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ES entries/targets & risk/rewards
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ES entries/targets & risk/rewards

  #1 (permalink)
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ES entries/targets & risk/rewards

Deleted my original first post bc it was not reflecting what I wanted to learn from my journal.

Reason for this journal is to learn from others and their experiences, so all feedback or comments are always appreciated. I do not read directions I learn from hands on, I watch,observe, and improve my own methods this way, and thru trail and error eventually succeed.I'm at a point in my trading where I need input to evolve further. Listed below are the questions I want to learn answers to thru the help of others. But before commenting please ensure you have the experience to comment, there is a difference is saying and knowing I hope no one takes offense to this.

1) there are many confluences that line up, you that have traded know this. Currently I am trading a method that I feel is the safest, small time frame with targets, reason for targets is you define area to get out, where if you trade discretionary, in my experience I give up some when market goes against me wether its at my target or at my stop without hard set targets, you know you'll give yourself a reason to let it ride for a few more moves.
1a-is one form of tracking the market better than another? because I have yet to see a crystal ball indi. Up is up down is down-comments appreciated on this topic

2)using small time frame now but watch larger time frames so if the market speeds up I can run with it on a more traceable time frame

3)I believe in reading the markets emotion, and IMO this is the key to being successful today and tom. How one does this I am curious to learn your style, yes I have my way which is more chart based technical, and when trading I dont let myself trade off a bigger picture 4 times as large as my main chart because things change a small chart eventually makes up the large one

4)rate of failure being so high one has to wonder will I be able to do this under this type of failure rate into the future, I understand drawdowns, and this is why I am now so focused on R2R, Imo its the key to surviving in this industry. Now this is area I need to work on to follow the age old saying cut your losers short, let your runners run, that is so much easier said than done, hence my target strategy now

Now a little bout me, full time for 3.5 years, traded live most of time. Started with APPL,CAT,DE,and a few others learned about the HFT''s etc moved over to ES, tried a few other futures but my main reason for ES, its a volume monster so for my long term trading I will stay here with the Emini's. I have experienced many platforms flaws and failures which cost me dearly, can't express this enough to a new trader(reliability,performance and service)

In closing I want thank @Big Mike for the platform and welcome any suggestions

Happy Trading to us all
R

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Last edited by Rad4633; September 4th, 2012 at 12:26 PM.
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  #3 (permalink)
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Rad4633 View Post
Ok recent threads have got me thinking about general questions and I would like the masses to chime in your thoughts. This will hopefully answer my questions on alot of stuff that I wonder about because honestly we dont know what the masses are doing or at least I dont

A recent thread by @dario1 on luck in trading, today in my last trade, was this luck ES went in my direction or was it that I knew there would be support on retrace, so were my odds 50/50 or better in my favor? My target was originally higher but I moved it down to NY open just bc I felt I needed too. I think this is how @Jedi has been expressing his way of trading. Im not much of a typer so this is my first post to my first thread. I have many other questions and examples I will add after the prior trading day is done which is RTH and ES only for me.

@Big Mike I searched for a thread like this and couldnt find one so if one exist please point me to it. This thread is to outline IMO all the confluences that I see (which can be confusing) and what different styles see in these areas and express why I would trade here and where my target would be, risk to reward etc. And then it is my hopes others can add to what idk which in the end I can evolve to a higher level than where Im at now, you say "do it a Journal" so here is mine

My question is, did you think this was a good level of support? What were your reasons for your entries? I just get the feeling that you are unsure if your trades were the right thing to do, but you may have seen someone else enter a trade at these entries.

I went long at the same level you did on your first trade, and it was based on a DB from a 60m chart and I waited to see if buyers were going to be responsive here and when I felt that buyers were coming in I got in myself. I waited 3 hours to close my 2nd target and I tightened that.

Back to your trades, I can see entering a long off the first SD after we made a HH which too me is a bullish move and even your 2nd trade we made another HH again another bullish move.

Based on your question and how you asked you really had no idea what you were doing or why you enter where you did. My suggestion is to read https://futures.io/elite-circle/3506-elusive-price-action-how-trade.html and other price action threads and other journals here in the forum. Ask questions in threads if you don't understand something. There is a wealth of knowledge here in the forum, but [B]most[B]importantly you have to do the work yourself. It takes dedication and hard work to make it in this business and if you feel your not cutout for this then don't risk your money. I hope this is helpful and I apologize if it is not.

Ryan

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  #4 (permalink)
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itrade2win View Post
My question is, did you think this was a good level of support? What were your reasons for your entries? I just get the feeling that you are unsure if your trades were the right thing to do, but you may have seen someone else enter a trade at these entries.

I went long at the same level you did on your first trade, and it was based on a DB from a 60m chart and I waited to see if buyers were going to be responsive here and when I felt that buyers were coming in I got in myself. I waited 3 hours to close my 2nd target and I tightened that.

Back to your trades, I can see entering a long off the first SD after we made a HH which too me is a bullish move and even your 2nd trade we made another HH again another bullish move.

Based on your question and how you asked you really had no idea what you were doing or why you enter where you did. My suggestion is to read https://futures.io/elite-circle/3506-elusive-price-action-how-trade.html and other price action threads and other journals here in the forum. Ask questions in threads if you don't understand something. There is a wealth of knowledge here in the forum, but [B]most[B]importantly you have to do the work yourself. It takes dedication and hard work to make it in this business and if you feel your not cutout for this then don't risk your money. I hope this is helpful and I apologize if it is not.

Ryan


Thank you for your reply, I lack in my wording in post at times plus I like to ask things so I might get responses from others this helps me understand a different angle than one I might have seen.

Since @bizman70 and others have been in the chatbox as of late, I often am in trades around the same time as those some before some after(Im not using VPOC or va's as of now and have just added back in IB range just bc I see it used alot now), and I do make wrong calls more than I like(average 68-78%+ Ninja positive trades actually lower number % makes more $ bc of longer hold times. The reason i did the 2nd to last trade was we had just made a HH off yest low,then retrace back to a strong support level it isnt the -1st deviation i just added vwap back w IB's last night and use those for ref(Love my @Fat Tails Indi's, thank you H), it was off of my anapivots and the retrace of 61.8, the reason for my exit was another pivot and we were at a short time frame TL, so get paid and wait,my last entry was to early bc we had just retraced off a pivot and vwap and middle of RTH OR I should have waited till it retraced to a pivot then entered, my target was higher bc wrking on only taking 1riskto3reward trades but had to pull it down bc my gut said to I moved it to a pivot also a 20sma on my bollinger chart which gets hit 90% or more of the time, also it was NY open. i use bollingers on my big time frame which is = to 60 min its a hybrid. As of late Ive gone away from reading price action candles, although it is nice to see prior candle and last candle formed even on one end ensuring a reversal is taking place or see darva's etc But I have moved away from that and watch support/res areas and trade to next targets.

Just in me replyin to you, i have to say thx bc it makes one go over their trade when questioned. I never trade off another sorry @Jedi bro just cant do it,lmao.. Ok this is my first thread so I want everyone to show love and help me out, slam me beat me up this is what Im looking for bc I need it> and were not even going to talk about how much i paid the markets to get to this point. So Im calling all my futures.io (formerly BMT) mentors help me, wasnt planning on doing this but how will ya know I started this unless I do this @ThatManFromTexas @Silvester17 @cory @wldman @vvhg @Privatebanker @Silver Dragon @Gabriyele , one and only @tigertrader @creekboy @Big Mike @Fat Tails @Tiberius @kbit more to come PB beat me to this post he s already posted

My goal is to learn more about getting perfect (better)entries and why the majority hold on to certain targets and learn to trade to them I know the targets just some times I exit early. And last to get better RvsR trade setups so this means what i showed in today chart, being close on my stop to my entries which I am not used to, Is this how close you are to your entries?

@itrade2win curious about your IB indi I noticed you had it on a 750tick chart but I would suppose you still let it calculate off first hour, thats what im doing now in testing, thoughts?

thanks again for your reply


Last edited by Rad4633; August 30th, 2012 at 11:56 PM.
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  #5 (permalink)
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Rad4633 View Post
Ok recent threads have got me thinking about general questions and I would like the masses to chime in your thoughts. This will hopefully answer my questions on alot of stuff that I wonder about because honestly we dont know what the masses are doing or at least I dont

A recent thread by dario1 on luck in trading, today in my last trade, was this luck ES went in my direction or was it that I knew there would be support on retrace, so were my odds 50/50 or better in my favor? My target was originally higher but I moved it down to NY open just bc I felt I needed too. I think this is how Jedi has been expressing his way of trading. Im not much of a typer so this is my first post to my first thread. I have many other questions and examples I will add after the prior trading day is done which is RTH and ES only for me.

@Big Mike I searched for a thread like this and couldnt find one so if one exist please point me to it. This thread is to outline IMO all the confluences that I see (which can be confusing) and what different styles see in these areas and express why I would trade here and where my target would be, risk to reward etc. And then it is my hopes others can add to what idk which in the end I can evolve to a higher level than where Im at now, you say "do it a Journal" so here is mine

The first reference for the day was we opened right at 8/24's VAL which lined up with VWAP this AM. The other reference was 8/24's low. Those were the two most profitable opportunities on the day. You had a good entry from the 1st standard deviation level this afternoon. This was also the DVAL for the day and the IB low. I took your chart and marked areas that are good entries aside from the initial short entry at the open. The goal is to trade at the extremes of the day. I circled in yellow the entries with the cyan circles being good exits. Note how price reacted to the flattened VWAP levels. Excellent rotational trade opportunities.

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  #6 (permalink)
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Private Banker View Post
The first reference for the day was we opened right at 8/24's VAL which lined up with VWAP this AM. The other reference was 8/24's low. Those were the two most profitable opportunities on the day. You had a good entry from the 1st standard deviation level this afternoon. This was also the DVAL for the day and the IB low. I took your chart and marked areas that are good entries aside from the initial short entry at the open. The goal is to trade at the extremes of the day. I circled in yellow the entries with the cyan circles being good exits. Note how price reacted to the flattened VWAP levels. Excellent rotational trade opportunities.

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thank you for taking the time PB, you rock.

yes this is what i was searching for by having this thread, to help me see thru other more experience eyes. I wasnt at pc long today around when i did trades, like I missed pullback after my trade bc i was away.

I will review more tom from your notes

When you can please glance it from from time to time as your opinion is always greatly appreciated

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  #7 (permalink)
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Rad4633 View Post
thank you for taking the time PB, you rock.

yes this is what i was searching for by having this thread, to help me see thru other more experience eyes. I wasnt at pc long today around when i did trades, like I missed pullback after my trade bc i was away.

I will review more tom from your notes

When you can please glance it from from time to time as your opinion is always greatly appreciated

You're welcome! The idea is to not have static targets in a rotational market such as ES. Put them at potential levels of support or resistance in the event the market turns against you. Also, it may be wise to put your target a tick in front of the actual level in the event only a small number of orders get filled at the referenced level. I'll be sure to check back from time to time.

Cheers,
PB

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  #8 (permalink)
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Rad4633 View Post
Thank you for your reply, I lack in my wording in post at times plus I like to ask things so I might get responses from others this helps me understand a different angle than one I might have seen.

Just in me replyin to you, i have to say thx bc it makes one go over their trade when questioned. I never trade off another sorry @Jedi bro just cant do it,lmao.. Ok this is my first thread so I want everyone to show love and help me out, slam me beat me up this is what Im looking for bc I need it> and were not even going to talk about how much i paid the markets to get to this point. So Im calling all my futures.io (formerly BMT) mentors help me, wasnt planning on doing this but how will ya know I started this unless I do this @ThatManFromTexas @Silvester17 @cory @wldman @vvhg @Privatebanker @Silver Dragon @Gabriyele , one and only @tigertrader @creekboy @Big Mike @Fat Tails @Tiberius @kbit more to come PB beat me to this post he s already posted

My goal is to learn more about getting perfect (better)entries and why the majority hold on to certain targets and learn to trade to them I know the targets just some times I exit early. And last to get better RvsR trade setups so this means what i showed in today chart, being close on my stop to my entries which I am not used to, Is this how close you are to your entries?

@itrade2win curious about your IB indi I noticed you had it on a 750tick chart but I would suppose you still let it calculate off first hour, thats what im doing now in testing, thoughts?

thanks again for your reply

I would strongly suggest to stop looking at what others are doing in the chat box. I pay very little attention to what is being said in there. Its more entertaining than anything else. You need to develop your own method of trading. That is the only way to make it. I'm not saying don't take ideas from others methods, but don't try to emulate what they do or enter because they entered a trade.

Yes, my IB is set for the RTH hours, but keep in mind that I use it and any indicator as a filter only. not as a reason to enter a trade because price bounced off of the VWAP or whatever. Market context and PA are the primary reasons to enter a trade and indicators secondly. If its the other way around I can't see it being profitable that way.


Last edited by itrade2win; August 31st, 2012 at 09:14 AM.
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itrade2win View Post
I would strongly suggest to stop looking at what others are doing in the chat box. I pay very little attention to what is being said in there. Its more entertaining than anything else. You need to develop your own method of trading. That is the only way to make it. I'm not saying don't take ideas from others methods, but don't try to emulate what they do or enter because they entered a trade.

Yes, my IB is set for the RTH hours, but keep in mind that I use it and any indicator as a filter only. not as a reason to enter a trade because price bounced off of the VWAP or whatever. Market context and PA are the primary reasons to enter a trade and indicators secondly. If its the other way around I can't see it being profitable that way.

The Chatbox is my breakroom from trading, I believe we all need a break from time to time IMO.

If im going to do this thread Ive got to learn to convey my thoughts better. My style of trading will become more clear the more I post

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Busy today with other things so Im in and out

Did trade last nite went to bed got stopped out, came back traded to target-reason for stop out Vwap flatten and price pulled back to it also my entry was late on first trade but when I got up came back to pc to check on it I re entered long, reason for poor entry was bc of indi I was playing with since deleted it off, back to my PA entries at key levels

Reason for trade knew price wanted 20sma on 12hybrid, also on 8 hybrid pattern forming W, target was also at Rmid

R2R-this had good risk to reward what i am striving for but stop out could have been avoided by correct entry, note I wasnt sitting at pc so when I came back and saw it jumped in, . Perfect entries are best then if it goes against you at least loss is small or small profit

my fibs are my targets if I had wanted to trade to the levels ES went to

Good luck guys Im outta here prob not back till next week

All thoughts greatly appreciated

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Last edited by Rad4633; August 31st, 2012 at 10:27 AM.
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