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Top Dog Trading (www.topdogtrading.com)


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Top Dog Trading (www.topdogtrading.com)

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  #1 (permalink)
 tosmonkey 
Daly City, California, USA
 
 
Posts: 18 since Sep 2010

A free training video. Talks about the five "energies" of trading. stock market trading and forex trading strategy - TopDogIntroWebinar I would say this is good for beginning traders.

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  #3 (permalink)
 tosmonkey 
Daly City, California, USA
 
 
Posts: 18 since Sep 2010


of his trading methodology:

You want a trend that is strong... at the right time... with support at your back.... confirmed by a bigger scale.

Elegant in its simplicity.

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  #4 (permalink)
 vegasfoster 
las vegas
 
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I watched the 5 day video and it was pretty good. That said, the whole 5 day concept didn't make any sense to me and I didn't learn anything new, but he pulled everything together into a complete method. I wasn't especially motivated to purchase anything beyond the free info though and I also didn't care for the hard sell I got after the fact. One thing is they kept sending me subsquent emails with lower and lower prices on their training videos. I don't know if they have the same marketing strategy, but if you are interested you might try waiting a week or so after you watch the videos and see what happens, you may be able to get it for a lot cheaper.

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  #5 (permalink)
 Mickey Caine 
Kent, England
 
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I purchased his course some time ago now. In my humble opinion I thought it was an excellent course for someone starting out in trading.

You are right regarding the price going up and down. I cannot remember the figure I paid now, but within a day or so of purchasing I received another email offering it at a cheaper price. I then sent an amusing (IMO) email complaining that I had miss timed my entry into his course. I received a reply within minutes, and he refuned me the difference straight away.

I would recommend him highly.

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  #6 (permalink)
 dsherman 
Michigan
 
Experience: Intermediate
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If I were to guess, I think Barry makes most of his money selling information.

Body Balance and Life Force International Top MLM Distributor - MLM Network Marketing Loser Makes Millions with Life Force International and Body Balance

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  #7 (permalink)
Martin Dunne
SF, Glendale
 
 
Posts: 6 since Jan 2011
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dsherman View Post
If I were to guess, I think Barry makes most of his money selling information.

Well, at least he has the integrity of revealing his full name and full business address instead of calling himself "Big Barry" (or even "Huge Barry" if he really wanted to impress suckers).

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  #8 (permalink)
 cory 
the coin hunter
virginia
 
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actually not a bad video, his one innovative is calling stochastic 'up/down cycle'
https://connectpro58377496.connectpro.acrobat.com/p59144995/?launcher=false&fcsContent=true&pbMode=normal

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  #9 (permalink)
 Ken F 
Asheboro, NC
 
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I bought the Top Dog Trading courses 1 and 2 and also the Invisible Edge Day trading course. Haven't subscribed
to his newsletter but probably will at a later time. This is not the holy grail of trading but it has gotten me on the right
track. I can only trade 1 day a week but have stopped losing money for the last 2 months thanks to this course.
One problem I see on this forum is members downloading indicators and then asking how to use them.
At TDT, Burns gives you a complete understanding of the indicators he uses. He does sell his custom indicators
but he also gives the settings for standard indicators that work just as well.
Yes, I do get emails trying to sell me something else but you can always unsubscribe if you feel the need.
Probably catch a lot of flack for this but I like the course. If you have a system that works for you, you don 't
need TDT, however if you are struggling , it might be worth a look.

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  #10 (permalink)
 GoldStandard 
arizona
 
Experience: Intermediate
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I can't say how good his paid material is, but based on his free material Barry does have a gift for explaining trading concepts in a clear and intuitive way.

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  #11 (permalink)
 bnichols 
Dartmouth NS
 
Experience: Intermediate
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His continuous & unabashed if somewhat less than slick self promotion is a little off-putting but I bought his course a couple of weeks ago out of curiosity, hoping to get a different perspective on my new obsession with short time frame spot Forex. I still consider it a worthwhile investment for me personally at this stage and perhaps cheap at a multiple of the price for traders in a similar situation (needing reassurance that potentially a programmable strategy does exist for short time frame spot Forex), as long as they are able to actually learn his methods & follow them to the letter--rule # 1 when system trading; namely stick to the rules long enough for probabilities to kick in, which can take months.

I don't mean to shill and this should not be construed as a recommendation but ..... I also trust his 90-day money back guarantee even if I have no intention of testing it--the info I purchased has already paid for itself--simply because I tend to "buy [what I perceive to be] the man" (even the politician on rare occasions) rather than the promises and so far Barry Burns appears to be the real deal. Also, a back of the envelope calculation suggests to me his traveling dog & pony show alone may pay him in the 6-figures, and that's without knowing what NT is paying him as a sponsor to flog their platform, which seems to support his claim that as a long-time profitable trader and self-styled educator he can afford to do what he wants to do, and appears to be legitimately qualified to do.

Edited to add: personally (familiar with the rudiments of C# & NT indicator development) I wouldn't buy his indicators since they're easily programmable

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  #12 (permalink)
 Cloudy 
desert CA
 
Experience: Intermediate
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I bought into his foundations course 1 and 2 some years ago. I also subscribed to his video newsletter for a while. He recorded a few live sessions but always seemed to scratch out, and his regular review videos consisted of scrolling back and forth on the "left side of the chart" and would even fudge his "rules". I lost money with his system. I was over leveraged, so part of that was my fault. But his 5 energies system did not work short term or long term.

There is a little value for his course and materials for the beginner if you don't mind paying a few hundred on how to learn to use the stochastic indicator and learn about divergences. And he does have a pleasant , friendly teacher's demeanor in his presentations and has done a lot of amalgamation of trading material out there to create his own lessons for beginning traders. But to this day, I don't believe he trades or is a successful trader outside of his educational product. Since then, I've seen real traders make profitable trades live, and I never saw that in his live recorded videos. You can find good working systems right here on futures.io (formerly BMT) such as Perry, ESFX, Al Brooks, CJBooths, Italian Job, or Fat Tails, and others that are far superior to the "5 energies" system.

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  #13 (permalink)
 DBraun126 
Atlanta, GA USA
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NinjaTrader (eod), Tradestation
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Posts: 17 since Sep 2011
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Well, BB has a GoToMeeting webinar coming-up tomorrow, in which he'll give away his "free indicator for pinpointing entries with Swiss clock precision." He says it's already in your trading software, but needs his (not the default) settings.

I assume, from this thread, it's Stochastic, and am wondering if any of you already know the inputs.

And, if anyone's interested, here's a link for the webinar - I got via e-mail:

https://www2.gotomeeting.com/register/561208202

Dennis

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  #14 (permalink)
 Ken F 
Asheboro, NC
 
Experience: Intermediate
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This is a followup to a post I made last year about TDT.
I no longer use his indicators or follow his trading methods. There are much better free indicators and methods on this
website than what TDT offers.
Emailed him a couple of times about seeing some of his live trades and kept getting BS about too difficult to trade
and narrate at the same time. However, he doesn't seem to have a problem talking and using replay mode to
trade. Soon after purchasing his course the calls started wanting me to pay several thousand dollars to receive
private tutoring, seems like a never ending cycle.
There is some value in the TDT trading courses but there is more in an elite futures.io (formerly BMT) membership.

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  #15 (permalink)
 Cloudy 
desert CA
 
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An update from me too. I noticed topdogtrading no longer has the "price action course". Check out forexpeacearmy reviews of tdt. No wonder, I remember seeing the outline of the price action course which looked almost like a point by point table of contents for Al Brook's original book. I remember I got the spam emails where BBurns kept saying the price action course is opening soon, as he was still doing his "research", no doubt trying to sift through Brook's hard to read personal jargon, lol. This site is a "regurgitator" site similar to anything by Mark Deaton. You got invites to private tutoring costing thousands? Amazing! That's news to me. I guess elitetrader and forexpeacearmy has done some good and really helped people be more informed in the past couple of years. Agreed, for sure you get ten times more value with a futures.io (formerly BMT) elite membership.

Other review threads
https://208.234.169.12/vb/printthread.php?threadid=219601

https://www.forexpeacearmy.com/public/review/www.topdogtrading.com

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  #16 (permalink)
 rdtw 
Des Moines Iowa United States
 
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Cloudy View Post
An update from me too. I noticed topdogtrading no longer has the "price action course". Check out forexpeacearmy reviews of tdt. No wonder, I remember seeing the outline of the price action course which looked almost like a point by point table of contents for Al Brook's original book. I remember I got the spam emails where BBurns kept saying the price action course is opening soon, as he was still doing his "research", no doubt trying to sift through Brook's hard to read personal jargon, lol. This site is a "regurgitator" site similar to anything by Mark Deaton. You got invites to private tutoring costing thousands? Amazing! That's news to me. I guess elitetrader and forexpeacearmy has done some good and really helped people be more informed in the past couple of years. Agreed, for sure you get ten times more value with a futures.io (formerly BMT) elite membership.

WOOT! WOOT!

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  #17 (permalink)
 sharmas 
Auckland
 
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Hi team

Did anyone attend the webinar yesterday.


Sharmas

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  #18 (permalink)
 rdtw 
Des Moines Iowa United States
 
Experience: Intermediate
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sharmas View Post
Hi team

Did anyone attend the webinar yesterday.


Sharmas

I showed up late and wasn't let in ... recording maybe?

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  #19 (permalink)
 Cloudy 
desert CA
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NT7, SC, ToS
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Trading: CL,NQ,YM
 
Posts: 2,135 since Jul 2011
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A recent video linked from his website:


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  #20 (permalink)
 papa15 
Wake Forest, NC
 
Experience: Intermediate
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DBraun126 View Post
Well, BB has a GoToMeeting webinar coming-up tomorrow, in which he'll give away his "free indicator for pinpointing entries with Swiss clock precision." He says it's already in your trading software, but needs his (not the default) settings.

I assume, from this thread, it's Stochastic, and am wondering if any of you already know the inputs.

And, if anyone's interested, here's a link for the webinar - I got via e-mail:

https://www2.gotomeeting.com/register/561208202

Dennis

I just watched a recording of his webinar. The stoch input is %D 3, %K 5, smooth 2, displacement 0, use 20/80 for oversold/overbought, and calculate on bar close FALSE. This is a free video, so I don't think I am giving away the store

My focus is on:
1. Avoid the opening chop.
2. Honor stops
3. Ensure reward > risk on all trades
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  #21 (permalink)
 Cloudy 
desert CA
 
Experience: Intermediate
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Not at all. Good observations. I would venture to say it's pretty much what the basic course pt1 and 2 covers:

( Like what is a stoch. What's a macd? what's divergence? Write a journal. (a page to photocopy) Record results. Look for conjunction of the "five energies". (basic indicators, a mov avg cross, and a 5 or 3:1 extra chart) And practice practice. )


I still have the course printed(used up my color ink cartridges then) out in some binder filling up space somewhere.

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  #22 (permalink)
 bnichols 
Dartmouth NS
 
Experience: Intermediate
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Broker: IB / IQFeed / Kids
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IMO pretty much all a beginner can take away from a discussion of this sort is that different folks use different systems, and that at some point it's up to the beginner to bite the bullet and start using one and preferably several of them in order to truly grasp whereof the others speak. The value of evaluating a number of systems for one's self lies in different perspectives provided by different approaches to a common goal. IMO there are 2 seemingly contradictory sides to the issue--on the one hand it's not possible to determine whether a system is right for you based solely on other peoples' experience or advice; whereas I also believe one system is as good as another if you're willing & able to become a disciple.

[As a sidebar I should probably point out the propensity not to accept opinion no matter what the authority until one has proven it for one's self is not a universal character trait and not necessarily a good thing even if good can come from it. In fact this trait often has a downside of which I became aware while still a toddler. By ignoring repeated commands for example not to touch the hot stove, play with knives or climb onto the roof of the house I came to learn there might be no harm in accepting one's parents' advice at face value occasionally, particularly if they are screaming].

I studied a number of systems including most described on this site more or less systematically before stumbling across BB, and stuck with BB simply because it seemed to fit me and my target market (shortish time frame spot currency) best, the possibility aside that while its cost was immaterial to me it may be a factor for some. This doesn't mean I ignore components of Fat Tails, Al Brooks, Perry and other systems (e.g. particularly when trying to estimate market sentiment or pick a precise entry) because IMO the latter made a science out of these aspects of trading. Unfortunately I'm not capable of the kind of focus required e.g. to evaluate price action tick by tick for any length of time--makes me want to tear my hair out--but don't deny that others are, and thereby make an excellent living trading relatively large dollar amounts per tick for a few points at a time. There are caveats, exceptions to the rules and some degree of hand-waving in all of the systems I've tested--none of them do the trading for us--but IMO this is simply indicative of what the trader needs to bring to the table; namely, an ability gained from experience to resolve apparent ambiguity inherent in the chosen method.

To summarize, what seems obvious to me is the market is the only given. It therefore also seems obvious a system that demonstrates positive expectancy for one trader must have elements in common with another system that performs as well for another trader. In other words, the debate over which system is superior reminds me of the debate between the blind men over the characteristics of the same elephant, in that all systems attempt to make sense of the same thing yet from somewhat different perspectives. For example, it seems to me qualitatively that Al Brooks microtrend breakouts, H/L 1&2 refer to approximately the same phenomena as BB's mini divergences in stochastics. In general it's not the difference in detail that matters as much as whether the approach strikes the proper chord in the brain of the trader, promotes objectivity within a trader's field of perception.

ETA: I want to add as an addendum that for me the process of learning a system, perhaps becoming a "disciple", has been iterative rather than a one-step process. While trading a system causes changes in the brain that reinforce original learning and improve execution I also forget things and pick up or resume bad habits that degrade performance, and a periodic review of all the systems I have some knowledge of helps determine whether I'm backsliding, often explains why profits are beginning to degrade. In addition, when reviewing the material I pick up nuances that I missed the first time through that contribute to the system's edge, and seem to come away with a deeper appreciation of what I thought I already knew. While in the early days I dismissed MACD and stochastics as beginner tools, too simple for Serious Traders, these days I'm almost in awe of them. This is as true of BB as Al Brooks' system, IIRC Brooks himself making a claim something to the effect that the amount of information in a 5 minute chart is far vaster than he can use. I'm guessing the treasure trove of info may not have been apparent to him the first time he looked at a chart

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  #23 (permalink)
 bnichols 
Dartmouth NS
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: MC, MC.Net, NT, TWS
Broker: IB / IQFeed / Kids
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BTW for S/R no matter what the system I depend heavily on Murrey Math (implementation of Gann lines as near as I can tell), PriorDayOHLC and pivots--not big on Fib myself.

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  #24 (permalink)
 wwhittin 
Houston, Texas, USA
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: TOS
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I bought the TDT method from Barry Burns at the recommendation of a friend. She had met Barry and felt that his methodology reflected his study of several other gurus. And, that Barry had the ability to analyze the methods of others to create an effective and eazy to understand method of his own. While his method did not work for me at the time, I do not think his method was at fault. I believe the fault was my own. I would rate him high on openness, honesty and desire to help others. Doesn't just about any method give us the edge we need if we can just implement it? I believe his does. But, so far I have moved on evaluating other methods. Frankly, (confession follows), I find an edge that seems to work, start back testing it and before I can finish my testing I find other ideas. Does anyone else suffer from the ability to focus?

Walt from Houston

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  #25 (permalink)
 Cloudy 
desert CA
 
Experience: Intermediate
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Trading: CL,NQ,YM
 
Posts: 2,135 since Jul 2011
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I would have to say the method is at fault. It isn't a consistent enough system. There are better methods shared here on futures.io (formerly BMT). Viewing some of Barry's live webinars he was just "scratching" trades or breaking his own system's rules. And he didn't do too many live videos. Most of the time it was scrolling from the left side of the chart while commenting. TDT material is fun to read and may be useful for an absolute beginner. But you can get better intro material free by just reading the information here at futures.io (formerly BMT). Some intro threads in the beginner's area recommended: "take the inexpensive route" (great trading psychology posts) , "introductory trading videos" and the futures.io (formerly BMT) youtube videos.

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  #26 (permalink)
 Cloudy 
desert CA
 
Experience: Intermediate
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posting recent ad link just for fun. looks more like a "Dr." now.

stock market trading and forex trading strategy - AdvancedCoursePromo

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  #27 (permalink)
 trendisyourfriend 
Market Wizard
Quebec
 
Experience: Intermediate
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Cloudy View Post
posting recent ad link just for fun. looks more like a "Dr." now.

stock market trading and forex trading strategy - AdvancedCoursePromo

Do you really want to see something real funny then don't look no further :
Forex Trading Workshop

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  #28 (permalink)
 Cloudy 
desert CA
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NT7, SC, ToS
Broker: AMP, DT, TDA
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Posts: 2,135 since Jul 2011
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haha, good one Tiyf. Here's another one.

(Be sure to block cookies and have your browser tracking cookies-blocker plugin on)

Emini Success Formula 2.0 Mentoring Program

And what a riot list of "testimonials". Like everyone's retail trading dreams came true.

Be wary, this guy has like more than 10 different web pages trying to get your email.
Better to do private browsing , and don't enter anything in.

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  #29 (permalink)
 tickscalper 
Phoenix, Az
 
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I first started trading futures with Barry Burns method, and after about 1.5 years of Sim trading was unable to turn a profit. I guess the reason I continued on was I liked the way he taught, and believed that I was at fault in trading the system. Also I am in college and am able to trade most mornings.

What I found was using the Stochastic his way(waiting for the bar to close and entering a tick above) often got you into the trade much too late to make any profit. The systems stops (swing low) were constantly hit as they are quite close to the entry. And if you always wait for the mini-divergence pattern you often miss many good trades. Unfortunately, I bought almost all his course's expect Fibonacci's. Luckily for me I never paid for the live training.

The only value I found in all his stuff, was the basic understanding of Stochastics, MACD, basic price patterns and some money management techniques, most of which can be learned for free.

I write this for others who may be going through the course's wondering if it's there understanding of the system or the system itself. For me it was the system. I am not sure if Barry trades and makes money with this system, or if he use's it in a more discretionary way from what he teaches. I have found more value in 2 months in futures.io (formerly BMT) than all my time with Top Dog method. I would recommend listening to FT71 or Dionysus Toast for some guidance, and then try to come up with your own style of trading. It is hard to learn the holy grail of trading is you.

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 WISDOM 
TUCSON, AZ/USA
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: NINJATRADER
Trading: ES
 
Posts: 11 since Mar 2014
Thanks: 1 given, 36 received

I have taken nearly all of Barry Burns courses including the latest advance course ($1,000). I have all of his indicators and still use them on my charts. Here is my take:

1. I have logged hundreds of trades using the Top Dog method. I have analyzed each setup and graded the setup and my money management of the trade. In short, over 80% of good setups and good money money management make money.
2. With the addition of the "Advanced" setups and indicators, the trading system is complicated and takes a significant amount of time to master.
3. Barry relies almost exclusively on his indicators and as a result many good trades would not be considered. Over the past several weeks I have started to apply "Price Action" techniques to my trading and have seen even better results. In fact, I would state that price action now takes precedence over the indicators.
4. I did subscribe to the news letter, but canceled because there was nothing new coming out of the videos.
5. He does response to questions but it make take 2-4 days in order to get a response.


Overall, I would recommend Barry and his Top Dog method. It is a solid system but it requires machine like discipline and total and complete concentration.

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 forgiven 
Fletcher NC
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: nijia trader
Broker: A.M.P. I.Q. ....C.Q.G.
Trading: ym es
 
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vegasfoster View Post
I watched the 5 day video and it was pretty good. That said, the whole 5 day concept didn't make any sense to me and I didn't learn anything new, but he pulled everything together into a complete method. I wasn't especially motivated to purchase anything beyond the free info though and I also didn't care for the hard sell I got after the fact. One thing is they kept sending me subsquent emails with lower and lower prices on their training videos. I don't know if they have the same marketing strategy, but if you are interested you might try waiting a week or so after you watch the videos and see what happens, you may be able to get it for a lot cheaper.

i did not get much out of it...most of the stuff you can get free...

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 TraderYoda 
Hampshire / United kingdom
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NinjaTrader
Broker: FXCM
Trading: Forex (Spot)
 
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bnichols View Post
IMO pretty much all a beginner can take away from a discussion of this sort is that different folks use different systems, and that at some point it's up to the beginner to bite the bullet and start using one and preferably several of them in order to truly grasp whereof the others speak. The value of evaluating a number of systems for one's self lies in different perspectives provided by different approaches to a common goal. IMO there are 2 seemingly contradictory sides to the issue--on the one hand it's not possible to determine whether a system is right for you based solely on other peoples' experience or advice; whereas I also believe one system is as good as another if you're willing & able to become a disciple.

[As a sidebar I should probably point out the propensity not to accept opinion no matter what the authority until one has proven it for one's self is not a universal character trait and not necessarily a good thing even if good can come from it. In fact this trait often has a downside of which I became aware while still a toddler. By ignoring repeated commands for example not to touch the hot stove, play with knives or climb onto the roof of the house I came to learn there might be no harm in accepting one's parents' advice at face value occasionally, particularly if they are screaming].

I studied a number of systems including most described on this site more or less systematically before stumbling across BB, and stuck with BB simply because it seemed to fit me and my target market (shortish time frame spot currency) best, the possibility aside that while its cost was immaterial to me it may be a factor for some. This doesn't mean I ignore components of Fat Tails, Al Brooks, Perry and other systems (e.g. particularly when trying to estimate market sentiment or pick a precise entry) because IMO the latter made a science out of these aspects of trading. Unfortunately I'm not capable of the kind of focus required e.g. to evaluate price action tick by tick for any length of time--makes me want to tear my hair out--but don't deny that others are, and thereby make an excellent living trading relatively large dollar amounts per tick for a few points at a time. There are caveats, exceptions to the rules and some degree of hand-waving in all of the systems I've tested--none of them do the trading for us--but IMO this is simply indicative of what the trader needs to bring to the table; namely, an ability gained from experience to resolve apparent ambiguity inherent in the chosen method.

To summarize, what seems obvious to me is the market is the only given. It therefore also seems obvious a system that demonstrates positive expectancy for one trader must have elements in common with another system that performs as well for another trader. In other words, the debate over which system is superior reminds me of the debate between the blind men over the characteristics of the same elephant, in that all systems attempt to make sense of the same thing yet from somewhat different perspectives. For example, it seems to me qualitatively that Al Brooks microtrend breakouts, H/L 1&2 refer to approximately the same phenomena as BB's mini divergences in stochastics. In general it's not the difference in detail that matters as much as whether the approach strikes the proper chord in the brain of the trader, promotes objectivity within a trader's field of perception.

ETA: I want to add as an addendum that for me the process of learning a system, perhaps becoming a "disciple", has been iterative rather than a one-step process. While trading a system causes changes in the brain that reinforce original learning and improve execution I also forget things and pick up or resume bad habits that degrade performance, and a periodic review of all the systems I have some knowledge of helps determine whether I'm backsliding, often explains why profits are beginning to degrade. In addition, when reviewing the material I pick up nuances that I missed the first time through that contribute to the system's edge, and seem to come away with a deeper appreciation of what I thought I already knew. While in the early days I dismissed MACD and stochastics as beginner tools, too simple for Serious Traders, these days I'm almost in awe of them. This is as true of BB as Al Brooks' system, IIRC Brooks himself making a claim something to the effect that the amount of information in a 5 minute chart is far vaster than he can use. I'm guessing the treasure trove of info may not have been apparent to him the first time he looked at a chart


@bnichols

Excellent points /opinions!!

Thanks very much

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