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Have you heard about XYZ?


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Have you heard about XYZ?

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  #11 (permalink)
Paradise, USA
 
Experience: Beginner
Platform: Big Charts
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GridKing View Post
But if you skip the guys and go straight to the girls it's definitely more fun and memorable, even if it takes longer

Ya, I remember when I was a kid playing spin the bottle with the neighborhood kids, if it landed on a guy you would skip the guy and go straight to the girl.

But I don't think that's how it is with these kids these days...now I understand what my Daddy meant, "Ah, the good ol'days."

"Faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen." --- "Therefore, I Believe it and I will see it. And every day and in every way, I am healthier, wealthier, and wiser."
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  #12 (permalink)
Coloado
 
Experience: Beginner
Platform: Ninja Trader
Broker: AMP, OEC, CQG
Trading: NQ
 
Posts: 129 since Sep 2010


Lornz View Post
But, before I retire, I will urge the many beginning traders to actually do the work required, and not waste time and money on distractions...

Cheers!

I wish someone would have beat the above statement into my head with a two-by-four. In the beginning I was convinced that you could "earn while you learn" and that if I paid big $$$ surely I would be successful. Boy was I wrong........$30 K wrong.

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  #13 (permalink)
Bala, PA, USA
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NinjaTrader
Broker: Mirus, IB
Trading: SPY, Oil, Euro
 
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Rayzor View Post
I wish someone would have beat the above statement into my head with a two-by-four. In the beginning I was convinced that you could "earn while you learn" and that if I paid big $$$ surely I would be successful. Boy was I wrong........$30 K wrong.

It's human nature. It's natural to want to travel the path of least resistance. As a new trader, who knows little about the market, you want to learn about this new concept. But, where to start? The natural tendency is to go to those who claim they have experience. But there are 100's of these guys out there touting their expertise at a substantial price. What's a newbie to do? Here's an idea, get on a trading forum and ask people's opinions! That is exactly the purpose of a forum. So, yes 'Have you heard of XYZ?', 'What do yo think about them'?, 'Are they worth my hard earned $2995'

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  #14 (permalink)
Oslo, Norway
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: CQG, Excel
Trading: CL
 
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Posts: 1,198 since Apr 2010


Rayzor View Post
I wish someone would have beat the above statement into my head with a two-by-four. In the beginning I was convinced that you could "earn while you learn" and that if I paid big $$$ surely I would be successful. Boy was I wrong........$30 K wrong.

$30K? Ouch... But I am quite certain most on this board have been similarly naive, albeit with smaller amounts...

I started trading right after high school, thus I didn't even have that much to put into my trading account, much less spend on "education".

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  #15 (permalink)
Coloado
 
Experience: Beginner
Platform: Ninja Trader
Broker: AMP, OEC, CQG
Trading: NQ
 
Posts: 129 since Sep 2010


monpere View Post
'Are they worth my hard earned $2995'

I am confident in saying "no".

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  #16 (permalink)
Sarasota FL, USA
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: TradeStation
Trading: Futures
 
Posts: 4 since Jun 2011
Thanks: 2 given, 0 received


TheSeeker View Post
I believe that you can learn good setups from courses. This is not to be confused with becoming a profitable trader...the latter is really a matter of thousands of hours of screen time and experience.

This has been my experience also. IMO a key element to succeed in this field is to find a framework that works for your tolerances and lifestyle. This doesn't come without considerable diligence in research, testing, analysis and commitment, part of that commitment is also to back yourself with a plan, executed in the market with real funds on the line. I've performed many many hours to simulation but that just doesn't cut it until you can monitor and analyse the results from live trading.

I've paid and attended many courses, bought a lot of systems and believe I've seen a pretty broad range of what's on offer out there and until I took components of what I'd seen, quantitively tested those for validity, integrated those that made the cut and developed my own system(s), then applied those to the market did it come together for me. Only then did I realize just how much work is really involved to make this work for me.

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  #17 (permalink)
Coloado
 
Experience: Beginner
Platform: Ninja Trader
Broker: AMP, OEC, CQG
Trading: NQ
 
Posts: 129 since Sep 2010


TheSeeker View Post
I've learned quite a lot from the various courses and chat rooms in the past. Exchanging info on vendors and educational services on this board can only help,imho.

I believe that you can learn good setups from courses. This is not to be confused with becoming a profitable trader...the latter is really a matter of thousands of hours of screen time and experience.

Yes, but is that help worth $7500.00? I will have to agree Seeker, but I have paid quite a bit at times for those little nuggets of truth. In all honesty I have found that the best stuff I have learned has been from $50 e-books and free stuff I have found on this forum. I must confess, I always assumed (stupidly) that those programs and rooms would give me confidence; they did not.

I have also realized that I am like Scarface (the move): "who do I trust????? me!!!!! I find my losses are much more palatable when the mistake is mine rather than a bad room call.

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  #18 (permalink)
New York
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NinjaTrader, TradeNavigator
Broker: Optimus Futures
Trading: Piano
 
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Posts: 111 since Jul 2012
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Have sombebody heard of Brian Hoffman Trading? I saw his presentation on NinjaTrader, and I liked it. But his video course costs 1000 usd, and I am not sure about him.

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  #19 (permalink)
East Bend
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: NinjaTrader, Tradestation, MetaTrader
Broker: Mirus/Kinetick
Trading: Futures, Oil, Gold, NQ
 
Posts: 49 since Mar 2010
Thanks: 2 given, 65 received

There are "markers" that I've identified similar to the list of cautions previously mentioned by Mike.

One of the things I hear most consistently from other traders is the "time" variable. Most of them report a 3-5 year learning curve before they entered into a break even + / profitable period of their careers. I don't know very many who opened an account and earned a living 6 months later. It's interesting to me that this falls in line with the "10,000 hour rule" you hear about with any type of proficiency.

I've also found that most vendors won't address losses and losing streaks. Beware the ones that use the word "compounding" in their presentations, ie, how quickly you can go from $10,000 to $100,000 in the account. It's the vendors that address things from the other direction that are worth their salt. I remember the first guy who spoke to me about Monte Carlo analyses, Average Draw Down, Max Draw Down, etc. My head nearly exploded. Then I read a book called "The Trading Game" by Ryan Jones where he unpacked 2 ideas that taught traders when to go from a live trading to a simulated trading account so as not to blow out an entire account. I call it his "Parachute" techniques. Vendors that don't tell you what to do/how to identify when to pull the "parachute" are usually worth avoiding.

Most vendors with an "arrow" indicator have almost never panned out for me. I've learned that in a room full of 10 people, with the same tools, there will be 10 different rule sets and personalities. It can be done, but authors like Richard Weissman point out that every trader has a "natural center of gravity" and is what their mother said all along, "very special". :-)

Even Gann noted this. He said once that lawyers and doctors had to go to school for substantial amounts of time before they could be considered lawyers and doctors - but people who have the physical means "money" assume themselves to be traders by the nature of their wealth. I believe that brokers have some culpability in this sense and should have as others have noted on this post a type of "driver's test" prior to trading live.

Just giving someone a simulated account and telling them to trade a simple system for 1 week (like a 5/20 SMA cross) regardless of results will tell you about a trader's readiness. If someone can't follow a simple 3 rule cross-entry-exit method (with nothing on the line) they're not ready to learn anything anyone has to teach.

Great posts here. I wish I'd read ones like these early on...

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  #20 (permalink)
Market Wizard
Fletcher NC
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: nijia trader
Broker: A.M.P. I.Q. ....C.Q.G.
Trading: ym es
 
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Ironman9973 View Post
Have sombebody heard of Brian Hoffman Trading? I saw his presentation on NinjaTrader, and I liked it. But his video course costs 1000 usd, and I am not sure about him.

my advice do not buy it..is it total b.s. ( no) does it have any real value (no) it may help you if you no nothing .. is it a waste of time..(yes) does he show any prof he can trade (no) do i think he can trade or know what he is doing ( no)

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