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TopstepTrader's Michael Patak (Founder) - Ask Me Anything (AMA)
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TopstepTrader's Michael Patak (Founder) - Ask Me Anything (AMA)

  #971 (permalink)
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In my opinion, the biggest benefit is allowing you to trade what feels like a real account, without you trading your real account and blowing it up. As a beginning trader, the chances of blowing up an account is very high. SIM doesn't provide the real world feel. I think TST does a good job of landing in the middle.

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Focused goals:
actions in the market are pre-considered
trades only occur when the market has conformed to expectations
donít rigidly stick to initial expectations against all evidence to the contrary
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  #972 (permalink)
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Does TST drawdown calculated unrealized or realized end of the day? Thank you.

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  #973 (permalink)
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skfutures View Post
Does TST drawdown calculated unrealized or realized end of the day? Thank you.

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Unrealized.

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  #974 (permalink)
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lemons View Post
Unrealized.

Thanks. Just to clarify, this is a quote from the the website.

"The Trailing Max Drawdown is calculated from your account balance high. So, if you make $500 on the first trading day your account balance will be $50,500 which will make your Trailing Max Drawdown $48,500 ($2,000 from the account balance high). If you were to lose $500 the next day your account balance goes back to $50,000, but your minimum account balance will remain $48,500."

This sounds like realized. They are assuming that the target was filled with limit order. Even then most of the time market has to tick through in order to get filled. From above example, if the market goes up +$700 (unrealized) and came back +$500 (realized) my minimum account balance would be $48,700 not $48,500.

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  #975 (permalink)
Market Wizard
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skfutures View Post
Does TST drawdown calculated unrealized or realized end of the day? Thank you.

Sent using the futures.io mobile app

In the Combine, the drawdown is based on the realized end of day balance. You are required to close at the end of day, so there is no unrealized end of day balance -- you can have no open trades after the close.

During the day, you can exceed the trailing max drawdown on either a realized or unrealized basis:


Quoting 
This number is calculated at the end of the trading day in the Trading Combine and Funded Trader Preparation. Which means that at any point during the trading day, you can drop below the minimum account balance, but you must be above it when the day ends.

(Source: https://help.topsteptrader.com/hc/en-us/articles/235514547-What-is-the-Trailing-Max-Drawdown- )

-----------------

The other loss rule to be aware of is the daily loss limit, which is calculated on an UNrealized basis, so you will be knocked out if your current trade exceeds the limit at any time:


Quoting 
Your Net P&L cannot hit or exceed the Daily Loss Limit at any point during the trading day (5:00 PM CT-3:10 PM CT). If at any time your Net P&L does exceed this amount for your account, any open trading positions may be flattened, any pending orders may be canceled, and your account may be prevented from placing any new trades until the start of the next trading day (5:00 PM CT). The account automatically becomes ineligible for funding once the Daily Loss Limit is exceeded.
...

The Daily Loss Limit is factored based on each trading dayís Net P&L, which includes simulated commissions, fees, and both unrealized and realized trade P&L values.

(Source: https://help.topsteptrader.com/hc/en-us/articles/235514507-What-is-the-Daily-Loss-Limit- )

------------------

You should be aware that the Max Drawdown rule for the funded account is different, and is the same as the daily loss limit:


Quoting 
In the Funded Account, this rule is calculated intraday, which means if the balance falls below the minimum account balance you will be pulled from your trades right away and the rule is considered broken.

Bob.


Last edited by bobwest; October 22nd, 2017 at 08:56 AM.
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  #976 (permalink)
Market Wizard
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skfutures View Post
Thanks. Just to clarify, this is a quote from the the website.

"The Trailing Max Drawdown is calculated from your account balance high. So, if you make $500 on the first trading day your account balance will be $50,500 which will make your Trailing Max Drawdown $48,500 ($2,000 from the account balance high). If you were to lose $500 the next day your account balance goes back to $50,000, but your minimum account balance will remain $48,500."

This sounds like realized. They are assuming that the target was filled with limit order. Even then most of the time market has to tick through in order to get filled. From above example, if the market goes up +$700 (unrealized) and came back +$500 (realized) my minimum account balance would be $48,700 not $48,500.

"Realized" has nothing to do with what type of order is filled. It has to do with whether the trade is open or not. Once you are filled, you have an unrealized profit or loss until you close the trade, at which time your P/L is realized.

Your account balance for the max drawdown is your realized balance at end of day, when all trades have been closed.

Bob.

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  #977 (permalink)
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jackbravo View Post
In my opinion, the biggest benefit is allowing you to trade what feels like a real account, without you trading your real account and blowing it up. As a beginning trader, the chances of blowing up an account is very high. SIM doesn't provide the real world feel. I think TST does a good job of landing in the middle.

Except the emotions of having real monty on the line. No sim can ever totally duplicate that. But you do have some emotion from TST because you are trying to pass the combine.

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  #978 (permalink)
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I got a PM from @skfutures with an excellent question. Basically, it is not clear from what I could find on the website whether, in the funded account, the new trailing max drawdown itself is computed the same way as in the Combine -- based on closing balance -- or on the high point reached during the day, realized or not.

So if his high point was +900, but he ended up at +700, which amount would be used, in the funded account, to calculate his new trailing max drawdown? Also, if the +900 was unrealized, would it be used, or would they use the highest realized balance?

I don't know, and it would be important to know, obviously.

I'm quoting from my reply to him, so the question will be out in the public space of the forum for others to see, and perhaps answer:


Quoting 
With TST, I know that when I was doing a Combine, I could exceed the trailing max drawdown during the day, whether in an open trade (unrealized) or after closing a trade (realized). But at the end of the day, my closing balance for that day could not violate the trailing max drawdown, and they also recomputed the new trailing max drawdown using the final, realized P/L for the day.

So, in your example, in the Combine, if you ended up +700 at the end of the day, your max trailing drawdown would be up +700, not +900. But I am not sure how it would be done in the funded account. That question is not directly addressed in the quote I posted from the website, although it does seem as if the entire rule is based on intraday, and unrealized, balance:


Quoting 
In the Funded Account, this rule is calculated intraday, which means if the balance falls below the minimum account balance you will be pulled from your trades right away and the rule is considered broken.

In all these cases, when you're not clear, I think it is best to send their support an email. They get back quickly and have always cleared up any questions I have had.

It's also the official word, and not an opinion that some guy on the forum has.

Perhaps @TopstepTrader could clarify this for us.

Bob.

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  #979 (permalink)
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eurex product was available in tst ??? if not why !!

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  #980 (permalink)
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bobwest View Post
I got a PM from @skfutures with an excellent question. Basically, it is not clear from what I could find on the website whether, in the funded account, the new trailing max drawdown itself is computed the same way as in the Combine -- based on closing balance -- or on the high point reached during the day, realized or not.

So if his high point was +900, but he ended up at +700, which amount would be used, in the funded account, to calculate his new trailing max drawdown? Also, if the +900 was unrealized, would it be used, or would they use the highest realized balance?

I don't know, and it would be important to know, obviously.

I'm quoting from my reply to him, so the question will be out in the public space of the forum for others to see, and perhaps answer:



Perhaps @TopstepTrader could clarify this for us.

Bob.

As a recent funded trader i can tell you it calculates it from ur account high at the end of the day/close not your account high during the day.
So if you were up $1000 during the day and by the time the markets closed you were only at $700 then they would only use that $700 in there calculations not the $1000.
Hope that helps

Thank you to everyone who helped me in my journal contest it all ment alot.
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