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Exactly! That is the first thing people have to understand when they want to buy an (expensive) indicator. Why would anyone in their right mind sell you a tool, that is making them rich? That does not happen.
And oh my god have I seen scammers selling this... Something like: Here is my "live" stream where you can see that this tool makes me 5000 dollar in 15 minutes, everyday! And I sell it to you for 500 dollars.
Everyone needs to understand that this is never going to happen!
I found this conversation to be very interesting. So here is my 2 cents worth. I have been a broker in the late 1980s and early 1990s. I have observations based on decades of learning. Trading. Developing trading systems. Spending time in various trading rooms and taking courses with educators and vendors.
In my observation most trading coaches and vendors are pure grifters. The grifter may have been lucky in the 1980s with a massive return and has built up a magic money machine selling training courses, indicators, books, newsletters.
Or the grifter can claim to be a high achieving athlete like a world class competitor, a chiropractor, or an engineer, a former bank trader. The grift is to be offering a Magic Money Machine for a very small fee based on bait and switch tactic. For instance: "I was a chiropractor then I turned to be a forex trader and for a small sum of several thousand dollars I will teach you the 10 trading setups which just work."
Or, I made millions in some trading competition in 1980s and I have been selling software indicators, books and newsletters for decades and everyone who follows me makes money consistently so it would be the best money you could ever spend is to pay me $5,000 for a training course. But I will never show you my trades over the last 2 years. But just trust me.
I am not saying that every educator/indicator/ newsletter seller is a grifter. I have actually incountered several I could whole heartedly recommend.
I would insist that a prospective service provider who claims to be a trader provide me with a validated broker statement of the last 300 trades or the last 5 years of active live trading.
If this information is unavailable I would suggest to quickly move on, regardless of how sexy and convincing the grift may sound.
Teaching others how to make money trafing the markets is an industy of its own.
Insist on valudation based on recent trade data, not tade data in some competition 35 years ago or happy client testimonials. Most loosing traders blame themself and are often too embarrassed to admit the con.
Understand that Trade Entries are the least important part of long term sussess. Risk management and trade exits are.
Understand that the magic money machine for traders does not exist.
Understand that one can learn from many sources and eventually evolve to be long term profitable after managing to navigate one's own psyche and organise useful information and knowledge in a personal way.
I am so sick and tired hearing about traders who demo trade for months making over a 200 percent per month and then blowing up a live account in 3 weeks. It makes me very sad.
I have personally never charged a cent to share my opinions and lessons. I am not a vendor.
I would imagine some of my opinions may infuriate others. Well, so be it.
That is an easy answer. It is because trading vendors and trading teachers can not make money trading. They make money teaching trading to people who want to learn how to trade.
Those that can trade , trade and make money.
Those who can not trade, sell trading information and products for money.
If I am making +$100,000 per year trading, WHY in the WORLD would I want to teach someone how to trade when I just scale up contracts size and make $1 Million a year? That would be dumb of me.
Anyone selling trading services or product or book or indicator without a recent +1 year trading record is scamming and lying and trying to get rich through selling dreams. Period.
We all grown adults, lets call it like it is and stop all this child play.
Making $100,000 per year trading is like having a 100k 9-5 job. To gain more freedom and diversify the income streams, one can think about adding additional passive income streams by creating a vendor or a trading teaching businesses.
As a business oriented person, I think about trading as an income stream, If I can use my trading skills to create another income stream I will do it. This will not question my trading capabilities nor experience
His point is if you are making $100K per year trading, then you can make $200K or $300K by scaling up in size. Now, there are limits on practical size trades because of slippage, but you would simply be trading multiple markets at once.
He does have a point: those who can, do ... those who cannot, teach! But trading is a lonely business and some people may want to run rooms to help others and have company while they trade. Of course that is a far cry from teaching classes and writing books!
Persistence! Nothing in the world can take the place of persistence.
Talent will not ... nothing is more common than unsuccessful men with talent.
Genius will not ... Unrewarded genius is almost a proverb.
Education will not ... The world is full of educated derelicts.
Persistence and determination alone are omnipotent! Calvin Coolidge
I don't think it is a question of lonelyness and company. trading is a risky activity. If you achieve generating 100k trading than you didn't really hit the jackpot. Yes you can scale up but what about the month you get ill or you can't trade. I see it as another form of job. it takes your precious time, it is stressful and risky. I like to mitigate risk with a business on the side
But the idea (expressed above, as if it were "factual") that someone selling trading education services and/or products somehow proves that they can't trade is both a counsel of despair and an obviously mistaken belief.
(When I see people saying that someone who can successfully do something that's very well paid would never be writing books or giving lectures about it, I always instinctively want to ask them how they wanted their lawyer, their dentist, their surgeon to get educated and qualified, if not partly by reading books and watching lectures, and who did they want to write those books and deliver those lectures?)
One of the keys to what is being said, is that, there is a tremendous amount of traders who were professionals, and very successful, before the year 2000. After the year 2000, they failed to be able to make money. If they had enough money to retire, they retired. Some need to make money some other way as they have no other skills. Some after retiring maybe wrote a book about their trading, maybe even told what their strategies were. The problem is, it doesn't work in today's market.
Patterns of volume were much different when liquidity was provided manually. Now, it is provided algorithmically by liquidity providers. Manual liquidity providing caused these consistent patterns of volume, where the volume would increase as the price went up in a trend. When it corrected, the volume would decrease, in very pretty patterns.
This happened because of the way the markets such as futures markets work and why the price moves. At each tick level in the futures market, a set of limit orders is provided. In order to move price up through that tick, aggressive market order buyers must buy all the limit order contracts that are provided in that tick level. When price goes up through a lot of levels, they say that the limit order book was swept. Now, there are no limit orders at those price levels. If there continued to be no limit orders at those levels, price could go all the way back down through the levels if only 1 single contract was sold. However, if the levels are filled back in, price must follow those same rules on the way back down, and market orders must sell through all the contracts at those levels.
When liquidity was provided manually, it took time to fill those levels back up. That allowed corrections to fall more on less volume. Now, since liquidity is provided algorithmically, it takes very little time to fill those levels back up. That vastly changed the way that the volume indicator works in the markets. So, now, we have a bunch of deadbeat prior professionals selling trading products that are worthless.
