Attack of the Robots - An Algo Journal - Trading Journals | futures io social day trading
futures io futures trading


Attack of the Robots - An Algo Journal
Updated: Views / Replies:3,337 / 63
Created: by vmodus Attachments:0

Welcome to futures io.

(If you already have an account, login at the top of the page)

futures io is the largest futures trading community on the planet, with over 100,000 members. At futures io, our goal has always been and always will be to create a friendly, positive, forward-thinking community where members can openly share and discuss everything the world of trading has to offer. The community is one of the friendliest you will find on any subject, with members going out of their way to help others. Some of the primary differences between futures io and other trading sites revolve around the standards of our community. Those standards include a code of conduct for our members, as well as extremely high standards that govern which partners we do business with, and which products or services we recommend to our members.

At futures io, our focus is on quality education. No hype, gimmicks, or secret sauce. The truth is: trading is hard. To succeed, you need to surround yourself with the right support system, educational content, and trading mentors Ė all of which you can find on futures io, utilizing our social trading environment.

With futures io, you can find honest trading reviews on brokers, trading rooms, indicator packages, trading strategies, and much more. Our trading review process is highly moderated to ensure that only genuine users are allowed, so you donít need to worry about fake reviews.

We are fundamentally different than most other trading sites:
  • We are here to help. Just let us know what you need.
  • We work extremely hard to keep things positive in our community.
  • We do not tolerate rude behavior, trolling, or vendors advertising in posts.
  • We firmly believe in and encourage sharing. The holy grail is within you, we can help you find it.
  • We expect our members to participate and become a part of the community. Help yourself by helping others.

You'll need to register in order to view the content of the threads and start contributing to our community.  It's free and simple.

-- Big Mike, Site Administrator

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
 

Attack of the Robots - An Algo Journal

  #41 (permalink)
Somewhere, Delawhere, USA
 
Trading Experience: Intermediate
Platform: TradeStation,Sierra Chart
Broker/Data: Tradestation Securities
Favorite Futures: VX, my kids
 
vmodus's Avatar
 
Posts: 257 since Feb 2017
Thanks: 431 given, 416 received


kevinkdog View Post
There is almost certainly a reason why you are missing orders, and it may or may not be the fault of Tradestation. I don't know.

BUT, what I do know is that any automated software solution will have its issues. So, changing from one software platform might just solve some issues, but bring up others.

The key with any platform you use is to perform root cause and corrective action analysis of any significant errors. I recommend you do just that. Then, depending on what you discover, you might conclude that a platform switch is appropriate.

I hope you solve it!

Order execution is really the least of our problems and we have had pretty good success on that front.

I suspect that the missed orders are a result of a memory leak or some bug in the Tradestation code. Running the same strategy against the same data set gives me two different results..... one set of results before restarting Tradestation and a different set after restarting. If I see it again, I will post an example of exactly what it looks like before and after a restart of the application. The strategy is clean.

Our Tradestation issues run far and deep beyond this particular issue and we have experienced a ton of problems over the years. I have installed and uninstalled TS more times than I care to think. Registry edits, lost data, corrupt files, installation failures.....you name it, we've done it with TS. We just don't trust the platform any longer, especially as we continue to grow our trading operation. I work with high end ERP systems, both functionally and technically, and what I'm seeing is definitely a bug. I don't expect a perfect system, but I do expect some level of stability and reliability. I have had TS freeze on me at least twice this past month, while in a live position.

I appreciate the encouragement. I know I can get through this, but as I've said in other posts, TS days are numbered in our shop.

~vmodus

Visit my futures io Trade Journal Reply With Quote
The following user says Thank You to vmodus for this post:
 
  #42 (permalink)
Somewhere, Delawhere, USA
 
Trading Experience: Intermediate
Platform: TradeStation,Sierra Chart
Broker/Data: Tradestation Securities
Favorite Futures: VX, my kids
 
vmodus's Avatar
 
Posts: 257 since Feb 2017
Thanks: 431 given, 416 received

@kevinkdog , I'm sorry if I may have sounded grouchy in my response last night. I gave what you said last night some more thought. It occurred to me that I can/should use the print feature in Easylanguage to see what my code is doing.

I have the print feature written in all of my strategies and have a parameter to turn it off or on. Here is the code:
 
Code
// Easylanguage code snippet
inputs:  // just add the inputs below to your existing inputs
   print_on(0),                  // 1 = turn print log on
   print_start_date(1190101),    // start date for the print log
   print_end_date(1190101)       // end date for the print log
   ;

vars:    // these variables are just for reference
   iTrend(0),
   Trigger(0)
   ;
   
// Condition to print 
Condition90 = print_on = 1 and Date >= print_start_date and Date <= print_end_date ;

// if condition is true, then print to the log
if Condition90 
   then
      print(Date, "-", Time, " - ","iTrend: " , iTrend, "Trigger: " , Trigger) ;
I actually add more 'print' statements as needed, to see other things as well.

Here is what the parameters look like on one of my strategies:
Please register on futures.io to view futures trading content such as post attachment(s), image(s), and screenshot(s).


So today I'm running it in sim again this morning, with print activated. Thanks again.... you got my thinking turned in the right direction. I'll let you know if I need assistance.

~vmodus


Last edited by vmodus; May 17th, 2019 at 09:23 AM. Reason: Corrected mention
Visit my futures io Trade Journal Reply With Quote
 
  #43 (permalink)
Somewhere, Delawhere, USA
 
Trading Experience: Intermediate
Platform: TradeStation,Sierra Chart
Broker/Data: Tradestation Securities
Favorite Futures: VX, my kids
 
vmodus's Avatar
 
Posts: 257 since Feb 2017
Thanks: 431 given, 416 received

Random weird trading observation on the VX


My weird trading thought of the day:

I am working primarily with the VX tool, and I'm pretty much in an upside down world. Like most people here on FIO, I don't care which way the market moves, as long as it moves. The weird part is that, as I'm watching my instrument fall (short), it is actually good news for the markets. So I cheer for my instrument to crash, this means the market (specifically the ES) is moving up.

Just a weird thing to experience.



~vmodus

Visit my futures io Trade Journal Reply With Quote
 
  #44 (permalink)
Somewhere, Delawhere, USA
 
Trading Experience: Intermediate
Platform: TradeStation,Sierra Chart
Broker/Data: Tradestation Securities
Favorite Futures: VX, my kids
 
vmodus's Avatar
 
Posts: 257 since Feb 2017
Thanks: 431 given, 416 received

Friday sim results (and stuff)

So today's sim run worked a lot better than yesterday. Using my lessons learned, I started TS fresh, only one strategy and nothing else (except trade manager once trading commenced.

Of course the results were not the best:
Please register on futures.io to view futures trading content such as post attachment(s), image(s), and screenshot(s).


From a market standpoint, there were three ranges that got to us. We were whipsawed a little at pre-market and then just at open, got in the correct side for most of the morning, then some whipsaw action, then another long trade, then a little more back and forth.

Today's Results:
  • -$764
  • 5 trades, 3 losses and 2 wins
  • Compare to the strategy performance report: -$867
So we did a little better than predicted by the strategy performance report. Obviously this was a losing day, but this week, for this strategy, would have been flat.

What I liked
  • Strategy identified all potential trades
  • Our actual P/L was close enough to the strategy report
  • Signals were good
  • Code did not fail like yesterday
What I didn't like
  • Strategy missed one trade, because of a timing issue; the limit price was not hit and thus we didn't get in.
  • There still work to be done on the trades that get missed
  • For this market and strategy, true automation might be difficult to accomplish
  • I pulled the plug on my strategy 4 minutes early.... I thought my EOD exit was not being hit.... then realized it evaluates at the end of the bar, thus I should have waited until 1610.
The VX is one challenging beast. I like the challenge, but the learning is painful. This strategy needs more work and I will have to think about whether I will trade this next week in sim or live. I am leaning towards sim, but will make a decision by Sunday night.

Anyhow, that is all I have for this week. I hope you all have a restful weekend and let's do this again next week.

~vmodus

Visit my futures io Trade Journal Reply With Quote
The following 3 users say Thank You to vmodus for this post:
 
  #45 (permalink)
Chicago
 
Trading Experience: Beginner
Favorite Futures: MES
 
snax's Avatar
 
Posts: 607 since Feb 2019
Thanks: 2,080 given, 1,644 received

Fascinating stuff as always, do you think it is odd that a volatility index like the VIX goes down when prices go up in a volatile fashion? I need to look to see if there is a gauge for volatility that disregards (or is neutral with regards to) direction and only focuses on the "spikiness/variance" of the movement itself.

Have a great weekend!

Visit my futures io Trade Journal Reply With Quote
 
  #46 (permalink)
OC, California, USA
 
Trading Experience: Advanced
Platform: IB/TWS, NinjaTrader, thinkorswim
Favorite Futures: stocks, options, futures, VIX
 
shodson's Avatar
 
Posts: 1,924 since Jun 2009
Thanks: 506 given, 3,533 received

The VIX is skewed because investors in equities are typically long-only, and when fear rises, PUT prices rise faster than the drop in CALL prices, increasing the VIX, and when the market is going up and doing well, fear subsides so PUTs go down in price faster than CALL prices rise, so the VIX drops. This is why the VIX usually rises in down markets and drops in up marketsx.

In short, if people are bullish they generally buy underlying instruments like futures, ETFs, and stocks, instead of CALLs, and use PUTs to insure them.

Also, an underlying can't go lower than zero, but it can theoretically go up to infinity. This absolute-zero floor also makes puts more expensive than calls.

If you want to just measure volatility in terms of actual up/down movement, just use ATR.

Follow me on Twitter Reply With Quote
The following 3 users say Thank You to shodson for this post:
 
  #47 (permalink)
Chicago
 
Trading Experience: Beginner
Favorite Futures: MES
 
snax's Avatar
 
Posts: 607 since Feb 2019
Thanks: 2,080 given, 1,644 received


shodson View Post
The VIX is skewed because investors in equities are typically long-only, and when fear rises, PUT prices rise faster than the drop in CALL prices, increasing the VIX, and when the market is going up and doing well, fear subsides so PUTs go down in price faster than CALL prices rise, so the VIX drops. This is why the VIX usually rises in down markets and drops in up marketsx.

In short, if people are bullish they generally buy underlying instruments like futures, ETFs, and stocks, instead of CALLs, and use PUTs to insure them.

Also, an underlying can't go lower than zero, but it can theoretically go up to infinity. This absolute-zero floor also makes puts more expensive than calls.

If you want to just measure volatility in terms of actual up/down movement, just use ATR.

Ahh thank you. I have never thought of volatility-skew in this fashion, I probably mis-understand it. I always think of it as merely "markets tend to crash faster than they rally" but the option-pricing is skewed as well. Thanks!

Visit my futures io Trade Journal Reply With Quote
The following user says Thank You to snax for this post:
 
  #48 (permalink)
Somewhere, Delawhere, USA
 
Trading Experience: Intermediate
Platform: TradeStation,Sierra Chart
Broker/Data: Tradestation Securities
Favorite Futures: VX, my kids
 
vmodus's Avatar
 
Posts: 257 since Feb 2017
Thanks: 431 given, 416 received


snax View Post
Fascinating stuff as always, do you think it is odd that a volatility index like the VIX goes down when prices go up in a volatile fashion? I need to look to see if there is a gauge for volatility that disregards (or is neutral with regards to) direction and only focuses on the "spikiness/variance" of the movement itself.

Have a great weekend!

I think it is better to think of the VIX as a fear gauge than a measure of volatility. Volatility can exist and the VIX (or VX, which is what I'm trading) can be low. For example, if this trade war were to be resolved, you would see the VIX drop like a stone, but see a ton of positive (bullish) volatility in equities.

Since the VX is tied to options rather than the underlying equity, it is related to options activity. I've oversimplified it, I'm sure, but I think that's the crux of it. Still learning about it as I go along here.

as @shodson mentioned, ATR is a good measure of volatility.


~vmodus

Visit my futures io Trade Journal Reply With Quote
The following 2 users say Thank You to vmodus for this post:
 
  #49 (permalink)
Somewhere, Delawhere, USA
 
Trading Experience: Intermediate
Platform: TradeStation,Sierra Chart
Broker/Data: Tradestation Securities
Favorite Futures: VX, my kids
 
vmodus's Avatar
 
Posts: 257 since Feb 2017
Thanks: 431 given, 416 received

Spot on!

Well, today was a good day. I decided yesterday that I would trade for at least one more day in sim. Today was the first day that sim actually matched my strategy performance report. Everything is spot on, so it is a very nice place to be.

Sim account, closed P/L = $188:
Please register on futures.io to view futures trading content such as post attachment(s), image(s), and screenshot(s).


Strategy Report (what would have been in a perfect world): P/L = $188
Please register on futures.io to view futures trading content such as post attachment(s), image(s), and screenshot(s).


Trade Manager Report, 5 round trip trades, no cancelled or missed trades:
Please register on futures.io to view futures trading content such as post attachment(s), image(s), and screenshot(s).


Today's Results (sim):
  • 5 round trip trades (S, L, S, L, S)
  • +$188 net profit

I believe I have worked out most of the bugs. My end of day exit worked as planned, unlike last week when I was pulling the plug too early.

Final thoughts for today. Here is today's VX chart:
Please register on futures.io to view futures trading content such as post attachment(s), image(s), and screenshot(s).

There are generally 2-3 good moves in this market per day. Unfortunately the best move of the day happened at 4:40. Do I want to trade at that time? Probably not. My partner tried it and didn't sleep well for six months. I would really have to trust the execution of my automated strategy to just let this run overnight. I'm far from that point. Just some things for me to think about.

Tomorrow:
I might trade live, but I think I want one more day of sim.

That's it. Algo should be sweet and simple like this. I didn't do any trading work, other than restart my PC and login. And update this journal.

See you all tomorrow!

~vmodus

Visit my futures io Trade Journal Reply With Quote
The following 3 users say Thank You to vmodus for this post:
 
  #50 (permalink)
Somewhere, Delawhere, USA
 
Trading Experience: Intermediate
Platform: TradeStation,Sierra Chart
Broker/Data: Tradestation Securities
Favorite Futures: VX, my kids
 
vmodus's Avatar
 
Posts: 257 since Feb 2017
Thanks: 431 given, 416 received



shodson View Post
The VIX is skewed because investors in equities are typically long-only, and when fear rises, PUT prices rise faster than the drop in CALL prices, increasing the VIX, and when the market is going up and doing well, fear subsides so PUTs go down in price faster than CALL prices rise, so the VIX drops. This is why the VIX usually rises in down markets and drops in up marketsx.

In short, if people are bullish they generally buy underlying instruments like futures, ETFs, and stocks, instead of CALLs, and use PUTs to insure them.

Also, an underlying can't go lower than zero, but it can theoretically go up to infinity. This absolute-zero floor also makes puts more expensive than calls.

If you want to just measure volatility in terms of actual up/down movement, just use ATR.

Thanks for the insight, @shodson. I did a lot of studying on options about 20 years ago, but never needed to know much until I started working with the VX.

~vmodus

Visit my futures io Trade Journal Reply With Quote
The following 2 users say Thank You to vmodus for this post:

Reply



futures io > > > Attack of the Robots - An Algo Journal

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search



Upcoming Webinars and Events (4:30PM ET unless noted)
 

futures io is celebrating 10-years w/ over $18,000 in prizes!

Right now
 

$250 Amazon Gift Cards with our "Thanks Contest" challenge!

Right now
 

Show us your trading desks and win over $5,000 in prizes w/Jigsaw Trading

September
 

Webinar: The Best Entries and Exits in trading & in life w/Agustin Lebron

Elite only
 

Webinar: NinjaTrader 8 Newest Features Release Sneak Peek

Sep 26
     

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
FX Robots / Automatic Systems Minds Currency Futures 6 July 24th, 2015 11:51 AM
Are robots hurting job growth? stephenszpak News and Current Events 0 January 13th, 2013 11:47 PM
ART CASHIN: Robots May Have Been Responsible For A Rare Synchronization ..... kbit News and Current Events 0 March 7th, 2012 10:47 AM
Robots Begin Removing Oil Well Cap, Oil Flows Freely Quick Summary News and Current Events 0 July 10th, 2010 05:30 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 07:07 PM. (this page content is cached, log in for real-time version)

Copyright © 2019 by futures io, s.a., Av Ricardo J. Alfaro, Century Tower, Panama, +507 833-9432, info@futures.io
All information is for educational use only and is not investment advice.
There is a substantial risk of loss in trading commodity futures, stocks, options and foreign exchange products. Past performance is not indicative of future results.
no new posts