white answer, I would say it depends on your situation.
I trade while working, one laptop is work, one is trading. I am not yet consistently profitable, so bear that in mind, but I believe that is mostly due to paying dues and learning how to trade rather than any influence of work and I'm stringing together profitable months so there is progress.
In 2019 when I started, I used to just trade on my work laptop, in the office, sitting next to someone who was essentially my boss.
I wouldn't want to still be doing that, and there are plenty of posts I've made lamenting the work/trading situation, but in the end I've been very lucky to be in a situation where I can try to make this happen and I'm quite happy right now. Some of it was my own doing, some ot it was just luck, if you can call a global pandemic forcing me to work from home "luck".
In the end, i think the contributing factors here are:
- Are you in a work situation where you feel established, and have a good relationship with your team and team-leads/bosses/directors, etc.?
- Can you learn to handle distractions and weigh your priorities effectively?
- Can you learn to trade in such a way that you don't have to be hanging on the edge of every tick? Timeframe and Psychology matter here in my humble experience.
I haven't mastered any of this but for me,
- work always comes first until the point where trading is far exceeding work income, which is not the case for me right now, so always tend to your main income-stream/non-trading career first and foremost.
- keep colleagues and bosses happy (unless you are the boss), they won't be worrying about what you're up to if you always deliver.
- From the trading side, if you can find enough time to select entries/stops/targets, enter trades and then detach yourself from the outcome, that is a big portion of the battle right there. I am TERRIBLE at detaching myself from the outcome, so I am constantly killing winners quickly, its something I am always working on, it may partially be work-related but I think there are probably other personal mental factors causing this behavior for me. Ideally, I would forget about the outcome and just do some work until the next setup and that is the goal I'm currently working on, one of them anyway.
I think @SMCJB's argument for automation is worth investigating too, if you are interested.
