Trading fast markets - futures io
futures io futures trading



Trading fast markets


Discussion in Trading Journals

Updated January 25th 2016 by billbohm
      Top Posters
    1. looks_one xelaar with 561 posts (1,326 thanks)
    2. looks_two Pedro40 with 29 posts (21 thanks)
    3. looks_3 podski with 26 posts (60 thanks)
    4. looks_4 kevinkdog with 22 posts (51 thanks)
      Best Posters
    1. looks_one xelaar with 2.4 thanks per post
    2. looks_two podski with 2.3 thanks per post
    3. looks_3 kevinkdog with 2.3 thanks per post
    4. looks_4 garyboy275 with 2.3 thanks per post
    1. trending_up 141,097 views
    2. thumb_up 1,983 thanks given
    3. group 120 followers
    1. forum 977 replies
    2. attach_file 516 attachments




Welcome to futures io: the largest futures trading community on the planet, with well over 100,000 members
  • Genuine reviews from real traders, not fake reviews from stealth vendors
  • Quality education from leading professional traders
  • We are a friendly, helpful, and positive community
  • We do not tolerate rude behavior, trolling, or vendors advertising in posts
  • We are here to help, just let us know what you need
You'll need to register in order to view the content of the threads and start contributing to our community.  It's free and simple.

-- Big Mike, Site Administrator

(If you already have an account, login at the top of the page)

 
Search this Thread
 

Trading fast markets

(login for full post details)
  #521 (permalink)
prague, czech republic
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NT7, MT4
Broker: LMAX
Trading: DAX, Gold, Euro
 
xelaar's Avatar
 
Posts: 1,517 since Feb 2013
Thanks: 1,740 given, 2,565 received

sorry, @olaag, I don't take apprentices, but you can find a top of information, examples and screenshots in this theme as well as links to free videos I published including one presentation/webinar on order flow.

Trade to live. Not live to trade.
Follow me on Twitter Visit my futures io Trade Journal Reply With Quote

Can you help answer these questions
from other members on futures io?
Convert NinjaTrader NT7 indicator to Tradestation EasyLanguage and RADARSCREEN
Platforms and Indicators
Issue meeting order entry conditions
Elite Automated NinjaTrader Trading
Last 5 minutes Label
ThinkOrSwim
Moving average with Lag reduction
NinjaTrader
Linux?
ThinkOrSwim
 
Best Threads (Most Thanked)
in the last 7 days on futures io
FIO Journal Challenge - June 2020 w/SharkIndicators
67 thanks
Spoo-nalysis ES e-mini futures S&P 500
63 thanks
June Charity Fundraiser - Feeding hungry families (2020)
51 thanks
Fixed vs trailing stops
28 thanks
AMP Futures / AMP Global Review
27 thanks
 
(login for full post details)
  #522 (permalink)
prague, czech republic
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NT7, MT4
Broker: LMAX
Trading: DAX, Gold, Euro
 
xelaar's Avatar
 
Posts: 1,517 since Feb 2013
Thanks: 1,740 given, 2,565 received

Today's trading

Today was an interesting day for a monday, volume was almost in a range of normal and comparing to any weekdays of last 5-6 weeks it's been very good.

I only made two live trades and few more on demo. A day in black on both.






I missed an opportunity of a wonderful vwap trade that would gone well over 100 ticks.

Trade to live. Not live to trade.
Follow me on Twitter Visit my futures io Trade Journal Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #523 (permalink)
prague, czech republic
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NT7, MT4
Broker: LMAX
Trading: DAX, Gold, Euro
 
xelaar's Avatar
 
Posts: 1,517 since Feb 2013
Thanks: 1,740 given, 2,565 received


I have pretty much formalized my updated trading plan with regards to current market conditions and live execution complications. I will post it some time later here. Still the same ideas and principles, but different ways to enter, different approach to stops.

Trade to live. Not live to trade.
Follow me on Twitter Visit my futures io Trade Journal Reply With Quote
The following user says Thank You to xelaar for this post:
 
(login for full post details)
  #524 (permalink)
prague, czech republic
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NT7, MT4
Broker: LMAX
Trading: DAX, Gold, Euro
 
xelaar's Avatar
 
Posts: 1,517 since Feb 2013
Thanks: 1,740 given, 2,565 received

The end?

Well today I am officially not a live trader for TopStep anymore. Yep, been kicked out. It's been a tough period to get started with rather hard conditions to implement during holiday markets. I have been doing ok, was in a plus, but at some point realized my setups weren't working without participation, no stop clusters to hunt. Basically treading water. So I came up with a bit different approach based on the same idea of significance of key levels in gold. It got approved as risk was different from that stated in my approved initial trading plan. Unfortunately it could not come at worst time, as we got some moves last week in gold with relatively weak volume but very directional. Unusual at least. And the worst came as on Thursday Obama dropped a tape bomb about cancelling exercises with Egypt which sent the gold high like a blast. I wasn't doing good that day, but it wouldn't be a catastrophe if I wouldn't decide to short market with a limit order based on previous failure to go higher in the range (sweet idea, would do that again), and using AOCO in T4. Gold just annihilated that resistance level and gapped quite a lot. Needless to say my stop placement by AOCO got rejected by CME and I was left holding a short in rising market with no stop. Sure I did close it but lost 36 ticks as opposed to planned 6.

Even though I did not hit even 25% of my Max Drawdown nor I got any close to DLL, I messed up stats with regards to the rule that your biggest losing day should be lesser than your biggest winning day. This rule is enforced after 10 days. That happened on day 11. I did not realized it counts backwards, I was mistakenly under impression I would have to post larger winning in next 10 days. My mistake. So this is over for now.

A piece of advice for anyone who's passed combine and getting ready to trade live: don't start too shy with stops smaller than normal and taking profits smaller than normal. If you do and then you decided to scale up you will have a risk your increased position or risk will result in a loser that is bigger than winner you previously achieved with taking smaller risk (dollar-wise). If you do so you you are fried after 10 days moratorium unless you post a larger winner within these 10 days. So even though a good trader should not really strategize and pay attention to stats thinking that good trading will sort itself out, that is not necessarily true when you trading with TST, as you need to be always aware about few rules that can bite you hard in the very beginning if you don't build a solid risk approach right from the beginning keeping this rule in mind.

As for now, I don't see much point either do another combine (I have 3 combines left, as a former live trader I am entitled to 2 free 10 day combines and I have another free combine as CTD student), before I get more confident with a different approach to risk and entry style, and that will likely to happen in second half of September.

As in regards to my combine-winning strategy, it certainly works but I grew tired of trading it. I had to start at 2 PM my time (7 AM CST) as junior traders aren't allowed to start earlier, and sit in front of PC for 5-6 hours straight, as my setup dictated close attention and placing order only when starts align. During LTP and later live trading stage I became a prisoner of my house, not leaving it for days, gain weight as I was unable to go out for a run or a ride on bike being glued to screens, and still I usually would have to struggle with what was left as better moves happened around my noon, at least those that were tradeable.

This is certainly a point to consider seriously if I want to do another combine and if I want to trade again live for TST. I will check out with Hoag later too see if that would be possible provided I have a strategy that benefited from earlier setups.

For now I plan to limit my trades to 1-2 per day and use larger stops, trying to capture bigger moves on failures. I won't be trading breakouts per se, as most of them fails and comes back and there is no way of knowing if they will continue in the break out direction of reverse. Trading reverse is more sensible as it is more probable. My idea will be taking a trade with up to 30 ticks risk, reducing it when possible and hold to get at least 50-60 ticks, if market permits - more. That should remove any influence of slippage, spread and any execution issue, which I have seen live quite some.

Another small piece of advice to combiners: if you plan to trade volatile instruments such as gold, gas and perhaps even crude and base your strategy on using small stops (like less than 10 or so) and hitting small targets basing your edge on high hit rate - think again. Slippage and execution issues when trading live will reduce your edge so much you would be glad not to lose money. My strategy did work live but frankly I became very bored as after slippage and smaller summer moves I was getting just few ticks left at most cases to collect, so it felt like a charity work - you sit for many hours straight every day and you win so little. So think again.

Trade to live. Not live to trade.
Follow me on Twitter Visit my futures io Trade Journal Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #525 (permalink)
Belgium
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: Ninjatrader
Broker: Ninjatrader Brokerage, CQG
Trading: FDAX, FDXM ...maybe
 
podski's Avatar
 
Posts: 388 since Sep 2012
Thanks: 493 given, 469 received

Summer trading

Xelaar,

Don't beat yourself up in any way. It has been a real education.

Many different markets have been murderous in the past weeks in just the way you say. Lots of fake outs. You get mugged by your own enthusiasm. Then you miss the big move. I know that the FDAX has been just like that.

Your methods are sound and your risk management good. Market condition detection is very important.

You also raise a crucial issue, at least for me. Trading a market from your afternoon to your nighttime is an extra strain that your brain and family can do without in my opinion. Let me rephrase that. Trading a market from my afternoon to my night is an extra strain that my brain and my family can do without.

Take a break, catch your breath, take a closer look at the DAX ..

p

Visit my futures io Trade Journal Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #526 (permalink)
Lübeck, Germany
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NinjaTrader, MT4
Broker: FXCM, Interactive Brokers, Oanda
Trading: Forex
 
JGSmith's Avatar
 
Posts: 132 since Aug 2013
Thanks: 55 given, 45 received

Interesting Insights

Your last post was a very interesting read. I don't trade the combine, and never plan to, but I found what you had to say to be a fascinating look into your trading mindset.

I am looking forward to seeing what you decide to do in the future. Take some time off and enjoy the freedom of not being connected with a firm for a little while. Allow yourself to enjoy life for a bit before you get back into trading. It will make a huge difference.

Good job for going for it. I celebrate the risk!

Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #527 (permalink)
prague, czech republic
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NT7, MT4
Broker: LMAX
Trading: DAX, Gold, Euro
 
xelaar's Avatar
 
Posts: 1,517 since Feb 2013
Thanks: 1,740 given, 2,565 received


podski View Post
Xelaar,

Don't beat yourself up in any way. It has been a real education.

Many different markets have been murderous in the past weeks in just the way you say. Lots of fake outs. You get mugged by your own enthusiasm. Then you miss the big move. I know that the FDAX has been just like that.

Your methods are sound and your risk management good. Market condition detection is very important.

You also raise a crucial issue, at least for me. Trading a market from your afternoon to your nighttime is an extra strain that your brain and family can do without in my opinion. Let me rephrase that. Trading a market from my afternoon to my night is an extra strain that my brain and my family can do without.

Take a break, catch your breath, take a closer look at the DAX ..

p

Thanks, Paul. I think I should be more disappointed myself than I am, but probably I am just happy this load is finally off my shoulders for now. It had a high toll on my life.

I agree about the critical issue. And I consider it the biggest issue for any European (and even worse Asian) trader to trade with TST. My thinking so far about a possible solution is that I would trade my own account during European session, and since I will be based on slower setups with larger risk and profits, I will be perfectly capable to trade TST account additionally from 2 to 5-6 PM my time, should any good setup arise. If not - pass the day. That should not be very hard at all. T4 is not suited to trade fast markets anyway, neither the fact as live trader you get only the live DOM, not charts, so you have to look at practice account charts and place trades in live DOM not being able to see them graphically on chart. I had to place 2 sets of trades, practice and live to be able to see the picture. It served me pretty bad in my last trading day where practice trade got closed even with 11 ticks slippage, but live trade was still open without stop hanging there as CME rejected my stop. So I got confused for 2 minutes without realizing it is still open. I though my limit was rejected too. So it is complicated to trade rapidly in this configuration, but with strategy that trades less and there is no big rush to place a trade within a second, that would be a possibility.

Trade to live. Not live to trade.
Follow me on Twitter Visit my futures io Trade Journal Reply With Quote
The following 4 users say Thank You to xelaar for this post:
 
(login for full post details)
  #528 (permalink)
prague, czech republic
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NT7, MT4
Broker: LMAX
Trading: DAX, Gold, Euro
 
xelaar's Avatar
 
Posts: 1,517 since Feb 2013
Thanks: 1,740 given, 2,565 received


JGSmith View Post
Your last post was a very interesting read. I don't trade the combine, and never plan to, but I found what you had to say to be a fascinating look into your trading mindset.

I am looking forward to seeing what you decide to do in the future. Take some time off and enjoy the freedom of not being connected with a firm for a little while. Allow yourself to enjoy life for a bit before you get back into trading. It will make a huge difference.

Good job for going for it. I celebrate the risk!

Thank you, I am looking forward to continue journaling here, now even more so, as I will be developing a strategy for my personal trading and possibly to pass a combine again focusing on trading less but for larger gains.

Trade to live. Not live to trade.
Follow me on Twitter Visit my futures io Trade Journal Reply With Quote
The following user says Thank You to xelaar for this post:
 
(login for full post details)
  #529 (permalink)
Australia
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NT7 and Sierra Chart
Broker: Interactive Brokers
Trading: ALL
 
Posts: 61 since Apr 2012
Thanks: 92 given, 15 received


xelaar View Post
Today was an interesting day for a monday, volume was almost in a range of normal and comparing to any weekdays of last 5-6 weeks it's been very good.

I only made two live trades and few more on demo. A day in black on both.






I missed an opportunity of a wonderful vwap trade that would gone well over 100 ticks.

Hi xelaar

Can i ask what charts you are using here? They look nice and clean.

Thanks and good luck in the future.

Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #530 (permalink)
prague, czech republic
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NT7, MT4
Broker: LMAX
Trading: DAX, Gold, Euro
 
xelaar's Avatar
 
Posts: 1,517 since Feb 2013
Thanks: 1,740 given, 2,565 received



Market Sniper 88 View Post
Hi xelaar

Can i ask what charts you are using here? They look nice and clean.

Thanks and good luck in the future.

Hey, MS88
it is CTS T4

Trade to live. Not live to trade.
Follow me on Twitter Visit my futures io Trade Journal Reply With Quote
The following user says Thank You to xelaar for this post:


futures io Trading Community Trading Journals > Trading fast markets


January 25, 2016


Upcoming Webinars and Events
 

Free BloodHound Licenses for everyone!

June
 

Every journal equals ten meals for the hungry

June
     



Copyright © 2020 by futures io, s.a., Av Ricardo J. Alfaro, Century Tower, Panama, +507 833-9432, info@futures.io
All information is for educational use only and is not investment advice.
There is a substantial risk of loss in trading commodity futures, stocks, options and foreign exchange products. Past performance is not indicative of future results.
no new posts