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Order Flow Analytics' D.B. Vaello (President) - Ask Me Anything (AMA)
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Order Flow Analytics' D.B. Vaello (President) - Ask Me Anything (AMA)

  #21 (permalink)
Trading Apprentice
Toledo, OH
 
Futures Experience: Advanced
Platform: NinjaTrader, proprietary API for TWS
Favorite Futures: NQ, YM, ES, FOREX
 
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..

Just meant that its an arbitrary construct and meant to dumb down the study of orderflow to appeal beyond the niche cross section of traders. It can be useful if measured from a significant pivot point or rotation. Just measuring from one edge of the chart to the next has little value.

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  #22 (permalink)
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DionysusToast View Post
Hi DB

First, let me disclose that I am the owner of Jigsaw trading - not sure if we compete or compliment but I have seen an overview of your products and they look pretty neat.

Based on your experience - what is it that is bringing so many people to Order Flow now? 18 months ago it was "Price Action" everyone was raving about and now Order Flow is very much in vogue. It is certainly being discussed much more on the various forums.

It's almost as if there can't be a 'next' fad because you can't drill down much lower.

Is this an awakening on the behalf of retailers or is it something you think will become less popular as something new comes along?

Your thoughts?

Cheers

Pete

I've been studying Market Internals pretty hard for the past week and I love the results. Just a heads up.

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  #23 (permalink)
Elite Member
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FalseProphets View Post
Isn't every software just a tool, a utility that bestows its benefits in varying degrees based on the user?
Sure, bid/ask analysis with an eye on immediate market depth can be accomplished by seasoned DOM traders. Do you mean to claim that you can watch the DOM for a few hours and know exactly when volume clusters ramp up in magnitude, sometimes a precursor to an immediate reversal or continuation, and you do that for multiple instruments simultaneously?? Even if you are blessed with photographic memory, why put oneself through that level of strain undertaking an activity that is stressful enough to begin with. Software, among other things, is supposed to make somethings we already do, easier.
It appears you went to great lengths to agree with most points on DB's explanation only to arrive at your main point that you don't need any software because you are really really great! Orderflow edge is not as it used to be since block orders are a thing of the past. But for scalpers, there is still plenty to exploit. By the way, any volume analysis tool that doesn't live and die by cumulative delta is already a cut above the rest.

P.S. I am not affiliated with DB nor am I a customer.


HI FP

it depends on what trader u are and which road/journey u went thru in becoming that trader , to know what style
of trading u suits u and what tools are best used for that purpose...

but how do you know if this or that tool .. is the right choice for you ? if u just start out ?
so why not start at the core ! .. wich is The tape and or the DOM ?

if u see how the markets work in its inner core .. and understand the mechanics behind it ,u then have the chance
to say this or that style suits me.. and for this and that i need this tool ,, or that ..

If u trade on the DOM u can limit your time u dont have to be infront of it for manny hours... how about only 2
at the open ? or the last hour ? .. again what suits u.. best

then u can set some reverence points ( not getting lost) .. like VPOC .. support / resistance daily high/Low.. swing
highs/Lows .. etc.. and watch how price trades torwards and acts at those levels to make a trade decision .. only
for a couple of ticks .. and your done for the day .. etc...

yess it gets stressfull and exhausting if ya dont have a great WorkLife Balance

i dont do it anymore... but that knowledege i gathered while scalping purely on the DOM .. is priceless...
and i dont regeret it...

now i only need HLC Bars and VOL.. thats it..

but to answer your question


On Multiple Instruments ?Hell no !

U wont belive how fast time flys by , if ya "trading in the zone" ie. on peak performance watching the DOM
and i traded only for couple of ticks .. not swing trading... ie. kept me busy

a quick ramp up on a typical DOM session
just focused on buying and selling pressure , path of least resistance.. Levels of interrest .. and thats it...
ie.



Simply observing the DOM , get a feel for the market or get nsync.
Watch what the market wants (path of least resistance)
Selling or buying pressure (wich is dominant)
Watch important levels and how price moves there and how it reacts( ydh,ydc,ydl,s/r,swl,swh,high vol areas low vol areas , recent heavy activity)
Get in , if market reacts in the favour of my position let it run till momentum dries up
Else get out dont be exposed to the market for to long , either take loss or BE
Watch out for games played ! Only trade the obvious !

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  #24 (permalink)
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Moderator Note


Please keep in mind this thread is so that you may ask questions to D.B. Vaello, President of Order Flow Analytics.

If you wish to discuss other things, use other threads.




Mike

Due to time constraints, please do not PM me if your question can be resolved or answered on the forum.

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  #25 (permalink)
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Instr.

Didn't see this question asked unless I missed it but what instruments does OFA work with? Your faq's refer to the website for the answer but I didn't find it anywhere. Thx.

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  #26 (permalink)
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Which data visualization library are you using? Infragistics?

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  #27 (permalink)
Site Administrator
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Tip


On Tuesday, February 26th @ 12:00 PM ET we'll hold a casual meeting with D.B. Vaello and Order Flow Analytics. The purpose of this meeting is to answer any questions from members.

Attend the event:
https://www3.gotomeeting.com/register/362893990




Mike

Due to time constraints, please do not PM me if your question can be resolved or answered on the forum.

Need help?
1) Stop changing things. No new indicators, charts, or methods. Be consistent with what is in front of you first.
2) Start a journal and post to it daily with the trades you made to show your strengths and weaknesses.
3) Set goals for yourself to reach daily. Make them about how you trade, not how much money you make.
4) Accept responsibility for your actions. Stop looking elsewhere to explain away poor performance.
5) Where to start as a trader? Watch this webinar and read this thread for hundreds of questions and answers.
6)
Help using the forum? Watch this video to learn general tips on using the site.

If you want
to support our community, become an Elite Member.

Reply With Quote
 
  #28 (permalink)
Elite Member
Hong Kong
 
Futures Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NinjaTrader, TWS
Broker/Data: IB/Kinetick
Favorite Futures: ES
 
Posts: 233 since Jan 2012
Thanks: 130 given, 306 received

OFA DB,

We hear much talk of needing to follow the large size institutions (despite some obviously losing like the majority), so lets call the winning guys 'smart money' for these questions. Everything relates to the ES market.

Q1. What are the most common footprints in the order flow that smart money leave for us to follow?

Q2. How does your OFA logic method identify these footprints? Can it be done, albeit with much difficulty(?), using standard 'tape reading' tools like the T&S, DOM, and such?

Q3. How do we differentiate between smart money and dumb institutional money at work?

Q4. How do we handle HFT/other big guys action that flips aggressively between bid and offer heavy limit orders being placed and pulled (within seconds often)? Or do we just not trade at this time, despite practice getting very common?

Q5. Have you compiled a list of typical 'games' that smart money plays to take others' money? If so, are these built into your OFA logic? Would you share same games list for others to comment on?

Thanks for your time. Look forward to your Q&A and future webinar.

Richard
Hong Kong

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  #29 (permalink)
 Vendor: orderflowanalytics.com 
San Antonio, TX, USA
 
Futures Experience: Advanced
Platform: OFA, Ninja, eSignal, R-Trader
Broker/Data: Dorman/ZenFire + IQfeed + eSignal
Favorite Futures: ES, 6E, 6B
 
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Thanks: 17 given, 75 received


DionysusToast View Post
Hi DB

First, let me disclose that I am the owner of Jigsaw trading - not sure if we compete or compliment but I have seen an overview of your products and they look pretty neat.

Based on your experience - what is it that is bringing so many people to Order Flow now? 18 months ago it was "Price Action" everyone was raving about and now Order Flow is very much in vogue. It is certainly being discussed much more on the various forums.

It's almost as if there can't be a 'next' fad because you can't drill down much lower.

Is this an awakening on the behalf of retailers or is it something you think will become less popular as something new comes along?

Hi Pete,

Thanks for the question - and I consider anyone in the space to be a compliment - not a competitor. I've been doing this for a pretty good while and I do see the interest level growing from the retail side but my assumption is that's just buzz and hype. It takes so much work to really be a trader - and most people getting into trading just aren't willing to accept that fact... So they look for whatever is new and being talked about. On the other hand, we've seen a massive transition from retail to professional interest over the last 12-18 months. They are finding value in the logic when applied to more traditional systematic approaches. That's something the retail guy will always struggle with.

So in short, I'd say for the average new retail trader everything is a fad because most will take 3 stops and quit or buy something else. For the professional trader there's an always expanding toolbox to work with. They only adopt new practices when time tests the value. For many that time is now.

We should talk and see how we can work together to bring more value to the field.

DB

If you have any questions about the products or services provided by Order Flow Analytics, please send me a Private Message or use the BMT "Ask Me Anything" thread.
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  #30 (permalink)
 Vendor: orderflowanalytics.com 
San Antonio, TX, USA
 
Futures Experience: Advanced
Platform: OFA, Ninja, eSignal, R-Trader
Broker/Data: Dorman/ZenFire + IQfeed + eSignal
Favorite Futures: ES, 6E, 6B
 
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kronie View Post
1) which vendor provides those 10 depth market levels?

Rithmic provides more depth than most are used to seeing - I'm sure they're not alone in that.


Quoting 
2) on thinly traded instruments relative to the massively high volume (bonds, sp5's and currencies), how well does the approach to OFA really work?, as with thin, so much becomes either stretched out or muted in interpretation or followthrough?

I think every instrument poses it's own unique challenges. I originally developed OFA for the ES only... That was before 07 when the market was trading a little different (anyone remember pre-QE action?) Actually the ES used to trade a lot like the 6E does now. It was ideal for that type of fluidity. I've converted a lot of my trading to the 6E and 6B because of the thick pig the ES has become. I honestly can't speak to bonds as I've never understood the competition there but we do have bond/note traders that love to utilize OFA. Part of that is because the logic we teach - it's pretty simple and follows a constant stream. With 4 individual tools, you may only find 1-2 that you feel can logically be applied to the market you're trading... For example I know that our CL traders see little value in the Stop-Run analysis and rely mostly on cluster sequences (Volume Cluster Analysis) and finding historical momentum points in the print.

I'll PM you and maybe we can talk through it with some examples.

DB

If you have any questions about the products or services provided by Order Flow Analytics, please send me a Private Message or use the BMT "Ask Me Anything" thread.
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