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Trading with the bots (sceeto.com)
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Trading with the bots (sceeto.com)

  #1 (permalink)
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Trading with the bots (sceeto.com)

Hi futures.io (formerly BMT) members,

Can anyone share his or her experience or views on Carl Weiss's sceeto algos?

His systems use proprietary algos to monitor changes in order flow through detection of HFT trading. Here is the link: ...sceeto

Any insights and comments are appreciated..

Thanks!

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@Big Mike,

Nope I haven't watched it yet. Thanks for the link!

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So no one is using sceeto? Kind of surprised there's not been any real discussion about this product, given the focus on order flow trading on this forum. I've still been trying to digest all the complex information provided by sceeto, but the product is really fascinating. Carl (the creator) is a standup guy and there's no hype/false promises in the marketing. Would love to hear if others are trying this product out.

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@ewex,

I'm surprised by the lack of information regarding sceeto as well. I signed up for a free 10 day trial last month and was very impressed by the information that sceeto generated each day for TF. Carl was very quick, polite and responsive with my enquires too.

However, I did not continue on with a paid subscription due to the following:

1. The WOW and WIND index didn't really help in my trading. While they provide the signals for a trader to stay within the trend, I guess I'm too counter-trend in mindset to appreciate their worth.

2. There are many signals generated by the Order Flow indicator that I personally find quite distracting. I didn't know that there are options to turn the signals on/off for sceeto in NT as I was using it on Sierra Chart.

3. I tend to find that the signals lagging at times, i.e. the price move has already occurred before sceeto prints High Frequency Buy/Sell Surge on the chart. I don't think this is the fault of sceeto though, probably more of a latency issue. Still, the Buying/Sellng Waning signals seem to have a better hit rate than the rest of the signals, when combined with the MacDaddy indicator.

4. Not much documentation or clips on using the signals to trade. I guess Carl wants to make sceeto as flexible as possible to accommodate different types of traders, but I wish there is the availability of basic trading systems based on sceeto signals. Carl did provide a few scenerios on his sceeto website, but I feel this is insufficient based on the capabilities of sceeto.

Ok, these are my basic observations on sceeto. I still believe it is a useful tool though it is too advanced for me currently.

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Webinar today...

For anyone who's interested in further information, they are doing a webinar today at 04:15 PM EDT:

NinjaTrader Partner Spotlight Presents …sceeto


Last edited by Daytrader999; August 16th, 2012 at 08:46 AM. Reason: Start time correction
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Now I remember this guy

He used to post on Elite Trader about a year ago with his stuff, it was free back then. I tried to use it but it did nothing. I hope he has improved since then. Maybe I will give him another look.

I think the direction EOT is going is the right one, machine readable news. I am not an affiliate of theirs I just think they are good people with better tools than most for sure.

I also think jigsaw had some good tools for detecting HFT, his iceberg indicator and some of his advanced tape reading tools.

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Quick Update

I tried sceeto and while I think it has a ton of potential, much improved over a year ago, it still needs work. The screen is cluttered with information and often things conflict with one another. WIND is saying go long, but just after watching Carl's presentation on trade set ups with market rotation he says go short. Or his set up for using MacDaddy conflicts with the other two. It's like anything in trading when you try and be all things to all people you often end up with clutter and confustion. I give Carl a lot of credit though he has some great tools for reading order flow, but needs work.

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dandxg View Post
I tried sceeto and while I think it has a ton of potential, much improved over a year ago, it still needs work. The screen is cluttered with information and often things conflict with one another. WIND is saying go long, but just after watching Carl's presentation on trade set ups with market rotation he says go short. Or his set up for using MacDaddy conflicts with the other two. It's like anything in trading when you try and be all things to all people you often end up with clutter and confustion. I give Carl a lot of credit though he has some great tools for reading order flow, but needs work.

@dandxg, short review but succinct. I am wrapping up a trial of Sceeto. And I give top marks to Carl for diligence, application and effort.

And no marks at all for the product. In the ES, there is sufficient reason to believe that, with more evolution, it may work. In CL, TF and 6E - I found the identification of increase/decrease in order flow incorrect and lagging at best and downright wrong on average.

Since scetto is not a complete methodology (it does not address trade management or position sizing at all - this is huge flaw), it must be used as a discretionary scalping tool. When used as such, and being incorrect on average half the time - it becomes very hard to overcome recency bias.

Potential doesn't count for toilet paper when it comes to professional trading. What sceeto has done because its claims (over reaching claims in my opinion) - is that, it has me thinking I want to try out CQG's trade flow bars and see patterns confluent with OF identification. And delve a little more deeply into OF rather than volume analysis.


Carl claims many traders are using this to enhance (and even create) an edge. I cannot dispute what others maybe experiencing, however it is any traders best interest to be very skeptical when concerned with their own livelihood. Carl has suggested improvements coming to simplify. I welcome that approach - and hope that one day in the future it will be worth another look.

there are a couple of other OF services I am currently studying as well - (and they all claim to resolve and simplify what many older traders called true trading expertise) - that being identifying order flow. The approach to all of them is the same - are they robust? Are they simple? Do they address trade management and position sizing. Without any of these hallmarks, these retail trading boxes are best left for people who want to gamble their accounts.

Edit - Common sense dictates you should be skeptical of my view. Do your trial and research and form your own opinion


Last edited by Deucalion; October 11th, 2012 at 06:05 PM. Reason: Added content
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