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stressless trading - Jam's StrategicDaytrading.com


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stressless trading - Jam's StrategicDaytrading.com

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  #1 (permalink)
 tony2604 
Europe
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NinjaTrader, CQG Trader
Broker: Mirus
Trading: currency futures, forex
 
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"STRESSLESS"
does this word exist in english? I didn´t find it in my dictionary. But in the company I´m in we work with high precision machines to make very exact holes with machines named "stressless" that couldn´t be done manually same way.

I´m happy! Because I´m in a room where I learned trading, to understand whats goin on, with indicators and with price-action and with psychology and with money-management. I can trade with patience and consistency now, this is not goin in one week, but I learnt it. And I can do my trading STRESSLESS - and this is important to avoid my losers - I can work stressless because I can trade with a strategy-manager and I have control over my trades.

I have been in many rooms last 2 years, in Germany, in UK, in Australia and of course in the US. I´m in business and I recognized who wants to make a fast business with me (beside the understanding of the trading in the meantime of course too). I was looking for a serious trading room and I´m happy to have one. I can - no, I have to! - recommend Jams StrategicDaytrading.com for education and for daily live-trading room. This I have to say here on this site where are discussed or questioned about rooms. I see here comments about many rooms I know and I have been with, I don´t want to comment, I don´t refer to one to blame maybe someone, there are a lot of guys doing this. I can just honestly say take a trial with strategicdaytrading.com.

Happy Trading!
Tony

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  #3 (permalink)
 trendisyourfriend 
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tony2604 View Post
"STRESSLESS"
...I can just honestly say take a trial with strategicdaytrading.com.

Happy Trading!
Tony

How much does it cost to buy this "stressless state of mind" ?

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  #4 (permalink)
 torroray 
Malaysia
 
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trendisyourfriend View Post
How much does it cost to buy this "stressless state of mind" ?

Priceless

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  #5 (permalink)
 RM99 
Austin, TX
 
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Everyone wants some extrinsic agent to make the decisions for them, to remove stress.

If you're paying for a room and you're A) successful and B) Actually learning how to replicate the results so you can eventually do it on your own (in intimate detail), then that's great. It's a good bridge.

My experience with the one trading group I was in, was that the moderator used different charts than me, had different platform and there was no video feed, only skype, and so even though the group was profitable, I felt like if the moderator was runover by a bus tomorrow, took an oathe of silence at a temple, moved to Antarctica,....whatever, I'd be left high and dry.

So I set out to learn and discover on my own.

I think groups and seminars and training are great when you're just starting out, but I also feel that eventually, if there is such a thing as intrinsic reward (job satisfaction, pride, sense of accomplishment, etc) with trading, it's only found when you blaze your own path.

Is it more stressful making your own trading decisions? Surely. Is it more rewarding? Possibly. Is it less "risky" in terms of discovering the group or the leader left, died, was sued and shutdown, etc, tomorrow? I'd say absolutely.

Furthermore, you may discover that the trading room you're using is holding you back from profits you never realized you could attain.

"A dumb man never learns. A smart man learns from his own failure and success. But a wise man learns from the failure and success of others."
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  #6 (permalink)
 tony2604 
Europe
 
Experience: Intermediate
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Broker: Mirus
Trading: currency futures, forex
 
Posts: 73 since Apr 2010
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Hi trendisyourfriend

I´m not owner of the room and I don´t get a commission and moreover I don´t know the actual room-fee as I´m lifetime member (as in 2 other rooms).

I informed you about quality. If you use it is on your end.

PS: trendisyourfriend untill the end, and this only 20% of the time, Barry says (great teacher too, other room)

Greetings


trendisyourfriend View Post
How much does it cost to buy this "stressless state of mind" ?


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  #7 (permalink)
 tony2604 
Europe
 
Experience: Intermediate
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Broker: Mirus
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Posts: 73 since Apr 2010
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Hi,

yes I have discovered in 2 years of life-rooms and trials and 2 blown out accounts.

You can only speak about things if you have seen both sides. I have.

Greetings


RM99 View Post
Everyone wants some extrinsic agent to make the decisions for them, to remove stress.

If you're paying for a room and you're A) successful and B) Actually learning how to replicate the results so you can eventually do it on your own (in intimate detail), then that's great. It's a good bridge.

My experience with the one trading group I was in, was that the moderator used different charts than me, had different platform and there was no video feed, only skype, and so even though the group was profitable, I felt like if the moderator was runover by a bus tomorrow, took an oathe of silence at a temple, moved to Antarctica,....whatever, I'd be left high and dry.

So I set out to learn and discover on my own.

I think groups and seminars and training are great when you're just starting out, but I also feel that eventually, if there is such a thing as intrinsic reward (job satisfaction, pride, sense of accomplishment, etc) with trading, it's only found when you blaze your own path.

Is it more stressful making your own trading decisions? Surely. Is it more rewarding? Possibly. Is it less "risky" in terms of discovering the group or the leader left, died, was sued and shutdown, etc, tomorrow? I'd say absolutely.

Furthermore, you may discover that the trading room you're using is holding you back from profits you never realized you could attain.


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  #8 (permalink)
 Lornz 
Oslo, Norway
 
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Platform: CQG, Excel
Trading: CL
 
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I checked out the site....

So let me get this straight... He has an automated system that nets > $80 000 in 4 months trading 1 contract, and a max drawdown of <$2500. By trading 10 contracts, he would make $3.2 mil a year. But still he takes time to have a trading room, offer seminars and, on top of all, sell this magical system to anyone who wants to get rich?

JAMAutoProTraderSales - jamthetrader's library

Seeing as he is not factoring in commissions, the results are obviously a backtest...

He is basically selling a course in curve-fitting...

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  #9 (permalink)
 RM99 
Austin, TX
 
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Trading: Futures
 
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Lornz View Post
I checked out the site....

So let me get this straight... He has an automated system that nets > $80 000 in 4 months trading 1 contract, and a max drawdown of <$2500. By trading 10 contracts, he would make $3.2 mil a year. But still he takes time to have a trading room, offer seminars and, on top of all, sell this magical system to anyone who wants to get rich?

JAMAutoProTraderSales - jamthetrader's library

Seeing as he is not factoring in commissions, the results are obviously a backtest...

He is basically selling a course in curve-fitting...

In fairness, it's $80k but you'd have to fund all those instruments in order to have them all in play at the same time, so the overall return is diminished by a factor nearabout 5 or so. But still.....

I'm with you. If something seems too good to be true...it usually is. And if he's truly trading "live" he'd be 100x better off focusing on trading instead of powerpoint presentations and running a business trying to sell the golden goose to others.

Ask yourself this.....if you could make $4k/month with a drawdown half that, trading 1 car, would YOU sell the system to someone else?

"A dumb man never learns. A smart man learns from his own failure and success. But a wise man learns from the failure and success of others."
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  #10 (permalink)
 Lornz 
Oslo, Norway
 
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Platform: CQG, Excel
Trading: CL
 
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RM99 View Post
In fairness, it's $80k but you'd have to fund all those instruments in order to have them all in play at the same time, so the overall return is diminished by a factor nearabout 5 or so. But still.....

I'm with you. If something seems too good to be true...it usually is. And if he's truly trading "live" he'd be 100x better off focusing on trading instead of powerpoint presentations and running a business trying to sell the golden goose to others.

Ask yourself this.....if you could make $4k/month with a drawdown half that, trading 1 car, would YOU sell the system to someone else?

I haven't sold it yet...

I honestly don't know why I keep opening these threads. It just bothers me that beginning traders give these people money....

@Big Mike Would it be possible to add a feature that allows one to hide the "Vendors" forum and posts related to it. When I log-in and scroll through the new posts and see something called "stressless trading", I am not strong enough to resist the temptation to read it...

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  #11 (permalink)
 Big Mike 
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Lornz View Post
@ Big Mike Would it be possible to add a feature that allows one to hide the "Vendors" forum and posts related to it. When I log-in and scroll through the new posts and see something called "stressless trading", I am not strong enough to resist the temptation to read it...

Not possible, sorry. Just look to the far right column when using "New Posts", it shows the forum so you can skip the ones that you don't want to read.

BTW, the best thing experienced traders can do here on futures.io (formerly BMT) is to help less experienced traders. Many of which are drawn in to the "get rich quick" style of trading through purchasing indicator systems or purchasing automated trading solutions. So I hope you will not skip the thread, but instead choose to help your fellow members and continue to educate them.

Mike

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 RM99 
Austin, TX
 
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The other thing that always makes me cringe is when someone claims..."works on any market, any instrument, any timeframe, any chart......"

Okay, let's be real here. If you developed a "system" that could be used on ANY chart, with any instrument, on any time frame, and it made considerable profit with dreamy drawdown.....why on Earth would you sell it.

What you're basically saying is...the system has no saturation.

You'd be like the borg. Once you took over one instrument to the point of saturation, you'd simply move to the next one. There'd be no limit to how much money you could make.

"A dumb man never learns. A smart man learns from his own failure and success. But a wise man learns from the failure and success of others."
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  #13 (permalink)
 tony2604 
Europe
 
Experience: Intermediate
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Trading: currency futures, forex
 
Posts: 73 since Apr 2010
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Hi,

true sentence. I - try to - do, my employees do, my kids do and even my dog is learning every day.

That´s why I´m happy where I am.


PS: and if you could write this also in 5 languages then you can say dumb. LOL

Have a great day!




RM99 View Post
The other thing that always makes me cringe is when someone claims..."works on any market, any instrument, any timeframe, any chart......"

Okay, let's be real here. If you developed a "system" that could be used on ANY chart, with any instrument, on any time frame, and it made considerable profit with dreamy drawdown.....why on Earth would you sell it.

What you're basically saying is...the system has no saturation.

You'd be like the borg. Once you took over one instrument to the point of saturation, you'd simply move to the next one. There'd be no limit to how much money you could make.


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  #14 (permalink)
 tony2604 
Europe
 
Experience: Intermediate
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Broker: Mirus
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Posts: 73 since Apr 2010
Thanks: 37 given, 20 received

Did I say "rich quick"? I wrote 2 years and also 2 blown out accounts.

Strange.




Big Mike View Post
Not possible, sorry. Just look to the far right column when using "New Posts", it shows the forum so you can skip the ones that you don't want to read.

BTW, the best thing experienced traders can do here on futures.io (formerly BMT) is to help less experienced traders. Many of which are drawn in to the "get rick quick" style of trading through purchasing indicator systems or purchasing automated trading solutions. So I hope you will not skip the thread, but instead choose to help your fellow members and continue to educate them.

Mike


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  #15 (permalink)
 Big Mike 
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tony2604 View Post
Did I say "rich quick"? I wrote 2 years and also 2 blown out accounts.

Strange.

I am talking in general terms - I have not looked at this site or the product.

When I say get rich quick, I mean your latest "discovery" of this solution. As in --- if you found this system 2 years ago, you would be rich right?

Any system advertised in this way, to me spells out "get rich quick". If the system were advertised in a way that said you had to closely monitor it, and constantly adapt it to the current market, it is one thing - but any system advertised as just turn it on and it makes money, to me that is "get rich quick".

Mike

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  #16 (permalink)
Charles
Indianapolis
 
 
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I was honestly looking to buy this product, but in doing so I always look for reviews and such of the product. Which lead me to this forum.

In short, I have no experience in trading futures, or forex, I know nothing. I figured maybe one of you can point me in the direction of a product that is worth the investment and time.

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 Big Mike 
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Charles View Post
In short, I have no experience in trading futures, or forex, I know nothing. I figured maybe one of you can point me in the direction of a product that is worth the investment and time.

There is no "product" that is going to make you money trading. The sooner you realize this, the better.

There are no short cuts. There are no holy grails.

If you want to become a neurosurgeon, earning hundreds of thousands per year, you have to attend many, many years of medical school, you need degrees, licenses, and a huge amount of hands-on experience.

The same is true of almost any professional career. Trading is no different.

The best resource for information is to read the posts and threads on the site, and start participating on the forum. In a few years, you'll begin to make sense of it all, and you'll have a chance to earn some money if you have worked very, very hard.

Mike

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 Lornz 
Oslo, Norway
 
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Charles View Post
I was honestly looking to buy this product, but in doing so I always look for reviews and such of the product. Which lead me to this forum.

In short, I have no experience in trading futures, or forex, I know nothing. I figured maybe one of you can point me in the direction of a product that is worth the investment and time.

You could start by looking at the free resources at the exchanges, e.g.:

Futures & Options Education for Effective Trading Strategies and Risk Management - CME Group

CBOE - Options Learning Center (Options)

For a comprehensive understanding of the mechanics of the futures market, get this book :

Amazon.com: The CME Group Risk Management Handbook: Products and Applications (Wiley Finance) (9780470137710): CME Group, John W. Labuszewski, John E. Nyhoff, Richard Co, Paul E. Peterson, Leo Melamed: Books

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 dlatbm 
Sydney Australia
 
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Platform: SierraCharts, NT
Trading: ES,TF,CL, SPI,
 
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RM99 View Post
Everyone wants some extrinsic agent to make the decisions for them, to remove stress.

If you're paying for a room and you're A) successful and B) Actually learning how to replicate the results so you can eventually do it on your own (in intimate detail), then that's great. It's a good bridge.

My experience with the one trading group I was in, was that the moderator used different charts than me, had different platform and there was no video feed, only skype, and so even though the group was profitable, I felt like if the moderator was runover by a bus tomorrow, took an oathe of silence at a temple, moved to Antarctica,....whatever, I'd be left high and dry.

So I set out to learn and discover on my own.

I think groups and seminars and training are great when you're just starting out, but I also feel that eventually, if there is such a thing as intrinsic reward (job satisfaction, pride, sense of accomplishment, etc) with trading, it's only found when you blaze your own path.

Is it more stressful making your own trading decisions? Surely. Is it more rewarding? Possibly. Is it less "risky" in terms of discovering the group or the leader left, died, was sued and shutdown, etc, tomorrow? I'd say absolutely.

Furthermore, you may discover that the trading room you're using is holding you back from profits you never realized you could attain.


tony2604 View Post
Hi trendisyourfriend

I´m not owner of the room and I don´t get a commission and moreover I don´t know the actual room-fee as I´m lifetime member (as in 2 other rooms).

I informed you about quality. If you use it is on your end.

PS: trendisyourfriend untill the end, and this only 20% of the time, Barry says (great teacher too, other room)

Greetings

Tony,
this guy a makes sensible point - What happens if JAM is affected by any of these events tomorrow, you can continue working with the indicator/strategy but there would be any further enhancements to it?
How many people are in the group?
Thanks

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  #20 (permalink)
 JamTheTrader 
Juno Beach
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: Ninja and TS
Broker: Optimus Futures / Matt
Trading: multiple
 
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Posts: 135 since Sep 2009


Big Mike View Post
I am talking in general terms - I have not looked at this site or the product.

When I say get rich quick, I mean your latest "discovery" of this solution. As in --- if you found this system 2 years ago, you would be rich right?

Any system advertised in this way, to me spells out "get rich quick". If the system were advertised in a way that said you had to closely monitor it, and constantly adapt it to the current market, it is one thing - but any system advertised as just turn it on and it makes money, to me that is "get rich quick".

Mike

Mike,

You have never been in the room and I have never stated "get rich quick" nor have I ever stated "just turn it on and make money" I would appreciate it if you would come in and learn what we really do so you will be properly informed. In fact we teach that trading is very hard and hold nothing back during our "free trials" I would expect these comments from the uninformed but not from the "owner and supposedly "unbiased"
Please retract your statements as they are not true!

BTW, we do teach traders safety and focus on no blown out accounts!

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  #21 (permalink)
 Big Mike 
Site Administrator
Swing Trader
Data Scientist & DevOps
Manta, Ecuador
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: Custom solution
Trading: Futures & Crypto
 
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JamTheTrader View Post
Mike,

You have never been in the room and I have never stated "get rich quick"

Jam, my reply was not regarding anything you wrote. If you look again, you'll see my reply was to someone else.

Mike

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  #22 (permalink)
 JamTheTrader 
Juno Beach
 
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Platform: Ninja and TS
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Big Mike View Post
Jam, my reply was not regarding anything you wrote. If you look again, you'll see my reply was to someone else.

Mike

Mike,

I have an idea that might help clear up the reputable vendors vs non reputable.

Here are my thoughts
1. start a section on the forums for vendor review, but the reviews must be done by a panel of unbiased traders that volunteer to spend at least a month in each room.
Each of the volunteers can then write up there findings and rate each vendor accordingly.

No reviews in this particular area from unknowns due to the fact that some vendors will enlist family members or friends to give false write ups.

This is a much need service and you would need to make sure the reviewers are completely unbiased and can give grades based on several criteria.

The vendors that refused would be listed as non participating and all vendors have to accept honest reviews and would be able to have a bad review adjusted by periodic revisits by the reviewers. This would be a huge service and would get rid of most of the crap out there, and would also let us as vendors know how we are doing!


I would be first inline as always

JAM

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  #23 (permalink)
 Tasker_182 
Cedar Rapids, iowa
 
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Platform: Ninjatrader
Broker: Ninjatrader - Continuum
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JamTheTrader View Post
Mike,

I have an idea that might help clear up the reputable vendors vs non reputable.

Here are my thoughts
1. start a section on the forums for vendor review, but the reviews must be done by a panel of unbiased traders that volunteer to spend at least a month in each room.
Each of the volunteers can then write up there findings and rate each vendor accordingly.

No reviews in this particular area from unknowns due to the fact that some vendors will enlist family members or friends to give false write ups.

This is a much need service and you would need to make sure the reviewers are completely unbiased and can give grades based on several criteria.

The vendors that refused would be listed as non participating and all vendors have to accept honest reviews and would be able to have a bad review adjusted by periodic revisits by the reviewers. This would be a huge service and would get rid of most of the crap out there, and would also let us as vendors know how we are doing!


I would be first inline as always

JAM

That sounds like a great idea!

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  #24 (permalink)
 cory 
the coin hunter
virginia
 
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Tasker_182 View Post
Trading Experience: Beginner

That sounds like a great idea!

everything sounds like a great idea until you find out there is no such thing as 'unbiased' trader. Every trade is bias depending on his own experiences. Just take a look at Amp vs Mirus thread for an example.

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  #25 (permalink)
 JamTheTrader 
Juno Beach
 
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cory View Post
everything sounds like a great idea until you find out there is no such thing as 'unbiased' trader. Every trade is bias depending on his own experiences. Just take a look at Amp vs Mirus thread for an example.

Cory,

Unbiased in this case simply means an objective view of each program, honesty in the room, what is being taught, is the vendor trading live for themselves or clients, are there students making money and growing in their trading.

Not all that want to trade will make it trading once they realize the work involved and that the perfect system does not exist. All we can do is show a path and help them not blow out.

JAM

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  #26 (permalink)
 dlatbm 
Sydney Australia
 
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dlatbm View Post
Tony,
this guy a makes sensible point - What happens if JAM is affected by any of these events tomorrow, you can continue working with the indicator/strategy but there would be any further enhancements to it?
How many people are in the group?
Thanks

JAM,
Since, you read this thread can you address my points?
Actually, it would be good for you to see that you should respond to all questions, not only when your ego hurts.
Your potential customer.

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  #27 (permalink)
 JamTheTrader 
Juno Beach
 
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dlatbm View Post
JAM,
Since, you read this thread can you address my points?
Actually, it would be good for you to see that you should respond to all questions, not only when your ego hurts.
Your potential customer.

dlatbm,

This has nothing to do with ego, it is about protecting the quality of training and integrity of my trading room. When posts are made that have no bearing on what we do in an attempt to generalize all trading rooms in the same category with little to no knowledge of each room you are discussing, vendors should have the same opportunity to set the record straight.

No, not every student will make it period, that is the nature of trading! It is very hard work and takes a lot of time and practice to learn. All we can do as mentors is help shorten the learning curve and point our students in the right direction. Should we be paid for that mentoring? Of course we should it is our time and our time is valuable as well!

Any room that does not tell you coming in that not everyone will make it and it will take a lot of work should be looked at with caution. In fact everything you do in life especially in this day and age should be looked at with some skepticism and decisions made to the best of your ability based on the information that you can obtain. Be careful who you listen to especially on forums where disgruntled and ten feet tall behind a computer seems to be the norm! And don't forget, as much as the forums would like to claim they are not biased, they make money off of advertising and the more participation they have the higher the advertising revenue regardless of the quality.

The only forum that I have ever recommended to my students and in fact have a link from my site is Big Mike's because I have always felt that he has the traders interest at heart. While I don't always agree with his sentiment about vendors, I do understand why he would be skeptical and that is why I suggested a vendor review board.

As to the points that I believe you are talking about, I completely agree that you should learn to fish for yourself due to the fact that anything can happen. Yes, I could theoretically get hit by a bus and where would you be then? I would hope that I had taught you enough by that point that you could go on trading without me.

The object is not dependency on me and my room, but in fact independence.

JAM

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  #28 (permalink)
 yusaf 
London, UK
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: Ninjatrader, Motivewave, tradestation and metatrader
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Hi guys,

I have been a member of Jam's room for few months now. I had tried quite a few systems and rooms before and I was very hesitant to join but glad I did. The reason i joined was because he was very honest and straight forward about trading and his system when i was on trial with him. I could see their trades live and trades of the members in his room.

I am surprised to see so many negative posts from people who haven't even been with him in the room. I am not here to advertise his room but I just wanted to share how I think of his services since I have been in the room everyday for the last 2 months. As far as I can remember, he has not promised me that i will get rich quick or any other fake promises most of them out there make. I learnt quite a lot from him and still learning.

Please don't take my word for it. Do your own research and at least try out a service before posting about it.

Jam, Great work on the new discretionary room by the way. Can't wait for the black belt program to start.

Happy trading all.

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  #29 (permalink)
 flyg 
Toledo, OH
 
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I had been in the room and purchased JAM's AutoProtrader, Idicators and Black Belt ( 3 months in the room)!

NO Holly Grail!

Nice job in the room by JAM, Kris, and KC..JAM does not promise easy road to riches and emphasizes the hard work needed...
You would have to be a fulltime trader to follow...Nice indicators and education
I had no benefit paying further for the room as basically I have another "Day job"

One caveat...I was unhappy with changing rules and and extra fees..Three months after I purchased the Autoprotrader, he added a yearly license fee of $25 and fees for upgrade.. Of course, those upgrades where free if you join the room again!

I did not think that was fair ( He could have just applied the CHANGE to new buyers but not those who already owned the system). Basic business practice..Do NOT change the rules in the middle of the game..

My 2 cents!

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  #30 (permalink)
 JamTheTrader 
Juno Beach
 
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flyg View Post
I had been in the room and purchased JAM's AutoProtrader, Idicators and Black Belt ( 3 months in the room)!

NO Holly Grail!

Nice job in the room by JAM, Kris, and KC..JAM does not promise easy road to riches and emphasizes the hard work needed...
You would have to be a fulltime trader to follow...Nice indicators and education
I had no benefit paying further for the room as basically I have another "Day job"

One caveat...I was unhappy with changing rules and and extra fees..Three months after I purchased the Autoprotrader, he added a yearly license fee of $25 and fees for upgrade.. Of course, those upgrades where free if you join the room again!

I did not think that was fair ( He could have just applied the CHANGE to new buyers but not those who already owned the system). Basic business practice..Do NOT change the rules in the middle of the game..

My 2 cents!

Fly G,
I hear you loud and clear and I will not be charging the 25.00 annual fee! You speak we listen
You were not the only one upset, so I cancelled it and chocked up to a learning experience for us! Thank you for you input.

JAM

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  #31 (permalink)
 4xmaster 
USA , Florida
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: NinjaTrader 7, NT8
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flyg View Post
I had been in the room and purchased JAM's AutoProtrader, Idicators and Black Belt ( 3 months in the room)!

NO Holly Grail!

Nice job in the room by JAM, Kris, and KC..JAM does not promise easy road to riches and emphasizes the hard work needed...
You would have to be a fulltime trader to follow...Nice indicators and education
I had no benefit paying further for the room as basically I have another "Day job"

One caveat...I was unhappy with changing rules and and extra fees..Three months after I purchased the Autoprotrader, he added a yearly license fee of $25 and fees for upgrade.. Of course, those upgrades where free if you join the room again!

I did not think that was fair ( He could have just applied the CHANGE to new buyers but not those who already owned the system). Basic business practice..Do NOT change the rules in the middle of the game.
My 2 cents!

I also purchased JAM's AutoProtrader system and I also have been in the room over six months on and off because I have a day job as well. One thing that irks me is the fact that JAM does not have an archived library of the teaching sessions of webinars and presentations that members can access anytime. I would like to watch on my days off from work so I can get up to speed if.

JAM has a habit of changing the rules after the fact to suit himself. At one time he was pushing Motive Wave software ad nauseam as a replacement for NinjaTrader 7 and how all his strategy and Indicators will be written for Motive Wave.

How he stopped the Black Belt Program for a couple of months then restarted and charged an additional fee on top of the membership dues to participate once again in the same program. I got tired of nickle and dime fees and changing of the rules in the middle of the game.

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  #32 (permalink)
 JamTheTrader 
Juno Beach
 
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4xmaster View Post
I also purchased JAM's AutoProtrader system and I also have been in the room over six months on and off because I have a day job as well. One thing that irks me is the fact that JAM does not have an archived library of the teaching sessions of webinars and presentations that members can access anytime. I would like to watch on my days off from work so I can get up to speed if.

JAM has a habit of changing the rules after the fact to suit himself. At one time he was pushing Motive Wave software ad nauseam as a replacement for NinjaTrader 7 and how all his strategy and Indicators will be written for Motive Wave.

How he stopped the Black Belt Program for a couple of months then restarted and charged an additional fee on top of the membership dues to participate once again in the same program. I got tired of nickle and dime fees and changing of the rules in the middle of the game.

Dennis,

Perhaps if you spent the time in the room and listened and left your ego at the door you might have made it! Instead of taking responsibility for your trading you blame someone else! Anytime you want to spend the time needed to learn how to trade come back in the room and I will spend the time to help you, I just expect you to listen, do the homework and attend my FREE classes that I give to all members.

BTY, go check out my testimonials, no I dont have 17000 like other sites, but mine are real and these are traders still in my room (Except You), but here is the one you wrote!!

"After Purchasing your JAM Auto ProTrader System I attended a few online education classes and I got to see what was under the hood and I started trading a single method. I used a "LIVE" account instead of a "DEMO" because a live account is real not play money. With the help of the Strategic Day Trading I was able to grow my micro account by more than 17% in a month. I already feel calmer than I ever have about identifying the strongest points in the market and having a simple, easily executable system for trading it. I'm certainly not new to trading--this is my sixth year as a serious market trader. I've been in the market trading nearly every day for the last three years. Thank you,
Dennis S.



You have 90 days free gratis use it wisely this time and you might just learn something !

JAM

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  #33 (permalink)
 SpyderTrader 
Chicago, Illinois
 
Experience: Beginner
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4xmaster View Post

JAM has a habit of changing the rules after the fact to suit himself. At one time he was pushing Motive Wave software ad nauseam as a replacement for NinjaTrader 7 and how all his strategy and Indicators will be written for Motive Wave.

Welcome to the world of trading chatrooms.
After checking out well over 20 rooms the last few years.....I came to one conclusion....that we as subscribers are the moderators main source of income.

None of them do any real or substantial trading.....and if they do, its very limited, for example....most of them are a bunch of lousy 1 lot traders.



JamTheTrader View Post

BTY, go check out my testimonials, no I dont have 17000 like other sites, but mine are real and these are traders still in my room (Except You), but here is the one you wrote!!


JAM



Wait, for real?

Someone gave you a testimonial, then came on this site to bash the very same site?
Did you offer a discount or compensation for the testimonial?

That has to be a mistake.

Around 5% move the market. 10% try to follow the 5%. The rest provide liquidity.
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  #34 (permalink)
 joaobucks   is a Vendor
 
 
Posts: 37 since Jan 2010
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I read many threads and this one has some peculiarities. JAM himself answers questions and challenges the nay-sayers. Best thing is JAM proposes that real users of the room should be entitled to post views. I second that. But most importantly, he proposes that all other rooms should offer free pass for genuine reviewers. And it isn't just one to three days that some offer as trial. Boy, that would save me a lot of money, as I have paid my dues over and over to get the inside view of a room. My last experience (this month) was a disaster: I was tempted by the awesome results (hypothetical disclosure was not enough to convince me that those results could be fake) posted by ezprotrading.com. Was I in for another painful lesson to swallow hook and sink on the damn purchase! It turned out I could detect the exact piece of fraud in the hypothetical results.

Anyway, I've been in dozens of trading rooms and buying more systems that wouldn't fit on my bookshelf if they weren't digital bytes. I always took statements like "80k in 4 months" (as mentioned in this thread) with a grain of salt. But this was the FIRST time ever that I caught the vendor (Ezprotrading) with specific example of fraud by the textbook definition. (If you wish to read my details, search this forum for Ezprotrading).

In conclusion, Charles (newbie on this thread looking for an honest way of learning and profiting from trading, blacklist ezprotrading). As far as JAM, I was in the room over two years ago and I didn't learn anything useful during the week trial so I was not excited about paying to go any further. Just tonight I saw JAM's email about the AutoTrader. I am a fan of autotrading, but at $3,500 I must be extremely sure this thing can pop $80k in four months (granted 5 markets as explained by someone else on this thread). Come to think of it, 40k with high probability of sureness will do. Nevertheless, even more appealing would be a nominal fee for two weeks to trial the Autotrader. If it makes me money, I'll be hooked on this *"drug." After all, a (system) junkie always a junkie. Vendors in general don't seem to grasp this and they want the dough upfront before one can 'snif' it.

*I am a Christian and absolutely clean (never done any drug whatsoever). My analogy here is only an attempt to express my thinking.

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  #35 (permalink)
 BeachTrader 
San Diego
 
Experience: Beginner
Platform: NinjaTrader
Broker: AMP / CQG
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joaobucks View Post

*I am a Christian and absolutely clean (never done any drug whatsoever). My analogy here is only an attempt to express my thinking.

You may like JAM then. He started offering a morning prayer in addition to being a trading mentor.

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  #36 (permalink)
 Big Mike 
Site Administrator
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joaobucks View Post
Just tonight I saw JAM's email about the AutoTrader. I am a fan of autotrading, but at $3,500 I must be extremely sure this thing can pop $80k in four months (granted 5 markets as explained by someone else on this thread). Come to think of it, 40k with high probability of sureness will do.

I hope you are joking?

If not, I have a bridge to sell you...

Mike

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  #37 (permalink)
 dandxg 
Denver, Colorado
 
Experience: Intermediate
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Trading: ES, CL, anything that makes $$
 
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BeachTrader View Post
You may like JAM then. He started offering a morning prayer in addition to being a trading mentor.

F*cking classic. Maybe he should rename himself to Creflow Dollar? I mean no offense but don't believe in religion and my experience has been people that point out that they are Christian are the biggest hypocrites and scam artists alive.

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  #38 (permalink)
 BeachTrader 
San Diego
 
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Yeah, I was disappointed with it to be honest as I don't like to mix my trading guru with my priest. I do like Jam though. Looking forward to seeing what he offers next.

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  #39 (permalink)
 Tiger45 
San Diego, CA, USA
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: Sierra Chart
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As a former participant in Jam's room, I thought I'd throw my two cents in. Overall, I liked it. Jam focuses on trading with very few distractions (politics, religion, etc). He emphasizes market structure and patience. He makes no claims about getting rich quick.

Here's what I didn't like about it: He doesn't trade during the session, but instead calls out the trades. Almost all trades are called out before hand (sometimes he's distracted answering a question and misses a call), so you do get a warning on upcoming setups. He will mark up the chart with arrows showing the trade. Here's where the slight of hand comes in. He will utilize his discretion and very often say that he wouldn't take a particular trade because of something (market structure, S/R near by, etc). If that trade happens to work, he will add that winner into the recap to show how many ticks it was possible to make that day. If it doesn't work, well, there you go. He didn't recommend it. He also slightly exaggerates the tick count at times (I don't know if this is deliberate, or just the result of trying to count bars quickly). These issues could be completely eliminated if he actually traded during the session (even in sim).

Occasionally he will briefly show "statistics" on some trade setups. These are a summary of how many ticks a particular setup ran for, for example he'd say setup X ran for over 20 ticks 30 times, over 10 ticks 40 times, etc. He doesn't show the losses, nor how the trades would have done using the money management rules he proposes. Also the data sample is small, typically only a month's worth of data.

I took his recent webinar with the hopes of being able to write a trading plan, since he advertised that he would be spending a lot of time on that. It was the worst part of the webinar, and overall, I was very disappointed with it.

I think if you spent a month or two in his room, you'd walk away with some valuable info. I'm not sure if you can just pay the room fees or if you have to buy the black belt program.

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  #40 (permalink)
 JamTheTrader 
Juno Beach
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: Ninja and TS
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Trading: multiple
 
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Big Mike View Post
I hope you are joking?

If not, I have a bridge to sell you...

Mike

Mike,

Please come in and I will take you through my tools before you make negative comments!! No promises about a holy grail, we are very realistic in our trading and with our members! As for price , you should re-read the site entry as price starts at 599.00 and can add modules after you get comfortable so people do not have to pay 3500 plus at first!

Again, I challenge you as I have in the past to come in and let me walk you through the program and why we do what we do! Then you can comment.

And yes, I am A Christian, and an American and very proud of it! Morning prayer is for everyone and separate from my room, I realize that some will bash this and not believe it, but... that is where I stand period!

May God bless our country!

JAM

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  #41 (permalink)
 JamTheTrader 
Juno Beach
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: Ninja and TS
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Trading: multiple
 
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Tiger45 View Post
As a former participant in Jam's room, I thought I'd throw my two cents in. Overall, I liked it. Jam focuses on trading with very few distractions (politics, religion, etc). He emphasizes market structure and patience. He makes no claims about getting rich quick.

Here's what I didn't like about it: He doesn't trade during the session, but instead calls out the trades. Almost all trades are called out before hand (sometimes he's distracted answering a question and misses a call), so you do get a warning on upcoming setups. He will mark up the chart with arrows showing the trade. Here's where the slight of hand comes in. He will utilize his discretion and very often say that he wouldn't take a particular trade because of something (market structure, S/R near by, etc). If that trade happens to work, he will add that winner into the recap to show how many ticks it was possible to make that day. If it doesn't work, well, there you go. He didn't recommend it. He also slightly exaggerates the tick count at times (I don't know if this is deliberate, or just the result of trying to count bars quickly). These issues could be completely eliminated if he actually traded during the session (even in sim).

Occasionally he will briefly show "statistics" on some trade setups. These are a summary of how many ticks a particular setup ran for, for example he'd say setup X ran for over 20 ticks 30 times, over 10 ticks 40 times, etc. He doesn't show the losses, nor how the trades would have done using the money management rules he proposes. Also the data sample is small, typically only a month's worth of data.

I took his recent webinar with the hopes of being able to write a trading plan, since he advertised that he would be spending a lot of time on that. It was the worst part of the webinar, and overall, I was very disappointed with it.

I think if you spent a month or two in his room, you'd walk away with some valuable info. I'm not sure if you can just pay the room fees or if you have to buy the black belt program.

Tiger,

We don't do recaps!!

We teach patience and how to keep your money when you are up! You are welcome to come back in for a few weeks free and see if this makes more sense to you. I will spend personal one on one time with you so you can understand how our room works, analyze your trades, and do everything in my power to have you in a better position very quickly after you work with me! No promises as you will have work to do as well and I expect you to do it!

Please don't let this sit as an empty offer, take me up on this as it is a one time offer! I want every customer happy and while some will never be due to the complexities of trading and the inability for some to maintain discipline and trade with a plan, I do believe anyone can make it if they truly want this and it is their passion.

Again, spend a few weeks, month or whatever you need at no charge and lets get you in a better place, you have nothing to lose

JAM

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  #42 (permalink)
 JamTheTrader 
Juno Beach
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: Ninja and TS
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dandxg View Post
F*cking classic. Maybe he should rename himself to Creflow Dollar? I mean no offense but don't believe in religion and my experience has been people that point out that they are Christian are the biggest hypocrites and scam artists alive.

You are welcome to our morning prayer room and never any obligation, we have some great people in the room and some non members as well.

JAM

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  #43 (permalink)
 JamTheTrader 
Juno Beach
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: Ninja and TS
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BeachTrader View Post
Yeah, I was disappointed with it to be honest as I don't like to mix my trading guru with my priest. I do like Jam though. Looking forward to seeing what he offers next.


BeachTrader,

We made it very clear that we respect everyone's right to freedom of religion and we do not push anything in our room! This is for anyone prior to the trading day that would like to come in for prayer. No obligation to the room to me just to the one upstairs

I certainly did not mean to offend.

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  #44 (permalink)
 dandxg 
Denver, Colorado
 
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JamTheTrader View Post
BeachTrader,

We made it very clear that we respect everyone's right to freedom of religion and we do not push anything in our room! This is for anyone prior to the trading day that would like to come in for prayer. No obligation to the room to me just to the one upstairs

I certainly did not mean to offend.


Hey maybe you aren't so bad after all, J/K. I live around some many religious ppl and that's fine as long as they don't preach to me it's all good. Whatever works for you.

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  #45 (permalink)
 Big Mike 
Site Administrator
Swing Trader
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Manta, Ecuador
 
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Posts: 50,008 since Jun 2009
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The "are you joking" comment was not aimed at Jam. It was in response to considering a $3,500 auto-trader but only if it can make 80k in 6 months.

Mike

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  #46 (permalink)
 sharmas 
Auckland
 
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Jam

Will you open this offer to others or just to Tiger.

Love what you do and is hard to get Honest rooms now days and Good on you.

Sharmas


JamTheTrader View Post
Tiger,

We don't do recaps!!

We teach patience and how to keep your money when you are up! You are welcome to come back in for a few weeks free and see if this makes more sense to you. I will spend personal one on one time with you so you can understand how our room works, analyze your trades, and do everything in my power to have you in a better position very quickly after you work with me! No promises as you will have work to do as well and I expect you to do it!

Please don't let this sit as an empty offer, take me up on this as it is a one time offer! I want every customer happy and while some will never be due to the complexities of trading and the inability for some to maintain discipline and trade with a plan, I do believe anyone can make it if they truly want this and it is their passion.

Again, spend a few weeks, month or whatever you need at no charge and lets get you in a better place, you have nothing to lose

JAM


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  #47 (permalink)
 joaobucks   is a Vendor
 
 
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Tiger describes what can best be defined as "recap," even if JAM doesn't think they do recaps.

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  #48 (permalink)
 joaobucks   is a Vendor
 
 
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BigMike, this assumption of 80K autotrader was first brought up by Lornz:
"So let me get this straight... He has an automated system that nets > $80 000 in 4 months trading 1 contract, and a max drawdown of <$2500...." But now we can't verify the veracity of Lornz`version because the origin of said claim has been deleted from this link <JAMAutoProTraderSales - jamthetrader's library>. You know the differences in what one says and what another perceives.

Nevertheless, I was in the webinar today when JAM clearly stated several times that this autotrader has nothing to do with what we are accustomed to see as autotrader, and that stand-alone profitable autotrader doesn't exist. Thus, my junkie mood for a quick fix from trading systems is slowing and painfully dissipating after years pursuing this route.

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 JamTheTrader 
Juno Beach
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: Ninja and TS
Broker: Optimus Futures / Matt
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Posts: 135 since Sep 2009


Big Mike View Post
The "are you joking" comment was not aimed at Jam. It was in response to considering a $3,500 auto-trader but only if it can make 80k in 6 months.

Mike

Thanks Mike, I appreciate that. We dont make any claims and in fact are very open about "not having a holy grail" but a set of tools that are not for everyone!


JAM

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 JamTheTrader 
Juno Beach
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: Ninja and TS
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Posts: 135 since Sep 2009


dandxg View Post
Hey maybe you aren't so bad after all, J/K. I live around some many religious ppl and that's fine as long as they don't preach to me it's all good. Whatever works for you.

Thanks,

Please feel free to come in and spend a couple weeks with us, no obligation at all I just want you to see what we do then you will be better informed to comment! We are not for everyone for sure, but we are transparent and very open and we have helped many, and I just really wish I could help everyone, but that would never be possible!

JAM

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 JamTheTrader 
Juno Beach
 
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sharmas View Post
Jam

Will you open this offer to others or just to Tiger.

Love what you do and is hard to get Honest rooms now days and Good on you.

Sharmas

Sharmas,

come in and spend a couple weeks with me, when you email us, just add in that I approved this as my wife is the gate keeper and we get a lot of abuse, even had one person with over 40 email addresses all with the same IP address and name, he managed to be in for 10 plus weeks in a row!

JAM

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  #52 (permalink)
 JamTheTrader 
Juno Beach
 
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Platform: Ninja and TS
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joaobucks View Post
BigMike, this assumption of 80K autotrader was first brought up by Lornz:
"So let me get this straight... He has an automated system that nets > $80 000 in 4 months trading 1 contract, and a max drawdown of <$2500...." But now we can't verify the veracity of Lornz`version because the origin of said claim has been deleted from this link <JAMAutoProTraderSales - jamthetrader's library>. You know the differences in what one says and what another perceives.

Nevertheless, I was in the webinar today when JAM clearly stated several times that this autotrader has nothing to do with what we are accustomed to see as autotrader, and that stand-alone profitable autotrader doesn't exist. Thus, my junkie mood for a quick fix from trading systems is slowing and painfully dissipating after years pursuing this route.

What I said was, "the Auto ProTrader is not a holy grail, but a tool that can be used to help traders".


All auto trading systems all fall apart over time and especially when you are talking about intraday trading.

Remember what you are trading, a living breathing entity that has a group of participants that all think a little different but has some common ideas as well. This is where we get our edge, when the commonalities come together to bring up to point in the trading day to allow for a high probability trade to take place. The patience in between, focus, and discipline is where most traders struggle and that is what he are trying to help with.

There is no substitute for hard work in trading and no easy way to learn but through hard work and perseverance, and an automated trader will not let you trade and just print money, but instead should be used as a tool in a traders tool box to "help" the trader with focus, discipline and trading multiple markets at once.

JAM

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  #53 (permalink)
 Tiger45 
San Diego, CA, USA
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: Sierra Chart
Trading: CL, ES
 
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Posts: 309 since Sep 2010
Thanks: 203 given, 422 received

Thanks, Jam, I will take you up on this. As I said, overall I liked the room. I didn't walk away with what I was hoping I would, but I'm willing to give it another try. I'll contact you via email.


JamTheTrader View Post
Tiger,

We don't do recaps!!

We teach patience and how to keep your money when you are up! You are welcome to come back in for a few weeks free and see if this makes more sense to you. I will spend personal one on one time with you so you can understand how our room works, analyze your trades, and do everything in my power to have you in a better position very quickly after you work with me! No promises as you will have work to do as well and I expect you to do it!

Please don't let this sit as an empty offer, take me up on this as it is a one time offer! I want every customer happy and while some will never be due to the complexities of trading and the inability for some to maintain discipline and trade with a plan, I do believe anyone can make it if they truly want this and it is their passion.

Again, spend a few weeks, month or whatever you need at no charge and lets get you in a better place, you have nothing to lose

JAM


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  #54 (permalink)
 Big Mike 
Site Administrator
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Manta, Ecuador
 
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  #55 (permalink)
 BeachTrader 
San Diego
 
Experience: Beginner
Platform: NinjaTrader
Broker: AMP / CQG
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That's too bad. Jam is basically a good guy. I wish he hadn't done that and understand why you would ban him for that. I wish him well though.

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  #56 (permalink)
 joaobucks   is a Vendor
 
 
Posts: 37 since Jan 2010
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Gee, what a turn of events. What could be said so bad by either side that things got out of control.

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  #57 (permalink)
 BeachTrader 
San Diego
 
Experience: Beginner
Platform: NinjaTrader
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Yeah, I didn't see anything that could be considered libelous in the posts. People were expressing their experience - not all positive. I think our society is too sue happy.

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  #58 (permalink)
 peterg 
maui
 
Experience: Master
Platform: NT, TWS,TW
Broker: IB.AMP.CQG.DTN
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BeachTrader View Post
That's too bad. Jam is basically a good guy. I wish he hadn't done that and understand why you would ban him for that. I wish him well though.

"Jam" the Trader
&
"The Black Belt System"

.....hmmmm I guy that does not use his real name,.... Is he a musician?,..... a jelly maker?, A Karate Kid?

A bit gimmicky if not competely cliche' wouldn't one say. Can we cut through the fluff...Puuulease, Get real or at least act Normal...

And For a company that touts "Transparency" as stated repeatedly in their numerous recorded videos,......

There are no Personnel or Moderator Profiles or Daily Documented Trade Results.

If they, or any other vendor for that matter, doesn't make the effort openly to provide the above
they aren't for real.

Because, if they did make consistent money they would tout, if not incessantly hype their P&L.

"good guy" just doesn't cut it these days.

Jam?

...you've been served.

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  #59 (permalink)
 Big Mike 
Site Administrator
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  #60 (permalink)
 tradermark2009 
Concord, CA
 
Experience: Intermediate
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Posts: 230 since Oct 2009
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Mike has a good track record and has always seemed more then fair...with all. Looks like Jam stepped over the line....remember Mike has been around a few blocks legally and knows his boundaries....so should Jam. Also, this is MIKE's forum he can chooses who comes and who goes. Like Mike stated keep the post to our experience related to Jam's trading.....personal attacks get no one any place. Good trading


Big Mike View Post
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  #61 (permalink)
 mattz   is a Vendor
 
 
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I always feel like futures.io (formerly BMT) has such a strong and powerful knowledgeable group that contributes articles, valuable lessons indicators, observations about platforms, asking the right questions, etc and another group that wants to be "popular" by simply bashing vendors,brokers, and anything on site. They rarely contribute anything of value. But, Mike gets to hear from the vendor because of comments like this and the "threat" of legal comes because it's his site. Essentially, he pays (literally legal bills) because of someone's els's thread that starts with "Hey, what do you guys think of..."

Let's resume to being professional, and every time you are about place sarcasm or criticism please keep in mind that every post is your legacy and things stay online forever.

Trading futures and options involves substantial risk of loss and is not suitable for all investors. Past performance is not necessarily indicative of future results. You may lose more than your initial investment. All posts are opinions and do not claim to be facts. Please conduct your own due diligence. Use only Risk capital when trading Futures.
1 800 771 6748 local 561 367 8686 email support@OptimusFutures.com
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  #62 (permalink)
 click03 
GG
Houston, TX
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: Market Profile, Jigsaw, NinjaTrader, ZenFire, DTN IQ, Market Delta
Broker: Mirus/Zen-Fire & TD Ameritrade
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I don't know Jam at all. Never been in his room, never used any of his indicators, though I have looked at them I think I could use a couple of them in my trading methodology. But, I do feel they are a little to pricey. I like that he stands up for being Christian and an American, not to put down any other religion or country. It is just good to see someone stand up for America and Christianity, since it seems to have become politically incorrect in this country to do so. What makes America so great is that it was built upon Christian values. Everyone created equal, everyone is born with certain rights, whether you are Morman, Muslin, Atheist, Jewish, or Christian. It is the Christian values that gives us our freedom and is why we help other countries and people who are not like us, more than any other country has done in the history of mankind, yet we are a new country.

Thanks for standing up Jam.





JamTheTrader View Post
Mike,

Please come in and I will take you through my tools before you make negative comments!! No promises about a holy grail, we are very realistic in our trading and with our members! As for price , you should re-read the site entry as price starts at 599.00 and can add modules after you get comfortable so people do not have to pay 3500 plus at first!

Again, I challenge you as I have in the past to come in and let me walk you through the program and why we do what we do! Then you can comment.

And yes, I am A Christian, and an American and very proud of it! Morning prayer is for everyone and separate from my room, I realize that some will bash this and not believe it, but... that is where I stand period!

May God bless our country!

JAM


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  #63 (permalink)
 Cristian 
Bucharest - Romania
 
Experience: None
Platform: NT, SC, MC, MW
Broker: NinjaBrokerage
Trading: ES
 
Posts: 40 since May 2011
Thanks: 5 given, 41 received

I was with JAM more than 6 months involved in his Black Belt program and also the Automatic Trading at the begining of 2011.
Together with his son he ran the Black Belt program until he (son) left this business and open his own non trading business (guess why) . At that time me and other which were interesting only on manual trading had to switch to automation since practically we had no support for manual trading JAM being absorbed to test his automation tools and becoming obvious he can not run 2 trading rooms and conduct the Black Belt program anymore.

The automatic trading was a failure with very few days in profit. He used to trade 4-5 instruments and if one of them was in profit the day before that one would be weighted the next day with no mention of the sum of P/L for all the instruments.
I finally quit but kept an eye on his site because thought the manual system had a chance
When he started again with the manual system he used to put on his site the performance of this system and updated daily.
Soon this trade log was not anymore available on the site.(again, guess why)
My conclusions:
1.careless teacher tempted to see his own path not the one of his students
2. over priced provider
3. lack of proof the system is consistently profitable (certified trade log of a live account)
4. over complicated system

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  #64 (permalink)
 Ganymed 
Switzerland
 
Experience: Advanced
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Trading: Futures
 
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Cristian View Post
I was with JAM more than 6 months involved in his Black Belt program and also the Automatic Trading at the begining of 2011.
Together with his son he ran the Black Belt program until he (son) left this business and open his own non trading business (guess why) . At that time me and other which were interesting only on manual trading had to switch to automation since practically we had no support for manual trading JAM being absorbed to test his automation tools and becoming obvious he can not run 2 trading rooms and conduct the Black Belt program anymore.

The automatic trading was a failure with very few days in profit. He used to trade 4-5 instruments and if one of them was in profit the day before that one would be weighted the next day with no mention of the sum of P/L for all the instruments.
I finally quit but kept an eye on his site because thought the manual system had a chance
When he started again with the manual system he used to put on his site the performance of this system and updated daily.
Soon this trade log was not anymore available on the site.(again, guess why)
My conclusions:
1.careless teacher tempted to see his own path not the one of his students
2. over priced provider
3. lack of proof the system is consistently profitable (certified trade log of a live account)
4. over complicated system

Hi Sir

What you are writing here is really very old stuff (starting 2011) and should not be published here, see Home

JAM's new MMA system with the new AutoTraderProIII is one of the simplest and best system I know and ever used (I started trading 2004 and I'm trading for living and it's going better and better especially since 3 weeks when I start using the new JAM MMA System and Autotrader III.

Please take MMA free trail and afterwards you should come back and give an objective commentary and report after a 1 week trial with the new JAM MMA Systems..

Thanks Heinz

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  #65 (permalink)
 flyg 
Toledo, OH
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: TS, NinjaTrader, TOS, IB
Broker: TS,TD Ameri
Trading: ES
 
Posts: 16 since Oct 2011
Thanks: 6 given, 3 received

I have tried and purchased JAM AutoTrader Pro a year ago ( paid a couple of thousands!!). Never could get a reliable setting from him on a single instrumnet that showed any consistent profit. It was clear my account was heading towards the Zero mark..I quit using it....

Worse part, as an OWNER of AutoTrader Pro you were supposed to have LifeTime free updates...Guess what..I have nver received a single update or upgrade or evern email since I refuse to keep funding his retirement fund by subscribing to his ever "Improving" trading room...

At this point, I wasted enough money and time on this JAM...I have a list...He is certainly on it...

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  #66 (permalink)
 ironman07 
Kansas City Mo.
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: Tradestation
Broker: tradestation
Trading: es
 
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Posts: 47 since Dec 2009
Thanks: 2 given, 47 received

Ive said it before and Im not holding back. The truth is what it is. why this guy would even try to defend this scamer is beyond reason. Ive brought up in the past the failure to update his results page and the facts that Jam was totally full of crap and did nothing but make numerous excuses why he could have a winning week or weeks. He didnt offer any support for his worthless crap just tried a new approach to make some quick cash. I took the time to examine his traing room and soon saw all his scams.. When his failings were addressed point by point he did nothing but try to change the subject and discredit my concerns. The scammers always find their way to either Florida or Texas and often use religion as part of their hoax. I even asked for long term proof he was profitable with his system and guess what... no proof... It's a shame anyone lost their hard earned money to this ja@@@ss...

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  #67 (permalink)
 Cristian 
Bucharest - Romania
 
Experience: None
Platform: NT, SC, MC, MW
Broker: NinjaBrokerage
Trading: ES
 
Posts: 40 since May 2011
Thanks: 5 given, 41 received

Hi Heinz,

I suppose you have an audited account/trading log endorsing your excitement abut JAM's products.
Since JAM never provide one I suppose those of his students are even more valuable.

Even more, my big concern is not only about the profitability of the system but the dishonesty of JAM and his incapacity to recognize his failure not only as a trading system creator but as a business manager also.
Even his new system is very profitable , which I doubt, I would not pay anymore a person who proved being unable to recognize his failure on delivering what he was paid for.



Ganymed View Post
Hi Sir

What you are writing here is really very old stuff (starting 2011) and should not be published here, see Home

JAM's new MMA system with the new AutoTraderProIII is one of the simplest and best system I know and ever used (I started trading 2004 and I'm trading for living and it's going better and better especially since 3 weeks when I start using the new JAM MMA System and Autotrader III.

Please take MMA free trail and afterwards you should come back and give an objective commentary and report after a 1 week trial with the new JAM MMA Systems..

Thanks Heinz


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  #68 (permalink)
FalseProphets
Toledo, OH
 
 
Posts: 41 since Nov 2012
Thanks: 16 given, 46 received

All,
I wouldnt hold the man's faith against him, although he does it from a place of arrogance. However, Jam is no better or worse than your average guru/mentor despite the arrogance. We should keep the discussion to that. I will offer my 2 cents:
First and foremost, the simple truth of the matter is that successful traders are able to attract outside money to trade to capitalize on their knowledge. They are rare but you can find them. Their websites will generally have a Managed Account structure for participation. The other vast majority of them are counting on newbies to signup by offering them dreams of working from home etc. etc.. 10 new signups a month for a couple of grand a pop for their magic indicators and what you have is a better living than what they ever managed in their non trading careers.
Pluses:
He is probably more well read than your average trade room guy. Atleast 50 books.
Is able regurgitate some common wisdom all day long in his trade room, to the benefit of inexperienced traders and help with developing good habits like shutting down after a daily target, good R/R etc.
Has his own version of almost every indicator known to man, with a Jam prefix to claim as his own. You get that when you become a member.
He will keep you from blowing up your account by stopping you from trading if things are not going well.

Minuses:
Total inability to condense and internalize the vast amount of knowledge from all his readings. You can see his videos created in the past 12 months or so and know that his charts at any given time bear no resemblance to what he was doing just 4 months ago. He will, of course, blame it on markets changing or the fact that he is only improving things. The reality is that he is 'lost' as a trader evidenced by his need to go from taking trades off of 4 different moving averages and balance point trades, to a hideous moving fibonnacci box, to this new Woodies rip off MMA system. Even his bar types dont stay constant and undergoes a new senseless change to compensate for other deficiencies.
He is not a scammer, and wants to do the best for his rooms. He just hasnt figured out how to condense his knowledge into something that will survive markets over a 6 month to a year period.
His real money maker is his programmer who he can count on without fail to come up with the next shiny feature on his indicators, his latest being sliders to turn on features on an indicator in Ninja, without having to click through the dialogue box.
At his worst, he comes across as an indicator peddler first and a real trader last. At his best, I think he does enjoy teaching.
Finally, the trade room epidemic is so painful to watch from afar. I wish the NFTA or CFPB would come up with some guidelines for this sub industry soon.
Thx

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  #69 (permalink)
 bayfisherman 
Tallahassee
 
 
Posts: 57 since Jan 2012

I'm always blown away at the negative comments people sling at each other in these forums...the egos, what a joke. What's the ole saying, if you don't have anything good to say just shut up. Had a friend a while back that saw my charts and told me to come to the forum and start posting charts, etc. My first few experiences in places like this was so bad with the idiots that want to talk down to people for whatever reason was almost enough for me never to come back. What's the end goal here with all your bull spewing...trying to put someone else down to make yourself look better...or is this some holy mission to save new traders from the grips of some evil trading company...I mean come on give me a break.

I stopped looking in other peoples threads because of this type of ego and arrogance and just started posting my own analysis not so much for others but more so for myself to help refine my craft. I've seen Jam's thread...I see a guy trying to pass along some free knowledge to other beginning traders, etc. Where do you guys get off talking all this trash about someone sharing his ideas like this...businessman selling trading software what's new about that...oh too pricey...try paying a programmer these days to do customized software sometime and see where you end up. I've seen his stuff, I've watched the program evolve as you say over the years, refining improving on systems that already work. I think that's the obligation of the developer. From what I can see I think most of you are missing the mark here, they are an education room not a live trading room/"signal service", using live markets to teach the members how to execute a trading plan...classes in the afternoon, etc. to follow up, most of which are based on reading price action, market structure in conjuction with a great set of indicators for confirmation. I don't know what kind of trading you pokey joes do but that's a pretty sound foundation in my book. I feel fortunate to still be a part of this program...I saw the value and potential from my first trial 4 years ago.

That's my 2 cents...lol

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  #70 (permalink)
 nanook77 
OKC, OK
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: Ninja Trader, Trade Navigator. ToS
Broker: PFG/CQG
Trading: forex, futures
 
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Posts: 23 since Jun 2010
Thanks: 84 given, 8 received

Thank for your thoughts and suggestions....


FalseProphets View Post
All,
I wouldnt hold the man's faith against him, although he does it from a place of arrogance. However, Jam is no better or worse than your average guru/mentor despite the arrogance. We should keep the discussion to that. I will offer my 2 cents:
First and foremost, the simple truth of the matter is that successful traders are able to attract outside money to trade to capitalize on their knowledge. They are rare but you can find them. Their websites will generally have a Managed Account structure for participation. The other vast majority of them are counting on newbies to signup by offering them dreams of working from home etc. etc.. 10 new signups a month for a couple of grand a pop for their magic indicators and what you have is a better living than what they ever managed in their non trading careers.
Pluses:
He is probably more well read than your average trade room guy. Atleast 50 books.
Is able regurgitate some common wisdom all day long in his trade room, to the benefit of inexperienced traders and help with developing good habits like shutting down after a daily target, good R/R etc.
Has his own version of almost every indicator known to man, with a Jam prefix to claim as his own. You get that when you become a member.
He will keep you from blowing up your account by stopping you from trading if things are not going well.

Minuses:
Total inability to condense and internalize the vast amount of knowledge from all his readings. You can see his videos created in the past 12 months or so and know that his charts at any given time bear no resemblance to what he was doing just 4 months ago. He will, of course, blame it on markets changing or the fact that he is only improving things. The reality is that he is 'lost' as a trader evidenced by his need to go from taking trades off of 4 different moving averages and balance point trades, to a hideous moving fibonnacci box, to this new Woodies rip off MMA system. Even his bar types dont stay constant and undergoes a new senseless change to compensate for other deficiencies.
He is not a scammer, and wants to do the best for his rooms. He just hasnt figured out how to condense his knowledge into something that will survive markets over a 6 month to a year period.
His real money maker is his programmer who he can count on without fail to come up with the next shiny feature on his indicators, his latest being sliders to turn on features on an indicator in Ninja, without having to click through the dialogue box.
At his worst, he comes across as an indicator peddler first and a real trader last. At his best, I think he does enjoy teaching.
Finally, the trade room epidemic is so painful to watch from afar. I wish the NFTA or CFPB would come up with some guidelines for this sub industry soon.
Thx

Many thanks, as a developer and forum moderator for the Strategic Day Trading site. Clear identification of: Issues that are true Problems = Opportunity for growth. (the true IPO of trading). My contributions and work is free to the room members and no monies are paid to me nor do i expect to be paid at some future date. The ongoing development of the room, it's training strategies and it's indicators, comes as a direct result of feedback from existing members.

One of the primary strengths of this site is a continuing focus on training, trader skill development and education. Each individual trader has their own learning strategies, consisting of combinations of the four basic modalities (visual, auditory, kinesthetic, and auditory digital [self talk]. This is further compounded by the brain pattern recognition strategies. As an example:

[I cdnuolt blveiee that I cluod aulaclty uesdnatnrd what I was rdanieg. The phaonmneal pweor of the hmuan mnid, aoccdrnig to a rscheearch at Cmabrigde Uinervtisy, it dseno't mtaetr in what oerdr the ltteres in a word are, the olny iproamtnt tihng is that the frsit and last ltteer be in the rghit pclae. The rset can be a taotl mses and you can still raed it whotuit a pboerlm. This is bcuseaethe huamn mnid deos not raed ervey lteter by istlef, but the word as a wlohe. Azanmig huh? Yaeh and I awlyas tghuhot slpeling was ipmorantt!]

Only about 53% of the people can read this scramble on the first try. When you add numbers to the mix, you might be one of the 17% to read: 7H15 M3554G3 53RV35 7O PR0V3 H0W 0UR M1ND5 C4N D0 4M4Z1NG 7H1NG5!

The key is to find a pattern structure that matches your existing eye/brain patterns flow and/or show trader's how to expand their their recognition skills? Only you know if this is the type expanded awareness that you need to become a successful trader, or you don't need to expand your awareness!

In the end analysis carefully consider this matrix of questions in just two simple dimensions:
+ / + : What will happen if I do this?
+ / - : What will happen if I don't do this?
- / + : What won't happen if I do this?
- / - : What won't happen if i don't do this?

Again thanks and trust this may shed some light on how this site continues to evolve.

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  #71 (permalink)
 tradermark2009 
Concord, CA
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: Sierra Charts and NT7
Broker: AMP/CQG
Trading: Mini's and CL
 
Posts: 230 since Oct 2009
Thanks: 974 given, 274 received

Hi Bayfisherman, sounds like you are doing the same, just slinging from the other side of the fence......how about stating how and why he is good...opinion dosn't help, since trading is about defined specifics when a plan is in place. You are calling people idiots, etc...how is that helpful to anyone. hint...it's not.


bayfisherman View Post
I'm always blown away at the negative comments people sling at each other in these forums...the egos, what a joke. What's the ole saying, if you don't have anything good to say just shut up. Had a friend a while back that saw my charts and told me to come to the forum and start posting charts, etc. My first few experiences in places like this was so bad with the idiots that want to talk down to people for whatever reason was almost enough for me never to come back. What's the end goal here with all your bull spewing...trying to put someone else down to make yourself look better...or is this some holy mission to save new traders from the grips of some evil trading company...I mean come on give me a break.

I stopped looking in other peoples threads because of this type of ego and arrogance and just started posting my own analysis not so much for others but more so for myself to help refine my craft. I've seen Jam's thread...I see a guy trying to pass along some free knowledge to other beginning traders, etc. Where do you guys get off talking all this trash about someone sharing his ideas like this...businessman selling trading software what's new about that...oh too pricey...try paying a programmer these days to do customized software sometime and see where you end up. I've seen his stuff, I've watched the program evolve as you say over the years, refining improving on systems that already work. I think that's the obligation of the developer. From what I can see I think most of you are missing the mark here, they are an education room not a live trading room/"signal service", using live markets to teach the members how to execute a trading plan...classes in the afternoon, etc. to follow up, most of which are based on reading price action, market structure in conjuction with a great set of indicators for confirmation. I don't know what kind of trading you pokey joes do but that's a pretty sound foundation in my book. I feel fortunate to still be a part of this program...I saw the value and potential from my first trial 4 years ago.

That's my 2 cents...lol


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  #72 (permalink)
 BeachTrader 
San Diego
 
Experience: Beginner
Platform: NinjaTrader
Broker: AMP / CQG
Trading: CL, ES, NQ
 
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bayfisherman View Post
I'm always blown away at the negative comments people sling at each other in these forums...the egos, what a joke. What's the ole saying, if you don't have anything good to say just shut up. Had a friend a while back that saw my charts and told me to come to the forum and start posting charts, etc. My first few experiences in places like this was so bad with the idiots that want to talk down to people for whatever reason was almost enough for me never to come back. What's the end goal here with all your bull spewing...trying to put someone else down to make yourself look better...or is this some holy mission to save new traders from the grips of some evil trading company...I mean come on give me a break.

I stopped looking in other peoples threads because of this type of ego and arrogance and just started posting my own analysis not so much for others but more so for myself to help refine my craft. I've seen Jam's thread...I see a guy trying to pass along some free knowledge to other beginning traders, etc. Where do you guys get off talking all this trash about someone sharing his ideas like this...businessman selling trading software what's new about that...oh too pricey...try paying a programmer these days to do customized software sometime and see where you end up. I've seen his stuff, I've watched the program evolve as you say over the years, refining improving on systems that already work. I think that's the obligation of the developer. From what I can see I think most of you are missing the mark here, they are an education room not a live trading room/"signal service", using live markets to teach the members how to execute a trading plan...classes in the afternoon, etc. to follow up, most of which are based on reading price action, market structure in conjuction with a great set of indicators for confirmation. I don't know what kind of trading you pokey joes do but that's a pretty sound foundation in my book. I feel fortunate to still be a part of this program...I saw the value and potential from my first trial 4 years ago.

That's my 2 cents...lol

I agree that Jam's room is an education room, not a trade call room. That is a fair assessment. But I question why he keeps changing his trading system. For example, the charts you posted don't look anything at all like the charts he was working with when I was in his room less than a year ago. I agree with making minor tweaks, but big changes to your trading system - No. How can we have faith in a trading system that needs major overhauls? That bothered me a lot.

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  #73 (permalink)
 bayfisherman 
Tallahassee
 
 
Posts: 57 since Jan 2012


BeachTrader View Post
I agree that Jam's room is an education room, not a trade call room. That is a fair assessment. But I question why he keeps changing his trading system. For example, the charts you posted don't look anything at all like the charts he was working with when I was in his room less than a year ago. I agree with making minor tweaks, but big changes to your trading system - No. How can we have faith in a trading system that needs major overhauls? That bothered me a lot.

Part of the change that takes place is not just the owner's doing folks...it's the input of all the members, one of the strongest points about being apart of that organization is that there is a big emphasis on team and team member input. The look may be a bit different but the basis is still the same...use of renko bars to enter on close for confirmation and to stay out of chop and noise, etc. What's changed is the bar size...as you know market volitility changes and therefore bar size may change as well. Bar sizes may vary as well from one market to the next based on volitility. The change has taken place though backtesting, which is another huge basis for upgrades for effiecient execution...nothing is put into play unless backtested first. These new bars you see here were brought to the company by one of the members, were backtested and put in play.

To address what trademark said about slinging from the other side...well, what kind of person attacks a man's religion, family, business, calls him names like fraud/scammer, makes fun of his marketing ideas...talk about people's opinion, sorry bro, these people are idiots or let's just say unenlightened. If you care to side with people like this you're part of the problem as well "elite member", whatever that means. To be honest I hold Big Mike accountable to allow comments such as these to exist here as his billing is no tolerance for this kind of behaviour.

Here's a look at the oil room for the past 30 days...just one of the entries listed here on the automated trade ticket, which is set to take trades only during the trade room hours 8am ET to 12 ET...it's the same since he's started his business...buying the dips and selling the rallies, nothing's changed here, just improvements to sound methodology...it's called trend trading.

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  #74 (permalink)
 Big Mike 
Site Administrator
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Data Scientist & DevOps
Manta, Ecuador
 
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bayfisherman View Post
To address what trademark said about slinging from the other side...well, what kind of person attacks a man's religion, family, business, calls him names like fraud/scammer, makes fun of his marketing ideas...talk about people's opinion, sorry bro, these people are idiots or let's just say unenlightened. If you care to side with people like this you're part of the problem as well "elite member", whatever that means. To be honest I hold Big Mike accountable to allow comments such as these to exist here as his billing is no tolerance for this kind of behaviour.

Use the Report Post feature to the right of every post to report a post to the staff and provide more information.

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  #75 (permalink)
FalseProphets
Toledo, OH
 
 
Posts: 41 since Nov 2012
Thanks: 16 given, 46 received

We can agree that part of the value in forums such as these is being able to read/write fairminded critique of vendors. It is easily discernible who is doing that vs. agenda based mudslinging. My earlier post would be one example of a fair assessment, I was thanked by Jam's developer/moderator as well.
I came back to this topic however because something didn't quite smell right. You say that you trialed 4 years ago and are still active with him. That is quite a long time; I know folks who have earned a J.D. in Constitutional Law in less time. That means one of two things;
1. You paid a lifetime room fee and just linger in his room because trading can be lonely.
OR
2. You are actually on his payroll, which means that your views, as important as they are, just needs an added disclosure for fairness. Wouldn't you agree?

Have you conducted webinars/moderated one of his rooms/benefit financially in any way from Jam, besides benefitting from his teachings?
Thx in advance.





bayfisherman View Post
Part of the change that takes place is not just the owner's doing folks...it's the input of all the members, one of the strongest points about being apart of that organization is that there is a big emphasis on team and team member input. The look may be a bit different but the basis is still the same...use of renko bars to enter on close for confirmation and to stay out of chop and noise, etc. What's changed is the bar size...as you know market volitility changes and therefore bar size may change as well. Bar sizes may vary as well from one market to the next based on volitility. The change has taken place though backtesting, which is another huge basis for upgrades for effiecient execution...nothing is put into play unless backtested first. These new bars you see here were brought to the company by one of the members, were backtested and put in play.

To address what trademark said about slinging from the other side...well, what kind of person attacks a man's religion, family, business, calls him names like fraud/scammer, makes fun of his marketing ideas...talk about people's opinion, sorry bro, these people are idiots or let's just say unenlightened. If you care to side with people like this you're part of the problem as well "elite member", whatever that means. To be honest I hold Big Mike accountable to allow comments such as these to exist here as his billing is no tolerance for this kind of behaviour.

Here's a look at the oil room for the past 30 days...just one of the entries listed here on the automated trade ticket, which is set to take trades only during the trade room hours 8am ET to 12 ET...it's the same since he's started his business...buying the dips and selling the rallies, nothing's changed here, just improvements to sound methodology...it's called trend trading.


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  #76 (permalink)
 nanook77 
OKC, OK
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: Ninja Trader, Trade Navigator. ToS
Broker: PFG/CQG
Trading: forex, futures
 
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Posts: 23 since Jun 2010
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FalseProphets View Post
We can agree that part of the value in forums such as these is being able to read/write fairminded critique of vendors. It is easily discernible who is doing that vs. agenda based mudslinging. My earlier post would be one example of a fair assessment, I was thanked by Jam's developer/moderator as well.
I came back to this topic however because something didn't quite smell right. You say that you trialed 4 years ago and are still active with him. That is quite a long time; I know folks who have earned a J.D. in Constitutional Law in less time. That means one of two things;
1. You paid a lifetime room fee and just linger in his room because trading can be lonely.
OR
2. You are actually on his payroll, which means that your views, as important as they are, just needs an added disclosure for fairness. Wouldn't you agree?

Have you conducted webinars/moderated one of his rooms/benefit financially in any way from Jam, besides benefitting from his teachings?
Thx in advance.

1. Have lifetime membership with Jam [and 1 other entity] - and don't need company. Trade for a living and for a few select friends. Give classes, for free, to small groups on Harmonic Bars and Splatter Theory, and on quantitative analysis of 'predictive indicators'. Also work on 'cold laser' brain and memory high frequency treatments for PTSD veterans, and still do some beta testing for NT, Microsoft, Palisade [@risk], TOS, etc.

2. Do not, nor do i expect, to receive any compensation from JAM, or any related parties. IMO, if one develops trading systems, why do you need someone's else's compensation. Wouldn't you say?

3. As to educational qualifications, they are post graduate, and was MBA adjunct professor of "Risk Analysis for Derivatives" as far back as 1991. Perhaps i qualify to make an assessment of a trading system - or - maybe not.

have a blessed day falseprophet

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FalseProphets
Toledo, OH
 
 
Posts: 41 since Nov 2012
Thanks: 16 given, 46 received

Hello Nanook77,
I remember you joining the room on one special occasion a few months back. I am a fan!
My previous email was for BayFisherman, however.
Hope you are doing well.
Take care.






nanook77 View Post
1. Have lifetime membership with Jam [and 1 other entity] - and don't need company. Trade for a living and for a few select friends. Give classes, for free, to small groups on Harmonic Bars and Splatter Theory, and on quantitative analysis of 'predictive indicators'. Also work on 'cold laser' brain and memory high frequency treatments for PTSD veterans, and still do some beta testing for NT, Microsoft, Palisade [@risk], TOS, etc.

2. Do not, nor do i expect, to receive any compensation from JAM, or any related parties. IMO, if one develops trading systems, why do you need someone's else's compensation. Wouldn't you say?

3. As to educational qualifications, they are post graduate, and was MBA adjunct professor of "Risk Analysis for Derivatives" as far back as 1991. Perhaps i qualify to make an assessment of a trading system - or - maybe not.

have a blessed day falseprophet


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  #78 (permalink)
 bayfisherman 
Tallahassee
 
 
Posts: 57 since Jan 2012

I did trial 4 years ago and saw the value in what he was doing then..he was using range bars...but the emphasis was still on buying the dips and selling the rallies within the intraday trend, market strucuture and price patterns, along with some fractal confirmation from a higher timeframe chart. All very sound methods...and you are right about the positive things you said about having a trading plan, no blow out accounts, daily goals...I liked the idea of confirmation on the close of the bar in the direction of the trade for entry...these were the things that stood out to me when I first sat in...I worked during the day so was unable to really give the NY session daytrading a go...I developed my swing trading method using my pitchfork analysis on the 60min charts, but kept in mind the entry system he was using to get in with tight risk when I took my swing trades...it was a great way for me to increase my risk to reward. I wasn't able to join at the time and participate in the room...so I went my way with what I learned there in that short time. I kept sending him my highertimeframe analysis and after a time he asked me if I wanted to post some of it on his members forum to help, which eventually led to a job offer.
I do moderate the room now...it's been about 6 months or so to date. We feature the CL, NQ, Eur/usd, Gbp/Jpy....Great people, good staff with an excellant product. I've been a part of a number of "trials"...Tim Morge at market geometry, outstanding, Paul Coglan at Coglhan Capitol, outstanding, Bill Duryea market profile, outstanding, TradeGuider.com VSA analysis, outstanding; but as far as ease of execution and consistancy, I really liked what I saw at strategicdaytrading. I can pretty much have anything I want programmed...we came up with an automated pitchfork that prints on the chart for you....looks great, we have a market profile historgram that prints on the chart awesome...amazing new bars we're using that is just crushing the oil and nasdaq markets we are teaching on each day in the live market action...really good stuff and continues to improve as the company grows.
The automated trade ticket chasis is incredible and still being developed...works great if you like to automate your strategy or I use it for backtesting to improve my discretionary trading as well as it relates to initial stop loss...b/e triggers...inital hard targets and different length trailing stops,etc for optimizing results. So yes I'm a bit bias when it comes to strategicdaytrading.com because I help run things there and teach, but I've been around a bit and seen what's out there and this is where I've landed. I've had offers to trade managed accounts. I teach a higher timeframe analysis class each saturday based on andrew's pitchforks, elliot wave, fibonacci clusters, cycles and momentum. So I'm staying pretty busy. Never implied you as one of those I was refering to with the obvious agenda. I do appreciate your comments as well. Hope this clears the air.


FalseProphets View Post
We can agree that part of the value in forums such as these is being able to read/write fairminded critique of vendors. It is easily discernible who is doing that vs. agenda based mudslinging. My earlier post would be one example of a fair assessment, I was thanked by Jam's developer/moderator as well.
I came back to this topic however because something didn't quite smell right. You say that you trialed 4 years ago and are still active with him. That is quite a long time; I know folks who have earned a J.D. in Constitutional Law in less time. That means one of two things;
1. You paid a lifetime room fee and just linger in his room because trading can be lonely.
OR
2. You are actually on his payroll, which means that your views, as important as they are, just needs an added disclosure for fairness. Wouldn't you agree?

Have you conducted webinars/moderated one of his rooms/benefit financially in any way from Jam, besides benefitting from his teachings?
Thx in advance.


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  #79 (permalink)
 Big Mike 
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  #80 (permalink)
 rjoerosso 
Las Vegas, NV
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NinjaTrader
Trading: ZB
 
Posts: 1 since Feb 2011
Thanks: 0 given, 1 received

Hello All,

I generally dont ever post on the forum because I never really had anything to offer. I am just a guy who has failed at trading since I started many years ago. Today after being a member for 874 days I am making my first post because I finally I have something that I beleive can help many traders who are walking in my proverbial shoes.

I wanted to give anyone interested an update on this thread regarding Strategic Day Trading. I want to be up front and say that I am a member/student of this program. I joined in mid may 2013.

I think it is unfortunate that Mike has banned the two gentlemen from Strategic Day Trading (SDT) from the forum as I see 3 quality individuals in disagreement yet all striving for the same cause. The cause of trying to get good quality trading information out to the public. I do admire Mike for running a tight ship, which is why I feel this is the best trading forum available. Yet I feel it is my duty as a fellow trader to let you know that SDT is by far the best trading education I ever received. I have been in and out of trading since the mid nineties and have never been successful. Spending thousands on trading education just to blow out accounts, then quit, then start over again. At the advice of a friend I took their (SDT) free trial and was impressed as I was with the others but these guys are different then anyone else. They trade right in front of me on the screen, explain exactly what they are doing and have made money everyday since I joined. If they get a loss, they let you know. Nothing to hide. They are as transparent as I have ever seen in a company. The thing that sets them apart is they have a structured approach to taking one from learning to trade to trading in sim to trading live to making a living trading. The whole package. I send them my results every day which keeps me accountable and most of all they are practically begging me to contact them if I am having the slightest of probelems. Now I don't want to start to sound like an advertisement here but I want to say to those traders that continue to fail as I have that for me, this is it. The place I can actually learn to make a career and a living from trading. Please remember though, I am only a few weeks into this so don't just jump in with all guns firing. Do the homework, ask questions, definately do the free trial. and convince yourself. Also I posted an article below (copy and paste into browser) about a gentlemen that goes from trading room to trading room and gives a review. I think you may find it interesting. Thanks and best to you all on your continuous journey in trying to trade successfully.

422 Futures Trading Rooms in the US: StrategicDayTrading.com | MarketClips

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  #81 (permalink)
 joaobucks   is a Vendor
 
 
Posts: 37 since Jan 2010
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It would be interesting if BM let this Handley PhD MBA JD futures trader carry on posting as long as he backs up his claims with live trading statements.

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  #82 (permalink)
 Big Mike 
Site Administrator
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Manta, Ecuador
 
Experience: Advanced
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Posts: 50,008 since Jun 2009
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joaobucks View Post
It would be interesting if BM let this Handley PhD MBA JD futures trader carry on posting as long as he backs up his claims with live trading statements.

He was banned.

Mike

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  #83 (permalink)
 cory 
the coin hunter
virginia
 
Experience: Intermediate
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joaobucks View Post
It would be interesting if BM let this Handley PhD MBA JD futures trader carry on posting as long as he backs up his claims with live trading statements.

he means this guy rjoerosso not bayfisher.

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  #84 (permalink)
 Big Mike 
Site Administrator
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cory View Post
he means this guy rjoerosso not bayfisher.

Handley was banned for self-promotion. I don't know who rjoerosso or bayfisher are so just wanted to clarify.

Let's keep this thread on-topic, it is for users to write experiences about Jam's site.

Mike

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  #85 (permalink)
 sharmas 
Auckland
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: Ninja Trader
Broker: Zen-Fire
Trading: CL and ES
 
Posts: 764 since Apr 2010
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Just wanted to share the review on StrategicDayTrading.com



422 Futures Trading Rooms in the US: StrategicDayTrading.com | MarketClips
Of the 422 rooms I have visited and evaluated, this room presents one very genuine and one very unique feature:

Genuine feature: JAM discusses in detail his winning and losing trades; admirable as most rooms sweep losing trades under the rug.
Unique feature: The Black Belt Mentorship System: it consists of careful review of each trade, actual trading account statements and daily mentoring over many months. Progression along the White – Black belt system is gated by successful performance in each level; it is a very demanding and competent system. It appears to be the best trade education program I have seen; it is careful, consistent, protracted and patient.

I observed trades called for 2 months with Strategic Day Trading (04.15.13-06.15.13), aver of 3.17 trades/d; aver $370/d; aver $1848/wk (note: all values given are based on P/L with 3 contract trade; official room trade is 2 contracts per trade). JAM exhibits a caring and friendly manner that is most comforting compared to some of the vitriolic [1], vulgar [2], or deceptive [3] rooms I have observed. He will wait for the market to come to him, as he trades and teaches patience and discipline every day.

Very often he is “one and done” meaning after a single $300-$600 profitable trade, he will go from active trading to active teaching and the room becomes didactic. True execution of “one and done” requires patience for the market and the trade to set up, execution according to his trade plan and then discipline to conclude for the day. As with the very best trade rooms, there is a pronounced diurnal variation in P/L: aver P/L for Monday: $851; Tuesday: $71; Wednesday: $557; Thursday $129; Friday: $240 (yes, that adds to $1848/wk).

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  #86 (permalink)
 sharmas 
Auckland
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: Ninja Trader
Broker: Zen-Fire
Trading: CL and ES
 
Posts: 764 since Apr 2010
Thanks: 3,793 given, 735 received

I am in no way associated with them
however when i see a good room i do like to promote

They are offering free trial

Free Trial


Test, trial, evaluate and make your own judgement about strategicdaytrading

Sharmas

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  #87 (permalink)
FalseProphets
Toledo, OH
 
 
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Sharmas,
You have set a pretty low bar when you compare trade rooms. Honesty is hardly enough reason to make a trade room great, its a starting point. A real system based on some fundamental truths about the financial markets would be a good bar, this room fails miserably at that. Your assessment of $400 per week/contract is a great week for them. They do much worse majority of the time, not to mention that the trades are prequalified as entry or advance entry. When advance entry turns out to be a loser, it wont be in the performance stats. Not to mention, that performance stats have been removed and restarted many times on their site after terrible monthly performances. Believe me, I know..I have over 2 years experience with this room and been through the pre BlackBelt, BlackBelt, MMA and Samurai gimmicks to the point where I can count 3 months and wait for the next gimmick to show up in my Spam.

White, yellow, purple belt folks are all simming,they have people who have been simming there for years. There is very little confidence amongst members because every trade is in the middle of a gazillion support resistance lines and there isnt a lot of real money being made in the room.
Just look at their autotrader gizmo..supposedly makes $30k in 4 months on one crude oil contract. Would you run a trade room if your system did that? Jam is a master curve fitter and bears responsibility in mentioning that one way to financial ruin is trading a backtested system on renko bars where both entry and exits are spectacularly optimistic and $30k on ~600 trades is more like $15k after slippage not counting commissions(discount atleast 3 ticks of slippage). Plus accounting for the fact that the curve fitted drawdown is over $3k before commissions and slippage means that no beginner will actually be able to trade even with $10k accounts.
At best, its a good education room for people who have not read a trading book in their lives and find a '2b' and three wave patterns to be new information.
Finally, I helped expose the last guy promoting Jam who actually was one of his forex room moderators. You posted the same MarketClips link that was posted by someone else recently and you are going out of your way to keep this thread on top, I must say.

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  #88 (permalink)
 BeachTrader 
San Diego
 
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sharmas View Post
Just wanted to share the review on StrategicDayTrading.com



422 Futures Trading Rooms in the US: StrategicDayTrading.com | MarketClips
Of the 422 rooms I have visited and evaluated, this room presents one very genuine and one very unique feature:

Genuine feature: JAM discusses in detail his winning and losing trades; admirable as most rooms sweep losing trades under the rug.
Unique feature: The Black Belt Mentorship System: it consists of careful review of each trade, actual trading account statements and daily mentoring over many months. Progression along the White – Black belt system is gated by successful performance in each level; it is a very demanding and competent system. It appears to be the best trade education program I have seen; it is careful, consistent, protracted and patient.

I observed trades called for 2 months with Strategic Day Trading (04.15.13-06.15.13), aver of 3.17 trades/d; aver $370/d; aver $1848/wk (note: all values given are based on P/L with 3 contract trade; official room trade is 2 contracts per trade). JAM exhibits a caring and friendly manner that is most comforting compared to some of the vitriolic [1], vulgar [2], or deceptive [3] rooms I have observed. He will wait for the market to come to him, as he trades and teaches patience and discipline every day.

Very often he is “one and done” meaning after a single $300-$600 profitable trade, he will go from active trading to active teaching and the room becomes didactic. True execution of “one and done” requires patience for the market and the trade to set up, execution according to his trade plan and then discipline to conclude for the day. As with the very best trade rooms, there is a pronounced diurnal variation in P/L: aver P/L for Monday: $851; Tuesday: $71; Wednesday: $557; Thursday $129; Friday: $240 (yes, that adds to $1848/wk).

The fact that Dean Handley gives JAM a good grade is not a plus. This guy promotes a lot of different room sites. He was banned from futures.io (formerly BMT) for self promotion here. Anyway, if I was JAM I would steer clear of Handley.

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  #89 (permalink)
 sharmas 
Auckland
 
Experience: Advanced
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Broker: Zen-Fire
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Posts: 764 since Apr 2010
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FalseProphets View Post
Sharmas,
You have set a pretty low bar when you compare trade rooms. Honesty is hardly enough reason to make a trade room great, its a starting point. A real system based on some fundamental truths about the financial markets would be a good bar, this room fails miserably at that. Your assessment of $400 per week/contract is a great week for them. They do much worse majority of the time, not to mention that the trades are prequalified as entry or advance entry. When advance entry turns out to be a loser, it wont be in the performance stats. Not to mention, that performance stats have been removed and restarted many times on their site after terrible monthly performances. Believe me, I know..I have over 2 years experience with this room and been through the pre BlackBelt, BlackBelt, MMA and Samurai gimmicks to the point where I can count 3 months and wait for the next gimmick to show up in my Spam.

White, yellow, purple belt folks are all simming,they have people who have been simming there for years. There is very little confidence amongst members because every trade is in the middle of a gazillion support resistance lines and there isnt a lot of real money being made in the room.
Just look at their autotrader gizmo..supposedly makes $30k in 4 months on one crude oil contract. Would you run a trade room if your system did that? Jam is a master curve fitter and bears responsibility in mentioning that one way to financial ruin is trading a backtested system on renko bars where both entry and exits are spectacularly optimistic and $30k on ~600 trades is more like $15k after slippage not counting commissions(discount atleast 3 ticks of slippage). Plus accounting for the fact that the curve fitted drawdown is over $3k before commissions and slippage means that no beginner will actually be able to trade even with $10k accounts.
At best, its a good education room for people who have not read a trading book in their lives and find a '2b' and three wave patterns to be new information.
Finally, I helped expose the last guy promoting Jam who actually was one of his forex room moderators. You posted the same MarketClips link that was posted by someone else recently and you are going out of your way to keep this thread on top, I must say.


Thank you
So why not you share your winning formula and enrich us all as to how we can win in this game or business.
Happy for you to share along.

Sharmas

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  #90 (permalink)
 BeachTrader 
San Diego
 
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FalseProphets View Post
Not to mention, that performance stats have been removed and restarted many times on their site after terrible monthly performances.

I have noticed the same unfortunately. I had observed that they included in their performance results trades that were not taken live in front of the group. This made me uncomfortable with the results page. Then they had a great idea of having people in the room validate the results. They did this for several weeks. Unfortunately their results weren't as good during this period. And today I looked at their results page and noticed they removed the validation process of the users confirming the trades. That's too bad. I think JAM and his team are a nice group of people but they should realize that any oddities/irregularities with performance results reduces trust.

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  #91 (permalink)
 sharmas 
Auckland
 
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Hi All

This is what really got me excited about StrategicDaytraining

The sample of the video attached here.

Sat Session Promo - pipslayer's library

Enjoy

Sharmas

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  #92 (permalink)
 sharmas 
Auckland
 
Experience: Advanced
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Posts: 764 since Apr 2010
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Hello Traders

I have been trading with JAM for a while and i have found him to be a really good teacher and support is fantastic.

Here is the latest offer and wont hurt for new traders to go in and check them out for a free weeks trial...

You then can make your own mind after..There is no hard sell at all

SHAPING THE FUTURE.
As school ends and trading slows down, traders can get caught up looking for larger moves or find themselves over-trading chop. Summer months can be great to trade if you just understand what you are looking for and how to make the adjustments. What worked in a fast opening market during peak months of trading can now leave you chopped up. JAM the Trader has made our summer trading adjustments in SDT's indicators so that the TEAM can hit their target goal. Our live education classes will reflect these changes and help you going forward in this season.

Don't be afraid to trade during the summer months, just trade slow and wait for the right trades to show up. And as always don't worry about what you miss, instead practice protecting your precious capital and the profits will take care of themselves.

Come in for a week and take advantage of our special discount when your trial is up! This offer is only good on the last day of your free trial.

Strategic DayTrading
Strategic DayTrading - Daytrade for a living
Skype: jamthetrader
Traders around the world working together as a TEAM.

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  #93 (permalink)
 Cristian 
Bucharest - Romania
 
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Seeing JAM has logs with his trades(if independently confirmed !) and finally gave up to all the automatic scalping systems was concentrating at 3 years ago I may conclude he is improving.

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  #94 (permalink)
 BeachTrader 
San Diego
 
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I am not sure you can totally trust the trade logs. For example (from what I observed in the past on a couple of occasions), if his entry software isn't functioning properly and causes big slippage or a loss he will record it like an ideal entry occurred instead - I guess to show what he thinks should have happened. I am just more comfortable recording your results as they actually happened, even with screw-ups. Even if he no longer does that, my view is tainted. So my preference would be for him to not publish his trade results at all. But overall I do think he is trading better than before - ringing the resister and not going for the huge winners.

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  #95 (permalink)
 sharmas 
Auckland
 
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Team
Giving you all a glimpse of what the chart looks like and also the results from today's session.



Love what i have seen and get from the room

Sharmas.

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  #96 (permalink)
FalseProphets
Toledo, OH
 
 
Posts: 41 since Nov 2012
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sharmas View Post
Team
Giving you all a glimpse of what the chart looks like and also the results from today's session.



Love what i have seen and get from the room

Sharmas.

We remember you being very excited about Pitchfork use in his room about a year ago. Now you are excited about this...I guess this is why Jim changes his stuff so frequently, it keeps the business going with fresh batch of unsuspecting dreamers. I thank you for all the promotion that you do for him.

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  #97 (permalink)
 sharmas 
Auckland
 
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"The only man who never makes a mistake is the man who never does anything."
-Theodore Roosevelt

Show me one trader who is still using the same EMA or any other indicator for last 10 years or even 2 years..

We evolve and learn and and keep learning.

We come to this forum to learn and share... I wish we were where you are in your trading and being successful ...i am still learning and gaining all i can

I share my experience and yes there are many who promised the Moon and couldn't deliver even dust.


sharmas

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  #98 (permalink)
 tturner86 
Elite Member
Portland, Oregon
 
Experience: Intermediate
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sharmas View Post
"The only man who never makes a mistake is the man who never does anything."
-Theodore Roosevelt

Show me one trader who is still using the same EMA or any other indicator for last 10 years or even 2 years..

We evolve and learn and and keep learning.

We come to this forum to learn and share... I wish we were where you are in your trading and being successful ...i am still learning and gaining all i can

I share my experience and yes there are many who promised the Moon and couldn't deliver even dust.


sharmas

Al Brooks.

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  #99 (permalink)
FalseProphets
Toledo, OH
 
 
Posts: 41 since Nov 2012
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sharmas View Post
"The only man who never makes a mistake is the man who never does anything."
-Theodore Roosevelt

Show me one trader who is still using the same EMA or any other indicator for last 10 years or even 2 years..

We evolve and learn and and keep learning.

We come to this forum to learn and share... I wish we were where you are in your trading and being successful ...i am still learning and gaining all i can

I share my experience and yes there are many who promised the Moon and couldn't deliver even dust.


sharmas

I wish you all the best trading has to offer and my comments are in keeping with this sentiment.
First, do all the people get their money back when they bought his program that used to peddle price bounces off 3 different moving averages, regardless of whether the market was coming of off accumulation or at the top of the third wave? Why does anyone get to charge for expertise when they are not much better than the ‘students’ in his room? How good a teacher can one be when people in his room are simming for years and no better off? Why haven’t you become a professional trader (or atleast not need the handholding anymore) from the great pitchfork sessions that you were exposed to a year ago?
Now for the people who are not changing chart templates every 3-6 months: Al Brooks, DB, Askar, and that’s just 3 names from this site alone. I can give a dozen more names but they don’t need the publicity.
Its not about not making mistakes, its about repeating them thats at question here.

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  #100 (permalink)
 BeachTrader 
San Diego
 
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Yeah I like Jam, but I don't feel he is a good trader - one reason being he changes his system too much . Actually I really liked the methodology Jam used when I signed up years ago where he used dynamic support and resistance zones, small size renko bars, clear Q filter signals, etc. I wish he never went away from that. Every time I come back to his room for a visit, the charts and system have changed again. Wish he wouldn't do that.

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