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Journal : Trading and training the mind - Giddy Up!!!
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Journal : Trading and training the mind - Giddy Up!!!

  #11 (permalink)
Elite Member
Toronto Ontario/Canada
 
Futures Experience: Beginner
Platform: Interactive Brokers
Favorite Futures: ES
 
Oiler's Avatar
 
Posts: 58 since Sep 2015
Thanks: 246 given, 29 received

Nice push on the basics for a beginner

...It does start to feel like a Vortex of Patterns pulling me in. And you are correct, very compelling stories for each method.

I have read some articles/books/watched webinars over the past few weeks and noticed that those numbers on the open/high/low are key.

I was really getting pulled in by the Fibs and abcd patterns. The initial high of seeing something that looks so easy was appealing. As I dig deeper and veer to the side - I notice that there is a tonne of information on the next thing that you need to know. At that point, it does become overwhelming and the idea of there being 100 different languages with 100 different dialects each starts to set in.

The goal is to get trading. Much like a baby, we need to try and roll around, crawl and then take those first steps.

Thank you for the reply Intelcap

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  #12 (permalink)
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Journal. Out of the Penalty Box

The power of the forum got me going today. I am greatful for the reply from one of the members this morning. Essentially, they could see that I was starting to go down the road of over analysis and pattern studying.

There post gave me the confidence to trade again with some recently acquired basic skills. The key to following the price action and key levels are the basic skills - to be refined - but not horrible at this point.

I was able to put on a couple of Sim trades that amounted to 9.75 points in the ES over 2 trades. Much attributed to a nice pus by the market from 1230-1255pm.

Then I did another long position to ad another 1.75 points.

This lead me to make 7 trades in my live account - after being in the penalty box for almost 3 days. From the 7 trades I ended up breaking even.

Going forward I will work at not trading in the noon-2pm period. I missed the morning today. As I spent most of it studying the patterns.

All sim and live trades today had an improved approach to usage of Stops versus a week ago.
This usage of stops and setting exit strategies is my biggest expense.

Until next week.

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  #13 (permalink)
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Murrells Inlet SC
 
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@Oiler. Wow- you seem to be one of the very few who accept advice and heed the warnings- that's great! It really is possible to travel down the wrong paths initially and then always have remnants of thing you read bog down your trading in the future. Obviously, you have to read what I'm writing but im not selling a book or indicator, just offering a little experience.

One other trait newbies get attached to is scalping. If you made 7 trades ( assuming round turns) then you might be getting out a bit too early. This is likely due to your initial experience loosing consistantly so you want to lock in profits when you can. I was a looser for several years and still struggle with exiting my positions too soon because of it, I always want to bank em because I had so much negative reinforcement. Believe that you can be right and the market will move further than you think it will. You gave up some 10+ points being wrong so try to focus on catching some bigger moves when you are right. It's very mentally challenging but when it takes off in your direction the rewards far out way scalping.

Also, stops will kill your account! I'm not saying don't get out when you are wrong but you've gotta give your ideas a little room to work- never assume the point you identified to take a trade is where the market will turn. If your close enough, you can make money on your exit.

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  #14 (permalink)
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Mental dump

I feel like that is what is needed this week. Out with the old and in with the new longer term strategy.

Scalping is addictive. Each trade is a high and a pat on the back when correct. When they turn into an expense, the question of it being worth the effort pops up.

Now the idea mentioned in the reply from @Inletcap about Believing is big!!! This is the challenge as I look at the charts and my numbers from those daily charts seeing the RTH ranges as very attractive for trading and getting income of 10 points rather than .5 points.

I think sustainability in this business is from listening to experience. Scalping full time and gambling feel very similar.

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  #15 (permalink)
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Sitting watching

Today was a slow day in terms of trading. I did find that not trading SIM makes me very selective. Today was a day where I just wasn't feeling it. The trend was up and I was looking for a big move down. Good learning in that I need to follow the market and realize that in general people want to buy.

At one point I did sell 1975 only to hold it as it hit 1980 and come back to 1977 where I exited, by error, with a limit sell in place, I thought I had canceled it. Selling at 1975 was wishful thinking. Again was very anxious to get in to what I imagined would be a big move down.

I would like to get in a little late and exit a bit early to stay in this business for a long time.

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  #16 (permalink)
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Fib a bit

Nice day on Tuesday. Actually took pointers form George Slezaks trading rules and tried to get in late and out early. Also, focused on the support and res levels while trying to keep the trigger finger in check. Used some fib numbers to get feeling/confirmation on some res levels.

Worked for my first income generating day in over a week. Total 3 round trips for 4.75 points. I did get in early on all of them and also out early on all of them. The patience is still needed.

Was happy with identifying the trend and range from opening hour - helped bring more objectivity and less emotion.

I closed up when I realized that I was up and was at the point where in total I had been sitting infront of the the screen for 5 hours. My goal is to be at 3 hours max in the morning and 1 hour in the afternoon.

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  #17 (permalink)
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Feel is coming into play

A bit more respect for the market and working at letting go of ego has improved trading this week. Much less trading as the scalp idea is being replaced by learning s/r levels.

Past 3 days have had two income generating days.
Es Trading

Tuesday 4.75 ... 2 round turns
Wednesday -.75 pts 2 round turns
Thursday 2.5 pts 2 round turns

net 6.5 on 6 round turns
a few weeks ago I was making 13-20 round turns a day and losing the majority of days. At that time winning trades averages .8 pts but losers averaged more than I would like to admit. Enough to realize something was very wrong.

Targeting improving trade entry, have been in early on majority of trades this week. Seeing a reversal in a 15 min chart and entering at the beginning of the next bar. Only to see true entry could have waited 30-60 minutes.

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  #18 (permalink)
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Oiler View Post
A bit more respect for the market and working at letting go of ego has improved trading this week. Much less trading as the scalp idea is being replaced by learning s/r levels.

Past 3 days have had two income generating days.
Es Trading

Tuesday 4.75 ... 2 round turns
Wednesday -.75 pts 2 round turns
Thursday 2.5 pts 2 round turns

net 6.5 on 6 round turns
a few weeks ago I was making 13-20 round turns a day and losing the majority of days. At that time winning trades averages .8 pts but losers averaged more than I would like to admit. Enough to realize something was very wrong.

Targeting improving trade entry, have been in early on majority of trades this week. Seeing a reversal in a 15 min chart and entering at the beginning of the next bar. Only to see true entry could have waited 30-60 minutes.

If you wait for a bar to close you will always be late and more often then not have to have a wider stop. Just fade your S/R levels - Place your trades where you find value and wait to see if they work out. You are NOT reducing risk by waiting until some arbitrary point in time to enter. this is called information confirmation and will kill you as a day trader. So many books teach what you are doing- think about what I said previously about those books- 90% fail because they all read the same shit! By the way- saw your prior post and something about fibs- dangerous road to travel.

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  #19 (permalink)
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Oiler please do yourself a favor. Re-read Inletcap’s post’s. Sound advice - you were given priceless gem’s!

Ask yourself – Is the market selling rallies OR buying breaks? Then look for a low risk entry at your S/R levels. The learning curve kills most in this biz.

Trading is nothing more than managing “RISK”.

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  #20 (permalink)
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Murrells Inlet SC
 
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Posts: 9,158 since Dec 2012
Thanks: 9,765 given, 25,670 received



trader14 View Post
Oiler please do yourself a favor. Re-read Inletcap’s post’s. Sound advice - you were given priceless gem’s!

Ask yourself – Is the market selling rallies OR buying breaks? Then look for a low risk entry at your S/R levels. The learning curve kills most in this biz.

Trading is nothing more than managing “RISK”.

Good stuff. I'll add some- the phrase low risk killed me because I saw risk as quantifiable when trading "after the turn". By this I mean that I knew where I was going to get stopped and I knew how many points I was going to take so I could say something like this trade has a 2:1 reward to risk ratio so I will take it. Worst thing ever! Gods honest truth- when I enter my initial order I want and expect the market to continue against me all the way up to the point where my trade idea is invalidated ( puking point). I get a bigger position on this way and can scale out once it moves my way to get my cost improved and then determine where I will bail if it goes wrong. When I nail an entry on my initial entry I get really sceptical and have to average up from that point and then scale out what I was just adding- gets quirky sometimes really quick. For risk- I have a general idea of the cost if the market trades decisively against where I thought my idea was invalidated ( beware of climactic moves- action needs to be backed by more action to be real). As for reward- have a general idea of how far I think it will go but as the day progresses that gets altered so no reason to spend too much time scientifically quantifying it.

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