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MBOXX ( similar to Weis Wave )/Wyckoff


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MBOXX ( similar to Weis Wave )/Wyckoff

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  #1 (permalink)
 mdsvtr 
Memphis,TN
 
 
Posts: 232 since Sep 2010

I was doing some research on the internet earlier today, looking for the Weis wave or as similar of a version of it as I could find for the T0rS platform, when I cam across an indicator called.....MBOXX

Here is a link showing the way in which to interpret the MBOXX ...
MBOXX Indicator | MBOXX Trading System

It takes the way in which Wychoff used Volume and time within the waves , to give a detailed explanation of when there was more demand vs supply and vice versa

It looks like a fantastic Indicator, and one of which simplifies the reading of having the numbers of the time / volume traded within each wave, by instead, plotting a blue or red box around that move " wave "


Anyways, just wanted to share, get other traders opinions and also see if anyone has used it yet

Please let me know,
Thanks - Michael

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  #3 (permalink)
 mctrade 
Pretoria South africa
 
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Wyckoff wave now available for eSignal at MCT Wyckoff Wave | Indicators / Tools | , | MC Trading

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  #4 (permalink)
 JoeRoss007 
Aue + Deutschland
 
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I use the MBoxChart from
Mboxwave.com

Its a very strong Indicator. Also the brand new add on.
Im looking for some traders, they are using the same Indicator - aspecially by the German DAX-Future-Trading

Greetings! Wolfgang




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  #5 (permalink)
 rassi 
the congo
 
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I have not seen that before but it looks very interesting as it mixes it with vsa. Dax would be my preferred market for the European session. Please post charts and info


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  #6 (permalink)
 ThomasK 
Marburg Hesse
 
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JoeRoss007 View Post
I use the MBoxChart from
Mboxwave.com

Its a very strong Indicator. Also the brand new add on.
Im looking for some traders, they are using the same Indicator - aspecially by the German DAX-Future-Trading

Greetings! Wolfgang




Just starting with it, had been using the WeisWave-AddOn sofar....

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  #7 (permalink)
 nttradert 
London/United Kingdom
 
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I use MBoxWave tools in my trading every day (mainly MWave chart/Mboxwavehistogram) as my primary indicators - fairly successfully.

There are a number of indicators as part of the package and additional indicators/algos are added on a regular basis.

Make sure you are running the latest version of NT8 as previous versions of NT did not always play well with the indicators.

There are a few different pricing models, but if you want continuous updates go for the grandfather package as that covers everything and there is generally a new indicator every 2 months or so.

Mike, the developer, has always been prompt in his replies when I have had queries, suggestions or a problem (so far has always been a problem with my PC/NT config and not the tools).

There is also an offer for access to a trading room who use the tools every day and provide training, mentorship and advice. The guys in the room are all successful traders (sadly no Trump jokes allowed though), who I feel go out of their way to help you. Although I do not trade the same systems as them, they provided me with great additional knowledge on Wyckoff and using the mboxwave tools in my trading as well as learning how trading should be done.

I initially bought the product a number of months ago, before the additional pricing models were available, but was able to upgrade at a good price, went all in and have no regrets.

I think the match of a great product with training from a great team of knowledgeable profitable traders is a fantastic match and I highly recommend both mboxwave and the training room.

Out of all the money I have spent (wasted) over the years, this is one of about 4 things I've purchased that has contributed to me becoming a better and successful trader.

tomC

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  #8 (permalink)
 forgiven 
Fletcher NC
 
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this new member with this glowing review only has 2 other post. ????? it sounds like it came straight of there web sight. any members using these tools that were green in 30 days and are now trading from Saint Kitts ..please by all means share with us all .....the wonderful thrill ride

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  #9 (permalink)
 nttradert 
London/United Kingdom
 
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If you are referring to me, I was no way in the green after 30 days. In fact, I still struggle.

I did a mentorship with David Weis and have studied a number of Dayton courses as well.

I gave the product a glowing review because that is what it deserves as it is the most comprehensive set of wyckoff tools compared to other products.

The review was my take on the product and I wrote it to help others make a more informed decision.

I mainly trade springs/upthrusts and vwap (best tool is from htech) and I use wyckoff principles and mboxwave .

Use it, don't use, it's all the same to me.

If you like wyckoff, consider the tool, but do your own research.

That will be 4 posts now ;-p

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  #10 (permalink)
 thefarmer 
YORK North yorkshire
 
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Follow Matt Bowen on twitter, he is one of the founders who uses MBOX, and posts charts and his PnL daily on his page
https://twitter.com/NOBStrades
Ive just started using the indicator's, and matt's a helpful guy, plus he knows a lot of useful people.

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  #11 (permalink)
 wilson619 
San Diego, CA
 
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I was (am) having trouble plotting MBox on NT8 when tick replay is enabled. Mike at MBox states it is not necessary to enable tick replay, however if you run other indicators that require it there may be an issue.

That said, I posted this issue on NT8 support and one person replied with the following, "Sounds like the third party indicator is attempting to circumvent the need to use tick replay to get bid ask delta data. And that it's trying to do this by comparing the bid, ask, and last prices from the three separate files which is WRONG because the three files are not synchronized due to the unavoidable fact that many records in the separate files will have the same time stamps therefore cannot be read in the correct order."

Mike has not responded to this comment, but I would be curious to know if this is how it is programmed? I have heard from another source that the cumulative delta totals are notably different.

Wilson

https://ninjatrader.com/support/forum/showthread.php?t=105929

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  #12 (permalink)
 wilson619 
San Diego, CA
 
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Mike, thanks for clearing that up. After posting my initial query and issue on Ninjatrader I didn't hear back from you regarding that comment made about coding Bid/Ask data without tick replay. I was hoping you would respond on Ninjatrader support after that since you acknowledged to me that you read it, but I appreciate your explanation here. Thanks again.

Wilson

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  #13 (permalink)
 planetmoto 
freasno, ca usa
 
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mboxwave View Post
Here is a Weis Wave vs MBoxWave Wyckoff Trading System - Comparison on NinjaTrader 8


Site for MBoxWave is https://mboxwave.com/

With the various issues NT8 still seems to have popping would you say mbox package may run more efficiently and more accurately on TradeStation? Can you share your thoughts on the matter as there seem to be a lot of posts still complaining about NT issues, thank you

Sent using the https://futures.io%20mobile%20app

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  #14 (permalink)
Bobo
Tampa, FL, USA
 
 
Posts: 28 since Jul 2013
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Any traders using MBoxWave for day trading Futures? What is your opinion?

On the website is not much decent information about using MBoxWave for trading, only screenshots of charts, zero videos showing trading with real time data.
It looks suspicious without such trading videos.

Maybe the extremely knowledgeable Big Mike can help?

Thank you.

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  #15 (permalink)
 nttradert 
London/United Kingdom
 
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Bobo,

Have a look here ...

[yt]https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCLKraR4UVif9dszy4DZLXtw/videos[/yt]

and more specifically ...



If you are an MBoxWave user, irregular emails are sent from Mike (Mike from MBoxWave - not Big Mike).

Personally, I have also highlighted the lack of videos, however, the videos provided are done in such a way that they do sufficiently explain the concepts and provide enough detail and explanation to set up the numerous MBoxWave indicators as well as demonstrate how they interact and how to use them to trade.

MBox Mike - more videos would always be welcome though :-)

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  #16 (permalink)
Bobo
Tampa, FL, USA
 
 
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nttradert View Post
Bobo,

Have a look here ...

[yt]https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCLKraR4UVif9dszy4DZLXtw/videos[/yt]

and more specifically ...



If you are an MBoxWave user, irregular emails are sent from Mike (Mike from MBoxWave - not Big Mike).

Personally, I have also highlighted the lack of videos, however, the videos provided are done in such a way that they do sufficiently explain the concepts and provide enough detail and explanation to set up the numerous MBoxWave indicators as well as demonstrate how they interact and how to use them to trade.

MBox Mike - more videos would always be welcome though :-)

Hello.
Thanks. I watched the videos before posting and they have nothing to do with trading using real time data, please see my post again.
His Twitter page is also only about some charts with the indicators and one video having nothing to do with trading using real time data.
I'm familiar with Wyckoff's work for many years, also with the work of David Weiss, which probably inspired MBoxWave, a relatively new software.

Are you using MboxWave for dat trading Futures? Based on your answer, I guess you are not using it.

I wanted some feedback from users of MBoxWave, their opinions resulting from day trading Futures. Why? To have some hints in evaluating the software before investing 1K in buying it.

Regards.

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  #17 (permalink)
 dk27 
Europe
 
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Don’t they have free trial? If not then it should be no go with them, trial is the must to evaluate, no videos or feedback will do.


Bobo View Post
Hello.
Thanks. I watched the videos before posting and they have nothing to do with trading using real time data, please see my post again.
His Twitter page is also only about some charts with the indicators and one video having nothing to do with trading using real time data.
I'm familiar with Wyckoff's work for many years, also with the work of David Weiss, which probably inspired MBoxWave, a relatively new software.

Are you using MboxWave for dat trading Futures? Based on your answer, I guess you are not using it.

I wanted some feedback from users of MBoxWave, their opinions resulting from day trading Futures. Why? To have some hints in evaluating the software before investing 1K in buying it.

Regards.


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  #18 (permalink)
 nttradert 
London/United Kingdom
 
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Bobo,

I had to make the same decision as you, but with a lot less information than is available now. I did my research and made my choice - it was a bit easier at the time as the intro version of MboxWave was only $100 more than the WeisWave package.

Shortly after my purchase I did a mentorship with David and there were a few awkward conversations about my choices.

At the end of the day, I had already decided that I wanted to trade a Wyckoff methodology and when I compared the products, there was a clear winner, and this is what I based my decision on. I think, if you are determined to trade using Wyckoff principles then a decent wave package is something that you need and once that decision is made, then it is a case of determining which product suits your needs best and gives you the best chance of success.

There is a free package available on futures.io called PAS that does waves and more importantly it is programmable, so maybe you should test your ideas with this before making a purchase/decision.

LizardTrader also has a paid for Swing Indicator that he is developing (not for public release as yet, but it can be purchased if you contact him) and I am one of his beta testers, however this is in it's infancy at the moment.

If you know Wyckoff and have made a decision to trade using Wyckoff and are ready to splash the cash, then there is enough information out there for you to make a decision.

If you want to know more about day trading using Wyckoff, then have a look at Dr Gary's courses as well as read ...



With regards to my trading I use MBoxWave (mainly wave info/delta volume and 3 stooges algos) on 5 min and 1 point range bars and I daytrade the ES.

As I am working full time I am trying to develop an automated strategy using NinjaTrader and this has good times and bad times - I am not making enough to daytrade full time with my current strategies.

I also use a combination of LT indicators with MBoxWave as well as a paid for trendline tool.

If you don't know what you want, then don't spend your money.

I hope that I have answered all your questions satisfactorily - anyone else who's purchased MBoxWave, feel free to add their views/experiences.

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  #19 (permalink)
 sudhirc 
detroit,mi
 
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@nttradert

Is there a lag in printing volume or delta volume for the waves?
Can you tell whether the signals are in real time? and does not repaint.

Thank you,
Sudhir

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  #20 (permalink)
 JonnyBoy 
Market Wizard
Montreal, Quebec
 
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sudhirc View Post
@nttradert

Is there a lag in printing volume or delta volume for the waves?
Can you tell whether the signals are in real time? and does not repaint.

Thank you,
Sudhir

Like any indicator that is measuring waves or rotations, there has to be a set criteria (usually user definable) when a wave is complete vs. still in progress. For example, price would have to rotate a certain number of ticks or points in the opposite direction (and close) to define the wave has completed and a new one in the opposite direction has started.

It is at this transition where it flickers between a new wave in the opposite direction and a continuation in the existing direction that you could consider "lag" or 'unconfirmed". There is no other way to code a wave / rotation indicator that sees every incoming tick.

The infamous PAS indicator notoriously repainted itself. It is an excellent indicator but it does repaint. It has to, that is the nature of what it is calculating. PAS charts look great in historical but real time is a different story.

Same goes here. That software / website you are referring to appears to be full of chart porn. I.E. charts that were cherry picked to isolate the perfect world setup, ensuring that X aligns with Y to get to Z.

I didn't see any live trades taking place because he probably doesn't trade. He writes software.

So if you did know the deltas and volumes on every wave, what would you do with that information?

He probably doesn't offer a trial because he knows once you use it, you can't replicate in live trading with real money. All vendors should allow a free trial, but that is a topic for another day.

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  #21 (permalink)
 Silvester17 
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JonnyBoy View Post
The infamous PAS indicator notoriously repainted itself. It is an excellent indicator but it does repaint. It has to, that is the nature of what it is calculating. PAS charts look great in historical but real time is a different story.

just to clarify, the PAS indicator does not repaint. explained here:




the only thing that does repaint (has to) is the volume in the PAS oscillator indicator. explained here:


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  #22 (permalink)
 JonnyBoy 
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Silvester17 View Post
just to clarify, the PAS indicator does not repaint. explained here:




the only thing that does repaint (has to) is the volume in the PAS oscillator indicator. explained here:


Agreed. I should have been clearer as to what part of the PAS I was referring to.

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  #23 (permalink)
 astroboy69 
dubai + dubai/UAE
 
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Hi

Been on this forum for sometime but rarely do I post as I value my time & privacy. I've been successfully trading my own book since 2001, concentrating on currencies since 2004. Been using Wyckoff's/David Weis's work as part of my trading method/edge for 8yrs now and recently went over to MBoxWave in order to replace my Weis Wave indicator in NT8

I trade off 15min 30min 60min 120min 240min Daily time frames utilizing a system I developed over the years which automatically triggers signals/potential trade entries via NinjaTrader 8's "Market Analyzer" + "Alert Log" in order to reduce the manual workload. I enter all my trade manually via my brokers platform.

This is not a paid for response and anyone who claims I do not trade then I beg to differ. As I have broker account statements showing my actual returns.

When it comes to developing a successful trading market edge. We all have to do so, by first delving deep & discovering, then understanding and taking into account our own "psychological makeup". At that point you can start developing a trading system that works best for you...!!!! Counter Trend or Trend Following or Scalping or Fundamental etc etc etc.

I can only speak for myself. I find these tools fit incredibly well into my existing trading system & has added to my existing trading edge. What I find useful about these MBoxWave tools is they add a deeper layer of understanding to the volume work I was already using via David Weis's indicator. I obviously respect Weis Wave as it's been one part of my trading system for 8yrs. So I will never speak ill of it, as I love it. MBoxWave simply takes this and makes it better in my humble opinion.

Should mike the owner of MBoxWave offer a 1week free trial as some people have stated in previous post's.....maybe.... but I have money so this wasn't an issue for me. Look over the years I've wasted 10's of thousands of dollars on various trading course's / tools / books / trading platform / trading seminars etc etc etc. This is simply a cost of doing business and developing a Trading Method/Edge that works for me.

Within the first week of owning the MBoxWave I made a suggestion to mike in as far as improving the tool by adding a feature. I shit you not, one week latter this dude coded it in and sent me the updated version for testing. Now listen MOFO's i'm 50yrs old this isn't my first rodeo.....I've been around the block a time or two. Mike provides good customer service which I find is rare in this business.

Anyone who want's to shit on this post and further waste there time in waiting for a reply, then your out of luck because i'm too busy trading to even bother responding to negative mindsets. Instead I advise you to concentrate on what really matters.......and only you can discover what that is.

I wish you all good luck and good fortune.

Cheers

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  #24 (permalink)
 avall38486 
Dallas, Texas
 
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Astroboy69,
You are completely correct. There is a cost to do business.
I like Mike's videos and the clarity of explanations.
Amin

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 Tengoku 
Slovakia
 
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Hi,

who bought it for sierra charts? Does it work preperly, no performance issues?

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 mrad 
Utrecht, The Netherlands
 
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Tengoku View Post
Hi,

who bought it for sierra charts? Does it work preperly, no performance issues?

Hi Tengoku,

I bought it for Sierra Chart and it works great, no performance issues at all.

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 Popsicle 
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I also recently bought the grandfather package for Sierra Chart. Great software. Works 100% as advertised.

I have NQ, ES, RTY, YM, CL and GC open with it the whole time, no performance issues at all. Mike is also very helpful and responds to queries quickly.

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  #28 (permalink)
 sienna 
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Same here. I also just bought it (but for NT8) and it is stable and seems very well coded. For the way my brain is wired, this approach works very very well. (no financial interest)

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 Oriole 
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nttradert View Post
Bobo,

I had to make the same decision as you, but with a lot less information than is available now. I did my research and made my choice - it was a bit easier at the time as the intro version of MboxWave was only $100 more than the WeisWave package.

Shortly after my purchase I did a mentorship with David and there were a few awkward conversations about my choices.

At the end of the day, I had already decided that I wanted to trade a Wyckoff methodology and when I compared the products, there was a clear winner, and this is what I based my decision on. I think, if you are determined to trade using Wyckoff principles then a decent wave package is something that you need and once that decision is made, then it is a case of determining which product suits your needs best and gives you the best chance of success.

There is a free package available on futures.io called PAS that does waves and more importantly it is programmable, so maybe you should test your ideas with this before making a purchase/decision.

LizardTrader also has a paid for Swing Indicator that he is developing (not for public release as yet, but it can be purchased if you contact him) and I am one of his beta testers, however this is in it's infancy at the moment.

If you know Wyckoff and have made a decision to trade using Wyckoff and are ready to splash the cash, then there is enough information out there for you to make a decision.

If you want to know more about day trading using Wyckoff, then have a look at Dr Gary's courses as well as read ...



With regards to my trading I use MBoxWave (mainly wave info/delta volume and 3 stooges algos) on 5 min and 1 point range bars and I daytrade the ES.

As I am working full time I am trying to develop an automated strategy using NinjaTrader and this has good times and bad times - I am not making enough to daytrade full time with my current strategies.

I also use a combination of LT indicators with MBoxWave as well as a paid for trendline tool.

If you don't know what you want, then don't spend your money.

I hope that I have answered all your questions satisfactorily - anyone else who's purchased MBoxWave, feel free to add their views/experiences.

I'm a total NOOB and heard about Lizard here. Kris L. the owner has been so over the top gracious it's amazing. Always answering my questions and offering the free 14 day trial (and extending the period if I need it) he's so impressive and above board. Have not purchased Lizard yet but I'm leaning that way. I keep reading and watching here for additional educators to consider.

I guess I need to look at MB too. Thanks all.

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 sienna 
Melbourne, Australia
 
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I'm a total NOOB and heard about Lizard here. Kris L. the owner has been so over the top gracious it's amazing. Always answering my questions and offering the free 14 day trial (and extending the period if I need it) he's so impressive and above board. Have not purchased Lizard yet but I'm leaning that way. I keep reading and watching here for additional educators to consider.

I guess I need to look at MB too. Thanks all.

Oriole,
Before you decide to fork out cash for MB, it might be wise to look at the videos, of Mike (at Mbox) trading 1 min chart , live account. Useful info on the suitability of this approach (or not, as the case may be), to one's preferences. Just check their website.
Sienna

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 Oriole 
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sienna View Post
Oriole,
Before you decide to fork out cash for MB, it might be wise to look at the videos, of Mike (at Mbox) trading 1 min chart , live account. Useful info on the suitability of this approach (or not, as the case may be), to one's preferences. Just check their website.
Sienna

Thank you. I started watching one of his videos yesterday and will continue. Do you have an opinion on MB? Does he do trials? There are so many different systems and indicators for sale that it is quite daunting. I’m determined to go slowly and not make a bonehead decision. Appreciate you taking the time to share.

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 sienna 
Melbourne, Australia
 
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Oriole View Post
Thank you. I started watching one of his videos yesterday and will continue. Do you have an opinion on MB? Does he do trials? There are so many different systems and indicators for sale that it is quite daunting. I’m determined to go slowly and not make a bonehead decision. Appreciate you taking the time to share.


Oriole,
You pose a very legitimate question, but it covers a cosmos of possibilities and I am not sure that I can provide cogent advice. Your intention of taking it slowly is wise and I wish I had that foresight when I started. Having said that, I still consider myself a beginner.

In the context of an indicator x or y, why not watch the YouTube videos of MB for a few weeks, and all those you can find retrospectively and see if that approach is for you. There is also the question of account size and time frame. MB uses a 1 min chart and although you can configure the software to any duration, tick, or volume, or range count, the examples used on a live account seem to focus mostly on 1 min and US market hrs. Is that appropriate for your situation?

I don't want to be seen as promoting MB, but 'simply' to answer your Q's: MB does not offer trials (so I believe). One factor to be aware of: Their training (if you fork out an extra amount on top of the software) ports you to the associated MB partner, an experienced trader and a room full of more/less experienced apprentices, some with seemingly consistent trading results, pulling out daily profits. This is a daily room, which starts with price action and EMA cross-overs (but no MB software). The idea is to train in patience, consistency and risk management. It assumes that you are a beginner. It is a fairly testosterone driven room, matched by real world approaches. Slowly they introduce aspects of the MB software, but it differs greatly from the MB videos, which I believe should be stated up front (it is not). The workspaces are spare, 5 EMA's, no MB. The approach is realistic, and a touch 'brutal', to mirror the indifference of the market and the competitive nature of the trading game....(my paraphrase of their approach).

Somewhat in contrast, the MB website videos show the set up Mike from MB uses. he is not part of that training or trading room, but is the coder and trades his own funds. Mike does not provide training, but does "answer" emails and chart screenshots. I have adjusted my workspace (NT8) to match his. I am also experimenting with 3 min, Vol + Range charts. My background narrative in all this is, that I am slowly adapting the potential of the software to suit my time of day and preferred instruments.

Having 'said' all this, this FIO resource offers incredible information and finally, I realize that (for a considerable part of the game), I am trading with/against myself....so maybe the section on Psychology at FIO is one of the real gems.

Just some thoughts, based on your questions. Anyway, hope it makes some sense,
Regards

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 bobwest 
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Oriole View Post
Thank you. I started watching one of his videos yesterday and will continue. Do you have an opinion on MB? Does he do trials? There are so many different systems and indicators for sale that it is quite daunting. I’m determined to go slowly and not make a bonehead decision. Appreciate you taking the time to share.

@Oriole, I have no knowledge or opinion about this particular vendor, other than the general observation that there are good vendors and bad vendors, and that potential customers should exercise care when it comes to handing over any money. (I know this is obvious, but I thought I would just say it anyway. It's also good advice.)

Be careful out there. The reason there are a lot of these systems for sale is that there is no lack of people who are willing to pay them for the trading success they seem to offer. Perhaps some do, too. But just be careful, that's all.

I would not comment here except that you said "There are so many different systems and indicators for sale that it is quite daunting," which made me want to caution you about the search for packaged solutions.

Again, I know nothing about this vendor and am not being positive or negative about them. The quest for solutions from sellers of systems can be perilous, however. Learn slowly and apply things that make sense to you.

Just a caution.

Bob.

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 JonnyBoy 
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Oriole View Post
Thank you. I started watching one of his videos yesterday and will continue. Do you have an opinion on MB? Does he do trials? There are so many different systems and indicators for sale that it is quite daunting. I’m determined to go slowly and not make a bonehead decision. Appreciate you taking the time to share.

My bug bear with any vendor is not allowing free trials of their product. Some of his indicators are so very simple (and I have commented on this before, see the link below) yet he is charging extortionate amounts.

He charges 300 USD for something called the MPace, that is literally coded in 5 minutes. The description of the indicator has nothing to do with how the indicator works, but it sure sounds fancy, that you can say.

I debunked this indicator here.



I am not saying his other products are not any good, but as others have stated, be careful. With the code protection available (especially for NT8 using Agile.net) these days, there is no excuse not to offer a free trial.

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 Oriole 
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JonnyBoy View Post
My bug bear with any vendor is not allowing free trials of their product. Some of his indicators are so very simple (and I have commented on this before, see the link below) yet he is charging extortionate amounts.

He charges 300 USD for something called the MPace, that is literally coded in 5 minutes. The description of the indicator has nothing to do with how the indicator works, but it sure sounds fancy, that you can say.

I debunked this indicator here.



I am not saying his other products are not any good, but as others have stated, be careful. With the code protection available (especially for NT8 using Agile.net) these days, there is no excuse not to offer a free trial.

I totally understand. I'm paralyzed into buying NOTHING at this stage because there are too many choices and MOST vendors are rip offs. Appreciate you taking the time. I'll keep reading and watching.

As far as good vendors vs. bad, the good seem few and far between. Just like most everything else in this world.

@bobwest, Thank you, @sienna Thank you!

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 ThomasK 
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I totally understand. I'm paralyzed into buying NOTHING at this stage because there are too many choices and MOST vendors are rip offs. Appreciate you taking the time. I'll keep reading and watching.

As far as good vendors vs. bad, the good seem few and far between. Just like most everything else in this world.

@bobwest, Thank you, @sienna Thank you!

Just stumbled over this thread….

I am using the mbox software for a couple of years right now and for me and my style of trading it is working very well (I use other, complimentary tools as well). On NT7 I used the Weis Wave indicator for quite some time, which did a very good job, too. Mbox is far more complex and has more functionality and is adding other stuff like delta into the Wyckoff Wave thing.
I can confirm the positive posts of other community members about Michael and his customer service, exactly my experience. In my opinion the screen shots and videos of mbox are providing a correct information what to expect from this software. It is working exactly like that.
If you are in the process of making a decision if Wyckoff and the Wyckoff/Weis/Mbox-Wave is suitable for you then you should get yourself a copy of David Weis' book "Trades about to happen". And you should subscribe to his daily newsletter (stock market update), which is free of charge and is often showing a 'wave chart' and other important Wyckoff stuff. I learned a lot from it.
As mentioned by other members already, Dr. Gary Dayton (one of his mentors was David Weis) is offering some good education as well, incorporating the Weis wave.
The 'Price Action Swing'-indicator for NT7 or NT8 by Dorschden available in the downloads-section of this incredible forum is offering the same functionality as the Weis-Wave - at least. So there you have something to play around with which may help you with your decision with the Wyckoff waves. And if you do a search on 'weis wave trade setups' on the internet you will find a lot of information on how to use them. You might even find the original handed out by David himself.

There will be a so-called vendor webinar with Mike from Mbox on March 12th - 'Discover Order Flow with MBoxWave' hosted by NinjaTrader Ecosystem. Usually, there is a Q&A at the end....

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 Tengoku 
Slovakia
 
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Sadly he doesnt provide trial This tells me, that he doesnt believe in his product much, while after trial not much people would actually buy it. I believe thats the reason why theres not trial, pay and I dont care if u use it or not...

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 Oriole 
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ThomasK View Post
Just stumbled over this thread….

I am using the mbox software for a couple of years right now and for me and my style of trading it is working very well (I use other, complimentary tools as well). On NT7 I used the Weis Wave indicator for quite some time, which did a very good job, too. Mbox is far more complex and has more functionality and is adding other stuff like delta into the Wyckoff Wave thing.
I can confirm the positive posts of other community members about Michael and his customer service, exactly my experience. In my opinion the screen shots and videos of mbox are providing a correct information what to expect from this software. It is working exactly like that.
If you are in the process of making a decision if Wyckoff and the Wyckoff/Weis/Mbox-Wave is suitable for you then you should get yourself a copy of David Weis' book "Trades about to happen". And you should subscribe to his daily newsletter (stock market update), which is free of charge and is often showing a 'wave chart' and other important Wyckoff stuff. I learned a lot from it.
As mentioned by other members already, Dr. Gary Dayton (one of his mentors was David Weis) is offering some good education as well, incorporating the Weis wave.
The 'Price Action Swing'-indicator for NT7 or NT8 by Dorschden available in the downloads-section of this incredible forum is offering the same functionality as the Weis-Wave - at least. So there you have something to play around with which may help you with your decision with the Wyckoff waves. And if you do a search on 'weis wave trade setups' on the internet you will find a lot of information on how to use them. You might even find the original handed out by David himself.

There will be a so-called vendor webinar with Mike from Mbox on March 12th - 'Discover Order Flow with MBoxWave' hosted by NinjaTrader Ecosystem. Usually, there is a Q&A at the end....

Thanks for taking the time on this. I'm in SLOW MOTION but I plan to study MBOX closely. I listened to a few of @ft71 webinars yesterday and they were very enlightening. I'm on it!

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 Oriole 
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Thanks for taking the time on this. I'm in SLOW MOTION but I plan to study MBOX closely. I listened to a few of @ft71 webinars yesterday and they were very enlightening. I'm on it!

Hi again. I’ve watched a few of Mike’s You Tube videos and emailed Mike. Very responsive, straight shooter kind of guy. He connected me with Matt who runs the trading room and I’ll be getting some guest passes for it. I like it and I feel like it fits my personality. Thank you again for the input. Will keep reading and learning.

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 Oriole 
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sienna View Post
Oriole,
You pose a very legitimate question, but it covers a cosmos of possibilities and I am not sure that I can provide cogent advice. Your intention of taking it slowly is wise and I wish I had that foresight when I started. Having said that, I still consider myself a beginner.

In the context of an indicator x or y, why not watch the YouTube videos of MB for a few weeks, and all those you can find retrospectively and see if that approach is for you. There is also the question of account size and time frame. MB uses a 1 min chart and although you can configure the software to any duration, tick, or volume, or range count, the examples used on a live account seem to focus mostly on 1 min and US market hrs. Is that appropriate for your situation?

I don't want to be seen as promoting MB, but 'simply' to answer your Q's: MB does not offer trials (so I believe). One factor to be aware of: Their training (if you fork out an extra amount on top of the software) ports you to the associated MB partner, an experienced trader and a room full of more/less experienced apprentices, some with seemingly consistent trading results, pulling out daily profits. This is a daily room, which starts with price action and EMA cross-overs (but no MB software). The idea is to train in patience, consistency and risk management. It assumes that you are a beginner. It is a fairly testosterone driven room, matched by real world approaches. Slowly they introduce aspects of the MB software, but it differs greatly from the MB videos, which I believe should be stated up front (it is not). The workspaces are spare, 5 EMA's, no MB. The approach is realistic, and a touch 'brutal', to mirror the indifference of the market and the competitive nature of the trading game....(my paraphrase of their approach).

Somewhat in contrast, the MB website videos show the set up Mike from MB uses. he is not part of that training or trading room, but is the coder and trades his own funds. Mike does not provide training, but does "answer" emails and chart screenshots. I have adjusted my workspace (NT8) to match his. I am also experimenting with 3 min, Vol + Range charts. My background narrative in all this is, that I am slowly adapting the potential of the software to suit my time of day and preferred instruments.

Having 'said' all this, this FIO resource offers incredible information and finally, I realize that (for a considerable part of the game), I am trading with/against myself....so maybe the section on Psychology at FIO is one of the real gems.

Just some thoughts, based on your questions. Anyway, hope it makes some sense,
Regards

Thanks for sharing on MBox. I continue to watch and learn. Scored a PDF of the Trade About To Happen. Gonna get a few trade room guest passes. Mike has been great via email. You still MBoxing every day? Onward and upward.

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  #41 (permalink)
 Oriole 
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Next question is about Matt Bowen. He runs No BS Trades (not “nobs trades”, no “bs trades”) and uses both his proprietary tools + MBox to trade. Not a lot of info on them but Matt and MBox Mike apparently work together. I really like MBox Mike. Matt has a trade room I’ll be doing a trial in someday soon. Just curious if anyone has any experience with Matt Bowen. Thank you.

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 trepidation 
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Oriole View Post
Thank you. I started watching one of his videos yesterday and will continue. Do you have an opinion on MB? Does he do trials? There are so many different systems and indicators for sale that it is quite daunting. I’m determined to go slowly and not make a bonehead decision. Appreciate you taking the time to share.

Hi again. I've briefly studied his indicators and he appears to be obfuscating standard terminology. I've reverse engineered part of his indicator system. MPACE has been described by JonnyBoy in another thread, which would be rudimentary to code up:


JonnyBoy View Post
The MPace indicator is NOT a speed or pace of tape indicator. All it does is measure the distance (in points) from the open to close of a bar and multiplies that value by the volume of the bar.

I didn't delve deep enough to figure out the smaller numbers on the PriceActionSwing (download in elite section), but the larger numbers are rounded volume divided by 10 using a 2 period Gann Swing. My scaling is different from his, but as you can see the swings match up exactly.


The MBoxHistogram is Bar-by-Bar Delta using UpTick/DownTick values and then overlayed on the chart (sim22 cumulative delta in elite section). There are some slight differences because his indicator uses a filter, but I didn't go into investigating the exact number. The MCumulativeDelta is a ratio of cumulative Delta, but I wasn't able to replicate it exactly. You can approximate it by drawing a horizontal line on a regular cumulativeDelta



You can use this as a starting point and experiment with his system and see if you like it. There's no education provided via this method of course

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 Maydo 
New York
 
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Anybody here actually using Mbox indicators? If so what do you think? I can fined any videos or reviews online. Everything is post by Mike with is the creator and he is not doing any trails with I dont like since there is a lot of BS out there.
Thanks

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 Oriole 
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Maydo View Post
Anybody here actually using Mbox indicators? If so what do you think? I can fined any videos or reviews online. Everything is post by Mike with is the creator and he is not doing any trails with I dont like since there is a lot of BS out there.
Thanks

https://mboxwave.com/

Go to the learning tab, there are a gazillion videos. I've had non stop emailing with MBox Mike, the creator and programmer over the last few weeks. He's responsive, no nonsense, no BS and I'll likely purchase in the next few months. I really like what he does if any of this helps. You can also get a trial to their trading room: No BS Trades

Matt Bowen runs the trading room and is Mike's partner.

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 Maydo 
New York
 
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Oriole View Post
https://mboxwave.com/

Go to the learning tab, there are a gazillion videos. I've had non stop emailing with MBox Mike, the creator and programmer over the last few weeks. He's responsive, no nonsense, no BS and I'll likely purchase in the next few months. I really like what he does if any of this helps. You can also get a trial to their trading room: No BS Trades

Matt Bowen runs the trading room and is Mike's partner.


I did get it actually. I have a system that iam using so this is just a addition. And it pays for it self with it first 20 min of trading So far so good. I like it a lot.

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  #46 (permalink)
 Oriole 
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Maydo View Post
I did get it actually. I have a system that iam using so this is just a addition. And it pays for it self with it first 20 min of trading So far so good. I like it a lot.

So you like it and it’s profitable? Is it easy to learn and use?

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 JonnyBoy 
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trepidation View Post
Hi again. I've briefly studied his indicators and he appears to be obfuscating standard terminology. I've reverse engineered part of his indicator system. MPACE has been described by JonnyBoy in another thread, which would be rudimentary to code up:



I didn't delve deep enough to figure out the smaller numbers on the PriceActionSwing (download in elite section), but the larger numbers are rounded volume divided by 10 using a 2 period Gann Swing. My scaling is different from his, but as you can see the swings match up exactly.


The MBoxHistogram is Bar-by-Bar Delta using UpTick/DownTick values and then overlayed on the chart (sim22 cumulative delta in elite section). There are some slight differences because his indicator uses a filter, but I didn't go into investigating the exact number. The MCumulativeDelta is a ratio of cumulative Delta, but I wasn't able to replicate it exactly. You can approximate it by drawing a horizontal line on a regular cumulativeDelta



You can use this as a starting point and experiment with his system and see if you like it. There's no education provided via this method of course

You are pretty much right and I think I have coded this mostly correct. It wasn't difficult to clone, but it is without the buy and sell signals. I don't intend to do anything with this as I am not that guy.

For me, this is just for fun. It would be more expensive to have a coder code this than to buy it, but I still believe his individual prices are astronomical. Perhaps, the Grandfather package is reasonable value...


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 Oriole 
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JonnyBoy View Post
You are pretty much right and I think I have coded this mostly correct. It wasn't difficult to clone, but it is without the buy and sell signals. I don't intend to do anything with this as I am not that guy.

For me, this is just for fun. It would be more expensive to have a coder code this than to buy it, but I still believe his individual prices are astronomical. Perhaps, the Grandfather package is reasonable value...


I appreciate your input...my thoughts:

1) 99% of traders don't have the skillset, time or knowledge to do this
2) Even if you think you have replicated it, maybe you haven't exactly
3) Lifetime updates are a great benefit (I know, they are only as good as him staying in business)
4) Support and question answering are important
5) I like the signals, you just gotta learn to filter out the bad ones
6) Mike just did a great presentation with Ninja Trader so he's plugged into them

so, I do think $1000 for his Grandfather package is reasonable for those of us that want a plug and play system to get trading. They do have sales so perhaps Black Friday is the best day to buy it. Most of us can manage this cost for a lifetime system. When it gets to be several thousand, I won't buy it for fear of getting ripped off.

I've emailed MBox Mike a few times with my dumb new guy questions and he always responds the same day and goes above and beyond to help. That's a HUGE part of the comfort in buying from a vendor. You want to feel (hope) like they're available and responsive after the purchase.

I don't know anything but of all the systems I've seen out there lately, this is reasonable IMHO. Thank you all for sharing your thoughts.

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 bobwest 
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Trading someone's signal without knowing what makes the signal happen, as well as why it happens and when it may be wrong, makes you entirely dependent on that person's understanding of the market, rather than your own.

What if whatever made the signal work in the past stops working, for whatever reason. Since you didn't know why it worked when it did, you also don't know why it stopped.

You're making real-money trades, but you don't really know why.... This is true no matter how good his track record is.

My feeling is that this is pretty close to suicidal, financially speaking.

But it's your money....

Bob.

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 LastDino 
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bobwest View Post
Trading someone's signal without knowing what makes the signal happen, as well as why it happens and when it may be wrong, makes you entirely dependent on that person's understanding of the market, rather than your own.

What if whatever made the signal work in the past stops working, for whatever reason. Since you didn't know why it worked when it did, you also don't know why it stopped.

You're making real-money trades, but you don't really know why.... This is true no matter how good his track record is.

My feeling is that this is pretty close to suicidal, financially speaking.

But it's your money....

Bob.

Very wise words, I don't even have this confidence to trade my own stuff, forget about someone else

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  #51 (permalink)
 Tengoku 
Slovakia
 
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Have anybody asked yourself, why price droped from 1999usd to aproximatelly 1200usd? Perhaps demand is decreasing, lol
Anyways, its tool for exorbitant price without even possibility to test it via trial

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 Oriole 
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bobwest View Post
Trading someone's signal without knowing what makes the signal happen, as well as why it happens and when it may be wrong, makes you entirely dependent on that person's understanding of the market, rather than your own.

What if whatever made the signal work in the past stops working, for whatever reason. Since you didn't know why it worked when it did, you also don't know why it stopped.

You're making real-money trades, but you don't really know why.... This is true no matter how good his track record is.

My feeling is that this is pretty close to suicidal, financially speaking.

But it's your money....

Bob.

I agree, if one trades a system without knowing why a trade occurs, that's insane. I have a reasonable understanding of the system and if I ever purchase it, I will 100% understand it before trading with live funds. I have a copy of "Trades About To Happen" by David Weis that I'm working on. I'm learning, have never blown up an account and will slowly evolve in my process. Thanks @bobwest!

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  #53 (permalink)
 bobwest 
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Oriole View Post
I agree, if one trades a system without knowing why a trade occurs, that's insane. I have a reasonable understanding of the system and if I ever purchase it, I will 100% understand it before trading with live funds. I have a copy of "Trades About To Happen" by David Weis that I'm working on. I'm learning, have never blown up an account and will slowly evolve in my process. Thanks @bobwest!

You're entirely welcome. Just go slow and make sure you do understand everything you do, from within your own point of view and as you have worked it all out.

As to blowing up an account, you probably will. Most of us seem to (I have), and it is a learning experience of its own if you can take it that way....

Bob.

When one door closes, another opens.
-- Cervantes, Don Quixote
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 Maydo 
New York
 
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Oriole View Post
So you like it and it’s profitable? Is it easy to learn and use?

Well i have a system that i use every day. I dont use much of the indicators but this is nice addition. I dont think you can make money if you dont know how to trade or you dont have a good system/set up. If you will just follow the signals you will blow out you account really quickly. If you have a good system this will help you at least it helps me. You have to understand what that script is all about and what is showing you! That is the most important part of using it! Today i did two trades based on my system with help of this indicator and all of the trades were excellent. This is only my second day using this but i love it so far.

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  #55 (permalink)
Lfx987
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Oriole View Post
Next question is about Matt Bowen. He runs No BS Trades (not “nobs trades”, no “bs trades”) and uses both his proprietary tools + MBox to trade. Not a lot of info on them but Matt and MBox Mike apparently work together. I really like MBox Mike. Matt has a trade room I’ll be doing a trial in someday soon. Just curious if anyone has any experience with Matt Bowen. Thank you.

Hello all,

I purchased the Grandfather package in 2018.

Whilst Mbox Mike and Matt Bowen may be partners, what is taught in the room is nothing to do with the Mbox software.

In fact, the basic underlying system taught by Matt ,the Mbox software is not even needed.

Matt has a wealth of knowledge but in all honesty, the crux of what is taught in the room is prices crossing over five stacked moving averages and when you are wrong, to get out quick (usually 10 ticks). And once you have made your "nut" for the day, to stop trading, or to then practice on a sim.

I felt "cheated" with the grand-father package. Whilst the software makes it easy to plot that would otherwise take some time to set-up, and looks/feels cleaner to look at, I had zero intention of trading off a one minute bar and the fact is many others who join rarely stick around, it's evident they feel the same.

There have been a few successes, whose daily PnL numbers Matt will present on his Twitter page, but when you consider all those who simply give up as what is taught is not in tune with their personalities, the ratio of successful people coming out the room is probably less than the industry average.

It did peeve me off when I found people could get guest pass for the room for a day or so. Had I known this, I would never have paid to join the room after a visit.

There are some very helpful people in the room but do not join if you want to learn about using the Mbox software or orderflow.

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  #56 (permalink)
 Oriole 
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Lfx987 View Post
Hello all,

I purchased the Grandfather package in 2018.

Whilst Mbox Mike and Matt Bowen may be partners, what is taught in the room is nothing to do with the Mbox software.

In fact, the basic underlying system taught by Matt ,the Mbox software is not even needed.

Matt has a wealth of knowledge but in all honesty, the crux of what is taught in the room is prices crossing over five stacked moving averages and when you are wrong, to get out quick (usually 10 ticks). And once you have made your "nut" for the day, to stop trading, or to then practice on a sim.

I felt "cheated" with the grand-father package. Whilst the software makes it easy to plot that would otherwise take some time to set-up, and looks/feels cleaner to look at, I had zero intention of trading off a one minute bar and the fact is many others who join rarely stick around, it's evident they feel the same.

There have been a few successes, whose daily PnL numbers Matt will present on his Twitter page, but when you consider all those who simply give up as what is taught is not in tune with their personalities, the ratio of successful people coming out the room is probably less than the industry average.

It did peeve me off when I found people could get guest pass for the room for a day or so. Had I known this, I would never have paid to join the room after a visit.

There are some very helpful people in the room but do not join if you want to learn about using the Mbox software or orderflow.

Thanks for responding. Matt and Mike are indeed "partners" Mike told me via email.

I finally did the free day in the trading room and hated it. Like you said, it's nothing like MBox Mike trades. Matt is profane and treats his members like they're idiots. Matt's charts are a crazy collection of indicators and he sells his own VWAP package. I left after about 2 hours.

I hope you are having success with MBox or do you think it's not worth the $$$? I still really like it better than anything I've seen but I'm still looking around.

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  #57 (permalink)
Lfx987
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Oriole View Post
Thanks for responding. Matt and Mike are indeed "partners" Mike told me via email.

I finally did the free day in the trading room and hated it. Like you said, it's nothing like MBox Mike trades. Matt is profane and treats his members like they're idiots. Matt's charts are a crazy collection of indicators and he sells his own VWAP package. I left after about 2 hours.

I hope you are having success with MBox or do you think it's not worth the $$$? I still really like it better than anything I've seen but I'm still looking around.


Ah the VWAP package. The Vwaps are being used as nothing more than moving averages and the start times for the vwaps is highly suspect but that's a whole other discussion. The Vwap indicators (for Ninja) used to be given away free but they have been re-coded by one of the other room members so it's an extra money earner for both of them I guess. They add the Volume profile to that to make it look fancy but they never reference it, just there for show really.

I use Sierra charts so with the zigzag indicator, it is possible to build mWaveChart and mWaveHistogram (volume or delta histogram) similar to mBox although it does not look or feel as "clean".

mBox software does make it easier to set-up and is visually much easier to look at. Whether it's worth over $1k, depends how easy it is to set-up the indicators on the platform you are using and how technically adept you are. Question is, do you want to spend time setting up indicators (maybe coding them or finding them) or developing trading ideas from a concept you feel has potential!

I do find the Mbox useful. All I really use is the mWaveChart and mWaveHistogram (volume and delta). mPace and mCumulativeDelta don't show anything useful in my opinion.

Again, in my opinion, I don't think you can use mBox as a stand-a-lone strategy (kudos to Mike as he seems to make it work for him based upon his YouTube videos). I find it useful to look at what each waves delta and volume is but I use it in conjunction with things like vwap & standard deviation levels as well as areas of interest.

It's a tool that helps you analyse what has happened in the past and helps us form a bias as to what may occur next but as we all know, what may happen has zero regard for what came before.

As a sidenote, despite the room not being for everyone, there have been a few people, whose trading results can be seen on Matts twitter, page, who mange to turn in excellent results, day in and day out. I guess what Matt teaches resonates with their personalities. But as I said, the successes are too few, it can be highly misleading.

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  #58 (permalink)
 Todd4 
Vancouver WA
 
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Can't comment on the trading room but I have been using Mbox for the past 6 months or so. As Lfx stated the only thing I personally find useful is the MWaveChart with Delta. Rest of it is useless to me. Was it a game changer in my trading results would say no. Is it a helpful tool for what I do, I would say yes. I tend to only take trades after an imbalance push, then get into a trade on the pullback for the second wave. I do watch the cumulative delta on that pullback.

Would I buy it again knowing what I know now, probably not.

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 sienna 
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Lfx987 View Post
Hello all,

I purchased the Grandfather package in 2018.

Whilst Mbox Mike and Matt Bowen may be partners, what is taught in the room is nothing to do with the Mbox software.

In fact, the basic underlying system taught by Matt ,the Mbox software is not even needed.

Matt has a wealth of knowledge but in all honesty, the crux of what is taught in the room is prices crossing over five stacked moving averages and when you are wrong, to get out quick (usually 10 ticks). And once you have made your "nut" for the day, to stop trading, or to then practice on a sim.

I felt "cheated" with the grand-father package. Whilst the software makes it easy to plot that would otherwise take some time to set-up, and looks/feels cleaner to look at, I had zero intention of trading off a one minute bar and the fact is many others who join rarely stick around, it's evident they feel the same.

There have been a few successes, whose daily PnL numbers Matt will present on his Twitter page, but when you consider all those who simply give up as what is taught is not in tune with their personalities, the ratio of successful people coming out the room is probably less than the industry average.

It did peeve me off when I found people could get guest pass for the room for a day or so. Had I known this, I would never have paid to join the room after a visit.

There are some very helpful people in the room but do not join if you want to learn about using the Mbox software or orderflow.

I very much agree with you and have had the same experience. That said, I do find the MboxWave indie very helpful and valuable (to me), but echo your thoughts on the combo package of Training and MboxWave / Matt Bowen's trading room

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  #60 (permalink)
 Popsicle 
Pretoria Gauteng
 
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Lfx987 View Post
Hello all,

I purchased the Grandfather package in 2018.

Whilst Mbox Mike and Matt Bowen may be partners, what is taught in the room is nothing to do with the Mbox software.

In fact, the basic underlying system taught by Matt ,the Mbox software is not even needed.....

I purchased the grandfather package too and I have been in the room since 2nd February this year. Although the above post is correct, I do think there is a bit more to be said about the trading room.

In the beginning I was also perplexed about the setups that are being taught as a foundation. But as I dug deeper I realized something. Trading is not about using a set of indicators (as most of us hopefully know by this stage). It is mostly about getting over yourself. Your mindset, your pre-conceived ideas etc. What Matt, Mike and the other pros teach in the room is what it takes to become a professional day trader. That is the foundation of the whole apprenticeship. Yes, you read that right, it is an apprenticeship. As in I am going to learn from a master how to develop a certain skill and apply that skill and master it. The basic setup you start off with to learn this skill is just that, basic. But it is done for a very good reason. It teaches you how to read price action, how to read momentum and how to manage risk effectively. Once you master that, you can basically do anything in trading.

Here is the thing that I see over and over in the room though. People cannot get over themselves and just accept the fact that they might have to start again with a very basic way to trade. Without fail they come into the room kicking and screaming and questioning everything. They begrudgingly start the basic setup idea, but every step of the way still fighting it and putting their own biases on it. The people I see that make it are the people who can get over their own ideas of what trading should be and just go with the flow and actually learn to trade. I have not come across another trading room ever that is so interested in making you an independent trader. One that does not need anybody else to trade. Yes I agree, if you look at the ratio of people who have 'made it' in the room it looks relatively small. What people miss though is that they all have one thing in common. They have all gotten over themselves and put trading first, no biases etc.

Once you have this basic setup down and trading it well, there are many options. All the pros in the room trade their own accounts differently. I think this is a testament to the fact that this room is there to teach you a basic way of looking at the market and you can build literally anything on top of that and be successful. Matt covers all the MBox indicators and concepts in the room every day constantly through the day. All you have to do is ask questions and he will happily answer.

You can look at my other posts on this forum. Over the last 4 years or so I have tried many approaches, some almost successful and some a total disaster. I have been in this room for almost three months now and I am happy to say that I have reached consistency already. I pretty much make my nut every day. And this I guess is the end goal, to be a consistent trader that could do this for a living. The only question you have to ask yourself is how far are you willing to go to achieve this. What are you willing to let go of and what are you willing to learn, even though it may seem basic in the beginning.

Just my 2c

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  #61 (permalink)
Lfx987
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Popsicle View Post
I purchased the grandfather package too and I have been in the room since 2nd February this year. Although the above post is correct, I do think there is a bit more to be said about the trading room.

In the beginning I was also perplexed about the setups that are being taught as a foundation. But as I dug deeper I realized something. Trading is not about using a set of indicators (as most of us hopefully know by this stage). It is mostly about getting over yourself. Your mindset, your pre-conceived ideas etc. What Matt, Mike and the other pros teach in the room is what it takes to become a professional day trader. That is the foundation of the whole apprenticeship. Yes, you read that right, it is an apprenticeship. As in I am going to learn from a master how to develop a certain skill and apply that skill and master it. The basic setup you start off with to learn this skill is just that, basic. But it is done for a very good reason. It teaches you how to read price action, how to read momentum and how to manage risk effectively. Once you master that, you can basically do anything in trading.

Just my 2c

Whist I agree with the concept of apprenticeship, what you have to appreciate is below:

1) There is zero mention that the rooms focus is not mBox. In fact it is implied that the room and the software go hand in hand. They are two completely separate businesses, each with its own focus. One is used to sell the other.

2) A good apprenticeship will include different approaches based upon different need of people.
With the room, the basic set-up is the be all and end all. You either learn that or there is nothing else.

If you ask Matt to teach you another set-up, he can't as he doesn't have one. In fact, he and Mike (not mBox Mike) then berate you or use passive aggressive suggestions to imply you are the problem and not their teaching.

Fact is, a good mentor has many techniques depending on the personality of whom they are teaching. Matt simply teaches what works for him, this is an apprenticeship of his techniques and not mBox - that is highly mis-leading.

Managing risk is imply to cut at a 10 tick stop irrespective of key levels or order flow. Never mind that you could have 15 losing trades, just keep going until you make your nut. This works for some but not for the many. Yet Matt has zero alternate techniques to teach does he?

Matt may cover the mBox indicators but he does not use them, he has zero set-ups that include them. He will often illustrate them AFTER THE FACT if they support his winning trades. People join to learn the mBox set-ups. It does not bode will when the room does not even believe in them to use them in any set up does it?

This thread alone has been going since 2015. If you assume the room gets 1 new client every month then over 5 years, that would be 60 clients yet how many have been successful? How many does Matt illustrate on his twitter for marketing purposes? 3 or 4?

When I was in the room, I used to hear the disappointment in peoples voices when Matt used to describe the set-up. In my opinion, it is near fraudulent the means by which the room is being sold as an mBox room.

You are implying that it the people who are to blame if they still fail after joining the room. Maybe some are but the fact is a teacher has many ways to teach, to teach only what works for the teacher, you have to question the teachers ability as a mentor.

I am happy that you found success in his teachings but lets not defend the basic point, the room and mBox are two independent products, neither one is required for the other.

You are implying the set-up is near gospel and everything you learn from that suggests if you cannot get it, you have no chance to make it. Again, a totally false assumption.

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  #62 (permalink)
 JonnyBoy 
Market Wizard
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Lfx987 View Post
Whist I agree with the concept of apprenticeship, what you have to appreciate is below:

1) There is zero mention that the rooms focus is not mBox. In fact it is implied that the room and the software go hand in hand. They are two completely separate businesses, each with its own focus. One is used to sell the other.

2) A good apprenticeship will include different approaches based upon different need of people.
With the room, the basic set-up is the be all and end all. You either learn that or there is nothing else.

If you ask Matt to teach you another set-up, he can't as he doesn't have one. In fact, he and Mike (not mBox Mike) then berate you or use passive aggressive suggestions to imply you are the problem and not their teaching.

Fact is, a good mentor has many techniques depending on the personality of whom they are teaching. Matt simply teaches what works for him, this is an apprenticeship of his techniques and not mBox - that is highly mis-leading.

Managing risk is imply to cut at a 10 tick stop irrespective of key levels or order flow. Never mind that you could have 15 losing trades, just keep going until you make your nut. This works for some but not for the many. Yet Matt has zero alternate techniques to teach does he?

Matt may cover the mBox indicators but he does not use them, he has zero set-ups that include them. He will often illustrate them AFTER THE FACT if they support his winning trades. People join to learn the mBox set-ups. It does not bode will when the room does not even believe in them to use them in any set up does it?

This thread alone has been going since 2015. If you assume the room gets 1 new client every month then over 5 years, that would be 60 clients yet how many have been successful? How many does Matt illustrate on his twitter for marketing purposes? 3 or 4?

When I was in the room, I used to hear the disappointment in peoples voices when Matt used to describe the set-up. In my opinion, it is near fraudulent the means by which the room is being sold as an mBox room.

You are implying that it the people who are to blame if they still fail after joining the room. Maybe some are but the fact is a teacher has many ways to teach, to teach only what works for the teacher, you have to question the teachers ability as a mentor.

I am happy that you found success in his teachings but lets not defend the basic point, the room and mBox are two independent products, neither one is required for the other.

You are implying the set-up is near gospel and everything you learn from that suggests if you cannot get it, you have no chance to make it. Again, a totally false assumption.

I think this is fair commentary you just made. I do not have the Mbox products, nor do I know anything about this trading room. However, like most traders on FIO, whenever a product or website is mentioned/reviewed I am always curious to check it out and take a look at the offerings.

From everything I read on the Mbox website, I was 100% convinced the trading room was an Mbox trading room. The cherry picked Twitter posts where supposed members charts are posted, appear to all show the MBox product. I can understand the confusion and it is unfortunate that this isn't made crystal clear to everybody.

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  #63 (permalink)
 Oriole 
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I appreciate you all chiming in here. We agree the MBox Wave indicator is good stuff and almost unanimously agree that the trading room "sell" as a package is misleading. It seems that using the Wave as part of a system can work but you're on your own for training with the YOUTUBE videos.
Best wishes to you all.

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knuckleheadmovies
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Next question is about Matt Bowen. He runs No BS Trades (not “nobs trades”, no “bs trades”) and uses both his proprietary tools + MBox to trade. Not a lot of info on them but Matt and MBox Mike apparently work together. I really like MBox Mike. Matt has a trade room I’ll be doing a trial in someday soon. Just curious if anyone has any experience with Matt Bowen. Thank you.

Hello-

I am in the room with Matt and Mike S, not Mbox Mike. I have been trading for 10 years, never live or purely focused on trading due to kids and work mostly. But I had a foundation of what trading is about. I thought I had a quite a bit of knowledge, which I quickly found out in the trading room i actually didn't. I went in thinking I would start off learning Mbox, wasn't the case when I did the free trial, but I was willing to learn even though I hated MA's. I am glad I listened, i have learned soooo much with these guys. They teach a trader to read candles as well as give a psychological background, which Matt has, he's been doing this for 30+ years. The nut is a concept to teach you to learn to you can win, it gives you that psychological edge a trader needs. The room and people in it are very supportive, but yea, we are adults and talk like it.

The reason I am posting this is because I read some posts that put the room in not such a favorable light. The room is a trading where it is hands on. They give you the setup, which is incredibly easy, and verbally grade your trades one by one. There is no sugar coating, and that is what a trader needs. There are no training wheels and your are not going to be bottle fed. The point is to learn to be a trader, that is a skill very few have but many more claim to be. So if you are not okay with being treated as an adult and learn from some of the best, then the room might not be for you. If you want to learn and have incredible results, which they can back up, and handle a boot camp type room, you'll succeed. You cannot be a quitter, like some who have posted here, who have joined and thought they could find something better. The results speak for themselves.

Also, you do gradually learn to trade the Mbox if you want, it process to learn in stages, which again are proven to work through results. I don't care to learn it at this point, maybe one day.

If anyone wants to go into further detail about the room, message me and we can chat about it.

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  #65 (permalink)
 JonnyBoy 
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knuckleheadmovies View Post
Hello-

I am in the room with Matt and Mike S, not Mbox Mike. I have been trading for 10 years, never live or purely focused on trading due to kids and work mostly. But I had a foundation of what trading is about. I thought I had a quite a bit of knowledge, which I quickly found out in the trading room i actually didn't. I went in thinking I would start off learning Mbox, wasn't the case when I did the free trial, but I was willing to learn even though I hated MA's. I am glad I listened, i have learned soooo much with these guys. They teach a trader to read candles as well as give a psychological background, which Matt has, he's been doing this for 30+ years. The nut is a concept to teach you to learn to you can win, it gives you that psychological edge a trader needs. The room and people in it are very supportive, but yea, we are adults and talk like it.

The reason I am posting this is because I read some posts that put the room in not such a favorable light. The room is a trading where it is hands on. They give you the setup, which is incredibly easy, and verbally grade your trades one by one. There is no sugar coating, and that is what a trader needs. There are no training wheels and your are not going to be bottle fed. The point is to learn to be a trader, that is a skill very few have but many more claim to be. So if you are not okay with being treated as an adult and learn from some of the best, then the room might not be for you. If you want to learn and have incredible results, which they can back up, and handle a boot camp type room, you'll succeed. You cannot be a quitter, like some who have posted here, who have joined and thought they could find something better. The results speak for themselves.

Also, you do gradually learn to trade the Mbox if you want, it process to learn in stages, which again are proven to work through results. I don't care to learn it at this point, maybe one day.

If anyone wants to go into further detail about the room, message me and we can chat about it.

Nice. First ever post on FIO defending the trading room in great detail...if I had a nickel...

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knuckleheadmovies
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Nice. First ever post on FIO defending the trading room in great detail...if I had a nickel...

I don't have much of a need to come and prove my penis size, that's why. You on the other hand... but it's okay, supposedly size doesn't matter.

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  #67 (permalink)
Lfx987
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knuckleheadmovies View Post
Hello-

I am in the room with Matt and Mike S, not Mbox Mike. I have been trading for 10 years, never live or purely focused on trading due to kids and work mostly. But I had a foundation of what trading is about. I thought I had a quite a bit of knowledge, which I quickly found out in the trading room i actually didn't. I went in thinking I would start off learning Mbox, wasn't the case when I did the free trial, but I was willing to learn even though I hated MA's. I am glad I listened, i have learned soooo much with these guys. They teach a trader to read candles as well as give a psychological background, which Matt has, he's been doing this for 30+ years. The nut is a concept to teach you to learn to you can win, it gives you that psychological edge a trader needs. The room and people in it are very supportive, but yea, we are adults and talk like it.


Think you are mistaken, no one disparaged the room per say, what was in question was what the room was teaching ie. is it teaching you to trade as per the style of mBox Mike.

Let me ask you a question.

The videos put out by mBox Mike (lets call him mMike), in the room on the first day of a new joiner, are any set-ups taught that teach you how to trade like mMike?

mMike does not trade with moving averages nor does he trade with 10 tick stops etc. His trading style is very very different to the basic set-up taught in the room.

Let me ask you, matt/mike.s/graham/and anyone else matt quotes on twiter, do they use the mBox indicators to make their trading decisions in the basic set-up?

If the answer to all of the above is no, then the room is not teaching what the grandfatherr package is implying it will teach ie. mBox.

No need to get defensive, if the set-up being taught (basically Bill Williams Alligator with 5 MA's instead of 3, and of different lengths) is different to how mMike trades, then the room is not teaching what it it implied it will be teaching.

Even if you get the basic set-up, there is no progression to learning how to trade like mMike because it is completely different.

The fact is you do not need mBox if you want to join the room and if you do buy mBox, the room isn't going to be the best place to learn how to use it like mMike. That's all there is too it.

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 JonnyBoy 
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Lfx987 View Post
Think you are mistaken, no one disparaged the room per say, what was in question was what the room was teaching ie. is it teaching you to trade as per the style of mBox Mike.

Let me ask you a question.

The videos put out by mBox Mike (lets call him mMike), in the room on the first day of a new joiner, are any set-ups taught that teach you how to trade like mMike?

mMike does not trade with moving averages nor does he trade with 10 tick stops etc. His trading style is very very different to the basic set-up taught in the room.

Let me ask you, matt/mike.s/graham/and anyone else matt quotes on twiter, do they use the mBox indicators to make their trading decisions in the basic set-up?

If the answer to all of the above is no, then the room is not teaching what the grandfatherr package is implying it will teach ie. mBox.

No need to get defensive, if the set-up being taught (basically Bill Williams Alligator with 5 MA's instead of 3, and of different lengths) is different to how mMike trades, then the room is not teaching what it it implied it will be teaching.

Even if you get the basic set-up, there is no progression to learning how to trade like mMike because it is completely different.

The fact is you do not need mBox if you want to join the room and if you do buy mBox, the room isn't going to be the best place to learn how to use it like mMike. That's all there is too it.

I wouldn't rise to the bait.

Michael from MBox started this thread himself with the username 'mdsvtr' and was banned. He later came on as himself under the user name 'mboxwave' and was subsequently banned. Now him or Matt obviously have a few user names that they use to browse FIO.

Memphis, TN appears to be quite a popular place for 'mdsvtr', 'mboxwave' and you guessed it 'knuckleheadmovies' to come from...what are the chances of that....

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brunoss
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First and for most, I'm not Matt or Mike S.or MboxMike neither being paid, I'm new to this community, couple of months, and I'm just a member of NOBS room, I'll be speaking for myself as I felt some of the comments and opinions above are different from mine and doesn't reflect the reality I see every day on NOBS room.

I have been trading since 2017, options and futures. I have been in different trainings enough to have heavy background, loaded with different ideas, indicators and algos.

I found Mbox indicators through NOBS tweets, bought the grandfather package and joined the Matt's chat room back in December 2019. My initial intention was to trade as MboxMike and use the product I bought, who doesn't, the guy is killing it with 10k profits on every YouTube video. Matt, Mike at my first day welcomed me and asked my background to understand my level of experience, Matt is sharing his screen every day and it is and has been consistently sharing the same info since, with mbox indicators and also NOBS indicators, I found it great as they complement each other. Matt most of the time is teaching how to read the market and use all indicators to give you the edge to be a successful trader, big part of his education is also related to psychology behind trading, being a successful trader, which I can't argue because I had not been able to consistently be a successful trader. He makes it clear that the room is an apprenticeship program, for you to become a professional trader, and if you proof your are in another level other than a beginner you will be treated as one, majority of the people that come and join the room are not able to do proof that, including me, so you have to understand where you belong, beginners team.

now to come to my point, if you're a not a successful trader, and can't prove your consistency, and think that they are misleading you in not getting into the mbox education, you have ego issues, simple as that, mbox algos and indicators are advanced trading stuff, and can help you a lot if you know already how to trade, then use it. But if by this point you are not able to read the BARS, price action, and be able to succeed with the basic pullback setup with moving averages that they also teach, which by the way it alone can lead you to success, where in this world you think you will be able to succeed using the mbox stuff. You got to reflect yourself on this. In the other hand, if you are successful trader, meaning you know how to trade already and can proof your consistency, Matt everyday calls out the mbox algos firing off, and make analysis on them, as a beginner you will not get it and honestly should not depend on it, they will give an edge once you already know what you are doing and that's it, even on MboxMike vídeos you see he is reading the price action, support and resistance, and uses the indicators to support his analysis, clearly he does not need them to trade, he is professional already.

Conclusion, NOBS apprenticeship program is great to help you not only to become a successful professional trader, but also to understand the mental problems you're facing that prevents you to be successful. You will learn all that you need to trade by yourself without anything else other than just reading the freaking bars, plus you will learn how to analyze and use mbox algos and indicators too, everyday.

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 investorcat 
Copenhagen + Denmark
 
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The room is not for everyone. You have to know what you want out of it. Sometimes Mike gets mad - but don't take it personally. I found that he's not mad at you but instead the way you trade. So just take the beating and learn - you can learn a LOT from these guys. Take what you can use and move on. That's what I did and it had worked wonders for me.

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Lfx987
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investorcat View Post
The room is not for everyone. You have to know what you want out of it. Sometimes Mike gets made - but don't take it personally. I found that he's not mad at you but instead the way you trade. So just take the beating and learn - you can learn a LOT from these guys. Take what you can use and move on. That's what I did and it had worked wonders for me.


That's the whole point.

The room is not what is "being sold". Many who join, join on the basis of being taught MBOX.

It should be made very very clear on the MBOX page that the room has it's own teaching/system and will not reflect the way in which mBox Mike trades.

If that warning was present, we wouldn't be having his conversation.

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Lfx987
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brunoss View Post
First and for most, I'm not Matt or Mike S.or MboxMike neither being paid, I'm new to this community, couple of months, and I'm just a member of NOBS room, I'll be speaking for myself as I felt some of the comments and opinions above are different from mine and doesn't reflect the reality I see every day on NOBS room.

I have been trading since 2017, options and futures. I have been in different trainings enough to have heavy background, loaded with different ideas, indicators and algos.

I found Mbox indicators through NOBS tweets, bought the grandfather package and joined the Matt's chat room back in December 2019. My initial intention was to trade as MboxMike and use the product I bought, who doesn't, the guy is killing it with 10k profits on every YouTube video. Matt, Mike at my first day welcomed me and asked my background to understand my level of experience, Matt is sharing his screen every day and it is and has been consistently sharing the same info since, with mbox indicators and also NOBS indicators, I found it great as they complement each other. Matt most of the time is teaching how to read the market and use all indicators to give you the edge to be a successful trader, big part of his education is also related to psychology behind trading, being a successful trader, which I can't argue because I had not been able to consistently be a successful trader. He makes it clear that the room is an apprenticeship program, for you to become a professional trader, and if you proof your are in another level other than a beginner you will be treated as one, majority of the people that come and join the room are not able to do proof that, including me, so you have to understand where you belong, beginners team.


So tell me, how many people after learning the basic set-up have started to trade like mBox Mike?

The step-up being taught in the room has noting to do with how mBoxMike trades.

mBox Mike does not use moving averages and he does not engage in bar by bar analysis to enter/exit trades.

Mike.s/Graham etc do not even use mBox in their trade entire/exits yet Matt in his advertising states Mbox indicators among the reasons that lead them to enter/exit trades. This is false advertising.

Again, am not saying the room has no value, am saying the room is not teaching what people sign up for.

It should be made VERY clear that the room is independent from Mbox software. That is all there is to it.

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 JonnyBoy 
Market Wizard
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Lfx987 View Post
So tell me, how many people after learning the basic set-up have started to trade like mBox Mike?

The step-up being taught in the room has noting to do with how mBoxMike trades.

mBox Mike does not use moving averages and he does not engage in bar by bar analysis to enter/exit trades.

Mike.s/Graham etc do not even use mBox in their trade entire/exits yet Matt in his advertising states Mbox indicators among the reasons that lead them to enter/exit trades. This is false advertising.

Again, am not saying the room has no value, am saying the room is not teaching what people sign up for.

It should be made VERY clear that the room is independent from Mbox software. That is all there is to it.

As you navigate more through this site and especially when looking at vendor reviews, there is a particular pattern of postings to look out for. Users that spring to the defense of the vendor in question typically have zero posts or very few posts and are therefore worth a little scrutiny, especially when a bunch of them show up in short succession.

Typically they all go onto provide glowing 5 star reviews, berating other users experiences in the process. The review is generally so skewed in favour of the vendor that it is worth questioning the genuineness of it, especially if it isn't a balanced review or isn't asking valid questions like yourself.

In some cases (like the user ''knuckleheadmovies'' that just got banned) there was clearly something untoward there. The FIO administrators do a phenomenal job in keeping FIO on the straight and narrow. I honestly don't know how they have managed to keep things as professional and balanced as they do for as long as they have.

This is the only trading forum IMO that is worth the time to be on. No other forum can touch the professionalism and passion of the users on here. Sure, heated debates take place in threads but that is because of their passion for trading!

I think you provided some excellent points and it is a pity that the vendor (alleged of course) feel they have to disguise themselves as "just another trader who isn't affiliated with the vendor" and belittle users who provide genuine and honest impressions. Their disingenuous attempts to swing the pendulum in their favour and chide other users genuine experiences, IMO, speaks volumes to the actual authenticity and underlying intentions of the vendor themselves.

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 yetispaghetti 
los angeles ca
 
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So... I feel like the only thing that I would actually use is the boxdelta... not really sure that I can justify 1000 for the grandfather package

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  #75 (permalink)
Lfx987
London
 
 
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JonnyBoy View Post
As you navigate more through this site and especially when looking at vendor reviews, there is a particular pattern of postings to look out for. Users that spring to the defense of the vendor in question typically have zero posts or very few posts and are therefore worth a little scrutiny, especially when a bunch of them show up in short succession.

Typically they all go onto provide glowing 5 star reviews, berating other users experiences in the process. The review is generally so skewed in favour of the vendor that it is worth questioning the genuineness of it, especially if it isn't a balanced review or isn't asking valid questions like yourself.

Thank you , very comforting to know :-)

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 sienna 
Melbourne, Australia
 
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Lfx987 View Post
That's the whole point.

The room is not what is "being sold". Many who join, join on the basis of being taught MBOX.

It should be made very very clear on the MBOX page that the room has it's own teaching/system and will not reflect the way in which mBox Mike trades.

If that warning was present, we wouldn't be having his conversation.

Lfx987,
Well said !! Being trained on Mboxx is the basis on which I bought both the software and the training. I also feel that their advertising is false. Am in a position where I am slowly adapting the Mboxx software to my way of trading. It is slow, because I am reliant on myself only. That is I am reliant on the publicly accessible videos, NOT any specific Mboxx training with any Q/A capacity etc etc. To be sure, the software is well coded and I do find it helpful, BUT there is no Mboxx training in the grandfather package. I was in the training room for 2 weeks and the previous posts are accurate. It's EMA and VWap on NQ and training one's patience on one specific set up. Mboxx hardly gets a look in and almost zero mentions.

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trader98336262
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i am new on this forum and i hope my comment on this thread will not be removed

i paid to join matts room about four months ago. i saw the youtube videos then bought the grandfather package thinking i could learn mbox because that is what is advertised on webisite. see this link

MBoxWave Software & Training ? No BS Trades

wen i was in there the first thing i was asked is if "i wanted to learn mbox" or "i want to make money". matt bowen asked me that. I told him i want to make money. someone named mike sappington then chimmed in and told me to "then take all that mbox shit off your charts" and he went rant about how people think mbox will make you money and thats all you need

i wasnt v happy but i did what i was told and started to learn the pullback setup. this setup is not reliable long term and u can see this because the people who preach it do not do it themselves

when i didnt get the setup straight away i was publically humiliated and berated by mike sappington. when i asked about things like support and resistance levels, both matt bowen and mike sappington would then tell me i was stupid if i thought s/r levels would make me money and that i was thinking too much. i only asked a question

ive been there four months. i paid for mbox yet havent learned any mbox.

i was in the room on friday

matt bowen and mike sappington are cruel bullies. i have been in there four months and i have yet to see a single trade matt has taken himself. not talking about a live trade here i mean a chart with his markings on.

hes very good at talking about trades after the fact but you never see him talk through a trade properly

matt was saying how the people on this forum are failed traders and are stupid *(insert swear word here)*

i believe what i have read above because i have seen it with my own two eyes

i have recordings of the room when theyve been saying this and if i see them cruelly have a go at another person i will consider doing something with the recordings that i have

the room is toxic and shut be shut down for good. no real teachings goes on in there. its seems to me its place for matt and mike sappington to pass the time and berate other traders who have paid a lot of money for training

there are some nice people in there. but matt bowen and mike sappington need to find something else to do because teaching people to trade is obviously something either of them want to do or really enjoy. they also use are very racist to european traders and put difficulties in them learning the trade down to their poor enlgish (rather than the poor training)

the whole room is a con and decent people are losing money to these two frauds

i had not heard of this forum before and have since seen it to be an excellent source of honest knowledge

when i heard matt talk about it i had to come on here to add my comment

admins please please please do not remove this

i noticed when someone searches for "mboxwave review" this is the second listing in google

i want to prevent other people from going to this room and losing their hard earned money

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 JonnyBoy 
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trader98336262 View Post
i am new on this forum and i hope my comment on this thread will not be removed

i paid to join matts room about four months ago. i saw the youtube videos then bought the grandfather package thinking i could learn mbox because that is what is advertised on webisite. see this link

MBoxWave Software & Training ? No BS Trades

wen i was in there the first thing i was asked is if "i wanted to learn mbox" or "i want to make money". matt bowen asked me that. I told him i want to make money. someone named mike sappington then chimmed in and told me to "then take all that mbox shit off your charts" and he went rant about how people think mbox will make you money and thats all you need

i wasnt v happy but i did what i was told and started to learn the pullback setup. this setup is not reliable long term and u can see this because the people who preach it do not do it themselves

when i didnt get the setup straight away i was publically humiliated and berated by mike sappington. when i asked about things like support and resistance levels, both matt bowen and mike sappington would then tell me i was stupid if i thought s/r levels would make me money and that i was thinking too much. i only asked a question

ive been there four months. i paid for mbox yet havent learned any mbox.

i was in the room on friday

matt bowen and mike sappington are cruel bullies. i have been in there four months and i have yet to see a single trade matt has taken himself. not talking about a live trade here i mean a chart with his markings on.

hes very good at talking about trades after the fact but you never see him talk through a trade properly

matt was saying how the people on this forum are failed traders and are stupid *(insert swear word here)*

i believe what i have read above because i have seen it with my own two eyes

i have recordings of the room when theyve been saying this and if i see them cruelly have a go at another person i will consider doing something with the recordings that i have

the room is toxic and shut be shut down for good. no real teachings goes on in there. its seems to me its place for matt and mike sappington to pass the time and berate other traders who have paid a lot of money for training

there are some nice people in there. but matt bowen and mike sappington need to find something else to do because teaching people to trade is obviously something either of them want to do or really enjoy. they also use are very racist to european traders and put difficulties in them learning the trade down to their poor enlgish (rather than the poor training)

the whole room is a con and decent people are losing money to these two frauds

i had not heard of this forum before and have since seen it to be an excellent source of honest knowledge

when i heard matt talk about it i had to come on here to add my comment

admins please please please do not remove this

i noticed when someone searches for "mboxwave review" this is the second listing in google

i want to prevent other people from going to this room and losing their hard earned money

Wow. That is an incredibly honest review, thank you. You do not need to be concerned about this post being removed, it is very apparent this is based on a real person spending real time in the room and proving very valuable feedback. And of course you have recordings of the session.

If FIO was being discussed in the room and then berated then that really goes to show the type of people we are dealing with here. @NinjaTrader have Mboxwave as a vendor, but it appears they do not seem too concerned about the live trading videos not containing any kind of disclaimer. This was pointed out in another thread but to my knowledge nothing has changed.

I hope they would also be interested in Mboxwave's close ties to the website you described. This isn't exactly a good advertisement for them IMO, but I guess we'll wait and see.

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 JonnyBoy 
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trader98336262 View Post
there are some nice people in there. but matt bowen and mike sappington need to find something else to do because teaching people to trade is obviously something either of them want to do or really enjoy. they also use are very racist to european traders and put difficulties in them learning the trade down to their poor enlgish (rather than the poor training)

This part about them being racist towards non English speakers is disgusting and abhorrent. Every time I think we are making progress in this world to eradicate racist behaviour, people like this remind me that we still have such a long way to go. I am glad you have the recordings of them.

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 yetispaghetti 
los angeles ca
 
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Just got the grandfather package last night, will paper trade the hell out of this thing before Sunday open and will test it out with MES and once I'm comfortable will be going to ES and using my regular contract size. Will keep you guys posted, didn't even bother with the trading room because of the reviews on this page. Thanks for saving me a grand guys 😁

Edit: wow I didn't even read the previous 3 messages and that's disgusting of them to do and now I'm really glad I didn't get the trading room as well...

Edit: I got 2 PMs asking me the reason and I figured I would just write it in the post to save some of you the extra step of PMing me and saving me from PMing back haha. I got it because I use delta and footprint charting to trade and this kind of simplified it for me. But again I still have to see. As of Apr25th2020 I am not sure. I messed around with it for a couple of hours and I consistently was positive but that's on paper so who knows?

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trader98336262
Madrid
 
 
Posts: 2 since Apr 2020
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thank you for not removing my post

i will be in his room again next week and will keep the recorder running

i agree

racism has no place in 2020

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  #82 (permalink)
 Stevun 
Rotterdam, The Netherlands
 
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I have been a member of this forum for a number of years. I have never posted anything because I consider 90% of the stuff here is of little value. This thread is an excellent example of misinformation. However, since there are blatant lies being posted I feel a need to respond.



JonnyBoy View Post
As you navigate more through this site and especially when looking at vendor reviews, there is a particular pattern of postings to look out for. Users that spring to the defense of the vendor in question typically have zero posts or very few posts and are therefore worth a little scrutiny, especially when a bunch of them show up in short succession.

Typically they all go onto provide glowing 5 star reviews, berating other users experiences in the process. The review is generally so skewed in favour of the vendor that it is worth questioning the genuineness of it, especially if it isn't a balanced review or isn't asking valid questions like yourself.

In some cases (like the user ''knuckleheadmovies'' that just got banned) there was clearly something untoward there. The FIO administrators do a phenomenal job in keeping FIO on the straight and narrow. I honestly don't know how they have managed to keep things as professional and balanced as they do for as long as they have.

This is the only trading forum IMO that is worth the time to be on. No other forum can touch the professionalism and passion of the users on here. Sure, heated debates take place in threads but that is because of their passion for trading!

I think you provided some excellent points and it is a pity that the vendor (alleged of course) feel they have to disguise themselves as "just another trader who isn't affiliated with the vendor" and belittle users who provide genuine and honest impressions. Their disingenuous attempts to swing the pendulum in their favour and chide other users genuine experiences, IMO, speaks volumes to the actual authenticity and underlying intentions of the vendor themselves.

The logic of JonnyBoy is fascinating. If a first-time post of a vendor is favourable it must be scrutinized. However, a first-time negative post is considered an honest review. No scrutiny necessary. Go figure.

Here is another profound statement by JonnyBoy


JonnyBoy View Post
I think this is fair commentary you just made. I do not have the Mbox products, nor do I know anything about this trading room. However, like most traders on FIO, whenever a product or website is mentioned/reviewed I am always curious to check it out and take a look at the offerings.

From everything I read on the Mbox website, I was 100% convinced the trading room was an Mbox trading room. The cherry picked Twitter posts where supposed members charts are posted, appear to all show the MBox product. I can understand the confusion and it is unfortunate that this isn't made crystal clear to everybody.

Go back to the NOBS twitter feed and look for Emma’s “cherry picked” trades and there are a lot of them. Impossible to miss. Never is there a Mbox tool shown.


I have been in the trading room since February and believe it or not I am not affiliated with the vendor. I am not trying to “swing the pendulum” as so you eloquently describe but I will debunk the obnoxious lies that are being spread here. This is my first post and probably my last as I have no intention in engaging with the people here. It would not surprise me if I get banned for the obvious reasons.

Many people here saying they bought the Mbox software because they saw Mike’s videos where he makes a bucket of money and want to trade just like him, so I assume the purchase was based on greed. This is only an assumption. Apparently, people fail to realize is that Mbox Mike developed that system for his trading style and only Mike can trade that way. No two traders trade the same. The point being is that majority of the people who buy the indicators are not profitable traders to start off with and are under the illusion that the Mbox tools will make them rich. Afterall, they all say they want to trade like Mbox Mike and he never posts losing trades.

I would agree that the web page is somewhat misleading and that the purchase of the apprenticeship is solely a Mbox trading room. Anybody who took the time to read the page thoroughly must have seen that no prerequisites were required. More importantly, it states the less trading knowledge is better. This should have made people think twice as Wyckoff trading requires background knowledge. There is a contact form at the bottom of the page. It requires little effort to make contact and ask for a one-day pass to the room where any questions would have been answered. Amazingly, this actually happened recently, and Matt Bowen advised that person (a doctor) NOT to join the room. Maybe it is on one of the recordings of trader98336262.

I read that people are complaining is about the scope of the trading being taught in the room. Matt Bowen offers a proven trading setup that will make approximately $50,000 annually. The time needed to achieve this is generally 15 months for the average person and requires commitment, discipline, determination, generally just a lot of hard work, day in day out. According to this forum Matt should adapt to all the whims of every trader in the room.
Just to put things in perspective.
Jim Dalton only teaches Market Profile. 1 month course $1099
Al Brooks only teaches his proprietary setup and has a trading room that costs $99/month
John Grady only uses DOM - 2 Weeks of Live Trading + Recordings + Set of Webinar Primer Videos: $1849
Matt Bowen NOBS Trading only teaches day trading based on 1 minute charts with LIFETIME access.
The point is everyone has a different timeframe and trading style and you should find what works with your personality. Personally, what is offered in the trading room is exactly what I sought. It does not bother me at all that the Mbox stuff is not part of the apprenticeship. Honestly, if I can make $50,000 per year, I will be more than satisfied. It is really that simple for me to accept this. I, unlike others on this forum, have no problem with this whatsoever. But then again, I have never had the illusion of trading like Mbox Mike. This makes no sense to me.

The post by trader98336262 motivated me to post for the first time here.

trader98336262
i paid to join matts room about four months ago. i saw the youtube videos then bought the grandfather package thinking i could learn mbox because that is what is advertised on webisite. see this link

Perhaps if you had done your due diligence you could have asked for a one-day pass. I thought everybody was aware there are a lot of scams in the trading world.

trader98336262
wen i was in there the first thing i was asked is if "i wanted to learn mbox" or "i want to make money". matt bowen asked me that. I told him i want to make money. someone named mike sappington then chimmed in and told me to "then take all that mbox shit off your charts" and he went rant about how people think mbox will make you money and thats all you need

This is the program they start with. They provide a simple pullback setup with a set of predefined rules to learn the discipline needed to trade successfully. This is where the majority of traders fail, they cannot follow simple rules, argue about everything and trade emotionally. The point Mike Sappington was making that any other indicators on the chart will only be a distraction, which is a correct assessment based on years of experience.
Personally, I like Mike Sappington. Politically incorrect and has a distinct character that is a little daunting in the beginning as he tends to swear and cuss a lot but that is just how he is. He has told quite few interesting stories. Mike has not had a losing day in more than two years, but I doubt if the sceptics here would believe that.

trader98336262
i wasnt v happy but i did what i was told and started to learn the pullback setup. this setup is not reliable long term and u can see this because the people who preach it do not do it themselves

This is a false statement. The setup has been proven by professional traders and more recently by one of the members who programmed the strategy to assess it with a reasonably large dataset.

trader98336262
when i didnt get the setup straight away i was publically humiliated and berated by mike sappington. when i asked about things like support and resistance levels, both matt bowen and mike sappington would then tell me i was stupid if i thought s/r levels would make me money and that i was thinking too much. i only asked a question

That is criticism and it appears you cannot deal with it. The trading rules are quite simple. Other people are also being criticized, one person I admire is Bruno, who always comes back for more despite the continuous verbal abuse. Point being is that the market does not care how you feel.
I suggest you watch a BBC series called Million Dollar Traders (3 parts) and note how harshly the traders there are treated.
Link to part 1:


trader98336262
ive been there four months. i paid for mbox yet havent learned any mbox.

You cannot even trade the basic pullback setup which is much simpler than the mbox. However, there is good news for you. It appears Mbox Mike has updated his site and here is the link to the free training.
https://mboxwave.com/free-training-ongoing-education

trader98336262
i was in the room on friday

matt bowen and mike sappington are cruel bullies. i have been in there four months and i have yet to see a single trade matt has taken himself. not talking about a live trade here i mean a chart with his markings on.


Cruel bullies. Seriously, are you a child? What would Matt showing his trade prove?


trader98336262
hes very good at talking about trades after the fact but you never see him talk through a trade properly

Another false statement. Matt talks a lot about the market and calls the market direction, however no trading is done in the room. You fail to mention that he does post trades of his successful students who are making money every day. Most are trading various (advanced) setups, including the pullback setup and some do use the Mbox tools. Others do not need to because Matt has taught them how to read the bars.

trader98336262
matt was saying how the people on this forum are failed traders and are stupid *(insert swear word here)*

I do not remember him saying that but out of curiosity how many traders on this forum consistently make money? Probably less than 5%. Would that make his assessment correct?

trader98336262
i believe what i have read above because i have seen it with my own two eyes

i have recordings of the room when theyve been saying this and if i see them cruelly have a go at another person i will consider doing something with the recordings that i have


Please do. Why don't you post them on this forum and let people judge for themselves. I am sure there are a few adults here.

trader98336262
the room is toxic and shut be shut down for good. no real teachings goes on in there. its seems to me its place for matt and mike sappington to pass the time and berate other traders who have paid a lot of money for training

You act like a spoilt child saying the room should be shut down simply because you cannot accept criticism and yet you cannot explain the successful traders Matt has taught.
Seriously, do you honestly think $1200 is a lot of money. You do know Mbox Mike trades 10 lots a pop.

trader98336262
there are some nice people in there. but matt bowen and mike sappington need to find something else to do because teaching people to trade is obviously something either of them want to do or really enjoy. they also use are very racist to european traders and put difficulties in them learning the trade down to their poor enlgish (rather than the poor training)


The racism card. I cannot recollect any racist remarks whatsoever. I have been in the room every single day since February. Nothing even close. The strange fact is they have successful (European) traders posting their trades.
I can only suggest you prove your allegation of racism and post your recordings.
Perhaps Matt Bowen can sue FIO for defamation of character as they are responsible for the content of this forum.

trader98336262
the whole room is a con and decent people are losing money to these two frauds

Which people? Most are trading a SIM account!

trader98336262
i had not heard of this forum before and have since seen it to be an excellent source of honest knowledge

when i heard matt talk about it i had to come on here to add my comment

admins please please please do not remove this

i noticed when someone searches for "mboxwave review" this is the second listing in google

i want to prevent other people from going to this room and losing their hard earned money


An excellent source of honest knowledge. Debatable, perhaps 10%. I consider your post is based on emotions and you cannot accept responsibility for your own failure, so you blame others. Others who have posted here fail at any form of self-criticism.

While I was doing my due diligence about Mbox apprenticeship I wanted to find out as much as I could about out about Matt Bowen. Coincidentally it came from this forum and I suppose it must have slipped past JonnyBoy as he would consider this as swinging the pendulum. I would agree with what is stated the post. Matt has ethics and integrity and he will do all it takes to make the people in his room successful if the person is prepared to commit to his apprenticeship. I should point out that this is my opinion and not a fact for the people who cannot distinguish between the two.

Finally, I suggest anybody reading this thread should be aware of false information being spread on this forum. They are not facts, but opinions based on emotions. Do not believe me. Simply ask for day pass to the room and judge for yourself. You can ask Matt whatever you please, that is, if you have the guts. I am sure Matt will oblige.


Matt Bowen -Indicator Warehouse use BMT indicators_ - Trading Reviews and Vendors _ futures

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 Oriole 
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Stevun View Post
I have been a member of this forum for a number of years. I have never posted anything because I consider 90% of the stuff here is of little value. This thread is an excellent example of misinformation. However, since there are blatant lies being posted I feel a need to respond.




The logic of JonnyBoy is fascinating. If a first-time post of a vendor is favourable it must be scrutinized. However, a first-time negative post is considered an honest review. No scrutiny necessary. Go figure.

Here is another profound statement by JonnyBoy



Go back to the NOBS twitter feed and look for Emma’s “cherry picked” trades and there are a lot of them. Impossible to miss. Never is there a Mbox tool shown.


I have been in the trading room since February and believe it or not I am not affiliated with the vendor. I am not trying to “swing the pendulum” as so you eloquently describe but I will debunk the obnoxious lies that are being spread here. This is my first post and probably my last as I have no intention in engaging with the people here. It would not surprise me if I get banned for the obvious reasons.

Many people here saying they bought the Mbox software because they saw Mike’s videos where he makes a bucket of money and want to trade just like him, so I assume the purchase was based on greed. This is only an assumption. Apparently, people fail to realize is that Mbox Mike developed that system for his trading style and only Mike can trade that way. No two traders trade the same. The point being is that majority of the people who buy the indicators are not profitable traders to start off with and are under the illusion that the Mbox tools will make them rich. Afterall, they all say they want to trade like Mbox Mike and he never posts losing trades.

I would agree that the web page is somewhat misleading and that the purchase of the apprenticeship is solely a Mbox trading room. Anybody who took the time to read the page thoroughly must have seen that no prerequisites were required. More importantly, it states the less trading knowledge is better. This should have made people think twice as Wyckoff trading requires background knowledge. There is a contact form at the bottom of the page. It requires little effort to make contact and ask for a one-day pass to the room where any questions would have been answered. Amazingly, this actually happened recently, and Matt Bowen advised that person (a doctor) NOT to join the room. Maybe it is on one of the recordings of trader98336262.

I read that people are complaining is about the scope of the trading being taught in the room. Matt Bowen offers a proven trading setup that will make approximately $50,000 annually. The time needed to achieve this is generally 15 months for the average person and requires commitment, discipline, determination, generally just a lot of hard work, day in day out. According to this forum Matt should adapt to all the whims of every trader in the room.
Just to put things in perspective.
Jim Dalton only teaches Market Profile. 1 month course $1099
Al Brooks only teaches his proprietary setup and has a trading room that costs $99/month
John Grady only uses DOM - 2 Weeks of Live Trading + Recordings + Set of Webinar Primer Videos: $1849
Matt Bowen NOBS Trading only teaches day trading based on 1 minute charts with LIFETIME access.
The point is everyone has a different timeframe and trading style and you should find what works with your personality. Personally, what is offered in the trading room is exactly what I sought. It does not bother me at all that the Mbox stuff is not part of the apprenticeship. Honestly, if I can make $50,000 per year, I will be more than satisfied. It is really that simple for me to accept this. I, unlike others on this forum, have no problem with this whatsoever. But then again, I have never had the illusion of trading like Mbox Mike. This makes no sense to me.

The post by trader98336262 motivated me to post for the first time here.

trader98336262
i paid to join matts room about four months ago. i saw the youtube videos then bought the grandfather package thinking i could learn mbox because that is what is advertised on webisite. see this link

Perhaps if you had done your due diligence you could have asked for a one-day pass. I thought everybody was aware there are a lot of scams in the trading world.

trader98336262
wen i was in there the first thing i was asked is if "i wanted to learn mbox" or "i want to make money". matt bowen asked me that. I told him i want to make money. someone named mike sappington then chimmed in and told me to "then take all that mbox shit off your charts" and he went rant about how people think mbox will make you money and thats all you need

This is the program they start with. They provide a simple pullback setup with a set of predefined rules to learn the discipline needed to trade successfully. This is where the majority of traders fail, they cannot follow simple rules, argue about everything and trade emotionally. The point Mike Sappington was making that any other indicators on the chart will only be a distraction, which is a correct assessment based on years of experience.
Personally, I like Mike Sappington. Politically incorrect and has a distinct character that is a little daunting in the beginning as he tends to swear and cuss a lot but that is just how he is. He has told quite few interesting stories. Mike has not had a losing day in more than two years, but I doubt if the sceptics here would believe that.

trader98336262
i wasnt v happy but i did what i was told and started to learn the pullback setup. this setup is not reliable long term and u can see this because the people who preach it do not do it themselves

This is a false statement. The setup has been proven by professional traders and more recently by one of the members who programmed the strategy to assess it with a reasonably large dataset.

trader98336262
when i didnt get the setup straight away i was publically humiliated and berated by mike sappington. when i asked about things like support and resistance levels, both matt bowen and mike sappington would then tell me i was stupid if i thought s/r levels would make me money and that i was thinking too much. i only asked a question

That is criticism and it appears you cannot deal with it. The trading rules are quite simple. Other people are also being criticized, one person I admire is Bruno, who always comes back for more despite the continuous verbal abuse. Point being is that the market does not care how you feel.
I suggest you watch a BBC series called Million Dollar Traders (3 parts) and note how harshly the traders there are treated.
Link to part 1:


trader98336262
ive been there four months. i paid for mbox yet havent learned any mbox.

You cannot even trade the basic pullback setup which is much simpler than the mbox. However, there is good news for you. It appears Mbox Mike has updated his site and here is the link to the free training.
https://mboxwave.com/free-training-ongoing-education

trader98336262
i was in the room on friday

matt bowen and mike sappington are cruel bullies. i have been in there four months and i have yet to see a single trade matt has taken himself. not talking about a live trade here i mean a chart with his markings on.


Cruel bullies. Seriously, are you a child? What would Matt showing his trade prove?


trader98336262
hes very good at talking about trades after the fact but you never see him talk through a trade properly

Another false statement. Matt talks a lot about the market and calls the market direction, however no trading is done in the room. You fail to mention that he does post trades of his successful students who are making money every day. Most are trading various (advanced) setups, including the pullback setup and some do use the Mbox tools. Others do not need to because Matt has taught them how to read the bars.

trader98336262
matt was saying how the people on this forum are failed traders and are stupid *(insert swear word here)*

I do not remember him saying that but out of curiosity how many traders on this forum consistently make money? Probably less than 5%. Would that make his assessment correct?

trader98336262
i believe what i have read above because i have seen it with my own two eyes

i have recordings of the room when theyve been saying this and if i see them cruelly have a go at another person i will consider doing something with the recordings that i have


Please do. Why don't you post them on this forum and let people judge for themselves. I am sure there are a few adults here.

trader98336262
the room is toxic and shut be shut down for good. no real teachings goes on in there. its seems to me its place for matt and mike sappington to pass the time and berate other traders who have paid a lot of money for training

You act like a spoilt child saying the room should be shut down simply because you cannot accept criticism and yet you cannot explain the successful traders Matt has taught.
Seriously, do you honestly think $1200 is a lot of money. You do know Mbox Mike trades 10 lots a pop.

trader98336262
there are some nice people in there. but matt bowen and mike sappington need to find something else to do because teaching people to trade is obviously something either of them want to do or really enjoy. they also use are very racist to european traders and put difficulties in them learning the trade down to their poor enlgish (rather than the poor training)


The racism card. I cannot recollect any racist remarks whatsoever. I have been in the room every single day since February. Nothing even close. The strange fact is they have successful (European) traders posting their trades.
I can only suggest you prove your allegation of racism and post your recordings.
Perhaps Matt Bowen can sue FIO for defamation of character as they are responsible for the content of this forum.

trader98336262
the whole room is a con and decent people are losing money to these two frauds

Which people? Most are trading a SIM account!

trader98336262
i had not heard of this forum before and have since seen it to be an excellent source of honest knowledge

when i heard matt talk about it i had to come on here to add my comment

admins please please please do not remove this

i noticed when someone searches for "mboxwave review" this is the second listing in google

i want to prevent other people from going to this room and losing their hard earned money


An excellent source of honest knowledge. Debatable, perhaps 10%. I consider your post is based on emotions and you cannot accept responsibility for your own failure, so you blame others. Others who have posted here fail at any form of self-criticism.

While I was doing my due diligence about Mbox apprenticeship I wanted to find out as much as I could about out about Matt Bowen. Coincidentally it came from this forum and I suppose it must have slipped past JonnyBoy as he would consider this as swinging the pendulum. I would agree with what is stated the post. Matt has ethics and integrity and he will do all it takes to make the people in his room successful if the person is prepared to commit to his apprenticeship. I should point out that this is my opinion and not a fact for the people who cannot distinguish between the two.

Finally, I suggest anybody reading this thread should be aware of false information being spread on this forum. They are not facts, but opinions based on emotions. Do not believe me. Simply ask for day pass to the room and judge for yourself. You can ask Matt whatever you please, that is, if you have the guts. I am sure Matt will oblige.


Matt Bowen -Indicator Warehouse use BMT indicators_ - Trading Reviews and Vendors _ futures

MBox Mike has indeed revised his product offerings and the NOBS Trading Room is NO LONGER being sold with The MBox Wave Trading System. Mike is now including MBox training for free.

Since this thread has evolved from reviews of MBox Wave Systems to a NOBS Trading Room review, perhaps whoever wants to continue on the NOBS discussion should start a new thread with a NOBS Trading Room title? I’d love to get this thread back focused to those trading MBox and how it’s going.

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 JonnyBoy 
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Stevun View Post

Go back to the NOBS twitter feed and look for Emma’s “cherry picked” trades and there are a lot of them. Impossible to miss. Never is there a Mbox tool shown.

...the same Emma who's Twitter account has been suspended for violating Twitter rules?


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 JonnyBoy 
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Oriole View Post
MBox Mike has indeed revised his product offerings and the NOBS Trading Room is NO LONGER being sold with The MBox Wave Trading System. Mike is now including MBox training for free.

Since this thread has evolved from reviews of MBox Wave Systems to a NOBS Trading Room review, perhaps whoever wants to continue on the NOBS discussion should start a new thread with a NOBS Trading Room title? I’d love to get this thread back focused to those trading MBox and how it’s going.

I agree. If MBox is no longer affiliated with NOBS, then it is no longer relevant to talk about in this thread.

Let's bump this thread back to on topic and Mbox stuff.

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 Stevun 
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JonnyBoy View Post
...the same Emma who's Twitter account has been suspended for violating Twitter rules?


Nope.

Account is not suspended, her last post was 2 hours ago.

Try again.



Emma twitter

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 JonnyBoy 
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Stevun View Post
Nope.

Account is not suspended, her last post was 2 hours ago.

Try again.



Emma twitter

Right. Sorry Emma. It was down earlier hence the screen shot. An incorrect tag in one of NOBS posts.

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 Monika 
Frankfurt Germany
 
 
Posts: 14 since Apr 2020

I know someone who also bought the grandfather version and feels cheated. Everyone has to decide BEFORE BUYING, but the cheek is that the complete package can be COMPLETELY rebuilt in SC within a few hours. I tried it for fun and it was easy. So you buy what you already have in SC anyway. Some call it fraud. I do not want to comment further on this.

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 JonnyBoy 
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Monika View Post
I know someone who also bought the grandfather version and feels cheated. Everyone has to decide BEFORE BUYING, but the cheek is that the complete package can be COMPLETELY rebuilt in SC within a few hours. I tried it for fun and it was easy. So you buy what you already have in SC anyway. Some call it fraud. I do not want to comment further on this.

I am not sure why this particular vendor does not offer a free trial so traders can determine if Mbox is the right fit for them. I believe that a few people have asked but the vendor refused. You can draw your own conclusion as to why. Not his business model I am guessing is one of the reasons.

I rebuilt the product in NT8 as well (I have no experience with SC). I have had many PM requests for it but it isn't IMO ethical to share it. At the same time, if the grandfather package was 50% to 60% less than it costs now, that is probably venturing in to the 'not bad for what you get' territory.

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 Monika 
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JonnyBoy View Post
I am not sure why this particular vendor does not offer a free trial so traders can determine if Mbox is the right fit for them. I believe that a few people have asked but the vendor refused. You can draw your own conclusion as to why. Not his business model I am guessing is one of the reasons.

I rebuilt the product in NT8 as well (I have no experience with SC). I have had many PM requests for it but it isn't IMO ethical to share it. At the same time, if the grandfather package was 50% to 60% less than it costs now, that is probably venturing in to the 'not bad for what you get' territory.

agreed!

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Lfx987
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Stevun View Post
so I assume the purchase was based on greed.


"... so I assume the purchase was based on greed. ..."

Think this applies TO EVERY SINGLE PERSON who has as ever endeavored to enter the realms of financial trading

The entire motivation of the financial industry is greed. Does not mater whether you are Warren Buffet, George Soros, or little Tommy trading from his bedroom.

Anyway, think the poster has missed the point entirely. As I keep saying, no one is saying the system that is taught in the room doesn't work (for some it works really well). The point is the room was sold as a means to learn mbox and it clearly does not do this.

As someone said, if the NoBS room is going to be discussed, best to discuss it in its own thread.

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Kurczak
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I do no use the MBoxx, so I do not know how useful it is, but if any one is looking for something similar just to try the idea of cumulative volume and price swings, can try this much cheaper: advantagetrading.net/adv-swings.html
Frankly, I'm curious about the usefulness and differences between the two sets.

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Kurczak View Post
I do no use the MBoxx, so I do not know how useful it is, but if any one is looking for something similar just to try the idea of cumulative volume and price swings, can try this much cheaper: advantagetrading.net/adv-swings.html
Frankly, I'm curious about the usefulness and differences between the two sets.

You are right, it's basically the same thing.

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 Maydo 
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Lfx987 View Post
You are right, it's basically the same thing.

I tried it, but I end up buying Mbox. I personally like Mbox. Really easy to use.

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 kirkvan 
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Maydo, I'm curious, do you use all of the MBoxWave indicators or have you pared down your set? In Mike Sokolik's trade videos, he's using subset.

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 Maydo 
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kirkvan View Post
Maydo, I'm curious, do you use all of the MBoxWave indicators or have you pared down your set? In Mike Sokolik's trade videos, he's using subset.

No, I have my setup..I just use MGann Swing and Mbox Histogram. I don't care much for a rest of it...Hi is trading completely different system than I do. He has just posted good trades I don't think he made any bad trades so far . I am not that good, but am ok with my profit

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 kirkvan 
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Thanks for your reply, Maydo. That you don't trade his recommended system/setup tells me something.

Yes, I'd like to see him post videos of mistakes, losses, etc. Often, there's much more to learn there than watching one winning trade after another. I don't imagine he has a 100% win record.

I also think it would be more ethical to report his results in points, not dollars. It takes a relatively large account to trade 10 or 20 contracts, especially if the trader is only risking 1-2% of their account at a given time. I think the large dollar daily earnings can too easily seduce potential purchasers that MBox is an easy get-rich-quick system.

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  #98 (permalink)
 JonnyBoy 
Market Wizard
Montreal, Quebec
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: NinjaTrader 8
Broker: Kinetick
Trading: ES
 
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kirkvan View Post
Thanks for your reply, Maydo. That you don't trade his recommended system/setup tells me something.

Yes, I'd like to see him post videos of mistakes, losses, etc. Often, there's much more to learn there than watching one winning trade after another. I don't imagine he has a 100% win record.

I also think it would be more ethical to report his results in points, not dollars. It takes a relatively large account to trade 10 or 20 contracts, especially if the trader is only risking 1-2% of their account at a given time. I think the large dollar daily earnings can too easily seduce potential purchasers that MBox is an easy get-rich-quick system.

The MBOXX videos and charts are presented to you by Cherry Picked Films Ltd. He never shows losses. He never shows when his indicators perform badly. He just scans for the instruments that worked that particular day for his indicators and marks up a chart. Pretty much rinse and repeat.

I watched one of his videos. It had lots of comments about him trading in SIM on his platform. He refuted and it appears the comment(s) has since been deleted.

It is easy to make a video of you trading profitably. If you made tons of money, post it. If you lost a ton of money, don't post it.

There is a reason why he doesn't give a free trial. It is up to the potential purchaser as to the reason why.

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  #99 (permalink)
 kirkvan 
Edmonds, WA
 
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JonnyBoy View Post
The MBOXX videos and charts are presented to you by Cherry Picked Films Ltd. He never shows losses. He never shows when his indicators perform badly. He just scans for the instruments that worked that particular day for his indicators and marks up a chart. Pretty much rinse and repeat.

I watched one of his videos. It had lots of comments about him trading in SIM on his platform. He refuted and it appears the comment(s) has since been deleted.

It is easy to make a video of you trading profitably. If you made tons of money, post it. If you lost a ton of money, don't post it.

There is a reason why he doesn't give a free trial. It is up to the potential purchaser as to the reason why.

JonnyBoy, sadly, I'm leaning in the direction of your opinion. There are things I do like about Mike, including his tech background at Sun and Oracle. I like that he split with that trading room that wasn't really teaching his system. $1098 is a relatively low price, given the many $5,000K "indicators + training" packages around.

What I do know is that most of what is taught in the retail trading world doesn't work and most people lose all of their money. A 95% failure rate is thrown around but I think it's more like 99%, especially in high-leverage Forex and Futures.

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 KahunaDog 
Hawaii at the beach
 
Experience: Beginner
Platform: Nt8, MotiveWave, TOS
Broker: S5
Trading: ES, ZB fine alcohol and muscle cars
 
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I have MBOX, I like it. It does what it was designed to do.


Do I trade like Mike the originator?
No.
What people fail to understand is the MBOX is based on Wyckoff/Dow theory. More importantly they fail to understand Wyckoff and indicators.
The indicators do what they're supposed to do. Thumbs up.
People fail to understand the context of the markets, the indicators, Wyckoff, market context, market concepts, self.

If you listen to the room moderator in the youtube video he is a real person who talks like a real person, colorful and like a lot of New Yorkers. Get over the political correctness, bs, etc. What a joke. If you don't like that then don't go. From what I read you can trial the room. No I am not in the room or a member. I simply liked the indicators and had an understanding of them before I bought. They did what I needed so I bought it. 1000usd no big deal. Invest in yourself and education. I knew ahead of time what the indicators did. How to start using it and what to look for. Do not try to buy the indicators to learn to trade. Learn about the markets, then learn what to measure then decide what tools to best use.


All these posts slamming MBox and Mike(S)... you should take responsibility for your own education, accountability and not be so sensitive.
I have a ton of indicators I paid for through the years and I like MBox for it displays what it is supposed to. I use several pieces of it in my normal layout. I use it in conjunction with footprintS, vol profile and dom.

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