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Another TST Combine


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Another TST Combine

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  #1 (permalink)
wa/ usa
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: schwab, metatrader, OEC,T4,TDameritrade
Trading: CL ES 6C 6E
 
Posts: 262 since Oct 2012
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Hi

Debated with myself a lot whether I should start a journal or not since there are quite a few combine journals here. But one of the biggest +'s is that you guys will hold me accountable and I can't hide. Frankly thats been my biggest hurdle in trading-make a mistake and try to justify or promise not to repeat it and then 3 months or 6 months down the line it happens again. I will also post some inspirational quotes that have had a big impact on my trading over the years.

I consider myself an average to above average trader. I am a big proponent of technical analysis (I use only moving avg,s candlesticks and volume profiling)and price action. I am learning as we go along.

Today was first day of combine. Did not start well. I personally dont like the T4 platform-one of the biggest problems with trading CL is T4 doesnt let you fix the dom and then scroll it--its locked for some reason. When its moving you cant click prices above or below the 10 tics its showing and darn thing moves so much slippage is crazy. On top of that I practised it a couple of days to get familiar with it and then like a noob added the trading window(the one for one click on side) and price hit my level and I kept clicking the price ladded and nothing happened (turns out you cant click the price ladded when that window is active). Started off with 2 mistakes and the pressure was on. No excuse for the mistakes--I thought I knew the limitations of their trading platform.

I wanted to build a cushion and never even go near the $1k daily limit they set-try to always stay on positive side. Not the start I wanted but my plan saved me as I started trading only 1 lot at the beginning. Once I got in flow of things it was pretty easy. I tried to shake off things from morning and was up about $150 in morning (from down 110). I dont have a daily goal $$ only trading well and not paying attention to $$. I thought of quitting at the moment while I was ahead but I decided to just take setups. A few more came up and except for morning 2 losers (another was a scratch for -1 tic, couldve closed for winner but more on this later) I had a winning streak of 8 or 9 before I quit for the day. Need to get to $3500. Up 580 for day.

My take from first day

Some parameters like the 1 tic loser that I could have closed as a 1 tic winner are just plain wrong. I knew the trade was going to fall apart ( and it did CL dropped 30 tics) , so all it does is promote someone to hold onto a loser and make a bigger loser. But I guess they dont have a better option for this. I kept on thinking about this one for a long time today LOL

No need to put undue pressure on yourself-you are only going to make mistakes. Its kinda like getting in drivers seat after vacation for 4 weeks on beach and you havent driven in meantime. Once you get behind the wheel and let intuitions take over its smooth sailing. More you think and second guess worse it becomes.

No need to put pressure with a fixed daily $ limit. CL didnt make any good more early on(the time generally when it does-even after the #) Being patient pays off.

Start small, get a feel, build a cushion and never ever go near the $1000 DLL. Its easy to hit in CL and GC. Trading max 5 lot you only need to have 2 losers with 10 tics to hit it. I am going to stick to 2-3 lots. If I have a cushion I ll go for it.

The profit target is fair imho. If you trade well you should acheive it without a problem.

Its only day 1, hope I can keep a straight head next week. A journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step

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  #3 (permalink)
Oklahoma City OK/USA
 
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Hey thanks for the journal/post. I am prepping to do the same thing here soon. Problem is I've never used T4. Surely there has to be a way to freeze the DOM?? Can you zoom it out or make it longer? Any T4 experts or CL traders that use T4 please speak up!

Thanks

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  #4 (permalink)
wa/ usa
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: schwab, metatrader, OEC,T4,TDameritrade
Trading: CL ES 6C 6E
 
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Here is the dom



Second one is centered-see how the arrows are greyed out and you cant scroll.


Either you have the dom going crazy and you have to keep recentering it-you can use auto recenter-then the two up and down arrows go grey and you cant scroll the dom up or down and click a price. Weird thing is you can click the price when it allows you to scroll but then it keeps going back to the price, so you got to be really fast. I am using OCO orders to just go around this-thank god its a SIM only. Imagine a rip in your direction and all you can do is just cancel your order rather than just putting it 10-15 tics higher each time like you can do in OEC. I ve tried to find an answer to this-cant find it in their videos. Might try their room chat on monday.


You can sign up for 2 week trial for free at topsteptrader to get practise.

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  #5 (permalink)
Oklahoma City OK/USA
 
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Wow, that just doesn't make sense. Pls let me know what you find out. I only enter using limit orders so being able to click on my entry price is a big deal. I wouldn't be able to deal with it flipping around past my entry price.

Thanks!

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  #6 (permalink)
phl pa. usa
 
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there is so much to learn about the ladder it boggles my mind -I will have to see if I can figure out how you did that setup thanks

:when you cheat -you only cheat yourself
refer to post # 470 & 527 & 930
option traders refer to post 996 thru 1005
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  #7 (permalink)
wa/ usa
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: schwab, metatrader, OEC,T4,TDameritrade
Trading: CL ES 6C 6E
 
Posts: 262 since Oct 2012
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You can check more on their webinar. I am fine if they don't have strategy orders like OEC but this basic scrolling part I don't get. Its fine for slow moving instruments like es etc but with CL I keep my mouse on the big X at all times. X and hit market that's all I was doing. Ridiculous hold times lol.

One thing I found out was the button you left click for centering price ladder if you right click it you can enter the price to go to on the Dom. Slooooow if u ask me. Shooting a musket

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  #8 (permalink)
prague, czech republic
 
Experience: Intermediate
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Actually you can fix the DOM, you can't scroll it with the wheel, but you can right click above or below center price and get it scrolled a screen up or down. It should be in autocenter mode. Smooth scrolling is not the one to use for trading. Just for observation. There is a lot of configurations and features there, take a time to learn them.

PS if you use buy/sell buttons they wont engage your OCO orders should you setup one. And TST will fail you if you don't use stops. You can use limits to enter at market with OCO.

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  #9 (permalink)
wa/ usa
 
Experience: Intermediate
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Posts: 262 since Oct 2012
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xelaar View Post
Actually you can fix the DOM, you can't scroll it with the wheel, but you can right click above or below center price and get it scrolled a screen up or down. It should be in autocenter mode. Smooth scrolling is not the one to use for trading. Just for observation. There is a lot of configurations and features there, take a time to learn them.

PS if you use buy/sell buttons they wont engage your OCO orders should you setup one. And TST will fail you if you don't use stops. You can use limits to enter at market with OCO.


Thanks that was very helpful. Can you take a look and tell me if you know what this warning loss limit is ? Cant make any sense of it at all

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  #10 (permalink)
prague, czech republic
 
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garyboy275 View Post
Thanks that was very helpful. Can you take a look and tell me if you know what this warning loss limit is ? Cant make any sense of it at all

I did not make any sense of it, some broker-related features that apparently not used.

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  #11 (permalink)
thabazimbi limpopo/south africa
 
 
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Good day,

The 17 in the little window stands for -$170, you will notice it goes into the red when you hit -$500/50 and you will be busted out if you have 100

Hope that helps,
Ian

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  #12 (permalink)
wa/ usa
 
Experience: Intermediate
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iankotze View Post
Good day,

The 17 in the little window stands for -$170, you will notice it goes into the red when you hit -$500/50 and you will be busted out if you have 100

Hope that helps,
Ian

Thats it-had to take a trade to find out myself LOL. It doesnt take into account commissions though. So got to watch for those yourself

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Legendary Market Wizard
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garyboy275 View Post
Thanks that was very helpful. Can you take a look and tell me if you know what this warning loss limit is ? Cant make any sense of it at all

The number is a percentage, from 0 to 100, telling you how far you are from your daily loss limit. A "17" means that for a $500 daily loss limit, you are currently at -$85, for example.

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  #14 (permalink)
wa/ usa
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: schwab, metatrader, OEC,T4,TDameritrade
Trading: CL ES 6C 6E
 
Posts: 262 since Oct 2012
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Piss poor execution on my part. Not good focus. Took two bad trades first thing in morning -lost one then upped to 2 lots and lost again and then I checked myself into rehab before I destroyed the day and then a small gain and another and then another loss. Only good thing was I didnt let go of myself totally. I generally have this tendency coming off good days like FT71 says you become more risk seeking. Kept the monkey in check. Took a beautiful long at 92.44 with a .10 stop and wouldnt you know it stopped by the low of freaking day. This was the point where I just wanted to give up for the day. Down almost $350 and as you know I didnt want to go over $500 since thats how much I can reasonably hit on a daily basis. I was still doing 1 lots at this time. See my logic behind doing only 1 lots-had I been doing 2 lots much more trouble trading near the DLL.

My take from today has been that every setup I took was a winner except one for a .10 loss right before it took off lost only $70 on this one. My problem today was taking mediocre setups and then getting out for 3-5 tics. I had 4 really good short that reversed into a stopout cause I moved my stop after they went 7 or 8 tics my way. Had I been quick on trigger to lock em in it wouldve been an up day for me.

I posted the link ^^ for the piss poor execution on my part--had I shorted and just held 1 lot i d have made about 20 tics but after all the reversals, I took the same short over and over again for 2-3 tics. Standing back and now looking at this is really painful. As of this writing it looks like a rollover is on the way too. Tough day to trade. From the lows of about $390 I went positive all the way and then negative again so deciding to call it quits here.

Not the way I wanted the day to go. This kind of day is the most useful day for a development as a trader in my opinion when so much can go wrong.

You dont get what you wish for, you get what you work for.





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  #15 (permalink)
Oklahoma City OK/USA
 
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Gary did you figure out how to turn off the DOM scrolling feature?

Thanks!

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  #16 (permalink)
wa/ usa
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: schwab, metatrader, OEC,T4,TDameritrade
Trading: CL ES 6C 6E
 
Posts: 262 since Oct 2012
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xelaar View Post
Actually you can fix the DOM, you can't scroll it with the wheel, but you can right click above or below center price and get it scrolled a screen up or down. It should be in autocenter mode. Smooth scrolling is not the one to use for trading. Just for observation. There is a lot of configurations and features there, take a time to learn them.

PS if you use buy/sell buttons they wont engage your OCO orders should you setup one. And TST will fail you if you don't use stops. You can use limits to enter at market with OCO.



^^^^ You can refer to this. I still use smooth scrolling and it cost me over $400 today just not fast enough to react and their requirement to use stops at all times. Normally in my personal account I would have hit cancel all and then decide what I want to do. More on this later.

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  #17 (permalink)
wa/ usa
 
Experience: Intermediate
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Nothing much to report other than max profit was about $250 at one time and then went negative and then positive again and I closed it for the day.

Just a couple of things on their requirements. I was in a trade with auto OCO orders and trade went in my favor with some momentum. In such a situation in my personal account I cancel all orders. Reevaluate my targets and put the orders back on. Took only about 30 seconds but I was already out of the trade by that time. Potential profit left on table about $1000(doubt I wouldve gotten all of it but at least $200-300 more wouldve been my guess) I have to now think of something to avoid this in future and I had 2 lots on for the trade too. It was the best gainer all day. I missed a couple of good moves after being distracted. Going forward focus is to watch and pay attention. Honestly didnt expect it to be this wild before tommorows #.

Edit: Couple of things to add-the losers took such a long time to either stop out or for me to close it out(did very well on closing all 3-all wouldve been stopped out) that the avg losing trade time was 7 mins and winners were fast (like above) that avg time was about 4mins. This is one of their requirements in scouting criteria given below. So far only thing in my favor is the win %. Makes me almost think that its not worthwhile to take 2-3 tic winners and rather have them as 1-2 tic losers. Although in your real account these 2-3 tic winners up real fast. But I guess they dont want you to have small winners and big losers. I wish there was a way to filter out all 1-3 tic trades.

Overall Average Win greater than Overall Average Loss
Overall Average Win Duration greater than Overall Average Loss Duration
Total Win percentage of 45 or greater

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  #18 (permalink)
wa/ usa
 
Experience: Intermediate
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Bad day today. Traded morning like a pro and afternoon like a Joe. From up $220 I wanted to ramp up and started taking 2 lots and got hit on every trade and after 3 losses stopped trading. Unfortunately one of the trades was to "fix" the stats and on one I couldnt revise fast enough to scaleout-went from +200 to -200 on that trade. Had I been able to scale out might have felt different. On another moved stopped and got high ticked stop out(moving stops doesnt help does it ?) I need to have more discipline and be aggressive on setups. Really no excuse all my fault. Shouldve been more patient and disciplined

Will post the screen shot later.

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  #19 (permalink)
prague, czech republic
 
Experience: Intermediate
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Maybe you should have put a detailed plan here, and adhere to it? Specifying precisely what setups you take, how much loss before bailing, etc.

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  #20 (permalink)
wa/ usa
 
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xelaar View Post
Maybe you should have put a detailed plan here, and adhere to it? Specifying precisely what setups you take, how much loss before bailing, etc.

I trade off candlesticks, Volume profile and price levels. Hard to point to one setup. Stop is "generally" 10 tics and profit target is 20 tics. However I sometimes deviate from the plan esp with profit targets-when it doesnt do what I expect it to do. Then I bail for 3-4-5 tics. I like hard moves or at least where it moves away from my entry and stay away. Going forward I ve decided once it moves in my favor close to 10 tics(could be 8 or 9) i am going to move stop to breakeven. THis is how I trade my real account and how I would trade a live account if I get there. I am going to ignore the stats for now.

To me I would have better respect for myself as a trader if I traded like I should and like I know I am capable of , rather than some stats like holding time for winners etc. Some stats are useful such as avg winner vs avg loser but in my case and I am sure in case of many others like I ve addressed earlier, when its not working I d rather take the 3-4 tics profit and look for next trade rather than wait for it to stop me out. So when you have 3-4 winners that are small and one full stop out and a winner that goes the your way, the Avg loser is bigger than avg winner. Kinda pointless unless you can filter out the small wins from losses.

But today's fauz pas was all on me. It wasnt about stats or anything. I tried to get "smart" with a trade and it became a bigger than avg loss -30 tics. I have to be disciplined about these.

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  #21 (permalink)
wa/ usa
 
Experience: Intermediate
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That pretty much sums my day today other than the small gains I had on other trades. In the morning my avg winner was 7 mins and had only one loser for 1 tic for 5 secs.



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  #22 (permalink)
wa/ usa
 
Experience: Intermediate
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Traded well but I just cant tame T4. Cost me over $480 in losses-had long and short in same account at same time (which is impossible and illegal too-check the rulebook). Only thing I didnt do is take a screen shot.

Down 800 on day. One good trade on rip up for 30 tics and one bad trade for -40 tics(again upped size after winning trade)
And then tried shorting the top-already had 2 short. It wasnt a desperation add -totally thought out , with just a 5 tic stop. I had lot of reason to beleive we were making the top for day and guess what "order rejected". Really have a hard time keeping my head straight about T4. Doesnt it calculate the net order position or look at orders like OEC does ? They want you to use Auto OCO orders but still cant net the position. If you have a 2 lot open position with Auto OCO on either side one side is going to fill when price moves either way to your stop or to your target. So how is your position over the max at anytime ?


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  #23 (permalink)
prague, czech republic
 
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It makes a lot of sense to spend these 2 free weeks of practice testing your system on T4 and getting used to T4 same time.

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  #24 (permalink)
wa/ usa
 
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Yea but how would that help in this situation. You are almost promoting a gambling mentality with TST-something which I have worked very hard to avoid Trading without stops, taking your biggest position right away, etc etc

How can you have a long and short at same time in your account ? LOL seriously I only see the lighter side of it now but should ve taken a screenshot of it. I talked to support but havent heard anything back. Also posted in the TST combine AMA.

As far as system goes its pretty solid. Might not be a rock solid like yours but risk:reward wise its good. Did what I said yesterday moving stop to breakeven and it worked pretty well, not caring for stats. But at least its making $$. Well, tommorow is another day

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  #25 (permalink)
wa/ usa
 
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But what do I know -it doesnt do it in practise account. Practise account works as desired. It lets you take your full 15 lot position. Did it with 2 lot then added 11 so its 13 with Auto OCO, so a total of 26 sitting and still lets you take the remaining 2 lots that you can for your full position


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  #26 (permalink)
prague, czech republic
 
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What I mean is if you tried to trade your system on test account before Combine, you would see any shortcomings and find out means to solve it with support. I have never seen anything like that during over 2 months of trading with T4 every day and I had scale ins and multiple positions at time. It took time to learn all T4 tricks though.

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xelaar View Post
It makes a lot of sense to spend these 2 free weeks of practice testing your system on T4 and getting used to T4 same time.

Or use Sierra Chart. A lot of people seem to not consider this for unknown reasons.

Mike

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  #28 (permalink)
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Just read in your post in TST AMA thread. I had the same problem with position size when OCO is on, usually it allows max-1 position to be put because of these OCO orders. I was able to gradually open up to 14 lots, if I was trying to add to already opened position. Or whole 15 if I used previously put stop orders. Same would be true for limits.

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  #29 (permalink)
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Big Mike View Post
Or use Sierra Chart. A lot of people seem to not consider this for unknown reasons.

Mike

Gotta pay for it. Also its interface is like looking at Windows 3.1 back again when I had a lot of hair on my head.

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Gotta pay for it. Also its interface is like looking at Windows 3.1 back again when I had a lot of hair on my head.

Yes, I don't understand people that think trading doesn't cost money.

As for interface, yes, it looks like Windows 3.1 is exactly right. The UI looks like the stone age out of the box, but if you spend an hour customizing it you'll find probably the best DOM in the industry...

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Yes, I don't understand people that think trading doesn't cost money.

As for interface, yes, it looks like Windows 3.1 is exactly right. The UI looks like the stone age out of the box, but if you spend an hour customizing it you'll find probably the best DOM in the industry...

Mike

I like T4, what else can I say?

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I like T4, what else can I say?

It's all personal preference. Ninja, T4, X_Trader, they all have great DOM's and you should select the one that best fits your trading style.

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xelaar View Post
Just read in your post in TST AMA thread. I had the same problem with position size when OCO is on, .

I dont what you mean by that--S/L OCO by its very nature is a position reducing order no matter which way you slice it. So how can a sitting Stop/target OCO stop you from adding. OCO orders shouldnt stop you from adding to a position.

And if I am wrong it shouldnt allow you to do that in the practise account also.

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I dont what you mean by that--S/L OCO by its very nature is a position reducing order no matter which way you slice it. So how can a sitting Stop/target OCO stop you from adding. OCO orders shouldnt stop you from adding to a position.

And if I am wrong it shouldnt allow you to do that in the practise account also.

Oh I agree with you. Its a bug or something but you cant add to an open position up to max size, always 1 car less than max.
Its same in practice account.

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I dont what you mean by that--S/L OCO by its very nature is a position reducing order no matter which way you slice it. So how can a sitting Stop/target OCO stop you from adding. OCO orders shouldnt stop you from adding to a position.

And if I am wrong it shouldnt allow you to do that in the practise account also.

Ninja behaves in this same way - if you have orders in the market (stop or limit) that exceed your position sizing limits it won't allow you to add more orders into the market. Its pretty common and makes sense from a risk management perspective. Also, its a trap to start blaming your software for having a losing day - its very tempting because its takes some of the responsibility away and lessens the frustration. But it will get you in the long run. The only thing that will make you a better trader is to take responsibility for your losses so you can learn from them. You probably realize this already but its worth mentioning it here.

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This is true because oco potentially can get both sides triggered. Happened to me on mc live. Dont see how allowing 1 less car can help though

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Days like this are really hard where you think you did everything right but still didnt workout. I stopped trading at -800 close enough for me. Also the reason for posting the public journal. Earlier I could always make the excuse that it wasnt my fault but the way I look at it is that its my account and ultimately I am responsible for it. Whether it goes up or down.

I had a good morning. One small gain then one loss but mentally I was good. Yesterdays profile was balanced and today was a gap up. I wanted to go long at open but there was nothing to lean against so I decided against it. Nearest stop would have been around 93.75ish about 40 tics away. I had trigger set for 93.80 but it never went there just gap and go. I was very disciplined and had good read. Never short in early morning coming off a balanced profile unless you find a solid reason(odds are just not good). It kept basing around 94.38ish to 94.50 I waited about 20 minutes to let it digest then got on when the move was ripe. Got in at 94.55 out for +30. Moved the stop to breakeven as soon as I got my 8-9 tics as planned yesterday. Then a small loss and small gains just chopping around. I stayed patient. Did some analysis and figured 95.18 to 95.30ish should provide some resistance. It topped around 95.18 got short2@ 95.09 then tried adding on its second ascent to 95.32(only after confirmation) I had put in a lot of effort into this trade. Tried going short at 95.24 thinking was going to hold it to end of day if it worked out(I had decent profit to hit a homerun). It rejected the order WTF--only had OCO orders open and I couldnt figure it out what was happening. Cancelled all orders (which is kinda risky for CL-you could be risking yr entire combine here on another rip) tried shorting again at 95.29 and missed it by a tic. It wouldve been fine by now--no big deal. Then closed 1 for a 5 tic loss since it wasnt going down. Then tried closing the other one and it wouldnt. I was long and short my own account on same contract. If you didnt know this is not only impossible but illegal too.

I tried a couple of different orders and tried cancelling orders nothing was working. Few seconds later I find out I am long 3 now. So I just flatten out and get the F out of the system. I find it rather comical now but one thing I forgot to do was take a screenshot of being long and short my own account. It's hard to explain without that but at the time I was more thinking of closing the position properly and trading properly rather than fixing someone's errors for them.

Anyways 5 days gone and I am down 1k. I have to really focus and build some wiggle room again.

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Surly View Post
Ninja behaves in this same way - if you have orders in the market (stop or limit) that exceed your position sizing limits it won't allow you to add more orders into the market. Its pretty common and makes sense from a risk management perspective. Also, its a trap to start blaming your software for having a losing day - its very tempting because its takes some of the responsibility away and lessens the frustration. But it will get you in the long run. The only thing that will make you a better trader is to take responsibility for your losses so you can learn from them. You probably realize this already but its worth mentioning it here.

But it allows on their practice account.

I feel the same way. It was my choice to do the combine, my choice to do it on T4 and my choice to enter the trades when I did and its reflecting in my account. No one else has anything o do with it. Thats why I have a public journal. The OCO was a missed chance (no big deal) I miss at least 5-6 trades every day. To me its the process not the end result that matters. If the process is right the end result will always be right, there maybe some hic cups on the way.

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xelaar View Post
This is true because oco potentially can get both sides triggered. Happened to me on mc live. Dont see how allowing 1 less car can help though


I ll take your word for it but unless its really close(or you have a restricting parameter such as limit etc) how can it trigger both I mean the milliseconds it needs to communicate-doesnt OCO mean One Cancels other ?

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Oh I agree with you. Its a bug or something but you cant add to an open position up to max size, always 1 car less than max.
Its same in practice account.


No its not check the practice account screenshot all Auto OCO--shorted 2 , added 11 then added 2 more upto max 15 allowed. I wouldve expected what you said above.

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Done early one good long for +16 and then 3 losses in a row-2 of them bigger than the stoploss. Neg 720 for day. Pretty close to max drawdown now. Not much room to wiggle.

Just a thought that entered my mind and a question to all those if you could chime in. If your normal stop is .10 and now you have only $300 to work with would you rather tighten the stop to .05 and take 6 trades or keep .10 stop and hope one or more trades are winners so you can keep trading. Think about it and post your reason behind it.

I ll start off by saying some trades have tighter stops than normal--like the rip up candles generally dont pullback .10 they just open and one timeframe higher. (of course you dont know that at the time) and most of the trades that work well dont ever go near your stop.

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garyboy275 View Post
Done early one good long for +16 and then 3 losses in a row-2 of them bigger than the stoploss. Neg 720 for day. Pretty close to max drawdown now. Not much room to wiggle.

Just a thought that entered my mind and a question to all those if you could chime in. If your normal stop is .10 and now you have only $300 to work with would you rather tighten the stop to .05 and take 6 trades or keep .10 stop and hope one or more trades are winners so you can keep trading. Think about it and post your reason behind it.

I ll start off by saying some trades have tighter stops than normal--like the rip up candles generally dont pullback .10 they just open and one timeframe higher. (of course you dont know that at the time) and most of the trades that work well dont ever go near your stop.

Having almost no room for error in smaller combines was my main argument going for the large one. Largest ones are the easiest to at least not to sink and rollover. Small ones require masterful risk aversion to stay afloat.

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xelaar View Post
Having almost no room for error in smaller combines was my main argument going for the large one. Largest ones are the easiest to at least not to sink and rollover. Small ones require masterful risk aversion to stay afloat.


I can agree with you there but again it was my choice I cant complain. Even if you fail the DLL or drawdown for day can you still trade for the max days allowed -30 days for me ?
Wish it was more like practice

Just todays results on practice

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garyboy275 View Post
But it allows on their practice account.

The size limits on the practice account are buggy on Ninjatrader. On my live account with a couple different brokers using Ninja I experienced the kind of size/order limitations you've described.

Kudos on taking responsibility - this is something we all struggle with and you're on the right side of the equation. Good luck in this combine.

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I can agree with you there but again it was my choice I cant complain. Even if you fail the DLL or drawdown for day can you still trade for the max days allowed -30 days for me ?

Nope, they will close your combine after the minimum number of trading days have passed. If you have a practice account you're using along with your combine, the only way to keep your combine open is to not get to the minimum number of days in your combine - once you hit it, if you've hit the DLL or max DD, they will close your combine.

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garyboy275 View Post
a question to all those if you could chime in. If your normal stop is .10 and now you have only $300 to work with would you rather tighten the stop to .05 and take 6 trades or keep .10 stop and hope one or more trades are winners so you can keep trading. Think about it and post your reason behind it.

Speaking from experience with my own deficiencies in this regard...
Something about your words above bother me very much. Specifically this:


garyboy275 View Post
or keep .10 stop and hope one or more trades are winners so you can keep trading.

I am guessing that we are assuming a $1000 daily loss limit. If I have lost $700 with a limit of $1000, the last thing I want to do is find a way to keep trading. It is true that sometimes (often even maybe) I have had a bad day early, and then I have clawed my way back to breakeven or even a small gain. The question is, can you do this while maintaining objectivity and reasonable risk? The two problems when you are at 70% of your loss limit are:

1) Traders have a tendency to force trades when they are down, in order to get back to breakeven
2) Traders have a tendency to take larger than acceptable risks in order to get back to breakeven

Even if you are successful in clawing your way back, it will be a harmful experience in the long run unless you can be very objective and stay selective in your approach, and keep risk equal to or smaller than normal. These two things are practically impossible to do when you are down 70% of your limit on the day. It's like being insulted and then getting punched in the face by someone, and then being expected to stand in front of them and have a civilized conversation, listening objectively to them. Which is why most would be advised to take a long break if they dare to continue, or simply stop trading (the hardest thing for a trader with gambling tendencies to do is to walk away from the screen).

If you are changing your stop drastically (which .10 to .05 is, and both of those are honestly quite suicidal for crude) because of your desire to keep trading, this is a big red flag, IMO. Again, only my opinion, but you should never hope that you get a win, particularly if it's so you try to continue to gamble your way (which is exactly what it sounds like) back to profitability. Hope is a 4-letter word in trading, a wise person once told me. The minute that you are hoping or wanting anything to happen, you are already fucked. When you are hoping for a winner so you can then hope for another winner, and thinking about your breakeven point.... you are not seeing a market for what it is, you are seeing it for what you need it to be in order for you to finish the day in the green.

I don't know if this sounds too blunt, but it's the truth. I have been there so many times, with only $100 or $200 to work with before I'm totally fucked, and itching to add because I am hoping with all of my being that the market will just do what I want it to do, so I can get out of this shit that I have gotten myself into. Then we reason, "if I can only get myself out of this, I will never let myself lose more than $X in a day again." This is totally flawed thinking, because you cannot change bad behavior with more of the same bad behavior--two wrongs don't make a right. Maybe not the answer to your question you were looking for, but as an objective observer, it is pretty clear to me to see based on what you wrote.

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  #47 (permalink)
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josh View Post
The question is, can you do this while maintaining objectivity and reasonable risk? The two problems when you are at 70% of your loss limit are:

1) Traders have a tendency to force trades when they are down, in order to get back to breakeven
2) Traders have a tendency to take larger than acceptable risks in order to get back to breakeven


I think I am past the gambling stage. I still had another 250 or so left on the day if I wanted to gamble but since I wasnt trading right I stopped. There was plenty of volatility to take advantage but I stuck to my plan-3 losers and you are out. I traded the practice and it was flawless from the above screenshot it added another $2k on top of that. Over 9k in profits on practice but like I said earlier practice or sim accounts with little or no accountability have little value imho. That's why I started this journal too. I ve been as I am thinking almost every trader has been, very few lucky ones havent been to the above promised land of redemption

Even if you are successful in clawing your way back, it will be a harmful experience in the long run unless you can be very objective and stay selective in your approach, and keep risk equal to or smaller than normal. These two things are practically impossible to do when you are down 70% of your limit on the day.

I would disagree here partly based on "how" you clawback. If you clawback with strategy/risk management then its a confidence builder for future. If you clawback throwing 5 lot first thing next trading day and it sticks, that would definitely come back to hurt you one day. Kinda like "come from behind victory". The teams that can do it, have no problem repeating that however teams that cant do it almost always choke in playoffs.


. Which is why most would be advised to take a long break if they dare to continue, or simply stop trading (the hardest thing for a trader with gambling tendencies to do is to walk away from the screen).


This is again in the rules. My trades overall have a decent time-between-trades period. Every loss I review why it happened and did I do it right. I also have made it a new effort to write things down in my personal journal when it happens. It also breaks the gambler mode. Its very hard to turn your head away from the screen but its a good habit I have built during the last week or so to document my thoughts right away.


If you are changing your stop drastically (which .10 to .05 is, and both of those are honestly quite suicidal for crude) because of your desire to keep trading, this is a big red flag, IMO. Again, only my opinion, but you should never hope that you get a win, particularly if it's so you try to continue to gamble your way (which is exactly what it sounds like) back to profitability. Hope is a 4-letter word in trading, a wise person once told me. The minute that you are hoping or wanting anything to happen, you are already fucked. When you are hoping for a winner so you can then hope for another winner, and thinking about your breakeven point.... you are not seeing a market for what it is, you are seeing it for what you need it to be in order for you to finish the day in the green.

Hope I agree is a bad choice of word. Expectation is what I meant. .10-.05 is a decent stop IMHO at least for my style of trading. I look at trading more as a risk:reward perspective to put expectancy in my favor. But then again, tighter risk also makes you miss the trades such as todays base around 94.45 after the runup. It was a CLVN and I expected it to go higher since it was just chopping around after having rejected the lows. Little did I know what a rip it was going to be. Bigger stop would have probably caught that. Again .10-.05 works for me-got in at 93.80 but had only one lot and out at .96 for +16 today(94.00 was the high before retesting lower-needed 2 lots there). I was honestly thinking if that was going to be LoD which it was but the selling before was brutal.

I don't know if this sounds too blunt, but it's the truth. I have been there so many times, with only $100 or $200 to work with before I'm totally fucked, and itching to add because I am hoping with all of my being that the market will just do what I want it to do, so I can get out of this shit that I have gotten myself into. Then we reason, "if I can only get myself out of this, I will never let myself lose more than $X in a day again." This is totally flawed thinking, because you cannot change bad behavior with more of the same bad behavior--two wrongs don't make a right. Maybe not the answer to your question you were looking for, but as an objective observer, it is pretty clear to me to see based on what you wrote.

I cant argue with that those are really good words. But for me I think I have matured as a trader. Took the 2 losses when I felt I was wrong. Tried another trade didnt work, done for day. Traded practice account which worked but I have no regrets. Only thing I have regret over and I deviated from plan is having losing days bigger than $500. And all my losing days started as winners. So it was larger than $500. If I do another combine I ll have to keep an eye out and consider what Xelaar said about bigger DDL for larger combines. Again, not because I want to keep trading like a gambler but only that it allows for a little bit of more wiggle room to get it right in case things dont work out in beggining unlike these smaller combines where in 2 days you have your back against the wall. The 30k is pretty much out of question for CL traders. You could hit the profit target in one day or the DLL.

Going foward over the weekend I have some thinking to do. Take the .05 or .10 limit. That could really make or break this combine. Here is a chart at least from my perspective where .05 would work and where .10 would work- marked on the chart the green would work with .10 and red would have worked with .05 so I dont think its that farfetched. Just need to do it.


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garyboy275 View Post
Just a thought that entered my mind and a question to all those if you could chime in. If your normal stop is .10 and now you have only $300 to work with would you rather tighten the stop to .05 and take 6 trades or keep .10 stop and hope one or more trades are winners so you can keep trading. Think about it and post your reason behind it.

Where you place your stops and how big they are shouldn't change depending on your P&L for the day. Stop placement should be based on market structure (however you define that). The market doesn't care that you only have $300 left to work with for the day.

If the market structure dictates that the trade setting up requires a larger stop than what your $300 would allow, then skip the trade. Taking a smaller stop (which is different to what you would normally take) just so you can keep trading, is not a good habit to get into. The market will prove to you soon enough that it doesn't care what your P&L for the day is.

Good luck.

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DarkPoolTrading View Post
Where you place your stops and how big they are shouldn't change depending on your P&L for the day. Stop placement should be based on market structure (however you define that). The market doesn't care that you only have $300 left to work with for the day.

If the market structure dictates that the trade setting up requires a larger stop than what your $300 would allow, then skip the trade. Taking a smaller stop (which is different to what you would normally take) just so you can keep trading, is not a good habit to get into. The market will prove to you soon enough that it doesn't care what your P&L for the day is.

Good luck.

That is actually a very good point also a part of my plan for position sizing. I passed on a very good trade(didnt know at the time of course) that I explained above just cause the stop would ve been about 30-40 tics which is too wide for me. Lots of people dont use position sizing in futures (and frankly its hard to do cause you cant split into fractions) but if you look for tight stop trades it can work better overall from risk:reward basis rather than just flat size trading. When a trade works and I ve seen it over and over that the best trades work right away. Like you said above, I have to pass over 3-4 trades everyday just on the stop basis. Who likes putting in all the effort only to be wrong on the stop and watch it go your original way ? Classic example was the yesterdays base around 94.37 was low after morning run up, it was high probability from being rejected lower that it would go higher. People with tight stops got taken out on the 5' bar right before it took off again for another $2--you miss the $2 move trying to save .05. I that case better to pass on the trade (as much regret as you might have for missing $2) than to have a tight stop.

Trading is lot like cooking or any other skill. Not enough salt, too much salt or put the darn salt on the table let people add it(no stops)

Thanks for your insight. Very valuable indeed.

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  #50 (permalink)
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Gary, you might want to read my thread about how to approach the Combine before you continue tomorrow:



Just quickly, it addresses 2 of your concerns, the bug that doesn't let you put on the max. number of contracts and the ability of going below the max. DD.
As an advice to save this Combine, you could sign up for another test account and trade it for 2-3 days to get more familiar with T4 and figuring out how it behaves in certain circumstances. Then you could try to make it back to the rollover stage in the real Combine....

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  #51 (permalink)
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Thanks Pedro I did read it earlier and re-reading it again.

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  #52 (permalink)
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Not a bad day +480 on day survived to fight another day. Just 2 trades for me first trade was with only .03 stop, no MAE at all, , all MFE, the 3 tic stop was 1 for entry and 1 stop and 1 for the slippage. Waited patiently for 45 minutes to let it line up and then hit it. There was again a good trade overnight short from 96.22 but logical stop was over 96.35 and plus it was overnight so I had to pass that, wouldve been a nice one to wake upto. Anyways, trades come dime a dozen. After the 2 Shut it down early and did practice.

Today was the last day of my practice account and it was the perfect day lined up for my trading. Made over 12k on practice, took all setups and all trades with .10 stop. 68% win rate, avg loser -90 avg winner 295, only the time on loser vs winner was not in my favor. Dont know if there is anything I can or want to do about it other than "fix" it.

Back to combine for now.


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  #53 (permalink)
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Nothing major--I was down early on first trade of day made near the lows of the morning. A couple of other small losers and then one winner and then I just scalped my way out of the hole to close positive +50 on day. I was determined to be + on day, may not be a good thing but right now just want to keep building the cushion.

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  #54 (permalink)
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Indisciplined when the crude #'s came out. Only good thing if you can call it a good thing is I stopped after the damage was already done and instead of revenge trading, I took a break after pondering if I wanted to continue or not for today (was down about $500-right at cutoff) I decided to continue and if I went lower than that I d stop. I didnt have much room from Max drawdown either and from down $650 made about $300 or so back with a 90% win rate. It seems I need to tighten up and the moment I have some gains I let go and become risk-seeking.

Made a couple of ok trades in ES but the elephant doesnt really move and I couldnt sit here and watch it. I need to cultivate more patience for my winners. I had 2 really good trades that were just 5-7 tic winners, next time I have to let my good winners run. Thats been a problem not putting on 2 lots.

PL -220 CL +87 ES and commissions of almost 135 on top for a total of -270 today. At least I feel good I came back from jaws of death and the winners boosted the confidence. This is second day in a row that I ve scalped my way back. Time to get ahead now.


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  #55 (permalink)
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Todays trading


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  #56 (permalink)
wa/ usa
 
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The trend continues-start positive, go negative, close positive for day but by much. Nothing much was happening in CL--I was also trading my own account. Net +20 on day. Whatever I made in ES gave it back in CL. Plenty to get chopped in CL in the morning, until later on it went on a stop run, didnt catch any of it although everything was screaming buy.

Got stopped out on many and the winners didnt run. Couple of winners turned back for breakeven trades. Got lucky on a few trades too-sold top ticks 2 times. After 10 days all I have to show is that it didnt blowout but neither is it profitable.

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  #57 (permalink)
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Finally +465 on day on 11 trades 10 winners. No losers.


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  #58 (permalink)
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Time for a review:

Friday I traded really well and I could have put the pedal to the metal but to me it was more a choice of closing +ve with good trading than the $$ figure. Close to $500 was good enough for me. It was actually the positive mental state that I was after. I wanted to clear my head of all the negativity and self doubt however small that had crept in from execution errors and some of it also came from the couple of negative starts for the day and then trying to grind it back towards breakeven. If I had some equity built in there were a few trades that would have definitely benefitted me as in current state I didnt want to risk even 10 ticks on 1 lot. As it happens in these circumstances both were perfect reads. One for 50 tics other one for over 200. The first one came when I had only $250 left on max drawdown. Hard to put 1/2 of it on a trade when you'll be sleeping and cant really watch it. I know TST doesnt allow overnight trading for live accounts so I am ok with missing these trades. I have one set for sunday night, lets see if it trades at a level I am comfortable with to put it on and see if it works. At least now I have the 10 tics stop to afford.

What really matters is the trading during the day. I Think my + or - $$ depends more on my mental state than anything else. Hence the focus on mental gain for Friday. I was up early on friday and completely missed the run up. I am not a chaser rather a sniper. Focus, set, ready, shoot...reload.

As far as the combine goes, I have another max 10 trading days I can use. I have been thinking whether I want to go for the home run-the profit target still $4500 away from here or just get a rollover which is only a $1000 away. The rollover I can pretty much get this week if I want to put my mind to it. If I get the rollover I can reset all my stats and start all over new. Not that the stats are bad or anything as of now-they actually turned around nicely on friday esp the hold time on winners. With a new combine comes the added pressure of starting all over again too. This one you are already in flow.

Things that are clearer to me from my combine so far (you can feel free to add if you want, since the owner has only his side and maynot see it as subjectively as someone standing away and observing)

1. I am a fighter. Even on down days I can shrug off and come back to close even, this has been the case on at least 4 days. Over all in bigger plan this helps out a lot. Closing a -450 days vs 45 profit is huge acheivement. Big + there for me.

2. I tend not to respect boundaries. I set myself a DLL at starting of $500 not the combine 1k but 3 times I exceeded that. Whether its execution errors or something else I need to respect that. I think TST gets kudos for having a DLL. The days I exceeded $500 DLL I came from +200 or so, SO in fact I went down more than $700. A big no-no. Big -ve for me there. Going forward its going to be a rolling $500-start with max $500 DLL, if I am positive 300 then DLL drops to -200 for the day. I am going to post a sticky for this in front of me so I remind myself all day.

3. I have traded only 1 lots mostly. I have traded 2 lots occasionally. Mostly when I feel things are going my way. I dont think there is an edge here. You make profit with 1 lots and give it back with 2 lots. Its happened to me a couple of times already. Part of the reason for trading 1 lots was to build a cushion and part of it was the ease of handling it on T4. If you enter 2 lots then U got to revise etc. Not the easiest thing to do when things get busy. If you put 2 , 1 lot trades you can move it around faster. So I call this a scratch. Something that needs improvement. Days I am feeling good I will start with 2 lots.

4. I am still not comfortable with T4. I have worked tirelessly and placed 100's of trades so far on both practice and combine account. I am using the simplest setup so no more execution errors to blame. Walking a tight rope until I finish the combine. Right now I use Auto OCO with reset on vol and order type. After the order is in the stop and profit target by default are on and I cancel the profit target right away and manage the profit manually and the stop stays. Once I take profit, cancel all orders. This has two benefits--first no standing orders are left, ever. I always have my working orders window visible and this has been my experience from trading stocks too. Always having working orders window open, knowing if something is open or sitting far away from current price. Second cancelling orders is only one button to hit, less chance of anything drastic happening. Just a redundancy measure that I have in place, will help a lot in live trading too. Trading this way will also help if price takes off immediately after I enter. The stop prevents the disaster, yet allows me to capture the upside. It doesnt happen often but at least when it does (1 time so far) I can sit and let price complete the cycle before I take profit instead of a quick hit to profit target and then watch it go another 40-50 ticks. So I think its a +ve that I have found a workaround a platform thats still having issues ( you can find people struggling with T4 issues all day in their room).

5. My stats on combine look ok now but earlier it was really short time for winners and long time for losers. I was letting losers hang out and wait till a setup failed or something. Its just been my personal experience that when you have a good setup and a proper stop, the set up maynot work but it might take some time for market to digest and negate your setup. As an example if you bought the pullback on friday for another continuation move and price just chopped around say .10 above your stop but below your entry, after a certain amount of time you are going to take the trade off no matter if its a loss or a gain. If you are lucky that your entry was below the price you are trying to exit, no matter how small 1-2 tics it will add a huge time factor to your trade and so also with the loser. This is a useless stat imho. I have been able to ignore pretty much all the combine stats so far, since they dont really pertain to my type of trading. I will share the spreadsheet once I am done since I dont have a software to do it and have to do it manually.

6. I havent had a blowout. This is the biggest and huge +++++++++ for me. The biggest mental + thing I can take from the combine if anything. My back was against the wall last weekend with only $250 left to max drawdown. I took some tight trades with only .05 risk and they worked. Slowly built it up. It truly was a mental struggle more than anything. The biggest trade opportunity came sunday night too. It was nailing the bottom, yet I had to pass on it cause I couldnt afford to. This was the biggest challenge and test. I thought about how I would feel if it didnt work out and how I would feel if it worked out. However, I shrugged it off Monday morning after seeing it had worked out and I didnt take it so on to next one. From then on it was two steps forwards one back until Friday and ended friday on high note.

So as of this day as the combine stands, to me its not if I finish postive (which is the goal), complete the combine(the ultimate objective of the whole exercise) or fail (also a possibility) but rather how I do it. If I blow up on DLL, I will hang my head in shame. If I fail and end in negative but I trade well I will still stand proud. The strategy is what has kept me in the game so far even with execution errors. So I know it works. If I fail not trading well and trying to go for the profit targets then also its a pathetic thing. Trading well is the objective in a good mental state. The $$ has always been there when a+b is there.

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  #59 (permalink)
wa/ usa
 
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I can share the overnight trade right now cause i dont think its going to pan out. It was based on Iranian elections and I think Oil is going to fall hard at least down to the 96.28 area and possibly 94.68. My idea was to short around 97.89 to 98.06 area with a .10 stop. Will still do it if I can get these prices but I think its going to open below 97.50ish and have a hard fall overnight. Anyways, just wanted to post it now so no one can claim a literal Monday morning quaterback.

This is one of the most inspirational quotes especially for trading that I have found in my trading career. I have these sayings plastered all over the walls at different places. Some even in the bathroom. You really need em when you are down and seemingly out.

"“You are never given a dream without also being given the power to make it true. You may have to work for it, however.”


― Richard Bach

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  #60 (permalink)
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garyboy275 View Post
This is one of the most inspirational quotes especially for trading that I have found in my trading career. I have these sayings plastered all over the walls at different places. Some even in the bathroom. You really need em when you are down and seemingly out.

"“You are never given a dream without also being given the power to make it true. You may have to work for it, however.”


― Richard Bach

Good one! Sometimes really hard....

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  #61 (permalink)
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One thing that jumps out at me is the average size of your winner's. In oil a 5 tick move is really just noise and so ideally your average winner should be closer to 15 or 20 ticks (or more). You had two days like that. They were also some of your lowest trade volume days. I think a big clue to future success lies is in these facts...

Seek freedom and become captive of your desires. Seek discipline and find your liberty. - Frank Herbert
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  #62 (permalink)
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Surly View Post
One thing that jumps out at me is the average size of your winner's. In oil a 5 tick move is really just noise and so ideally your average winner should be closer to 15 or 20 ticks (or more). You had two days like that. They were also some of your lowest trade volume days. I think a big clue to future success lies is in these facts...

I just trade the edge but you are right. And the keyword there is "ideally". On a lot of trades I book my profit if a trade hasnt moved my way in "X" amount of time. Without going into too much detail, I expect the trade to move my way right after I enter or soon after. I dont nurse winners. There were some good trades in there that I got out on my own for various reasons, some execution errors etc. Only 14 winners over 10 tics and 19 losers over 10 tics(this is what really gets me more than the winners). If you take care of losers the winners take care of themselves. 50% of the trades are within 4 tics. The spreadsheet might have some errors, I am not done yet but I wanted to see where I stand.


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  #63 (permalink)
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Sorry, bogus post on my part, tapatalk posted by mistake.

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  #64 (permalink)
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Had a family emergency last night --and when I came home sat on my computer and traded like a drunken sailor. At the end of it all I could think of what FT said in one of his webinars about trading thru life's major events. For now no more posts as of now I think I have failed the combine at least on my personal level. I posted yesterday that I wouldnt not exceed $500 yet I did and I kept on adding to losers instead of trading a setup.

I didnt want to leave you guys who visit hanging but once I am back I ll do a full analysis and if I will do another combine or not. But for now, no more posts on this thread from my side.

Thanks to those who visited and contributed. Your insight was very valuable. And Bigmike for having such a wonderful site.

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  #65 (permalink)
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Hang in there and best of luck!

Trade to live. Not live to trade.
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  #66 (permalink)
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Doing another Combine is not a bad thing. Learn and progress with each one.

I think I need 2 more posts before I can use futures.io (formerly BMT) for my journal provider.

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BeansTwoNiner View Post
I think I need 2 more posts before I can use futures.io (formerly BMT) for my journal provider.

Actually you don't. You can attach screenshots as soon as post #1. You just can't use external image hosts.

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  #68 (permalink)
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The final stats on how the combine ended are shown below. The 950 negative day was really the one that broke the camel's back. I didnt get stopped out and still had another 1000 in Max DD and another 7-8 days I could trade but I was just not trading well. I traded 2 days after that day and both went well, not cause I was trading well but maybe cause the market went my way. My take from taking the combine so far is

It money spent well--I know people beat them up that its sim but I personally have traded the sim at the same time as the practice combine, In the sim there is no "real world" feel or pressure to it. I made 9-12k back to back days on 150k, so that basically means you could complete the 150k combine in 2 days but is it going to happen ? I doubt it.

On my losing days I need to stop before i do too much damage. Sometimes I make the money back but overall its a losing proposition. I am trading best when I take losses as easily as winners. I need to work on my patience too. For me personally all in all out works best. There is no attachment to the trade and I can see the market objectively, if I have even 1 lot position it skews my view.

You need to know the ins and outs of the platform. It is a buggy platform and has lot of shortcomings and with TST's restrictions such as using Auto OCO's or no fill until price has gone thru your level on exits(whereas FIFO in reallife) etc you need to have a strategy of how you are going to cover the shortcomings of either the firm,platform or other things that are not under your control but you are still responsible for them.

Gaming the combine's stats is a losing proposition in the longer term. Some of their stat requirements are questionable but you can request a custom combine.

Having the journal here is also adding to the pressure so if I do another combine I would pass on having a journal here.


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  #69 (permalink)
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I'm sure others have pointed out to you and Hoag, but your average loser is greater than your average winner. its only a matter of time before you hit your loss limits again.

Have you considered CTD?

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  #70 (permalink)
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BeansTwoNiner View Post
I'm sure others have pointed out to you and Hoag, but your average loser is greater than your average winner. its only a matter of time before you hit your loss limits again.

Have you considered CTD?


Making blanket statements only shows what you "think" you know. I havent posted deeper stats which I do have but havent posted.

With a 62% win ratio and an avg win to loss ratio of 2:3 its still positive expectancy. Thats after all the bad trades, glitches with software, bad orders, not getting filled on FIFO etc. Might not seem much to you but I know where I need to improve and CTD (inspite of their constant push towards it-almost to the point of spamming) I doubt could improve what I need to improve.

BTW are you associated with TST in any paid capacity that you are benefitting from them?

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garyboy275 View Post
Making blanket statements only shows what you "think" you know. I havent posted deeper stats which I do have but havent posted.

With a 62% win ratio and an avg win to loss ratio of 2:3 its still positive expectancy. Thats after all the bad trades, glitches with software, bad orders, not getting filled on FIFO etc. Might not seem much to you but I know where I need to improve and CTD (inspite of their constant push towards it-almost to the point of spamming) I doubt could improve what I need to improve.

BTW are you associated with TST in any paid capacity that you are benefitting from them?


I'm just another recruit just like you.

Hoag's blanket statements were said to me as well. And yes, I only know as much as I know, that's why I ponied up to expand my knowledge as my trade reports speak for them self.

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  #72 (permalink)
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Actually Hoag's comment of average losers greater than average winners were said to me on many occasions when I requested many scout calls.

All the best to you and your journey.

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  #73 (permalink)
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BeansTwoNiner View Post
Actually Hoag's comment of average losers greater than average winners were said to me on many occasions when I requested many scout calls.

All the best to you and your journey.


Actually at some point in near future I will post a detailed analysis of this combine. At this point I neither have enough time nor motivation and that leads to priority of other things to do the detailed analysis. I am sorry if I sounded harsh earlier. Your comments sounded a bit "elite-traderish" I am sure you didnt mean like that but I am under a lot of duress right now so please dont take offense.

As far as the biggest winner vs biggest loser, if your win % is big enough (like for me it is) you can get away with it my only problem is sticking with stop losses. My over +10 tick losses are way more than I d like them to be. My stop is 7 tics but I move it around and I need to stop that. One thing that TST doesnt show in their stats that "should" be there is the MFE vs MAE. To me that is a very key stat. Going forward I am keeping a tab on that.

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garyboy275 View Post
Actually at some point in near future I will post a detailed analysis of this combine. At this point I neither have enough time nor motivation and that leads to priority of other things to do the detailed analysis. I am sorry if I sounded harsh earlier. Your comments sounded a bit "elite-traderish" I am sure you didnt mean like that but I am under a lot of duress right now so please dont take offense.

As far as the biggest winner vs biggest loser, if your win % is big enough (like for me it is) you can get away with it my only problem is sticking with stop losses. My over +10 tick losses are way more than I d like them to be. My stop is 7 tics but I move it around and I need to stop that. One thing that TST doesnt show in their stats that "should" be there is the MFE vs MAE. To me that is a very key stat. Going forward I am keeping a tab on that.

I too suffered from moving stop when I shouldn't, try this, make it your goal for this week to NOT move your stop. That is your goal, not to improve your stats or care about the outcome of the trade.

As not moving a stop or target is a key fundamental to trading. I did that for a week and I got over it. I no longer have the urge to act on moving a stop when the market get close. Think about it for a second, if you are inconsistent with your actions, how can you rely on your stats?

And don't worry, no offence taken, just surprised a fellow TST'er would have that kind of reaction to my comment having put Hoag in the subject, a little respect would have been shown as we're all here to help each other. If you have not requested a Scout Call, Hoag will say exactly what I mentioned. How you overcome it, is up to you as he does not give any advice as to how, only that you need to improve upon that.

So rather then spending your time thinking you are doing the right thing to correct it, its better to just get the right answer from someone who knows what they are talking about. Cause you can easily spend the next 20 weeks trying something new, or trying something else, only to be in the same position you are in right now.

Time is money remember.

Listen, if you ever need to chat, look me up in the CTD Office Hours as that is where I hang out during the day. I'm also in the Financials Pit if you cannot get access into CTD OH.

I just don't want others going down the path I took when there are solutions out there to speed up the learning and developing process. As today, that is all I did, journal my thoughts and assessment of the market and it was a Trading Goal of mine to do that today.

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  #75 (permalink)
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Journal my thoughts and assessment using the concepts I have learned from CTD that is and its an eye opener.

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BeansTwoNiner View Post
Journal my thoughts and assessment using the concepts I have learned from CTD that is and its an eye opener.

@BeansTwoNiner,

Stop mentioning CTD. I have a lot of respect for TopstepTrader and their program, but you sound like a complete shill. You are damaging their reputation by doing this hard sell on Every. Single. Post. about CTD. Enough already!!!!

You are a newbie and we understand, learning and feeling good is exciting, and you are welcome to share your experience here. But I swear every single post mentions CTD and I've had it!

Mike

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@BeansTwoNiner,

Stop mentioning CTD. I have a lot of respect for TopstepTrader and their program, but you sound like a complete shill. You are damaging their reputation by doing this hard sell on Every. Single. Post. about CTD. Enough already!!!!

You are a newbie and we understand, learning and feeling good is exciting, and you are welcome to share your experience here. But I swear every single post mentions CTD and I've had it!

Mike


Sorry dude, just excited about what I have learned.

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Sorry dude, just excited about what I have learned.

Thanks for your understanding.



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I'm excited because Bob has helped me develop to the point now and it turns out, you're right, I'm doing a hard sell and didn't even realize it. I just did not want people going down the path I went of wasting endless amounts of time and money on things I've tried in the past.

For that I truly am sorry.

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  #80 (permalink)
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Great job!

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Just a follow up. The stats shown don't really represent the 'true stats' for example the winners are getting skewed by 1 tick winners which I consider as flat trades. It was a momentum trading strategy based with something else added to it but objective was to trade each and every day. Given CL volatility the strategy worked really great. Wonder if it would work the same once things settle down? Given current conditions even 6 months should be enough to have a good cushion to sit through lean times.

The one losing day happened right after 2 big winning days. Up till then and since Then I traded mostly 1-2 lots and that day it was my first trade of the day and a really great setup and I got stopped to the tick on a 3 lot. I had thought of expanding the stop by a few tick since everything was lined up perfectly but I didn't and it fell 200 ticks from there. Given the volatility I didn't want to expand the stop since I already had the combine in the bag lest some slippage or something weird happened. After that I took a couple more trades but my heart wasn't really into it as I kept looking at what I could have done with the earlier trade. The reason I am sharing this is that I think more can be learnt from that day than the winning days. To me these are the days when u take baby steps toward maturing as traders

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Update:

I was asked to do LTP since 90% winning days and 10k profit vs a 3k profit objective isnt enough for TST. I started LTP yesterday and today I hit the $1500 target for LTP also but you have to trade minimum 10 days so I am just going to finish the 10 days with 8 more days to go.

I kept my stats for combines done in 2013 and I find that now I have matured especially well. I don't know how much TST pays attention to their trading rooms but called the CL bottom as it happened today before the 180 tick rally, my target was only 50 ticks and before that I was riding shorts down. The parameters I still find are very tight for CL trading and one wrong step as happened to me back in 2013 really puts you in a big hole where as if you start right then you have some (not much) room for errors.

Today I was short from 4841 with target being at least the weak lows at 4773 being taken out and 4765 as target and some unauctioned areas below from the overnight lows made earlier in week target 4723. Took it with only 1 lot and it churned around all day and based on stats there was a 70-76% possibility of target being hit but I got out at 4828 and added short again at 4850 down to 4805 area and then some scalps. The key idea was great but my stop was making me nervous and stop was 35 ticks higher. Had the stop been hit with a 230 gain yesterday I d be pretty much back at breakeven. The reason for sharing this trade is to show you what a thin razor's edge you are walking trading a TST combine or LTP.

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Well past the target $1500, 6 more days to go.

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garyboy275 View Post
Well past the target $1500, 6 more days to go.

Great job, again!

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Done with the LTP after 5 days. JH called to let me know they are willing to go ahead. We'll see how it goes from here on.


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garyboy275 View Post
Done with the LTP after 5 days. JH called to let me know they are willing to go ahead. We'll see how it goes from here on.


Congrats!

You are clearly killing it. Keep us updated.

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Congrats

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Congrats

Congrats! Great Trading.

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garyboy275 View Post
Done with the LTP after 5 days. JH called to let me know they are willing to go ahead. We'll see how it goes from here on.


Congrats. Good job!

Bob.

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Congratulations! Well done!!

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  #92 (permalink)
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@garyboy275 Congratulation, it is very inspiring thread.
I went through it post by post. When i read it it feels like it is my journey.

I am currently taking combine too and following exactly the same steps as you are. I am suffering mentally as you described here. I hit my daily stop 3 times, since i started combine. I've been very close to fail it, only 300 dollars away.

After each time i hit that limit, I start my trading day with mentality that I failed and there is not much too loose now. i'm got so upset about it, that my mind become empty and I stating to execute my trades with one lot only. My concentration and execution become so perfect that i can see my account is recovering and have more buffer to play.

It is amazing to see that you actually achieved it and got funded. It leaves me some hope that i can break my bad habits and achieve it too.

Just need to get the monkey off my back

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  #93 (permalink)
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Congratulations garyboy275 !

So what happened since you passed the LTP ?
Did you get funded by Topstep Trading ?
If so, how did the live trading go ?

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