Has anyone ever heard of Felton Trading? (www.feltontrading.com) - futures io
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Has anyone ever heard of Felton Trading? (www.feltontrading.com)


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Has anyone ever heard of Felton Trading? (www.feltontrading.com)

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  #321 (permalink)
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  #322 (permalink)
Bala, PA, USA
 
Experience: Intermediate
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Big Mike View Post
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I think the discussion serves to justify or not, Felton's view on why he does not trade live while moderating his trading room.

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  #323 (permalink)
Toronto, ON
 
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monpere View Post
I think the discussion serves to justify or not, Felton's view on why he does not trade live while moderating his trading room.

I agree with monpere. In trying to assess the merits of any product it is immediately relevant whether or not the sales agent uses the product or not. Would you buy a car from a used salesman that he refuses to ride in and insists you both take a ride in his gee whiz car simulator instead? If he won't run it on the road, should you?

I looked at this system last year and lost all interest in Felton when I heard him arguing that sim trading was an adequate test of the tools he is peddling. Anyone who thinks sim trading is the same as real trading is either smoking something or selling recycled snake oil and does not have your best interest at heart.

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  #324 (permalink)
Bala, PA, USA
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NinjaTrader
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Trading: SPY, Oil, Euro
 
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exiledgoblin View Post
I agree with monpere. In trying to assess the merits of any product it is immediately relevant whether or not the sales agent uses the product or not. Would you buy a car from a used salesman that he refuses to ride in and insists you both take a ride in his gee whiz car simulator instead? If he won't run it on the road, should you?

I looked at this system last year and lost all interest in Felton when I heard him arguing that sim trading was an adequate test of the tools he is peddling. Anyone who thinks sim trading is the same as real trading is either smoking something or selling recycled snake oil and does not have your best interest at heart.

Bottom line is, whether or not a vendor trades live or sim, has no bearing on how YOU will perform using that method. So, to me it doesn't matter. The vendor doesn't have to trade the method at all for that matter, he doesn't even have to be a trader! For me, he just has to have a viable idea, I will run with that idea and determine if that idea will work for me or not.

Never believe anything any vendor ever says, no matter how awesome it seems. You take that concept home, kick the tires and put it through the paces. That is what will determine if that method will work for you. The vendor trading live or sim is immaterial. He could trade that discretionary method live and make a gazillion dollars in front of your eyes, so you buy that method, and you lose your pants in 3 days. Beyond that method itself, your own discretionary input and trading approach will determine your success with it, not if the vendor trades it live or sim.

I am mainly a divergence trader. I am not a Felton supporter, nor opponent, but I initially learned divergence from Roger Felton years ago, yet I could not become profitable with divergence until I grew as a trader, studied other people's approaches to divergence, and developed my own trading style using divergence. I now trade divergence quite differently then Roger. Although I was never profitable trading his method exactly how he taught it, I did learn quite a bit from his ideas, and his approach and views on the subject, just as I learned other aspects of divergence from a couple of other vendors as well.

I use to believe that a vendor should trade live also, but as I grew as a trader, I've come to realize that a vendor's trading or lack thereof, will not guarantee my success. My own handling of the method is the only thing that determines how that method will perform for me.

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  #325 (permalink)
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monpere View Post
Bottom line is, whether or not a vendor trades live or sim, has no bearing on how YOU will perform using that method.

.
.
.

The vendor trading live or sim is immaterial.

Except when some vendors list his "track record" like a spreadsheet, with all the money you could have made trading his system, and none of those trades were taken live - or in some cases, some vendors are known for not being clear about what they call as trades in the room, and the winners show up in the "track record" report on the website but losers are no where to be found.

@monpere, would you stop trading your system live, and instead only trade it sim and run a room selling those signals?

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  #326 (permalink)
Bala, PA, USA
 
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Big Mike View Post
Except when some vendors list his "track record" like a spreadsheet, with all the money you could have made trading his system, and none of those trades were taken live - or in some cases, some vendors are known for not being clear about what they call as trades in the room, and the winners show up in the "track record" report on the website but losers are no where to be found.

@monpere, would you stop trading your system live, and instead only trade it sim and run a room selling those signals?

Mike

Agreed, that actually was one of my issues with Felton. The track record would show many trades that were never even mentioned in the trade room. It should not be touted as a track record, it is just a list of signals as defined by the method. Many of those trades he was not able to identify in real time while watching the market. Some of those signals might have been impossible to enter due to various market conditions.

Overall, I think people should approach trade rooms with the intent of learning something that will grow them as a trader. If you are looking for the method that will make you profitable the moment you open the box, you will be often disappointed.

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  #327 (permalink)
siam, west coast andaman sea
 
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<in reference to felton himself and his trading, what he would and would not do.... and what is he up to now; really do not mean much at presence, as he is not able to say anything any more in response to what we say here and now.... roger has been kicked out of this trading community for good. however roger himself, i believe, is still interested in this thread about his feltonian livelihood>

furthermore, am also trying to find out whose expressed opinion here really at the final analyses is more reliable and profitable as well, as far as trading is concerned?

sometimes, by reading written expression from some traders whom you thought you knew at bmt, you kinda believed that they were reasonable traders. at other time, like today, i wondered if i myself really have a decent brain left to follow what went on around here.... L O L

just what do these statements mean in relation to helping traders toward adequately learning to trade, trading for profit or trading toward greater profitability?

1....In trying to assess the merits of any product it is immediately relevant whether or not the sales agent uses the product or not. Would you buy a car from a used salesman that he refuses to ride in....

probably vendors just want to make a buck or two from those overly anxious wannabes....

2....Anyone who thinks sim trading is the same as real trading is either smoking something or selling recycled snake oil and does not have your best interest at heart....

vendors probably just want you to believe that whatever they are showing you, would enrich you as well, at the end....

3....The vendor doesn't have to trade the method at all for that matter, he doesn't even have to be a trader!....

now, here is a seemingly revolutionary idea on trading.... wonder if the trader meant what it said....
that one can teach me to snow ski, if and when the purported instructors do not ski himself or herself....

4....would you stop trading your system live, and instead only trade it sim and run a room selling those signals?....

in more likelihood than not, a profitable trader would just keep on trading until his setups disrupt his earnings so much so that the trader needs to do something else, other than trading live and for profit....

then he/she could use his former profitable setups and experiences to convince other wannabes to part with their hard earned euro....
----------------------------
what happens here, happens across the board. there are always those, some even with good intention and all; trying their darnest in the name of HELPING, ASSISTING, EDUCATING, ENHANCING AND ENRICHING..... in so many different ways--to get money or something equivalence from you....

if you are just starting out in learning to trade, you probably won't know nor notice the differences among bmt and other trading forums on the net;
at bmt here, you are pretty safe with your money, there are much fewer vendors on the take...
besides what you need to become reasonably successful and consistent in trading is practically free here.

most enchanting is.... most abled coders, programmers et al would construct and make your dream-indicators or likewise.... come true;
but whether or not, they are tradeable and/or profitable are different matter altogether.

THIS IS JUST MY PERSONAL OBS, k? and--no, i have no biz association with big mike nor any of his biz, just wanna make it abundantly transparent. just a one man opinion which could differ significantly from your own thoughts, belief systems and trading philosophy and practice. wishing everyone profitable and happy trading. cheers.

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  #328 (permalink)
Market Wizard
Quebec
 
Experience: Intermediate
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Big Mike View Post
...
@monpere, would you stop trading your system live, and instead only trade it sim and run a room selling those signals?

Mike

In my opinion, a much better scenario would be for him to manage multiple accounts and take a cut on each profitable trade. This way people would not need to learn how to trade and could still keep their main occupation or be at the beach all day long while monpere would be busy killing the markets for him and everyone else.

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  #329 (permalink)
somewhere, brazil
 
Experience: Intermediate
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Trading: forex
 
Posts: 60 since Jul 2011
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Hey Guys!

Cloudy, you'll probably remember me because I was sending you my terminal results. Nakachalet, I was the guy that was always talking about double-tops and double-bottoms. I disappeared from trading for a few months because I have been remodling an apartment. I'm still not done yet! I stepped away because I couldn't be at the screen in the morning, and longer-term trades don't seem to work with my personality/risk tolerance.

Now, today was the first day in a LONG while (3-4 months) that I sat at the screen. It's tough!! It's hard to stay focused and interested. My opinion from watching the trials is that Roger is a decent guy with a decent system. The problem, I think for Roger is that I can't find anyone on any serious message boards who have paid for his course that come here to show terminal real trading software results. (Most of us just "tried out" his limited services to non-members). He offered to train someone in another forum for free; I would take him up on an offer like that!! At the end of the "training", even if the styles don't match, then you have a live room that you can go to to hear people doing the same thing as you're doing. It would help to stay focused I think. That would definitely be in Roger's best business interest: he trains someone who is the member of a "community" to honestly tell/show other people how they are doing. Well, if he wants to do that, he knows where I'm at.

Yeah, back when members of futures.io (formerly BMT) could see the trials, I also got wrapped up in the live -vs- demo trading. But being away has given me some time to think about it: it's impossible to anwer questions, and risk live money. The only thing lacking, IMO, is the NinjaTrader results INSTEAD OF speadsheets, or show both. The trading software-generated results (terminal results) are hard to fake. Demo or Live. The only time I have seen where this becomes an issue is when profit targets are VERY SMALL (3-4 ticks). Demo trading is an immediate fill whereas live trading usually has to contend with a higher spreads. I still believe that the basis of his system is sound because I have been using something similar for a while now.

In the meantime, if there're any real paid-up customers who are using his software, I'm sure people are still curious to hear the results. Good or bad. I hope good though because I NEVER see anything positive about vendors. I like to think there are more honest people out there, and not just tricksters.

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  #330 (permalink)
somewhere, brazil
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: metatrader
Trading: forex
 
Posts: 60 since Jul 2011
Thanks: 0 given, 23 received



trendisyourfriend View Post
In my opinion, a much better scenario would be for him to manage multiple accounts and take a cut on each profitable trade. This way people would not need to learn how to trade and could still keep their main occupation or be at the beach all day long while monpere would be busy killing the markets for him and everyone else.

Agreed. But nowadays there are things like ZuluTrade and other trade copiers that weren't around 20 years ago. They say that at an older age, it's harder to get used to new things. BTW - I read that there are a few traders at Zulu that have so much money following them, they easily make over $1 million a month. (Personally, I would never let someone else trade my money out-of existence!, no matter what their past performance shows.)

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