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Get In, Get up and Leave - trading style
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Get In, Get up and Leave - trading style

  #91 (permalink)
Elite Member
Vancouver Canada
 
Futures Experience: Beginner
Platform: Investor RT & Ninja
Broker/Data: IB & IQ DTN
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Revelation (Possibly)

Stopped out at 2029. Not a huge surprise as my entry location was terrible as mentioned in the previous post. That means my stop was in the obvious location and I became an easy prey.

Then I realised something which could be A GAME CHANGER.

First of all, I feel comfortable with stops and taking hits/losses. It's cost of doing business. However, I realised that I have been thinking SAFETY first. e.g Where can I hide with my stops. I wanted to make it harder for the market Noise or Locals to hunt my stop. Not a bad approach.

What if I could step up?

What if I can think like OTF? Instead of thinking like a 1-2 lot trader, I can imagine me dealing with 10,000 contracts to sniff out and whack those stops?

What if I begin to think like a PREDATOR, rather than a prey?

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  #92 (permalink)
Site Administrator
Manta, Ecuador
 
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What happened at 2029 that invalidated your trade premise?

Mike

Due to time constraints, please do not PM me if your question can be resolved or answered on the forum.

Need help?
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  #93 (permalink)
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Big Mike View Post
What happened at 2029 that invalidated your trade premise?Mike

My premise was yesterday's high will hold and Sellers will push it down to 2010 and take the stops from last 2 days balance. Hence I placed my stop above 2028.

I realised, soon after entry, that the stop location was bad and I should have waited for vWAP test and entry at 2025 would have given me a good safety margin. My stops are currently fixed at 8 points and hence 2025 would have placed my stops at 2033 (above from noise or stop hunting). I am doing weekend analysis and fine tuning my stops/targets but this is still early stage.

I could have re-entered short above 2030 as my expected scenario of 2010 can still take place but I set my rules as ONE trade only if my stops are hit. I am allowed to re-enter with a second trade if my 1st trade hit all targets.

 
  #94 (permalink)
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Change in Personal quote/Avatar

@Big Mike. How do I change the quote below my Avatar? I could n't find that option in my profile.

I want to change mine from 'Dumb Trader' to 'Hunting for Stops'.

I believe I graduated from my 1st year of trading training school and hopefully learn how to reach my targets better.

 
  #95 (permalink)
Site Administrator
Manta, Ecuador
 
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Narcissus View Post
@Big Mike. How do I change the quote below my Avatar? I could n't find that option in my profile.

I want to change mine from 'Dumb Trader' to 'Hunting for Stops'.

I believe I graduated from my 1st year of trading training school and hopefully learn how to reach my targets better.

https://futures.io/profile.php?do=editprofile

Mike

Due to time constraints, please do not PM me if your question can be resolved or answered on the forum.

Need help?
1) Stop changing things. No new indicators, charts, or methods. Be consistent with what is in front of you first.
2) Start a journal and post to it daily with the trades you made to show your strengths and weaknesses.
3) Set goals for yourself to reach daily. Make them about how you trade, not how much money you make.
4) Accept responsibility for your actions. Stop looking elsewhere to explain away poor performance.
5) Where to start as a trader? Watch this webinar and read this thread for hundreds of questions and answers.
6)
Help using the forum? Watch this video to learn general tips on using the site.

If you want
to support our community, become an Elite Member.

The following user says Thank You to Big Mike for this post:
 
  #96 (permalink)
Site Administrator
Manta, Ecuador
 
Futures Experience: Advanced
Platform: My own custom solution
Favorite Futures: E-mini ES S&P 500
 
Big Mike's Avatar
 
Posts: 46,238 since Jun 2009
Thanks: 29,350 given, 83,220 received


Narcissus View Post
My premise was yesterday's high will hold and Sellers will push it down to 2010 and take the stops from last 2 days balance. Hence I placed my stop above 2028.

I realised, soon after entry, that the stop location was bad and I should have waited for vWAP test and entry at 2025 would have given me a good safety margin. My stops are currently fixed at 8 points and hence 2025 would have placed my stops at 2033 (above from noise or stop hunting). I am doing weekend analysis and fine tuning my stops/targets but this is still early stage.

I could have re-entered short above 2030 as my expected scenario of 2010 can still take place but I set my rules as ONE trade only if my stops are hit. I am allowed to re-enter with a second trade if my 1st trade hit all targets.

This is why I don't use hard stops. And re-entering the same trade after a stop just means your stop shouldn't have been there, the trade is still valid. You should be adding to the position in fact if the market gives you that chance and the trade is still valid, assuming you correctly sized the initial trade knowing that the likelihood you've perfectly timed the market is not great, and allowing for scale ins.

Mike

Due to time constraints, please do not PM me if your question can be resolved or answered on the forum.

Need help?
1) Stop changing things. No new indicators, charts, or methods. Be consistent with what is in front of you first.
2) Start a journal and post to it daily with the trades you made to show your strengths and weaknesses.
3) Set goals for yourself to reach daily. Make them about how you trade, not how much money you make.
4) Accept responsibility for your actions. Stop looking elsewhere to explain away poor performance.
5) Where to start as a trader? Watch this webinar and read this thread for hundreds of questions and answers.
6)
Help using the forum? Watch this video to learn general tips on using the site.

If you want
to support our community, become an Elite Member.

The following 3 users say Thank You to Big Mike for this post:
 
  #97 (permalink)
Elite Member
Vancouver Canada
 
Futures Experience: Beginner
Platform: Investor RT & Ninja
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Favorite Futures: ES
 
Posts: 1,106 since Dec 2014
Thanks: 2,132 given, 1,645 received


Big Mike View Post
This is why I don't use hard stops. And re-entering the same trade after a stop just means your stop shouldn't have been there, the trade is still valid. You should be adding to the position in fact if the market gives you that chance and the trade is still valid, assuming you correctly sized the initial trade knowing that the likelihood you've perfectly timed the market is not great, and allowing for scale ins.Mike

I totally agree. Infact, that's been my method for several months now i.e Trading with NO stops.

However, I have identified certain Psychological issues with me which makes it difficult to be objective. For instance, I consider my trade as valid even when the overwhelming evidence is against me. I realised that the underlying problem could be accepting that I am wrong.

Hence, I am having a trial period of 3 months with fixed stops/targets. I will let the market hit my stops, multiple times, and I will get used to the concept of being wrong first. I think that's a pre-requisite for any newbie wanting to be a professional. Fairly similar to Mark Douglas suggestions but that's not the reason why I am doing it.

'I AM GOING TO BE WRONG, LOTS OF TIMES. MAY BE EVEN MORE OFTEN THAT I AM RIGHT'.

My eventual goal is to trade without stops but I need to develop the objectivity and adaptability to Market conditions first. Hence, I am focusing on discipline. I am not worried about the losing trades or the monetary loss. Learning the skills is the key for me.

Right now, my focus is Discipline and Execution. Reading the market behaviour is next.


Last edited by Narcissus; October 20th, 2015 at 09:28 PM.
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  #98 (permalink)
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October 20 summary

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Embarrassing trade today. Not because I was stopped out - That's part of the game.

The reason it's silly because of the stop location.

It's obvious that the amateur stops are going to be 1-2 points above the highs of the last 2 balance days. Where did I put mine? Right there at 2030. Though I realised my poor entry straightaway, I wanted to stick to my 100% rule - NO CHANGE TO STOPS OR TARGETS - NO MATTER WHAT. It will hopefully think twice, thrice.... before I press the Buy/Sell button.

My expectation of 2012 low being taken out didn't play out though. Hence my targets wouldn't have been hit. I guess, I was excited to catch the early downside momentum which turned out to be a trap. However, learnt a valuable lesson about change in mentality about stops placement as detailed below in my other post.

 
  #99 (permalink)
Elite Member
Murrells Inlet SC
 
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Narcissus View Post


Embarrassing trade today. Not because I was stopped out - That's part of the game.

The reason it's silly because of the stop location.

It's obvious that the amateur stops are going to be 1-2 points above the highs of the last 2 balance days. Where did I put mine? Right there at 2030. Though I realised my poor entry straightaway, I wanted to stick to my 100% rule - NO CHANGE TO STOPS OR TARGETS - NO MATTER WHAT. It will hopefully think twice, thrice.... before I press the Buy/Sell button.

My expectation of 2012 low being taken out didn't play out though. Hence my targets wouldn't have been hit. I guess, I was excited to catch the early downside momentum which turned out to be a trap. However, learnt a valuable lesson about change in mentality about stops placement as detailed below in my other post.

Don't be embarrassed, I got tagged too on the breakout this morning. It was posted for the entire community to see me puke- never embarrassing because we all do it! It's difficult to judge on the right edge of your screen whether it will continue or not. Whenever that happens I always ask myself once I'm flat and objective- was that a climax? Was it confirmed by internals? If the trade is still valid then you just have to renter and grit your teeth ( praying you don't get dinged twice )

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  #100 (permalink)
Elite Member
Vancouver Canada
 
Futures Experience: Beginner
Platform: Investor RT & Ninja
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Posts: 1,106 since Dec 2014
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October 21 update


I am likely to sit out today for 2 reasons.

I made significant changes to my charts - Took Delta off and de-cluttered it. Hence need a day to get familiar with the new looks.

Secondly, I saw this Humongous consolidation around 2030 during European pre-open for almost 3 hrs. Even after US open, the struggle is continuing with Bears edging. Since the subsequent moves are often quick and trendy, I wanted to see more clarity. Fake breakouts are quite common during these epic struggles.


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