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GruttePier's trading journal to getting profitable
Started:October 11th, 2015 (12:20 PM) by GruttePier Views / Replies:38,232 / 726
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GruttePier's trading journal to getting profitable

Old February 9th, 2016, 05:29 PM   #161 (permalink)
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The market will tell you when you are wrong. The internals will disagree and price action will follow and you will know-

Exactly but my issue is how fast I can recognize that I am wrong, usually late than early so if I am in multiple contracts and I am wrong that's a way bigger hole to fill. Of course, I shouldn't be trading futures if I can't handle stress but what to do I am a human :-). This year my goal is consistency let's see how this goes. BTW, thanks for all the help on main ES thread helping tremendously for me to be profitable trader. My main goal is to be able to hold contracts overnight without any fear.

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Old February 9th, 2016, 05:44 PM   #162 (permalink)
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Exactly but my issue is how fast I can recognize that I am wrong, usually late than early so if I am in multiple contracts and I am wrong that's a way bigger hole to fill. Of course, I shouldn't be trading futures if I can't handle stress but what to do I am a human :-). This year my goal is consistency let's see how this goes. BTW, thanks for all the help on main ES thread helping tremendously for me to be profitable trader. My main goal is to be able to hold contracts overnight without any fear.

When it hurts or has you on the edge of your seat- You are wrong! And, if a 3-5 point loss hurts, you should be trading SPY or one of its leveraged equivalents. If you have to bail at 3 -5 points to stay in the game, you are playing the wrong game.

That said- I know its tough getting all this stuff figured out- I truly believe 95% of the books out there hurt developing traders more than they help as they cloud the mind with principles that sound rational but do not hold merit in the real world of making money.

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Old February 9th, 2016, 05:51 PM   #163 (permalink)
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Found that poem- like how it relates to trading

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Old February 9th, 2016, 06:37 PM   #164 (permalink)
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@choke35, @Inletcap, @bmtrading, @Tap In
Very helpful responses in the last few posts, all true and lots of stuff to think about!

@Inletcap
What I just now realized (nice poem btw) after all the responses, is that you are focussed on maximizing profit first and managing risk second. Because your focus is on profit (and not on risk), all your trading decisions are intended on maximizing the potential profit, and not on reducing risk. This explains why you let profit runs, see pullback as an opportunity to increase size, can resist the psychologal effect of pullbacks, remain in the (losing) trade as long as you believe in your bias, etc. Versus the risk averse, struggling but learning trader (me) who secures profits, gets anxious during pullbacks, has fixed stops of x% of account size and gets scared about reversing internals.
Am I correct in this?

This may all sound very logical and make me look like an idot, but it is something that I just now realize. You have a winning attitude and as such you take different trading decisions.

While doing the previously mentioned excercise, I noticed the many opportunities that I had. All worth 342 points in total. Because I focus on risk first and profitability second, I banked only 7 out of the 342 potential points.
This is again in line with what @choke35 says regarding daily ranges of 45 points and trading within the noise level.

Thanks guys for your feedback, really appreciate it.
Now let me digest it all :-)

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Old February 9th, 2016, 09:03 PM   #165 (permalink)
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GruttePier View Post
@choke35, @Inletcap, @bmtrading, @Tap In
Very helpful responses in the last few posts, all true and lots of stuff to think about!

@Inletcap
What I just now realized (nice poem btw) after all the responses, is that you are focussed on maximizing profit first and managing risk second. Because your focus is on profit (and not on risk), all your trading decisions are intended on maximizing the potential profit, and not on reducing risk. This explains why you let profit runs, see pullback as an opportunity to increase size, can resist the psychologal effect of pullbacks, remain in the (losing) trade as long as you believe in your bias, etc. Versus the risk averse, struggling but learning trader (me) who secures profits, gets anxious during pullbacks, has fixed stops of x% of account size and gets scared about reversing internals.
Am I correct in this?

This may all sound very logical and make me look like an idot, but it is something that I just now realize. You have a winning attitude and as such you take different trading decisions.

While doing the previously mentioned excercise, I noticed the many opportunities that I had. All worth 342 points in total. Because I focus on risk first and profitability second, I banked only 7 out of the 342 potential points.
This is again in line with what @choke35 says regarding daily ranges of 45 points and trading within the noise level.

Thanks guys for your feedback, really appreciate it.
Now let me digest it all :-)

Let's start off by saying that I am not nearly as perfect as your sentences written above but in a general sense what you wrote is what I strive to be. I do not calculate risk on trades except for maybe my initial opening trade of the day- when I feel something has to happen by xx or I'm out and I know how far xx is. I see an opportunity and and I take it to see if it will work. Once in a trade I have the same emotions as everyone else. I wonder if that reversal is the end or why internals are weakening. I wonder if I should just close out when my first target gets hit and it looks like it's over. Then I tell myself about all the times I closed out too soon and wished I had... I rely heavily on my P&F charts to weed out the noise and focus on the prize- I find those help. You will see me post- no more adds- that's when I feel the steam is running out and I feel I have to accept what's left on and keep from loosing it. Before then you are correct- looking for ops to maximize the results and secondarily focusing on not giving everything back.

I guess you are correct in that I view each trade as an opportunity vs a risk. I never really thought about that but I used to see them as a risk and traded accordingly. I feel that is the definition of trading scared money. Big Mike once told me that things would change once I became very consistant for a period of time and he was right. I do not fear a loss as I know I will overcome it swiftly (see today's computer issue loss) and will have forgot about it in the time it takes to get on the next set up. One thing I have been working on lately is trying to amaze myself with what is possible- little things like carrying a larger position longer, taking reload opportunities more often and trying to hold a piece until my ultimate target is reached are examples of trade things but also maintainining context in the face of adversity- Try to "wow" yourself and see what you are truly capable of- if nothing else it's kind of fun but keep your ego in check when you are amazed at your own success

For the record- you don't look like an idiot at all for recognizing this stuff. In fact, you opened my mind to behaviors to focus on going forward and things I am glad I don't do anymore. Your journal is excellent because you are doing every single thing with passion to make a success and documenting the hell out of it all. Keep at it- we all see your work and are all here to help.


Last edited by Inletcap; February 9th, 2016 at 11:45 PM.
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Old February 10th, 2016, 10:32 AM   #166 (permalink)
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Feb 10th prep

Market overview (15.30 CET)
- Asia: Japan down 2.%, China neutral
- Europe 2% up
- Oil neutral
- Gold/silver neutral
- Bonds down

Important price levels
- 1943.25 Upper range since Jan
- 1931.00 Naked VPOC + R2
- 1864.50 Lower range since Jan + yesterday high + R1
- 1840.75 Support/resistance level + VWAP + overnight low
- 1826.00 OR low + LOD
- 1804.25 Long time low

- Overnight made higher high and tested the trading range since January (1864 - 1942)
- Overall sentiment is neutral
- I expect a further test to see if we can get back in January's range, possibly finding RTH support at the 1864 level. Bears will be loose if we break below the 1838 (yesterday low+ Y VAL)

I'm able to trade only 1 hour in the morning session.

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Old February 10th, 2016, 12:55 PM   #167 (permalink)
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Inletcap View Post
Big Mike once told me that things would change once I became very consistant for a period of time and he was right. I do not fear a loss as I know I will overcome it swiftly

Another nugget here...

Sorry to bother you on trading hours, please respond whenever you get a chance

Would you please go back to past in your time machine and explain us how did you become consistent for a period of time? This is the exact phase I am in...been consistent for past five weeks but that fear keeps coming back asking me what if you give up the profits...Also, it would be real help how did you mange and become consistent over the period of time when you have small account let's say 25k account.

Thanks once again...

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Old February 10th, 2016, 03:58 PM   #168 (permalink)
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Feb 10th

Trade 1: -3.25
- Breakthrough of important price level (R1, overnight high, SR level). Was doubting to enter now on this price level or wait for a pullback to this price level
- Internals supporting the move, except TRIN (below 1.20 but making higher low)
- Long 1 contract, risk 4 points, profit target 1872 (only 30 mins left to trade for me)
- Closed when stop seemed to be hit, but did not get hit
- Hindsight: let market prove I'm wrong, don't close it myself. Unneccesary loss + risk based mentality and not a winner's mentality

Trade 2: +4.25
- Re-entry of previous trade
- Need to quit trading now (work), taking profit near initial profit target. Otherwise I would have added at what at this moment looks like a pullback
- Hindsight (coming back at 20.00h): This was indeed a pullback. The profit target that I would have set at 1882 (just below R2) has been missed by a few points

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Old February 10th, 2016, 04:55 PM   #169 (permalink)
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One more

One last trade since kids & dog are sleeping and wife is not at home.

Trade 3: +6.25 points
- Breaking the 1855 price level turned my bias into negative. Nice H&S pattern on point & figure
- Pullback to significant price level (IB low, SR level past couple of days)
- Internals confirming downward direction
- Short 1 contract, risk 4 points, profit target 1845 (weekly LVN, above PP, -1SD)
- Profit target did not get hit by 1 tick, closed manually
- Since RTH is almost over, did not want to add on what seems to be a pullback to ETH open

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Old February 10th, 2016, 05:52 PM   #170 (permalink)
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bmtrading9 View Post
Another nugget here...

Sorry to bother you on trading hours, please respond whenever you get a chance

Would you please go back to past in your time machine and explain us how did you become consistent for a period of time? This is the exact phase I am in...been consistent for past five weeks but that fear keeps coming back asking me what if you give up the profits...Also, it would be real help how did you mange and become consistent over the period of time when you have small account let's say 25k account.

Thanks once again...

See this from another thread- off topic but this was my beginning:


Inletcap View Post
That'll pay your first week or two's tuition. Then you will add 10k which should get you a few months because you will stop out every $50. Do that one more time until you feel really bad about essentially loosing a mediocre car. Take a break- come back with 25k a couple months later- work it down to 10k - stare at the screen in awe, SIM trade until you are " on to something" for 3 days in a row- blow out that 10k and come back with $50k to trade 1-3 contracts once you finally understand what you don't understand. Hope this helps and maybe saves you some money- I skipped the 5k level personally.

Before the last add I SIM traded religiously and realized that I was taking "system trades" with no context. The "Ahh Ha" moment for me came when I added floor pivots to my charts and started viewing the markets as running to or from those lines (I'm not saying this is right or that I still feel that way). That was my first exposure to context. With this view I began holding trades a little bit longer as I blindly believed they would go to the next line. Keep in mind I was heavily using fibs and harmonic patterns at this time (foolishly in retrospect). By using those patterns I learned to trade where I wanted to place trades (like on fib levels or pattern completion zones) and got rid of waiting for reversals or information confirmation such as bar patterns- I also had a moment where I realized I could pick a turning point but I felt I had to wait for the professionals to go first and stopped that behavior at once. Somewhere in here I began using Mark Fishers ACD system (opening range) modified to my likings and it really helped by getting me on the right side of the market in the morning and adding context throughout the day. At that point in time I was a break even trader. I was always looking at P&F but breakouts are tough to trade.

Watching the spoos thread I saw how Big Mike was scaling in and fading out (he was more active back then intraday)and framing his days context based on yesterdays hi, low, close etc. This was a natural fit with my pivot points for context and things really started coming together as I abandoned patterns and fibs and begun to look at just Support and resistance from price and synthetics (i.e. floor pivots, volume profile, daily hi/ low, onl, onh, etc) for fading areas to build a position. I added VWAP and the SD bands for further context after a while and have the system I use today with all this stuff combined. Weekly pivots I have used in my position trading (professional practice) for a long time and I have been using them more and more the past year or so for ES trading at the higher timeframe or large target levels. I've missed a 1000 things here but its a decent summary of my journey and the important stuff.

Support & Resistance + Market Context + Execution + Patience + Objectivity are the keys to this game. The last two you have to fake it until you become it- first 3 can be taught IMO. I work on all of them everyday.

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