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Like a turtle to his balcony...
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Like a turtle to his balcony...

  #741 (permalink)
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Expecting a NORMAL day.

Got it, but not until after pit close... But CL is possibly a more ETH market.


No, I am changing that. Maybe a Normal Variation? The A base was so wide initially.


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It looked like it would be a "Normal Day" until G period.


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Last edited by GaryD; April 2nd, 2013 at 09:11 PM.
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I would say that at this point in my walk down the market profile path, it has cost me more than it has made me. That in no way is preventing me from moving forward in it, nor has it lessened my interest. I have been down similar paths before. Learning something new always starts this way.

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Merging the last few trading days shows price has returned home to value once again.

I almost shorted the pit close, but it kept going and I have been burned twenty too many times.

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That was about as good of an entry as I could have gotten on the day. I am so quick to abandon them though. Learning to scalp took a lot of work, now learning not to is taking just as much.

And I would have normally tried that long entry at the bottom, but was waiting for price to take out the "poor low". It's like trading requires sloppy perfection.


Last edited by GaryD; April 2nd, 2013 at 09:56 PM.
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But, the concept of "value" on a daily basis, with Vwap, DPOC, etc., has really started to sink in.

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I am so quick to abandon them though. Learning to scalp took a lot of work, now learning not to is taking just as much.

I remember @Big Mike saying in a post or was it a webinar..... don't remember, anyways he was saying something similar; Unlearning scalping took a long time.

Robert

nosce te ipsum

You make your own opportunities in life.
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I remember @Big Mike saying in a post or was it a webinar..... don't remember, anyways he was saying something similar; Unlearning scalping took a long time.

Robert

I would like to be a scalper when I enter a trade, but then something else the very next second.

There are so many psychological layers that formed over time as I learned to scalp. It amazes me day after day how hard it is to stay in a trade after I "feel" it is dead. That feeling was shaped over hundreds of thousands of dollars of experience, but it is not a feeling I still wish to possess.

Work in progress.

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closed 61

.

One of many

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I would like to be a scalper when I enter a trade, but then something else the very next second.

There are so many psychological layers that formed over time as I learned to scalp. It amazes me day after day how hard it is to stay in a trade after I "feel" it is dead. That feeling was shaped over hundreds of thousands of dollars of experience, but it is not a feeling I still wish to possess.

Work in progress.

You need to some how just keep the mentality of having a runner

Trade 2 contracts, have one at a set target of confluence to reduce risk and bank profits

Then just let your runner do its job

Once you have secured the trade and hedged risk

Relax and just let the market work things out for you

Your position will either start working out developing positive information in the trade

Or you get stoppe out and it didn't work

But you managed risk

The only way we can manage risk is with trade location and correct trade management

Once you have got the locations right and you manage risk correctly, you can look to start adding to you poisons as the develop

Most important thing is to try get a runner going and relax

Obviously depending on the market condition determines if it's a destination trade or not

" I will follow my rules, I will take my stops, I will be disciplined and i will work with the market....NOT AGAINST IT! Professional mind control is the key"
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GaryD View Post
I would say that at this point in my walk down the market profile path, it has cost me more than it has made me. That in no way is preventing me from moving forward in it, nor has it lessened my interest. I have been down similar paths before. Learning something new always starts this way.

I think this is a reasonable place to be. I tried profiling, and abandoned it and came back to it probably 3 times (over the course of 2 years or so I think?) before I finally "got it" enough that it was actually, truly helpful. During the foggy times, it was sometimes more of a distraction and I would get pissed because it didn't "work" like it was supposed to. You just started learning this stuff a few weeks ago, and you can't learn this (or trading in general) from a book--we need time for observation first, then to developing some ideas about how it works such that our brain understands it without having to recall anything from what someone else has said on the subject. Maybe you'll wind up not using it in the traditional sense, but as you mentioned a couple of posts up, you have already benefited from a fuller understanding of the notion of value, even if you never look at a profile again. And to me, that's the value of all of this--coming up with ways of seeing things that make sense to you.

Gary, I'm sure you've read most if not all of MoM, but I'll quote it here.


Quoting 
A futures trader who has progressed beyond competency also begins to intuitively feel when conditions are right for a successful trade. Again, this intuitive ability is fostered by more than just a sound fundamental base. Through market experience, you will begin to recognize certain situations where all the concepts and theories come together and you "feel" the trade. Once you have reached this stage of market understanding, the difficult part becomes learning to trust your intuitions—to trust the feeling of opportunity. In other words, a proficient trader must begin to learn and develop self-understanding.

Ok, all well and good, but when I reread this (during the 3rd read?), it was kind of an eye-opener for me:


Quoting 
Market structure is the finished product, and it is always easier to see the finished product than to identify the stages of its assembly. Mastering market structure is largely a matter of successfully recognizing and interpreting the Profile graphic. Understanding the role of time, however, requires a much deeper understanding of the market's auction process. Trading logic is the hardest to learn, particularly from a book or instructor, for logic is the ultimate outcome of trading practice and experience. Trading logic is the raw human instinct of the marketplace.
True trading logic comes only through intensive participation and careful examination of real market situations.
...
but the information is in the market. Successful trading requires the ability to find and interpret the more subtle clues found in time and logic, and integrate them with the developing structure.
...
It takes time to build structure. Thus, while the Profile structure reveals a lot, the sheer fact that time must transpire suggests that fundamental changes occur in the market before they are revealed by structure. Structure acts as the market's translator, and translated information is second-hand information. The market has already
spoken in the form of time and logic. Traders who rely exclusively on structure without integrating time and logic will be late in entering and exiting the market, just as catcher who holds his throw until he sees how fast a man stealing second base can run will never make the out.
...
Summary: Logic creates the impetus, time generates the signal, and structure provides the confirmation.

To me, it's the f***ing holy grail of trading, because it goes to the heart of what it means to accept risk, to enter the realm of the unknown. Structure is only confirmation, AFTER the fact. Yet, so many traders want to use the profile as a signal (not saying you do, just that many do). It's a map, but it provides no signal.

And my point in all of this is that you are already a good trader with intuition and logic, something that many traders do not have. If you can use profiling to complement what you do, you can have a more complete picture, but it should not replace your instincts as a trader, because you have good instincts.

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