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CFRN.net / insidefutures.com trading room legit? (Christian Financial Radio Network)


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CFRN.net / insidefutures.com trading room legit? (Christian Financial Radio Network)

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  #11 (permalink)
New York City
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: Ninja Trader
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Trading: ES
 
Posts: 68 since Aug 2009
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ThatManFromTexas View Post
@tellytub

Have you ever seen a vendor who said their system lost money....

Yeah, my favorite is Puretick. That track record is unbelievable! o wait its unbelievable because you cant find one person who says you can even come close to replicating it.

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  #12 (permalink)
London
 
Experience: Intermediate
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Trading: EUR/JPY
 
Posts: 2 since May 2013
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CFRN..better than some, but..

I gave CFRN's methodology a go for a while, essentially you pay $2k approx. for access to a set of supposedly custom indicators and a methodology for using them. There is a trading room that runs for a couple of hours from the US open; which I think has a subscription charge after the first 3mths.

Although Michael has used his own names for his indicators, they are in fact just standard indicators found in any charting package. What he calls the BBC (Bull Bear Cross) is simply a 21ema. I overlayed that MA on the chart, there is no question that is what it is.

The primary indicator Michael uses he calls the CF_Slingshot. However, it did not take me too long to figure out this one also (although slightly more tricky than the thinly disguised "BBC"). The CF_Slingshot is a combination of a fast and slow stochastic loaded in the same window. Now I am not sure exactly what settings Michael uses but you could play around with the settings to see what works in any particular market. See attached image:

.

This isnt Michael's chart setup, he uses range bars, I am just illustrating the indicator

To trade with this tool you are looking for divergences to get in on pullbacks to the main trend which is essentially the trading method employed by Michael. I have shown a couple of divergence in the screenshot so it is clear what I mean. After you spot the divergence you simply wait for a close above/below a retracement trend line drawn up the lows (for a downtrend) or up the highs (for an uptrend), re-drawing if necessary when you get wicks above/below this trend line. The other entry is a pullback to the "BBC" and a downclose (for a downtrend) or an upclose for an uptrend.

In case you want to replicate the tool here are the settings I used:

Slow Stoch: %K:21, %D:5, Smoothing:7 (shown in red)
Fast Stoch: %K:7, %D:2, Smoothing:1 (shown in white)

In both cases you want to hide the main line and just show its Signal line. Again I played around until I got something that behaved pretty well for the currency pair I traded; these aren't necessarily the best settings.

Michael also uses what looks like a non-lagging ma in addition to the 21ema. Not sure what setting he uses for that but the one I show in the diagram is a 21 period and looks close to Michael's indicator. You look for a divergence following a cross of the BBC by price and the non-lag ma (and then a pullback), so price is trending in the direction of the trade indicated by the divergence. He has one final indicator called a stepline, but he doesn't use that except as a trailing stop primarily.

Does his method work? Some people in the room seem to make money - at least one guy does, his name is Frank. He seems to pull in a sackful of ticks every session. Michael calls his trades and sometimes shows his DOMs (but not all the time). He seems to take some setups and not others, I took most setups I saw and was losing money.

So the bads are:

- you are paying for predominantly standard indicators that have required no or extremely little coding, for which you are asked to pay a princely sum of around $2k or so. There is a certain unchristian lack of transparency here..
- there is little help given to those who are losing money, instead the constant emphasis in the room is making sure the people on the trial are happy and they understand the setups (clearly so that they will part with there hard earnt cash at the end of the week)
- their trade record as reported is not reconcilable with my experience of the effectiveness of the indicators. To be effective you would need to introduce some other concepts, possibly just some basic analysis of S/R levels (no mention of a pivot level or any other price structure/level)
- you are tied in with their brokerage, a small outfit called Daniels Trading who white label the OEC platform (a nice platform except the DOM). My experience with Daniels was a bit mixed, they seem helpful but are also traders and seem a little bit too busy at times (email response for instance was often slow)....I contrast that with an Infinity broker I was also using at the time who would not leave me alone...and I mean that in a nice way, he was always out to help and solve any issue I had. That is what you want from a broker.

the goods:
- he does call the trades he takes.. supposedly anyway, as I said you rarely see his DOMS.
- they run a weekly workshop for all "partners" where they go over the basic setups and nuances plus new stuff that Michael has been working on.
- they have an archive library of all (100 or so) previous workshops they have done. Interesting to see all the previous incarnations of indicators that Michael has invented over the years.

Well that is about all I have to say. For me there were elements missing in their methodology and a bit of over-reliance on indicators. Sure the indicators did give you an edge in certain circumstances, but those circumstances need to be defined a little better in my view. A fair percentage of the setups misfired in my experience.

There is also the non-transparency issue around the "custom" indicators (if you ever join, try asking Michael if the BBC is really just a 21ema...and see what the response is...if you get one). Good luck.

LoneRanger

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  #13 (permalink)
Michigan, Jackson
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NT and TS
Broker: NT Continuum
Trading: ES, CL
 
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tellytub View Post
They sure have a good track record according to their website!

My understanding is CFRN's track record is inclusive of all trades taken on the several instruments traded. I am not sure though, that Michael, himself, makes all those trades but others who trade with him. I appreciate the fact that he tells you in advance before he takes a trade and tells you what he is looking to trade. Too expensive for my taste, especially when you can trade a 21 ema yourself on a 4 tick range chart and a divergence indicator.

Ken

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  #14 (permalink)
the coin hunter
virginia
 
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cory's Avatar
 
Posts: 5,995 since Jun 2009
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check out this Buffy template circa 2009

http://www.ninjatrader.com/support/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=4522&d=1233767998

ninja forum
https://www.ninjatrader.com/support/forum/showthread.php?t=9206&highlight=bline

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  #15 (permalink)
Washington
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: NinjaTrader
Broker: NinjaTrader
Trading: ES, NQ
 
Posts: 53 since Dec 2009
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toulouse-lautrec View Post
something looks familiar here.... did this guy sell some kind of slingshot system / indicator in the past.... ?
the indicators were for TS and Ninja. He had specific setups were price returned to some kind of mean where he would then take a countertrend trade.... my memory is really blurry here... not sure if this is the same person or i am just having hallucinations....

I believe it was Stack trader. It's no longer in existence. He used a lot of HMA's and traded pullbacks. His name is Michael Bourque.

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  #16 (permalink)
Washington
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: NinjaTrader
Broker: NinjaTrader
Trading: ES, NQ
 
Posts: 53 since Dec 2009
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cory View Post
check out this Buffy template circa 2009

NinjaTrader Support Forum

ninja forum
B line - NinjaTrader Support Forum

Just a few more indicators and Buffy would of had that one right!

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  #17 (permalink)
san antonio, tex
 
 
Posts: 73 since Nov 2014
Thanks: 17 given, 28 received

is cfrn.net legit (was the original question)

DeWayne entered a trade using OEC's DOM in weekly partners sample made available to the general public. He wanted to buy at a higher price than the market(buy stop) which would confirm the signal. Suddenly he got filled at the market. What happened he exclaimed!! What happened was he entered a LIMIT order. Now, if he was really entering all the trades that he claims that he enters, he would known to RIGHT click which would of entered a STOP order. https://futures.io/images/smilies/animated/faint.gif

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  #18 (permalink)
Super Moderator
Portland, Oregon
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: F-16CM-50
Trading: GBU-39
 
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thailerdurden View Post
DeWayne entered a trade using OEC's DOM in weekly partners sample made available to the general public. He wanted to buy at a higher price than the market(buy stop) which would confirm the signal. Suddenly he got filled at the market. What happened he exclaimed!! What happened was he entered a LIMIT order. Now, if he was really entering all the trades that he claims that he enters, he would known to RIGHT click which would of entered a STOP order. https://futures.io/images/smilies/animated/faint.gif

These guys are jokes. They are trading SIM. I sat through two weeks of their trade room. Utter and complete junk. They have no understanding of the market and what is really driving price. The trade off their indicators which are lagging and not worth the $3k they charge.

These guys make me even more sick as they fly under the Christian banner. They are just another group of people trying to rob you using whatever label suits them best.

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  #19 (permalink)
Quebec
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NinjaTrader wt Rancho Dinero's profiling tools
Broker: AMP/CQG
Trading: ES, NQ, YM
 
trendisyourfriend's Avatar
 
Posts: 3,877 since Oct 2009
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@Big Mike

I think i found a bug in the futures.io (formerly BMT) matrix

In the space below LoneRanger's name it shows 1 Thanks received while he got more than that?

That's not fair, he should get a refund.

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  #20 (permalink)
Site Administrator
Manta, Ecuador
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: My own custom solution
Trading: Emini Futures
 
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trendisyourfriend View Post
@Big Mike

I think i found a bug in the futures.io (formerly BMT) matrix

In the space below LoneRanger's name it shows 1 Thanks received while he got more than that?

That's not fair, he should get a refund.

It's a bug when someone makes only one post. Will fix itself if he posts again

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