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Tiger's Price Action Journal
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Tiger's Price Action Journal

  #91 (permalink)
Elite Member
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itrade2win View Post
My guess is that you are trading with only (1) contract and if that is the case then I would suggest that you look for setups that would give you the better opportunity to hit your minimum target and that should be based on PA = Price Action. My stop is set at 25 ticks and I hardly ever move it. I trade with a (2) targets set at +10 +25, but at times again based on the setup I may move the targets to +8 +15. If price comes back at me I just close the trade and I go by feeling by watching how price moves on the Dom if it is not going to continue and hit my 2nd target I simply just close the trade. But there has been times that I am confident that price will continue and let the price come back against me a few ticks and let the trade move back in my direction.

Yes, only 1 contract. I used to trade with 2 where the first target was 5 ticks, and I almost always got my first target. However, I suffered from 'movingmystopitis' really bad, and I found that I had a lot of very small wins and it only took 1 full 2 contact stop out to undo it all.

I think confidence IS the key, and Mike reiterates that point on his reply. I remember reading a post by cbratin (I think) where he mentioned the exact same thing: trust your trade and put the stop where the market tells you that you're wrong. A lot of people feel this way.

Tomorrow I will give it a try.

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  #92 (permalink)
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Today I abandoned moving my stop to BE+1 on most trades and just let the trade go. The result was poor, meaning had I continued moving my stop quickly, I would have done better. As it was, I came out +7 ticks on 7 trades.

Obviously my stop out trades weren't great, but I still can't help feeling that moving to BE quickly isn't a bad idea. But 1 day doesn't tell the whole story, and as I get better at this, perhaps things will change.

There was a slight downward trend to the early morning session, so I was leaning short. However, there did appear to be some strong support around 86.50 from the 2 hammers around 01:00 and a higher low at 04:00

Trade #1
Price had been rolling over and descended below the EMA. When the 05:30 bar hit bottom and started it ascent, I put a buy stop above and was carried upward. The next bar continued upward and I had +9 ticks and was sorely tempted to move my stop, but left it at -11. The bar reversed and I was stopped out. -11 ticks.

Trade #2
The bar that stopped me out was a strong down bar, and I went short at the bar close. This trade wasn't too smart, since I was aware of the strong support at the 86.50 area, which is why I went long on the first trade. Right idea, poor timing and decision. Never had a chance to move my stop. Full stop -11 ticks.

Trade #3
Price failed to move higher and started back down. The 05:55 hammer failed to move price higher, and got a close under the EMA. Placed a sell stop 1 tick below the open of the big green bar and got caught in a downward tidal wave. I had 22 ticks MFE in the trade with a hard stop of 25 ticks, and left everything alone rather than lock in something. Really poor trade management. -11 ticks.

Trade #4
Still trying to impose my will on the market. -11 ticks.

Trade #5
As price started to climb back in to the early morning range, I decided against putting in a buy stop at the most recent pivot high at 86.91, but instead place a buy stop just over the morning congestion. Was filled on the next bar for a nice trade. +25 ticks.

Trade #6
After the big run, the 07:20 bar formed an inside doji (rare!), then another doji making LH and LL. Placed a sell stop at the bottom and was filled for a nice trade. +25 ticks.

Trade #7
As price resumed its uptrend, I again decided against putting a buy stop at the most recent pivot high, but instead waited for price to push through that, then placed the buy limit order at 87.37 and was filled. Once again, poor trade management caused me to sit on my hands as MFE approached 21 ticks. This time I decided to outsmart myself and move my stop to BE+1 where I was taken out, right before price resumed its climb. Had I just did what I had been doing all morning, it would have been +25 tick trade.

So doing the arithmetic, if I would have been consistent in my trade management, I would have come out +32 ticks by capturing the full 25 ticks on the last trade.

Had I moved to BE+1 like I usually do, trades 1 and 2 would have been +2 instead of -22, trade #3 was just stupidity for not taking something away (would have BE+1 at a min), and trade 4 would have been a full stop anyway. That leaves me +43 ticks. A slightly better result.

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Tiger's Price Action Journal-cl-01-11-5-min-12_2_2010.png  
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  #93 (permalink)
Student Of The Markets
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Tiger,

Good job, holding onto your trades without moving your stops. I bet that may have been hard for you to change from your old habit.

You would have done better if you had taken Longs today. If you look at a RTH 5 or 15 min chart you can see that the market was in a bullish channel from the PD and continued the whole day right from the open.

Good luck tomorrow!

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  #94 (permalink)
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itrade2win View Post
Tiger,

Good job, holding onto your trades without moving your stops. I bet that may have been hard for you to change from your old habit.

You would have done better if you had taken Longs today. If you look at a RTH 5 or 15 min chart you can see that the market was in a bullish channel from the PD and continued the whole day right from the open.

Good luck tomorrow!

Well .... I'm not a true believer at this point, but my mind is open to the idea.

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  #95 (permalink)
Sharpening mental edge
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Tiger45 View Post
6 CL trades today and net positive (sim), but if you lift up the hood, there's room for improvement.

Trade #1
This was just plain stupid and I'm going to let it go at that. I saw the congestion and took the trade anyway. I rationalized it with LL, LH, spinner doji nonsense, but the truth is I shorted in the middle of a range. -6 ticks.

Trade #2
Price closed below the EMA after making a LL. The previous bar also tested the upper end of the range. Another dumb trade, because I traded in the middle of a range. -11 ticks.

Trade #3
The only reason I took this trade was because it was sim. I placed a buy stop 1 tick above the range after the prior strong bar. Had a hard stop in. +25 ticks.

Trade #4
After moving higher, price returned and tested the prior range. Figuring prior resistance now became support, I went long 1 tick above the prior bar. I didn't do the math on this, because I should have had my stop below the low of the prior bar, but instead kept it at 11 ticks. It was good that I got out BE +1 because I would have been stopped out at the very bottom of the next bar. HOWEVER, price didn't go below the prior bar, which was the logical stop.

Trade #5
This is another trade I wouldn't have taken in real life because it was so close to the oil report. The 07:10 bearish engulfing bar and the next two bars indicated a failure to go higher. As the 07:25 bar fell, I placed a limit order at 85.64. I took 10 ticks of heat, then the oil report came out. Got 3 ticks of slip in my favor. How real is that? +28 ticks.

Trade #6
The market had been ranging all morning, and the big 08:45 bar pushed right up to the upper limit. I had been looking for a 15 tick scalp trade and had the DOM set on 15 ticks and forgot to change it back to 25 ticks. Place another buy stop above the big green bar that initially set the range at 06:10. Got filled and hit the target for +15 ticks.

The second chart is a clean version of the first chart, uploaded by request.

chart attached from the other day

Attached Thumbnails
Tiger's Price Action Journal-cl-01-11-5-min-12_1_2010-marked.png  
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  #96 (permalink)
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rassi View Post
chart attached from the other day

Geez - I feel like a moron. When you said the chart was from the other day, I thought you meant that I posted the wrong chart. I didn't realize that you uploaded a chart with commentary on it to help me. Sorry it took so long for me to get it.

Thanks for this.

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  #97 (permalink)
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No CL trades today, but I did take 1 6E trade for 26 ticks (pips?).

I put the two instruments up on separate monitors, and I'm embarrassed to admit that I had never noticed how correlated the two instruments are.

That begs the question - why put up with the craziness of CL when 6E gives the same signals? Does anyone trade both?

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  #98 (permalink)
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Tiger45 View Post
That begs the question - why put up with the craziness of CL when 6E gives the same signals? Does anyone trade both?

Sure, many trade CL and the EUR/USD. @FulcrumTrader is one, his primary arsenal afaik is CL+6E.

Mike

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  #99 (permalink)
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Didn't see the forest for the trees. Today I was focused on trading with the trend. CL was up big, so I thought, great, up trend. I marked up my charts with S/R lines (actually, only support since there weren't any recent resistance lines to be had) and off the races I went.

Trade #1
After topping out, CL started down. This drop slowed right where I had a support line, so I went long at 90.13. I kept my stop at 10 ticks where I was stopped out. -10 ticks.

I tried to catch a short trade on the 06:45 bar with a limit sell at 89.85 but wasn't filled. Price continued to drop and stopped at a 5 min support line.

Trade #2
Went long at 89.45 and planned on riding it back to the EMA. On the 07:05 bar, after about 8 ticks to the good, I moved my stop to the bottom of the 06:50 hammer, thinking that might offer support. I was stopped out on the 06:55 bar. +4 ticks.

I had drawn a 60 min support line that was just a hair under the previous 5 min line. As price moved into that, I'm still thinking retrace to the EMA.

Trade #3
When long 89.27 on the 06:55 bar, but this time moved my stop to BE+2 after the 07:25 bar started showing me some love. Short relationship. +2 ticks.

So now I'm looking at the amazing down trending day and trying to figure out why I was so fixated on long trades. Here's what I came up with.

The first trade was almost forgivable, since the trend was up and price had come down to a 5 minute support level, and was still close to the EMA.

I did try to short the 06:45 bar, missed entry, and didn't chase it. I was still under the illusion that there was support nearby.

Both the second and third trades were right at what I believed was support. By the time price broke through the 60 min support at 07:30, the move was over.

On a brighter note, I took 3 trades on 6E and made 20 ticks.

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Tiger's Price Action Journal-cl-01-11-5-min-12_7_2010.png  
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  #100 (permalink)
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Thanks for posting.

In my experience, when traders try to go long from an extreme (like your first long) it generally has something to do with wanting to get a "big win", so you are trying to get in "early". You might ask yourself if that fits.

Your next trades, all longs after price was clearly moving down, were likely because you were in the mindset of "longs". You were determined to make the long work, and again you wanted to catch it as early as possible in the new up trend that was about to develop so you could maximize the profit gains ("big winner").

I make this type of mistake too every now and then. Luckily I usually catch it right away. It happened just a few days ago, where I was trading the wrong side of the market and then as I was telling my trading buddy I realized "duh, I am making a big mistake" and then I corrected myself.

Some might call it the "catch a falling knife" syndrome.

Anyway, keep at it! A trading master is just someone who has made all the mistakes and survived. Important thing is to keep measuring yourself consistently and keep moving forward, just work on two things at any given time in a two week period, and measure yourself every single day on how well you accomplished those two things (net profit aside).

Mike

Due to time constraints, please do not PM me if your question can be resolved or answered on the forum.

Need help?
1) Stop changing things. No new indicators, charts, or methods. Be consistent with what is in front of you first.
2) Start a journal and post to it daily with the trades you made to show your strengths and weaknesses.
3) Set goals for yourself to reach daily. Make them about how you trade, not how much money you make.
4) Accept responsibility for your actions. Stop looking elsewhere to explain away poor performance.
5) Where to start as a trader? Watch this webinar and read this thread for hundreds of questions and answers.
6)
Help using the forum? Watch this video to learn general tips on using the site.

If you want
to support our community, become an Elite Member.

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