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Novice ES trader system advice


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Novice ES trader system advice

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  #1 (permalink)
Oldenburg, Germany
 
 
Posts: 64 since Aug 2014
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I'm just preparing my journal here.

ZigZagJournal - by arroganzmaschine

I mostly scalp 3-4 ticks. I trade through Sierra Chart with Tickcharts (ES 350, FGBL 55) and the DOM.

My indicators and setup:
- ZigZag to identify the short term trend
- Volume within ZigZag
- Volume Profile on DOM
- HL Bars

My strategy:
- Everytime a new HH or LL has formed, I wait for the retracement and look in the DOM when the buying/selling pressure has gone to enter for trading to a newer HH or LL.
- My target is on the last HH/LL
- My stoploss is one tick behind the HL/LH

-----------------------------------------

I will post all my entries and exits. I will describe them with a few words. Posts are hopefully made everyday.
Will start this journal in the next week with a few first trades. Maybe me and everybody else can learn from this.

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  #3 (permalink)
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Hi,

I trade ES using the DOM too.

How long have you been trading this "strategy" consistently and what are your results? Do you take every single pullback or do you use your judgement?

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  #4 (permalink)
Oldenburg, Germany
 
 
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Hi isla,

this strategy now for about 2 months. At first I only took my eyes watching the DOM working. This was a hard process for me. I'm mostly breakeven right now, because I have some psychological barrier to enter every possible trade live. Most of the time my instinct was right, but thats the point: I leave out many opportunities.

Maybe I can start posting in the next week, what my daily result was and where I entered my positions. Should be helpful, because entering SIM isn't by far not the same as live.

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  #5 (permalink)
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Still not sure from your answer whether you look for a trade on every pullback from HH/LL, or whether you use discretion to judge market conditions/context.

I believe that being break-even after two months is not sufficient to go Live. If you do consider starting a journal here, I think it would be the best thing to do in your situation. It will definitely help you get more clarity about your results and will enable you to decide if it's time to risk your money.

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  #6 (permalink)
Oldenburg, Germany
 
 
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Thank you isla!

Mostly I take every pullback from a new HH/LL to enter a trade. Also when the trend is changing, I trade the new pullback. I will definately start a journal where I trade ~ 2 hrs daily with this method in paper mode. Later, I will go on with trading live, if I got all the advices from the community. It's also possible to record my trading and upload it.

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  #7 (permalink)
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If I were you I wouldn't expect any improvements based on the community's advice. People may ask you questions which may lead you to further thinking and research. But be careful accepting anyone's advice, no matter how "experienced" a member is. You will benefit from the journal by seeing your progress and by being accountable, which will, hopefully, add to your discipline and build confidence in your process.

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  #8 (permalink)
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Thank you, I will!

Can I start the journal within this thread or do I have to open another? I will take care of everything to start the journal in the next days.

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  #9 (permalink)
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I guess you could ask Mike to move this thread to Journals.

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  #10 (permalink)
Oldenburg, Germany
 
 
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Thank you very much! I will start doing work about the journal. How can I contact Mike?

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  #11 (permalink)
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arroganzmaschine View Post
Thank you very much! I will start doing work about the journal. How can I contact Mike?

Just address @Big Mike or any other member like such, and the member will receive a notice that he's been mentioned in your thread.

...And BTW, Welcome to futures.io (formerly BMT) !

"If you don't design your own life plan, chances are you'll fall into someone else's plan. And guess what they have planned for you? Not much." - Jim Rohn
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  #12 (permalink)
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Hi Daytrader999,

good to see some german friends here also participating. I will be preparing my journal in the next days. Hopefully it can be some great information for everyone.

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arroganzmaschine View Post
Hi Daytrader999,

good to see some german friends here also participating. I will be preparing my journal in the next days. Hopefully it can be some great information for everyone.

Yeah, I'm always glad to see some more German speaking traders around here as well.

And as you can see, Mike already moved your thread to the journal section.

"If you don't design your own life plan, chances are you'll fall into someone else's plan. And guess what they have planned for you? Not much." - Jim Rohn
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Daytrader999 View Post
Yeah, I'm always glad to see some more German speaking traders around here as well.

And as you can see, Mike already moved your thread to the journal section.

Thank you for letting Mike know that my thread has to be moved.
Maybe we can get in touch later and start to know each other better.

Have a nice evening!

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  #15 (permalink)
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UPDATE: First post changed and now we can go on trading in the next weeks. Will post entries and exits in the next week. Not able to trade the whole and every day.

Have a nice day!

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arroganzmaschine View Post
UPDATE: First post changed and now we can go on trading in the next weeks. Will post entries and exits in the next week. Not able to trade the whole and every day.

Have a nice day!

1. Get yourself an elite membership.
2. There are many threads and journals on trading the ES with different tyles and systems. Some are very close to what you described.
3. Take the time to do your homework.
4. Read this thread.

Head up and keep your stick on the ice!
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  #17 (permalink)
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Fritzk View Post
1. Get yourself an elite membership.
2. There are many threads and journals on trading the ES with different tyles and systems. Some are very close to what you described.
3. Take the time to do your homework.
4. Read this thread.

Thank you for your reply. I already thought about Elite membership. But first, I want to take the step of starting a journal. Everything else comes later and when I spent enough time studying.

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  #18 (permalink)
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I just traded this method for 4 weeks now on SIM, but I'm still confused.
Also in Backtest it is not profitable for me. I switched over to blank charts for trading price action on tick charts.

Has anyone a good advice how to start scalping the tickcharts with a good, consistent method?

I'll be thankful fo any advice.

EDIT: I'm thinking about trading the DOM with blank tick charts. I studied order flow for about two months, but I have problems on false breakouts. How can I avoid such failures?

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  #19 (permalink)
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If you want to scalp tick charts i think you will need to use a time frame lower than 2000 ticks. The key to making scalp trades is that you have 2 primary charts. For example, one chart you look at and, if the most recent bar is going up you say the trend is up, and only take trades in that direction. I was having luck scalping the tf using a 144 tick chart and a 2000 tick chart. The problem with scalping is that it depends on momentum. I'm not sure the secret to discovering momentum ignition but, I'm having some luck using the Gomi tools available to elite members. When my 2000 tick is near a support level, i look for signs that the price will find support and squeeze. I guess I need to start a journal to maybe talk about this idea in a broader way. If you change your longer term chart, the bigger the squeeze. scalping depends on these squeezes and you need a way of identifying when and what direction a squeeze will happen. If you just try to get in and out all the time I'm not sure how profitable that will be in the long run. Its super frustrating taking a lot of trades each day with mixed success.

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matthoffman View Post
If you want to scalp tick charts i think you will need to use a time frame lower than 2000 ticks. The key to making scalp trades is that you have 2 primary charts. For example, one chart you look at and, if the most recent bar is going up you say the trend is up, and only take trades in that direction. I was having luck scalping the tf using a 144 tick chart and a 2000 tick chart. The problem with scalping is that it depends on momentum. I'm not sure the secret to discovering momentum ignition but, I'm having some luck using the Gomi tools available to elite members. When my 2000 tick is near a support level, i look for signs that the price will find support and squeeze. I guess I need to start a journal to maybe talk about this idea in a broader way. If you change your longer term chart, the bigger the squeeze. scalping depends on these squeezes and you need a way of identifying when and what direction a squeeze will happen. If you just try to get in and out all the time I'm not sure how profitable that will be in the long run. Its super frustrating taking a lot of trades each day with mixed success.

Yes, it's super frustrating. I'm looking forward to scalp via DOM on Sierra Chart. I used 55 tickcharts (FGBL, TF) and 500 Tickcharts (ES) for scalping with this method. But in which area do I have to scalp with DOM and what are the exact setups I have to look for in the DOM? I'm learning for 2 months now...

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Hi,

For anything DOM related jigsawtrading is the best informational resource in my opinion. I think their videos are here on futures.io (formerly BMT) as well.

But you'll need to add something extra to just watching the order flow. Figure out what method you'll be using for determining the location of interest. Order flow means different things under different circumstances.

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isla View Post
Hi,

For anything DOM related jigsawtrading is the best informational resource in my opinion. I think their videos are here on futures.io (formerly BMT) as well.

But you'll need to add something extra to just watching the order flow. Figure out what method you'll be using for determining the location of interest. Order flow means different things under different circumstances.

Is just watching the DOM and charts not enough?

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  #23 (permalink)
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Well specific setups using the DOM are taught by John Grady, and he teaches the 30 yr note and possibly the ES. His setups are hard to find on the tf and es honestly because the low size used in these contracts doesn't give you much thinking time. I don't know specific setups used on the 55 tick. My understanding is bunched up lines all around a support area. clusters of 55 tick bars show lots of interest in an area. The OHLC bar has been used in all the times I've seen an example. depending on the break (up or down) thats the trade. You increase your odds of success by using the higher time frame chart to show trade direction. Have you tried youtube?

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arroganzmaschine View Post
Is just watching the DOM and charts not enough?

DOM and charts are instruments. You need to developed understanding of what moves the price.

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matthoffman View Post
Well specific setups using the DOM are taught by John Grady, and he teaches the 30 yr note and possibly the ES. His setups are hard to find on the tf and es honestly because the low size used in these contracts doesn't give you much thinking time. I don't know specific setups used on the 55 tick. My understanding is bunched up lines all around a support area. clusters of 55 tick bars show lots of interest in an area. The OHLC bar has been used in all the times I've seen an example. depending on the break (up or down) thats the trade. You increase your odds of success by using the higher time frame chart to show trade direction. Have you tried youtube?

I thought I knew the direction by using short term direction within the tick charts (e.g. 500 ticks for ES). Then I localize support/resistance areas or just trade trend direction with DOM. But I'm struggling sometimes identifying the right direction in entering the trade.

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arroganzmaschine View Post
I thought I knew the direction by using short term direction within the tick charts (e.g. 500 ticks for ES). Than I localize support/resistance areas or just trade trend direction with DOM. But I'm struggling sometimes identifying the right direction in entering the trade.

I've not used the dom on Sierra charts but, If I were planning a long trade, I would watch the dom as it pulled back. When the volume of trades cuts off, especially if its near a support line, vpoc, low volume node, high volume node. I would enter my long there. I think you confirm this on the 55 tick chart as a double top or bottom. So the bars tap that area and pull back from it.

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matthoffman View Post
I've not used the dom on Sierra charts but, If I were planning a long trade, I would watch the dom as it pulled back. When the volume of trades cuts off, especially if its near a support line, vpoc, low volume node, high volume node. I would enter my long there. I think you confirm this on the 55 tick chart as a double top or bottom. So the bars tap that area and pull back from it.

Especially for ES. Which two tick charts would you recommend? I just used 500 tick until now.

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arroganzmaschine View Post
Especially for ES. Which two tick charts would you recommend? I just used 500 tick until now.

I've seen people use the 440 and 576 and 610. I don't think it matters too much, theres no magical chart number. I would stick with odd numbers since even numbers are going to be popular with most newbies and you may have a slight edge by using a odd number. So if you like the 500 try using a 490 instead. Ideally you get a slight angle in the trend direction ahead of other people using the even number.

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matthoffman View Post
I've seen people use the 440 and 576 and 610. I don't think it matters too much, theres no magical chart number. I would stick with odd numbers since even numbers are going to be popular with most newbies and you may have a slight edge by using a odd number. So if you like the 500 try using a 490 instead. Ideally you get a slight angle in the trend direction ahead of other people using the even number.

When do I leave the long trade? On the last high? Or just hold it until another resistance appears?
Just use on charts or two? (e.g. 490 and 1000 tick?)

In addition to that: How long do I have to wait? And how much do I have to watch the DOM until a clear signal appears? Just short term buying pressure? Or over a timeframe of 1-2 minutes?

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arroganzmaschine View Post
When do I leave the long trade? On the last high? Or just hold it until another resistance appears?
Just use on charts or two? (e.g. 490 and 1000 tick?)

Don't focus too much on chart configurations. Also it's not useful for your development as a trader to ask many questions. Trust me, no answer will be better than the one you'll get after a bit of thinking yourself.

Try to go beyond squiggles and numbers on your screen. Develop a framework for yourself and then use the tools for execution of your OWN ideas.

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isla View Post
Don't focus too much on chart configurations. Also it's not useful for your development as a trader to ask many questions. Trust me, no answer will be better than the one you'll get after a bit of thinking yourself.

Try to go beyond squiggles and numbers on your screen. Develop a framework for yourself and then use the tools for execution of your OWN ideas.

Thank you! I will use this as an advice. But one last question: Does the price always retrace to the last support/resistance zone? If not, when do I enter?

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arroganzmaschine View Post
When do I leave the long trade? On the last high? Or just hold it until another resistance appears?
Just use on charts or two? (e.g. 490 and 1000 tick?)

Getting out isn't an easy answer. I make this mistake a lot and don't always let my winners run. A basic way of getting out would be to use a Keltner chanel (51 period with 3.5) on your 490 tick. When you decided to get in at the support line hopefully the trend takes the 490 above the 51 period line and keeps it above that. When the trend crossed the top of the chanel your in luck and the prices are really going to roll. A pull back to the 51 line isn't a concern but, when the price goes under, and closes below, the price action is signaling that people are exhausted and the trend for the day might be over. you can confirm this with lowering volume if you are using a volume study also. A really large time frame like the 240 or 400 min will show a doji during this event, which is also strong signal the trend is exhausted. Market profile guys would get out if the trend crossed below and its hitting a low volume area.

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matthoffman View Post
Getting out isn't an easy answer. I make this mistake a lot and don't always let my winners run. A basic way of getting out would be to use a Keltner chanel (51 period with 3.5) on your 490 tick. When you decided to get in at the support line hopefully the trend takes the 490 above the 51 period line and keeps it above that. When the trend crossed the top of the chanel your in luck and the prices are really going to roll. A pull back to the 51 line isn't a concern but, when the price goes under, and closes below, the price action is signaling that people are exhausted and the trend for the day might be over. you can confirm this with lowering volume if you are using a volume study also. A really large time frame like the 240 or 400 min will show a doji during this event, which is also strong signal the trend is exhausted. Market profile guys would get out if the trend crossed below and its hitting a low volume area.

I always thought scalpers make 5-10 trades an hour within one market. Or isn't it just so high frequented?

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arroganzmaschine View Post
I always thought scalpers make 5-10 trades an hour within one market. Or isn't it just so high frequented?

Same principle, use the keltner band on a lower time frame, say the 55 or 144 and make more trades. The keltner band is just an atr for you to judge price movement. Don't think of it as an indicator that gives you magic signals. Just use it to judge the price reaction in specific areas.

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matthoffman View Post
Same principle, use the keltner band on a lower time frame, say the 55 or 144 and make more trades. The keltner band is just an atr for you to judge price movement. Don't think of it as an indicator that gives you magic signals. Just use it to judge the price reaction in specific areas.

Thank you! I will share my experiences within this journal in the next weeks. If anybody also has an adivce, I'm very thankful. I will start from the bottom now setting up my DOM environment and trading in SIM again.

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arroganzmaschine View Post
Thank you! I will share my experiences within this journal in the next weeks. If anybody also has an adivce, I'm very thankful. I will start from the bottom now setting up my DOM environment and trading in SIM again.

Good luck!! Make sure you manage your risk and take breaks.

"When new money is created on a grand scale, it must go somewhere and have some major consequences. One of these will be greatly increased volatility and instability in the economy and financial system."
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  #37 (permalink)
Oldenburg, Germany
 
 
Posts: 64 since Aug 2014
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On the first page is an attachemend with my setup within the DOM. Do I have to add information to the DOM? It's default is already great!

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  #38 (permalink)
wichita,ks, united states
 
Experience: Advanced
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Trading: ES,TF,NQ,CL,
 
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arroganzmaschine View Post
Would anybody recommend using the DOM within Sierra Chart for analysing order flow? On the first page is an attachemend with my setup within the DOM. Or isn't it enough information?

That looks good

"When new money is created on a grand scale, it must go somewhere and have some major consequences. One of these will be greatly increased volatility and instability in the economy and financial system."
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  #39 (permalink)
Oldenburg, Germany
 
 
Posts: 64 since Aug 2014
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Thanks. So just using the DOM and Chart to understand what happens. I will try this out.

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  #40 (permalink)
Oldenburg, Germany
 
 
Posts: 64 since Aug 2014
Thanks: 53 given, 11 received

After a long time of absence and learing process, I finally had time to spend the first session trading the ES.

My explanation:

Trade 1: Looked for the double bottom there. Saw less selling pressure and decided to take the long trade. Didn't hold it long enough, but there came selling pressure again.

Trade 2: After the breakout of the bearish trend, I took this trade because of buying pressure and the POC behind it.

Trade 3: Entry by pullback and seeing buying pressure again. Exited too early, because the market moved sideways a bit too long for me. What can I do better there?

Thanks in advance to everyone who replied so far.

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  #41 (permalink)
wichita,ks, united states
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: NinjaTrader
Broker: AMP
Trading: ES,TF,NQ,CL,
 
Posts: 19 since Jan 2014
Thanks: 427 given, 16 received


arroganzmaschine View Post
After a long time of absence and learing process, I finally had time to spend the first session trading the ES.

My explanation:

Trade 1: Looked for the double bottom there. Saw less selling pressure and decided to take the long trade. Didn't hold it long enough, but there came selling pressure again.

Trade 2: After the breakout of the bearish trend, I took this trade because of buying pressure and the POC behind it.

Trade 3: Entry by pullback and seeing buying pressure again. Exited too early, because the market moved sideways a bit too long for me. What can I do better there?

Thanks in advance to everyone who replied so far.

Hey good job today. trading is all about developing a feel for the market and your catching on. the only way to hold a trade longer is to use a higher time frame, say a 4500 tick and judge the larger trend there. Then you can make a better decision regarding the sideways movement and what it means. Ie, is this topping action or consolidation action for another leg up. Good luck!

"When new money is created on a grand scale, it must go somewhere and have some major consequences. One of these will be greatly increased volatility and instability in the economy and financial system."
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  #42 (permalink)
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Nice job journaling @arroganzmaschine.

I want to let you and all your readers know that in October futures.io (formerly BMT) has a Trading Journal contest w/prizes. The contest runs October 1 to October 31, and the three best journals (as decided by futures.io (formerly BMT) members) will receive a 150K combine from TopstepTrader.

The contest thread is here:



That thread will be open for posting starting Wednesday, October 1. As the author of your journal, you need to make a post in that thread linking to your journal, and then ask users to press the "Thanks" button on that post if they want to vote for your journal to win the contest.

Members can vote for as many different journals as they want. Votes are cast in the Contest thread only, and only on the first post made by the author of the journal that contains a link to their journal. This is done so I can easily count the "Thanks Received" by author/journal, and award the three prizes.

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  #43 (permalink)
Oldenburg, Germany
 
 
Posts: 64 since Aug 2014
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Big Mike View Post
Nice job journaling @arroganzmaschine.

I want to let you and all your readers know that in October futures.io (formerly BMT) has a Trading Journal contest w/prizes. The contest runs October 1 to October 31, and the three best journals (as decided by futures.io (formerly BMT) members) will receive a 150K combine from TopstepTrader.

The contest thread is here:



That thread will be open for posting starting Wednesday, October 1. As the author of your journal, you need to make a post in that thread linking to your journal, and then ask users to press the "Thanks" button on that post if they want to vote for your journal to win the contest.

Members can vote for as many different journals as they want. Votes are cast in the Contest thread only, and only on the first post made by the author of the journal that contains a link to their journal. This is done so I can easily count the "Thanks Received" by author/journal, and award the three prizes.

Mike

Thank you Mike! I definately don't know if my journal has a great chance in this contest. But as my journal will grow in the next few weeks, I will decide to take a look there.

Max

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  #44 (permalink)
Oldenburg, Germany
 
 
Posts: 64 since Aug 2014
Thanks: 53 given, 11 received

Quick update before market news:

Trade 1: Selling pressure on last bottom.

Trade 2: Buying pressure on last short term resistance zone.

BEWARE: It's SIM mode and still not live trading.

Trading for today stopped. Time is limited.

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  #45 (permalink)
Oldenburg, Germany
 
 
Posts: 64 since Aug 2014
Thanks: 53 given, 11 received

Quick update:

Trade 1: Downtrend, selling pressure on lower high and less buying there

Trade 2: thought it could be trend change and saw less selling pressure. Bad!

Trade 3: Less buying pressure on last higher high, took stop at +1 after trade went +5 ticks. Bad situation for me. Better was that I moved it not so fast to BE. But lessons learned!

Have a nice weekend.

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  #46 (permalink)
Oldenburg, Germany
 
 
Posts: 64 since Aug 2014
Thanks: 53 given, 11 received

After a long period of time, I will be back to keep the journal up to date. I will post some updates on my trading in the next few days and start to go on posting my trades. Hope everybody is doing well.

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