Short term TF trading - futures io
futures io



Short term TF trading


Discussion in Trading Journals

Updated
      Top Posters
    1. looks_one indextrader7 with 449 posts (941 thanks)
    2. looks_two josh with 36 posts (46 thanks)
    3. looks_3 Victory Trader with 26 posts (3 thanks)
    4. looks_4 cmmichaels with 21 posts (16 thanks)
      Best Posters
    1. looks_one SteveH with 2.7 thanks per post
    2. looks_two indextrader7 with 2.1 thanks per post
    3. looks_3 Traderwolf with 1.6 thanks per post
    4. looks_4 josh with 1.3 thanks per post
    1. trending_up 112,157 views
    2. thumb_up 1,209 thanks given
    3. group 90 followers
    1. forum 797 posts
    2. attach_file 283 attachments




Welcome to futures io: the largest futures trading community on the planet, with well over 125,000 members
  • Genuine reviews from real traders, not fake reviews from stealth vendors
  • Quality education from leading professional traders
  • We are a friendly, helpful, and positive community
  • We do not tolerate rude behavior, trolling, or vendors advertising in posts
  • We are here to help, just let us know what you need
You'll need to register in order to view the content of the threads and start contributing to our community.  It's free and simple.

-- Big Mike, Site Administrator

(If you already have an account, login at the top of the page)

 
Search this Thread
 

Short term TF trading

(login for full post details)
  #501 (permalink)
 indextrader7 
Birmingham, AL
 
 
Posts: 1,065 since Apr 2012

Here's the end of notebook 1.

Finally putting together some type of checklist (notice this only happened out of necessity because I starting losing money because we weren't in a pretty bull market for me to throw darts at).

That will be all the uploads for tonight. This was tedious to do, but great to go back and see the early early stages starting to journal about my trading.


Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #502 (permalink)
 websouth 
Perdido Beach, AL
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: graph paper
Trading: Guitar
 
websouth's Avatar
 
Posts: 1,150 since Jul 2009
Thanks: 1,094 given, 1,313 received


indextrader7 View Post
Remember how before I was saying, "yeah... let's find the huge spikes and trade those! big $$$ baby" Well, here's my reaction to giving that a whirl for a while.


Funny... good stuff

I just found an old notebook from 7/10/01 which is about 2 inches thick. I think I printed off the whole stockcharts.com website at the time then I have notes all over it.

“Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.” - Dr. Seuss
Follow me on Twitter Visit my futures io Trade Journal Reply With Quote
The following 3 users say Thank You to websouth for this post:
 
(login for full post details)
  #503 (permalink)
 Big Mike 
Site Administrator
Swing Trader
Data Scientist & DevOps
Manta, Ecuador
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: Custom solution
Trading: Futures & Crypto
 
Big Mike's Avatar
 
Posts: 50,093 since Jun 2009
Thanks: 32,554 given, 98,581 received


websouth View Post
Funny... good stuff

I just found an old notebook from 7/10/01 which is about 2 inches thick. I think I printed off the whole stockcharts.com website at the time then I have notes all over it.

I don't have them anymore, but I remember printing out all kinds of charts and mocking them up and making all kinds of notes.

While I don't do that anymore, I still recommend it for new traders. There is just some kind of physical connection between a printed piece of paper, a pen, and you making notes on it that is lost when you move it to electronic medium. I think your brain tends to hold memories much better with something physical and tangible, like a printed chart.

Mike

We're here to help -- just ask

For the best trading education, watch our webinars
Searching for trading reviews? Review this list

Follow us on Twitter, YouTube, and Facebook

Support our community as an Elite Member:
https://futures.io/elite/

Visit other sites? Please spread the word about your experience with our community!
Follow me on Twitter Visit my futures io Trade Journal Reply With Quote
The following 9 users say Thank You to Big Mike for this post:
 
(login for full post details)
  #504 (permalink)
 Boomer34 
Georgia, USA
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: TOS
Broker: TOS
Trading: SPX
 
Boomer34's Avatar
 
Posts: 164 since Mar 2011
Thanks: 74 given, 57 received


Big Mike View Post
I don't have them anymore, but I remember printing out all kinds of charts and mocking them up and making all kinds of notes.

While I don't do that anymore, I still recommend it for new traders. There is just some kind of physical connection between a printed piece of paper, a pen, and you making notes on it that is lost when you move it to electronic medium. I think your brain tends to hold memories much better with something physical and tangible, like a printed chart.

Mike


I agree with ya 100% Mike...

And thanks for posting your journals IT7.

Follow me on Twitter Reply With Quote
The following user says Thank You to Boomer34 for this post:
 
(login for full post details)
  #505 (permalink)
 indextrader7 
Birmingham, AL
 
 
Posts: 1,065 since Apr 2012

Took a few trades to get it right.

Expected a breakout, then reversed to short, then reversed back to long... went 10 ticks in my favor before sharply reversing, so I reversed my position again, then rode the 40+ tick move down.


Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #506 (permalink)
 Boomer34 
Georgia, USA
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: TOS
Broker: TOS
Trading: SPX
 
Boomer34's Avatar
 
Posts: 164 since Mar 2011
Thanks: 74 given, 57 received

That was a nice ride down

Follow me on Twitter Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #507 (permalink)
 cmmichaels 
London England
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: Metatrader
Trading: Spot $
 
Posts: 91 since Apr 2012
Thanks: 1,075 given, 149 received

IT7 thanks so much for the posts and the journal what you are doing is showing us things that you can't read or learn about anywhere! The hard work and dedication you need, the real learning curve you have to go on and what you put yourself through psychologically and financially. This is the real truth to trading and I haven't seen it shown like this anywhere.

Amazing stuff.

I'm really happy to see the videos back again as well always look forward to watching them after work.

Cheers mate.

Visit my futures io Trade Journal Reply With Quote
The following user says Thank You to cmmichaels for this post:
 
(login for full post details)
  #508 (permalink)
 WarEagle 
Birmingham, AL
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: SierraChart
Broker: DDT/Rithmic
Trading: TF/ZN/CL
 
WarEagle's Avatar
 
Posts: 30 since Apr 2010
Thanks: 56 given, 25 received


cmmichaels View Post
IT7 thanks so much for the posts and the journal what you are doing is showing us things that you can't read or learn about anywhere! The hard work and dedication you need, the real learning curve you have to go on and what you put yourself through psychologically and financially. This is the real truth to trading and I haven't seen it shown like this anywhere.

Amazing stuff.

I'm really happy to see the videos back again as well always look forward to watching them after work.

Cheers mate.

+1000

I've never seen anyone post old journal entries...ever. Really enjoy the "inside baseball" look at your development as a trader. You'll probably never know the full extent that this will help others (myself included).

Hopefully any newbie reading this will get splashed with the cold water of reality, not as a discouragement but as a true picture of the time and effort that lies ahead.

Thanks man.

Reply With Quote
The following 2 users say Thank You to WarEagle for this post:
 
(login for full post details)
  #509 (permalink)
 indextrader7 
Birmingham, AL
 
 
Posts: 1,065 since Apr 2012

First trade today. Was hoping for a little more on the 2nd half, but good trade.


Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #510 (permalink)
 indextrader7 
Birmingham, AL
 
 
Posts: 1,065 since Apr 2012

Continuation after complex pullback? We'll see.



9:31 - Took this trade off at BE, not liking the timing right now.

Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #511 (permalink)
 indextrader7 
Birmingham, AL
 
 
Posts: 1,065 since Apr 2012

I've built a large position. Stop is about to be moved to breakeven, which will feel fantastic.



(Took 10/16 contracts off the table, and moved stop below last dip)

Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #512 (permalink)
 indextrader7 
Birmingham, AL
 
 
Posts: 1,065 since Apr 2012


Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #513 (permalink)
 josh 
Georgia, US
 
Experience: None
Platform: SC
Broker: AMP+CQG
Trading: ES, HSI, Nikkei
 
josh's Avatar
 
Posts: 5,469 since Jan 2011
Thanks: 6,059 given, 14,557 received

Nice job IT7, very professional and somewhere an amateur trader wouldn't dare go--adding. It takes cajones beyond compare even though today is a perfect day for it. I was long ES and am happily flat at this point, but I hope for your sake it will give you the pop you are looking for.

Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #514 (permalink)
 indextrader7 
Birmingham, AL
 
 
Posts: 1,065 since Apr 2012

Ok, just taking off the last 6 contracts. Mainly because I'm hungry. Happy trading all.

Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #515 (permalink)
 indextrader7 
Birmingham, AL
 
 
Posts: 1,065 since Apr 2012


Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #516 (permalink)
 indextrader7 
Birmingham, AL
 
 
Posts: 1,065 since Apr 2012

Working on developing a trading system. Looking for that holy grail of simple rules to follow to be wildly successful.


Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #517 (permalink)
 indextrader7 
Birmingham, AL
 
 
Posts: 1,065 since Apr 2012

Used to follow a lot of currency pairs, multiple times a day.

Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #518 (permalink)
 indextrader7 
Birmingham, AL
 
 
Posts: 1,065 since Apr 2012


Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #519 (permalink)
 indextrader7 
Birmingham, AL
 
 
Posts: 1,065 since Apr 2012

Three goals I had: make 25 pips/week, always have the correct position size for my stop loss, and cut losers short and let winners run. Also starting to realize that there is a process of BECOMING a trader. Sounds straightforward, but that's a conclusion that I came to after a lot of struggle.


Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #520 (permalink)
 indextrader7 
Birmingham, AL
 
 
Posts: 1,065 since Apr 2012

Lost $7,700 in a string of really bad trades (probably half of my account at the time), and circled where I smashed the pen into the notebook when it happened a few pages back in the journal (to remind myself of that pain and ability to make mistakes).


Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #521 (permalink)
 indextrader7 
Birmingham, AL
 
 
Posts: 1,065 since Apr 2012

...and the cycle of pumping myself back up begins.


Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #522 (permalink)
 indextrader7 
Birmingham, AL
 
 
Posts: 1,065 since Apr 2012

Shockingly, I made more mistakes and lost considerably more money.

Here's a bit of self talk, with select words blurred out for this posting.


Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #523 (permalink)
 indextrader7 
Birmingham, AL
 
 
Posts: 1,065 since Apr 2012

Ok, last post from this journal. This journal was where trading was no longer this wonderful exciting new thing that would make me rich, but rather a tough butt whipping where I started to learn how hard this game was. I started to learn things and have battle scars that could help me going forward. Many tears shed and awful deep pain felt. All worth it.


Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #524 (permalink)
 trendisyourfriend 
Legendary Market Wizard
Quebec
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NinjaTrader wt Rancho Dinero's profiling tools
Broker: AMP/CQG
Trading: ES, NQ, YM
 
trendisyourfriend's Avatar
 
Posts: 4,050 since Oct 2009
Thanks: 3,701 given, 5,235 received


indextrader7 View Post
I've built a large position. Stop is about to be moved to breakeven, which will feel fantastic.



(Took 10/16 contracts off the table, and moved stop below last dip)

Obviously you are not a conservative trader ;-) What type of money management are you using? That's a risky bet to put 16 contracts on the table when most of the time you use 4 contracts. Specially on a 250 ticks chart where it's almost noise most of the time.

Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #525 (permalink)
 indextrader7 
Birmingham, AL
 
 
Posts: 1,065 since Apr 2012


trendisyourfriend View Post
Obviously you are not a conservative trader ;-) What type of money management are you using? That's a risky bet to put 16 contracts on the table when most of the time you use 4 contracts. Specially on a 250 ticks chart where it's almost noise most of the time.

Hey, great question.

It's not as wild and risky as you might think.

I put on a normal size position, and once it was in significant profits, I added to it, then I later doubled that (8 contracts) to sixteen. My money management was super tight, at any point during the trade if price began to retrace, I would exit the trade at a worst case scenario of a normal size loss... most likely would cut it off around breakeven. To me, the risk of this type of trade is that I'll get stopped at breakeven more times than not, since adding to the position keeps moving your breakeven point up (more likely to retrace there at some point).

The stop level on the chart for me is usually a worst case scenario stop.

I really don't think that most of the movement of a 250 tick chart is noise. Do you really?

Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #526 (permalink)
 Big Mike 
Site Administrator
Swing Trader
Data Scientist & DevOps
Manta, Ecuador
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: Custom solution
Trading: Futures & Crypto
 
Big Mike's Avatar
 
Posts: 50,093 since Jun 2009
Thanks: 32,554 given, 98,581 received

Thanks for sharing those journals @indextrader7.

Here is what I put on the homepage:

@indextrader7 has been regularly posting to his journal on futures.io (formerly BMT) for several months now, but just recently he dug up his old pen + paper journals from many years ago, and started sharing them.

I really found it great to skim the notes from his old journals, you can see the experience unfolding year after year with every new page he shared.

His futures.io (formerly BMT) journal is about trading the Russel 2000 (TF), but the wisdom within from his notes applies to all trading. Check it out (continued...)

Mike

We're here to help -- just ask

For the best trading education, watch our webinars
Searching for trading reviews? Review this list

Follow us on Twitter, YouTube, and Facebook

Support our community as an Elite Member:
https://futures.io/elite/

Visit other sites? Please spread the word about your experience with our community!
Follow me on Twitter Visit my futures io Trade Journal Reply With Quote
The following user says Thank You to Big Mike for this post:
 
(login for full post details)
  #527 (permalink)
 trendisyourfriend 
Legendary Market Wizard
Quebec
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NinjaTrader wt Rancho Dinero's profiling tools
Broker: AMP/CQG
Trading: ES, NQ, YM
 
trendisyourfriend's Avatar
 
Posts: 4,050 since Oct 2009
Thanks: 3,701 given, 5,235 received


indextrader7 View Post
...
I really don't think that most of the movement of a 250 tick chart is noise. Do you really?

By noise i mean more prone to kick you out of the game. Maybe i did not chose the right expression as you can effectively trade a 250 tick chart.

Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #528 (permalink)
 josh 
Georgia, US
 
Experience: None
Platform: SC
Broker: AMP+CQG
Trading: ES, HSI, Nikkei
 
josh's Avatar
 
Posts: 5,469 since Jan 2011
Thanks: 6,059 given, 14,557 received


trendisyourfriend View Post
Obviously you are not a conservative trader ;-) What type of money management are you using? That's a risky bet to put 16 contracts on the table when most of the time you use 4 contracts. Specially on a 250 ticks chart where it's almost noise most of the time.

Most people add as the market goes AGAINST them, and reduce as the market moves WITH them. It's exactly the opposite of how it should be done, and as long as the adds are at strategic locations and do not raise the average too much to outweigh the benefits, it's absolutely the right thing to do when the market as strong direction. When the market is balanced and ranging, adds do not work well, as the market needs to be directional, but today for the most part it was very well suited for adding.

Reply With Quote
The following user says Thank You to josh for this post:
 
(login for full post details)
  #529 (permalink)
 Traderwolf 
Raleigh,NC
 
Experience: None
Platform: Versatile and Stable
Broker: Reliable and Accurate
Trading: Money
 
Traderwolf's Avatar
 
Posts: 250 since Feb 2012
Thanks: 154 given, 1,028 received


josh View Post
Most people add as the market goes AGAINST them, and reduce as the market moves WITH them. It's exactly the opposite of how it should be done, and as long as the adds are at strategic locations and do not raise the average too much to outweigh the benefits, it's absolutely the right thing to do when the market as strong direction. When the market is balanced and ranging, adds do not work well, as the market needs to be directional, but today for the most part it was very well suited for adding.

Josh....... Very well said and great point. I was introduced to this concept about a year ago and I was amazed. It is opposite of what most were preaching.. In strong trends and breakouts, you scale in to positions versus scaling out. Your risk is the smallest when you first enter(since you have the smallest size) and you only add to your size when the market tips its hand in terms of trend strength.(i.e. follow the herd).

The hardest part of this(at least for me) is what IT7 describes and it is money management and the willingness to forfeit the initial profit as well as the perceived risk one has with adding size.. Even though you can get your stop to breakeven in most cases, this discomfort with adding in a trend(vs taking profits) leads me to hardly ever do this. I still have problems with this strategy even though I know it makes sense and works..

It seems like the things that work best in trading are the things that are the most counter-intuitive and hardest to pull off psychologically. This strategy fits that bill to me.


Wolf

Reply With Quote
The following 3 users say Thank You to Traderwolf for this post:
 
(login for full post details)
  #530 (permalink)
 mstier 
San Francisco
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: In house
Trading: Futures
 
Posts: 21 since Apr 2012
Thanks: 55 given, 24 received


indextrader7 View Post
Ok, just taking off the last 6 contracts. Mainly because I'm hungry. Happy trading all.

Very cool trade to see. And congrats on the religious journal keeping that's amazing. A bit of inspiration to be more diligent about mine!

Reply With Quote
The following user says Thank You to mstier for this post:
 
(login for full post details)
  #531 (permalink)
 stillgrinding 
Palm Beach, Florida, USA
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: Ninjatrader, ThinkorSwim
Trading: Futures, US stocks
 
Posts: 5 since Mar 2012
Thanks: 4 given, 1 received

Thank you for posting your written journal entries. These are true gems. I read those lines such as " you don't have the skill to day trade" or " the problem is you" and it reminds me of when I (just recently) wrote that myself. I'm basically still-grinding along. Making small improvements daily. Thank you again for sharing this.

Reply With Quote
The following user says Thank You to stillgrinding for this post:
 
(login for full post details)
  #532 (permalink)
 cmmichaels 
London England
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: Metatrader
Trading: Spot $
 
Posts: 91 since Apr 2012
Thanks: 1,075 given, 149 received

One thing that this journal is hammering home for me is that if you are learning to trade this way one of the biggest skills that needs to be mastered is being able to take a loss. I feel like you have to be able to look at a trade in a completely unbiased way and say this isn't working/this looks wrong/this doens't look like it is going to play out like I had planned and then get out the trade. Then look at the trade and think do I want to be now trading the other way(Something IT7 does supremely well). The 2 most important aspects I am working on is unbiased Adaptability and Intuition in all of my trades. I feel like now there is now magic analysis that you are suddenly going to learn that is going to make you certain trades are going to work so it is always going to come down to how you manage the trades that don't work and then of course exiting profitable trades at the right time is a nightmare.

Visit my futures io Trade Journal Reply With Quote
The following 3 users say Thank You to cmmichaels for this post:
 
(login for full post details)
  #533 (permalink)
 indextrader7 
Birmingham, AL
 
 
Posts: 1,065 since Apr 2012

I scaled into another trade today, as it went in my favor. Once I had scaled in, I thought to bring up the recording tool and let you see me manage the trade. Not much to it, just protect downside and protect profits.

The entry (hammer candle formed as price slowed entering a support level), added to it quickly on a break above the hammer close, and then added again on a strong bull candle.

You see me take 4/12 off the table because price stalled for a few candles. Sorry it ran out of time, but you know by that point the trade was over.

Screenr - indextrader7: 7-19-12 live scaled in trade mgmt

Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #534 (permalink)
 mstier 
San Francisco
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: In house
Trading: Futures
 
Posts: 21 since Apr 2012
Thanks: 55 given, 24 received

Really nicely done, thanks for the video. Lots to think about from your posts over the last few days!

Reply With Quote
The following user says Thank You to mstier for this post:
 
(login for full post details)
  #535 (permalink)
 indextrader7 
Birmingham, AL
 
 
Posts: 1,065 since Apr 2012

1. Shorted as price broke down after a deep retracement up.

2. Went long as there wasn't the follow through down I was wanting. This wasn't a good decision, as my breakdown (short) bias was still the correct one, this up leg was simply a small retrace back up to test the recent highs.

3. The bad trade wasn't working out (as most bad trades don't), and I re-aligned with the correct bias for the down move. I added to my position as it broke below the lower tail of the entry candle.


Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #536 (permalink)
 indextrader7 
Birmingham, AL
 
 
Posts: 1,065 since Apr 2012

Still pretty much in experimentation mode with this adding to winning positions thing. Learning things daily.

Here's the trades for today:


Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #537 (permalink)
SteveH
Orlando, Florida, USA
 
 
Posts: 34 since Oct 2010
Thanks: 3 given, 96 received

The price you pay (both emotional and mathematical) for having big winners from adding to a winning trade while keeping initial capital risk small is that your longer term winning pct will drop to 30-40%. [But I think you already sense this without having to experience 100's of attempts.]

Reply With Quote
The following user says Thank You to SteveH for this post:
 
(login for full post details)
  #538 (permalink)
 indextrader7 
Birmingham, AL
 
 
Posts: 1,065 since Apr 2012

Well, I got out of this short trade too early for sure. I just didn't like the way price action was shaping up with the small body candles, seemed like the bears were struggling to win.

Not to worry. I've done my job. I've managed risk. Endless more opportunities abound.


Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #539 (permalink)
 Surly 
denver, colorado
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NT
Trading: ZS
 
Surly's Avatar
 
Posts: 704 since Mar 2011
Thanks: 628 given, 1,258 received


SteveH View Post
I think psychology in trading is over-rated.

You don't need psychology to tell you to stop doing stupid things which never work mathematically over the long term. You need common sense and emotional maturity. If you have to start digging into Mommy/Daddy issues in this game, you're done. Go find a normal job where you don't get money taken from you for every little mistake you make.

A more correct statement would be that all trading education is "over-rated" - that is the point of marketing and advertising - to make something more desirable than it actually is..

However, your contention that psychology is unimportant is fanciful. Why do you think Steven Cohen (SAC capital) hired Ari Kiev to work for his hedge fun for 6+ years. Why do you think one of the most successful hedge funds in the world hired Brett Steenbarger to be their full-time, on the floor psychologist(and likely pay him 7 figures)? Why do you think Ed Seykota formed his "Trading Tribes" to deal with personal psychological issues? It wasn't to distract them from analysis and trading - it was because once you master a method of trading, you will still be held back by any psychological issues you have not yet dealt with.

One's propensity to hold or add to losers, take profits early, gamble to win back losses, etc are all related to how well one handles anxiety, uncertainty, and emotional difficulty. Like it or not, these things are influenced more than any other single factor by the way one's primary care-givers treated them during their early years.

You certainly don't need to delve into personal psychology to make a little money at trading - you only need to do that if you want to make a lot of money from trading.

Seek freedom and become captive of your desires. Seek discipline and find your liberty. - Frank Herbert
Visit my futures io Trade Journal Reply With Quote
The following 6 users say Thank You to Surly for this post:
 
(login for full post details)
  #540 (permalink)
 Surly 
denver, colorado
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NT
Trading: ZS
 
Surly's Avatar
 
Posts: 704 since Mar 2011
Thanks: 628 given, 1,258 received

IT7 - I wanted to add my voice to the thanks for starting and maintaining this journal. Good work, I've enjoyed reading/watching it. If you're interested in a different take on trading psychology, I wanted to encourage you to check out Ari Kiev's book "the Psychology of Risk" - you might really like Ari. He's got a lot of free podcasts here. His approach is different from the other popular trading psych guys.

Also - I used the 250 tick chart when I traded the TF (and would again if I traded TF) - one thing I found useful to have on my chart was a "tick counter". Its a small indicator that counts down the number of ticks on each bar so that you know when the current bar will close and next bar will start. I got mine from some thread here on futures.io (formerly BMT) but forget where - I exported the indicator from NT and attached it here if you want to try to install it to check it out (I may or may not have done it correctly so let me know if it works).

Happy trading!

Seek freedom and become captive of your desires. Seek discipline and find your liberty. - Frank Herbert
Attached Files
Register to download File Type: zip TickCounter.zip (3.3 KB, 19 views)
Visit my futures io Trade Journal Reply With Quote
The following 3 users say Thank You to Surly for this post:
 
(login for full post details)
  #541 (permalink)
stok
Dallas
 
 
Posts: 11 since Jul 2011
Thanks: 2 given, 3 received


indextrader7 View Post
Well, I got out of this short trade too early for sure. I just didn't like the way price action was shaping up with the small body candles, seemed like the bears were struggling to win.

Not to worry. I've done my job. I've managed risk. Endless more opportunities abound.

So is that your only trade today?

Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #542 (permalink)
stok
Dallas
 
 
Posts: 11 since Jul 2011
Thanks: 2 given, 3 received

Question to those that add to winners. If your initial size is X, how high do you average in? 2X, 3X, 4X+?

Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #543 (permalink)
 josh 
Georgia, US
 
Experience: None
Platform: SC
Broker: AMP+CQG
Trading: ES, HSI, Nikkei
 
josh's Avatar
 
Posts: 5,469 since Jan 2011
Thanks: 6,059 given, 14,557 received


stok View Post
Question to those that add to winners. If your initial size is X, how high do you average in? 2X, 3X, 4X+?

As long as adding doesn't cause the average to be such that it becomes a losing trade (i.e., when adding to a long, the average should still be below the stop), then add to your heart's content. Personally I try to get more on in the beginning. So if initial size is X, will add X/2 and again X/2 or X/3.

I am trying to improve my ability to scale in and out in the same trade sequence. So I'm short, and have scaled out at two good points, and have scaled back in at one, and finally scaled back out. It's quite psychologically difficult to do so, because not only are you watching unrealized profits evaporate, you area worsening your average price as you add. But if you reduce along the way, you bank profits. Combining adding with reducing can, IMO, be a great way to stay in the market on a day like today without just praying that it keeps going--taking profits, and then getting back in at appropriate places, as long as the premise is still valid, and the market is still confirming..

Reply With Quote
The following 2 users say Thank You to josh for this post:
 
(login for full post details)
  #544 (permalink)
 indextrader7 
Birmingham, AL
 
 
Posts: 1,065 since Apr 2012


stok View Post
So is that your only trade today?

No, I had several others. Hopefully will get a review up here.


stok View Post
Question to those that add to winners. If your initial size is X, how high do you average in? 2X, 3X, 4X+?

I don't have hard rules on this. Most of the time I go by equal increments (long 4, add 4, add 4, etc)

Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #545 (permalink)
 indextrader7 
Birmingham, AL
 
 
Posts: 1,065 since Apr 2012

If you were going to develop a role for:

- a trading risk manager
- physically in the room with you (has his own computer setup/monitors), but a remote option would be a plus.
- using whatever software/hardware necessary to
- monitor individual trade risk (making sure it didn't exceed thresholds)
- monitor daily loss timeout threshold and daily loss stop trading threshold
- also monitor basic trading rules such as checking logic behind entries and making sure stops aren't widened and positions aren't doubled down.

How would you PHYSICALLY set this arrangement up. Ninjatrader doesn't allow multiple versions of the same account running simultaneously, so the only idea I have would be to run a duplicate image of one of my monitors to a monitor of his, so he can monitor something like open p/l, cumulative p/l, and a chart (which would show position size and stop placement). Screen sharing software is another idea, as well as solves the remote problem.

Any thoughts on this are much welcomed and appreciated.

Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #546 (permalink)
 josh 
Georgia, US
 
Experience: None
Platform: SC
Broker: AMP+CQG
Trading: ES, HSI, Nikkei
 
josh's Avatar
 
Posts: 5,469 since Jan 2011
Thanks: 6,059 given, 14,557 received


indextrader7 View Post
If you were going to develop a role for:

I suppose the remote software is a reasonable idea--I use TeamViewer for this. Free, iOS and Android versions as well. But just for someone physically in the room, a mirrored monitor as you mention might do the trick. I have to ask, what are you trying to do here?

Reply With Quote
The following user says Thank You to josh for this post:
 
(login for full post details)
  #547 (permalink)
 cmmichaels 
London England
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: Metatrader
Trading: Spot $
 
Posts: 91 since Apr 2012
Thanks: 1,075 given, 149 received


indextrader7 View Post
If you were going to develop a role for:

- a trading risk manager
- physically in the room with you (has his own computer setup/monitors), but a remote option would be a plus.
- using whatever software/hardware necessary to
- monitor individual trade risk (making sure it didn't exceed thresholds)
- monitor daily loss timeout threshold and daily loss stop trading threshold
- also monitor basic trading rules such as checking logic behind entries and making sure stops aren't widened and positions aren't doubled down.

How would you PHYSICALLY set this arrangement up. Ninjatrader doesn't allow multiple versions of the same account running simultaneously, so the only idea I have would be to run a duplicate image of one of my monitors to a monitor of his, so he can monitor something like open p/l, cumulative p/l, and a chart (which would show position size and stop placement). Screen sharing software is another idea, as well as solves the remote problem.

Any thoughts on this are much welcomed and appreciated.

For physically in the room you can get a VGA splitter cable or whatever one is right for your screen that will just split the image onto another screen so it will just look exactly the same as yours.

For remote then screen sharing software would work best.

Visit my futures io Trade Journal Reply With Quote
The following user says Thank You to cmmichaels for this post:
 
(login for full post details)
  #548 (permalink)
 indextrader7 
Birmingham, AL
 
 
Posts: 1,065 since Apr 2012

I'd love to hear if anyone has original ideas outside of what I suggested as possibilities. There may not be anything else, but anything strikes you please share!

Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #549 (permalink)
 indextrader7 
Birmingham, AL
 
 
Posts: 1,065 since Apr 2012

On more of a trading note, and related to this journal, I wanted to share something. People are often asking me about learning curve, and what made the tipping point to successful consistent trading.

I CAN'T SPEAK HIGHLY ENOUGH OF DAILY PROCESS GOALS.

For so long I begged and pleaded and demanded of myself to be a good trader, make money, don't make this mistake or that blunder. I would sit down with the mindset of trading well, or making money, or following a system, etc.

The more I think about it, the more headway I started to make once I came up with a daily PROCESS goal. For example.. after reviewing the day's trades, I would decide to make tomorrow's process goal to keep all stops within 20 ticks, or make sure every trade has an attached stop and target order, or make sure I have a written down explanation for every trade taken, or wait for the candle close to take a signal, etc, etc

This is still to this day of utter importance to my trading. I find that when my results start to be less than stellar, it's due to me having strayed away from a consistent review process, documented trades, and using that information to come up with 1 or 2 process goals for the next trading day. Win or lose don't care... follow the day's process goal to the death. That's how I really achieve peak performance.

Hope that helps someone.

Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #550 (permalink)
 futuretrader 
Como Italy
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: Ninjatrader, customized
Trading: ES
 
Posts: 526 since Feb 2010
Thanks: 471 given, 642 received

If you get your broker to give you a second log-in for the same account, you can connect two instances of NT (on different machines) to the same account.

Your risk management has always looked solid to me, except when you talked about "loading up" on a "day-saving" trade, which set off alarm bells.

On a separate note, I have been exploring NT's stats via Excel, and I can't see the logic in NT's MAE/MFE calcs when you are scaling into and out of a trade. Even the reporting by individual contract is inaccurate. So the only way I can see to get these stats accurately is to go back over the bars (I'm thinking of adding a 1-tick range series) and calculate them myself. Have you (or anyone else) also found this, or am I missing something?

Reply With Quote
The following user says Thank You to futuretrader for this post:
 
(login for full post details)
  #551 (permalink)
 josh 
Georgia, US
 
Experience: None
Platform: SC
Broker: AMP+CQG
Trading: ES, HSI, Nikkei
 
josh's Avatar
 
Posts: 5,469 since Jan 2011
Thanks: 6,059 given, 14,557 received


futuretrader View Post
On a separate note, I have been exploring NT's stats via Excel, and I can't see the logic in NT's MAE/MFE calcs when you are scaling into and out of a trade. Even the reporting by individual contract is inaccurate. So the only way I can see to get these stats accurately is to go back over the bars (I'm thinking of adding a 1-tick range series) and calculate them myself. Have you (or anyone else) also found this, or am I missing something?

You are correct. Here is the reason why you see what you see. Using an example from yesterday, I sold some at 1387. I scaled out half at 1383.50, and scaled back in to the full position at 1382.50. At this point I have banked 3.50, but for the purposes of the ATM strategy I am short now from 1385.50 (1387*2 + 1382.50). Now, based on THIS price (1385.50), it will calculate all the stats. So even though I took literally 1 tick of heat as I hit the bid to sell 1387 and 1387.25 never even went offer again, it calculates that during the duration of the trade, the high price was 1387, so based on the recalculated entry of 1385.50, it thinks I took 6 ticks of heat on my full position. And on top of that, let's say you short 2, scale out 1, and add 1 back. Your max size at any one time is 2, but NT says that you traded 3, so it will say you took heat on 3, when you took none on 2!

This is why I do not export from NT, because these stats are not correct. Also, duration of time in a trade (exit time) is off when scaling as well. I can't imagine why--entry time should be earliest of all trades, exit time should be latest of all trades, but even this is wrong. It only takes about 30 seconds per trade, and if I can't do it during the day I will do if afterward. This way I actually can verify what happened and go over the trade as well.

Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #552 (permalink)
 indextrader7 
Birmingham, AL
 
 
Posts: 1,065 since Apr 2012


josh View Post
You are correct. Here is the reason why you see what you see. Using an example from yesterday, I sold some at 1387. I scaled out half at 1383.50, and scaled back in to the full position at 1382.50. At this point I have banked 3.50, but for the purposes of the ATM strategy I am short now from 1385.50 (1387*2 + 1382.50). Now, based on THIS price (1385.50), it will calculate all the stats. So even though I took literally 1 tick of heat as I hit the bid to sell 1387 and 1387.25 never even went offer again, it calculates that during the duration of the trade, the high price was 1387, so based on the recalculated entry of 1385.50, it thinks I took 6 ticks of heat on my full position. And on top of that, let's say you short 2, scale out 1, and add 1 back. Your max size at any one time is 2, but NT says that you traded 3, so it will say you took heat on 3, when you took none on 2!

This is why I do not export from NT, because these stats are not correct. Also, duration of time in a trade (exit time) is off when scaling as well. I can't imagine why--entry time should be earliest of all trades, exit time should be latest of all trades, but even this is wrong. It only takes about 30 seconds per trade, and if I can't do it during the day I will do if afterward. This way I actually can verify what happened and go over the trade as well.

+1 Have to do MAE and such on my own.

Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #553 (permalink)
 futuretrader 
Como Italy
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: Ninjatrader, customized
Trading: ES
 
Posts: 526 since Feb 2010
Thanks: 471 given, 642 received

Thanks Josh, I'd forgotten about NT recalculating the entry price; that explains it. I had noticed (and corrected for) the exit times.

I know entering the numbers doesn't take long, but I prefer to get it set up and just push a button, so I can focus on entering reasons and psychology....

Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #554 (permalink)
 Surly 
denver, colorado
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NT
Trading: ZS
 
Surly's Avatar
 
Posts: 704 since Mar 2011
Thanks: 628 given, 1,258 received


indextrader7 View Post
If you were going to develop a role for:

- a trading risk manager
- physically in the room with you (has his own computer setup/monitors), but a remote option would be a plus.
- using whatever software/hardware necessary to
- monitor individual trade risk (making sure it didn't exceed thresholds)
- monitor daily loss timeout threshold and daily loss stop trading threshold
- also monitor basic trading rules such as checking logic behind entries and making sure stops aren't widened and positions aren't doubled down.

How would you PHYSICALLY set this arrangement up. Ninjatrader doesn't allow multiple versions of the same account running simultaneously, so the only idea I have would be to run a duplicate image of one of my monitors to a monitor of his, so he can monitor something like open p/l, cumulative p/l, and a chart (which would show position size and stop placement). Screen sharing software is another idea, as well as solves the remote problem.

Any thoughts on this are much welcomed and appreciated.

Might as well reply while I wait for ES to get down to yesterday's low....

Check out Teamviewer software (teamviewer.com) - they have software solutions for the "physical" aspect of what you're trying to do and they are free for personal use.

I think if you can find someone (or pay someone) to do these things for you (position size, stop loss, and daily threshold management) that would be helpful in a lot of ways. I think there is a slippery slope aspect to outsourcing these aspects of personal discipline but the reality is that trading involves the emotions and can trigger unwanted behaviors in us. Thinking for myself - I would view such oversight as a "crutch" that I used while I worked on developing the proper personal discipline on my own over time. In your list the job of "checking logic behind entries" seems very difficult for someone else to do in realtime for your style of trading and (IMHO) would be better done by you during the process of trade review after finishing trading.

Something I'm beginning to work more on is dividing up the various roles of trading (analyst, entry manager, trade manager, risk manager, etc) and assigning goals and tasks to these various roles. In this way I can assign process goals for each role and work on not letting the goals of one role "bleed into" the goals of another role (e.g., not let my "analyst" role start affecting my "risk management" role).

Seek freedom and become captive of your desires. Seek discipline and find your liberty. - Frank Herbert
Visit my futures io Trade Journal Reply With Quote
The following 5 users say Thank You to Surly for this post:
 
(login for full post details)
  #555 (permalink)
 indextrader7 
Birmingham, AL
 
 
Posts: 1,065 since Apr 2012

Just a few failed attempts at joining this downtrend so far. A couple limit entries not filled as price fell below.

Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #556 (permalink)
 indextrader7 
Birmingham, AL
 
 
Posts: 1,065 since Apr 2012

Ended up getting in on a few shorts after that last post. 2 winners 1 loser.


Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #557 (permalink)
 indextrader7 
Birmingham, AL
 
 
Posts: 1,065 since Apr 2012

I'm off to the beach. May trade in the AM, may not...

Happy trading to all, and to all a good money management system.

Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #558 (permalink)
 indextrader7 
Birmingham, AL
 
 
Posts: 1,065 since Apr 2012

Hit the wrong button on my first trade today. Haven't done that in a while. Should be 2 for 2 today, but I'm down 3 ticks.


Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #559 (permalink)
 indextrader7 
Birmingham, AL
 
 
Posts: 1,065 since Apr 2012

Decent trading today, up 0.5%. Did not like that I had a losing trade larger than any of my winners; it was still well within risk parameters.... The problem was more on the winning side of the equation. I had two trades that I managed too tightly that I only took 25% and 50% of the swing in profits. On the larger losing trade, CLEARLY my entry wasn't valid after the very next candle.

Overall banked some ticks today though.


Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #560 (permalink)
 indextrader7 
Birmingham, AL
 
 
Posts: 1,065 since Apr 2012

Screenr - indextrader7: 8-9-12 recap

Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #561 (permalink)
 Traderwolf 
Raleigh,NC
 
Experience: None
Platform: Versatile and Stable
Broker: Reliable and Accurate
Trading: Money
 
Traderwolf's Avatar
 
Posts: 250 since Feb 2012
Thanks: 154 given, 1,028 received



IT7,

As I look at your trades, it appears as if you trade primarily off of previous levels of S/R to enter and also buy/sell pullbacks in trends.

I have seen quite a few traders trade previous levels of S/R using volume profiles and price profiles(variations of market profile). Have you ever looked at this approach to trading since it appears to be very similar to how you trade and provides a lot of information to the trader?

Actually, there have been many webinars on Big Mike Trading on this subject and how this methodology can be used.

Good job on this journal and thanks.

Wolf

Reply With Quote
The following user says Thank You to Traderwolf for this post:
 
(login for full post details)
  #562 (permalink)
 indextrader7 
Birmingham, AL
 
 
Posts: 1,065 since Apr 2012


Traderwolf View Post
IT7,

As I look at your trades, it appears as if you trade primarily off of previous levels of S/R to enter and also buy/sell pullbacks in trends.

I have seen quite a few traders trade previous levels of S/R using volume profiles and price profiles(variations of market profile). Have you ever looked at this approach to trading since it appears to be very similar to how you trade and provides a lot of information to the trader?

Actually, there have been many webinars on Big Mike Trading on this subject and how this methodology can be used.

Good job on this journal and thanks.

Wolf

Traderwolf, I haven't looked at it before. I really don't even know what it is; I do see people talking about it a good bit though. Given your sense for how I trade, how do you think it would benefit me? Looking forward to hearing, and thanks for the info!

Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #563 (permalink)
 Traderwolf 
Raleigh,NC
 
Experience: None
Platform: Versatile and Stable
Broker: Reliable and Accurate
Trading: Money
 
Traderwolf's Avatar
 
Posts: 250 since Feb 2012
Thanks: 154 given, 1,028 received


indextrader7 View Post
Traderwolf, I haven't looked at it before. I really don't even know what it is; I do see people talking about it a good bit though. Given your sense for how I trade, how do you think it would benefit me? Looking forward to hearing, and thanks for the info!

IT7,

Since I do not know your trading routines and you are a consistently profitable trader, I am not sure any of this will help you. One of your biggest strengths appears to be money management , and this process does not touch it at all. Here is my take on the value of Volume Profile(to me anyhow):

I will talk about Volume Profile since it is my preference. It represents the amount of shares traded at a given price or tick. I look at previous day in detail looking for places where price traded frequently(Called High Volume Nodes or HVN), and I also look at places where price did not trade frequently(called Low Volume Nodes or LVN). I do look at previous days profiles to look at previous days highs and lows and overall market trend, but place more emphasis on previous day since I am a scalper.

HVN's typicallly act as S/R since price has traded at that level frequently. I am expecting a reversal when heading into a HVN usually. You identified one of these today in your video from the close of the previous day and actually played a reversal off of it. LVN's do not always act as S/R since price did not trade there frequently. It can either be a place where you would expect a breakout or a place where you would expect a reversal and I let the larger price action context guide me as to which way I would lean when we get to that level.

So the real value (to me) of this methodology is to allow you to determine price levels that I have high interest in placing a trade BEFORE THE MARKET OPENS. This HOMEWORK is done without the stress of the market moving fast and furious. As you know , trading is all about having the patience to wait for your setup or levels to appear and sometimes "hurry up and waiting" is the most difficult part. This methodology allows you to do your HOMEWORK before the market opens and develop an overall trading plan for the day. There are other methods and ways to do this and this one is not the holy grail. It is one that is easy to define , easy to use, and very repeatable which lends itself to trading plan consistency.

This is a very brief explanation of a version of this method and hope it helps. BTW, the same analysis can be used with Price Profile(Called TPO for Time Price Opportunity) and should produce similar results.

Wolf

Reply With Quote
The following 4 users say Thank You to Traderwolf for this post:
 
(login for full post details)
  #564 (permalink)
 josh 
Georgia, US
 
Experience: None
Platform: SC
Broker: AMP+CQG
Trading: ES, HSI, Nikkei
 
josh's Avatar
 
Posts: 5,469 since Jan 2011
Thanks: 6,059 given, 14,557 received


Traderwolf View Post
HVN's typicallly act as S/R since price has traded at that level frequently. I am expecting a reversal when heading into a HVN usually. You identified one of these today in your video from the close of the previous day and actually played a reversal off of it. LVN's do not always act as S/R since price did not trade there frequently.

As you say, all methodologies are subject to our individual interpretation and use. With that being said, most profile traders would probably disagree with your remarks above. Each case is unique, but in general, extremes (where reversals occur) are characterized by low volume. Thus, a return to a low volume area is viewed by many as an opportunity for a possible reversal, given that the market rejected that area previously. High volume areas, on the other hand, contained lots of activity, and are the "meat" of the day. Thus, while a group of prices that previously traded heavy may indeed provide a bounce, the market is returning to an area that was previously accepted, and thus may very well be accepted again (i.e., no reversal). Again, these are just ideas, and there is no right and wrong; but I think most profile traders would tend to generally accept this way of explaining things. It's quite over-simplified of course, and should not be taken as anything other than a rough overview.


Traderwolf View Post
This methodology allows you to do your HOMEWORK before the market opens and develop an overall trading plan for the day. There are other methods and ways to do this and this one is not the holy grail. It is one that is easy to define , easy to use, and very repeatable which lends itself to trading plan consistency.

Indeed, it is not the holy grail though many seem to be religious followers of profiling due to its recent popularization by some in the trading community. Neither is "homework" the holy grail, nor is exhaustive planning necessary, for me. Some approach is certainly necessary, but for me personally, my pre-market preparation is greatly influenced by activity all the way up to the open, rendering any planning done the night before or much before the open to be out of date and rather useless. I have ideas at the open, but by no means does my approach that day which is developed prior to the open have much bearing after the first hour or two; at that point, the activity of the day rules and I try to get in tune with that, regardless of what plan may have been created prior to the day's beginning. Again, just my thoughts, and YMMV.

There is a good thread on futures.io (formerly BMT) here.

Reply With Quote
The following 2 users say Thank You to josh for this post:
 
(login for full post details)
  #565 (permalink)
 Surly 
denver, colorado
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NT
Trading: ZS
 
Surly's Avatar
 
Posts: 704 since Mar 2011
Thanks: 628 given, 1,258 received

Honestly IT7, I wouldn't spend your time learning volume or market profiling theory. Its reasonably good stuff to know but I don't think it will help you the way you trade now. It may change how you trade and that may be good or may be bad. I think you've got a good, intuitive feel for the way TF moves and you're relatively fearless and consistent (meaning that you will trade and keep trading and stay with it as opposed to letting opportunities pass you by).

That said, I think you would do best to figure out ways to help you get rid of your losers quicker and hold your winners. That advice "cut losers, hold winners" is useless on the face of it - the key is figuring out how to cut YOUR losers and hold YOUR winners. You might look at how many 250 tick bars it takes for your typical winner to start showing a profit - they you could decide to get out of your trade if its in the red after x number of bars. A lot of this is going to come from getting used to the action of getting rid of trades that aren't working - just getting out of them and then waiting for the next time you see an opportunity - cut and move on, cut and move on.

Holding winners is also difficult - you're never going to know which trades will be the big winners vs the ones that will come back and stop you out at BE. You seem to hold your trades for 3-10 minutes on average so you might spend some time to look at historical data to get a feel for the average size of a move over this timeframe and set realistic objectives for the size of your typical winner. That way you'd have a goal - say 20 ticks or so and you can try harder to hold a trade that's working until it gets to that size. By "try harder" I mean keeping a looser stop.

Anyway - I'm not offering much practical advice here, just some thoughts. Good trading!

Seek freedom and become captive of your desires. Seek discipline and find your liberty. - Frank Herbert
Visit my futures io Trade Journal Reply With Quote
The following user says Thank You to Surly for this post:
 
(login for full post details)
  #566 (permalink)
 Traderwolf 
Raleigh,NC
 
Experience: None
Platform: Versatile and Stable
Broker: Reliable and Accurate
Trading: Money
 
Traderwolf's Avatar
 
Posts: 250 since Feb 2012
Thanks: 154 given, 1,028 received


josh View Post
As you say, all methodologies are subject to our individual interpretation and use.

Agreed


josh View Post
I have ideas at the open, but by no means does my approach that day which is developed prior to the open have much bearing after the first hour or two;

Most of the best opps are in the first 2 hours.


Wolf

Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #567 (permalink)
 indextrader7 
Birmingham, AL
 
 
Posts: 1,065 since Apr 2012

I will admit that I've gotten a little jealous over seeing other traders setups. I decided to step it up myself. Just rigged this up tonight. Literally used books to set up the higher monitors in the back. (Waiting on my stand to arrive), but already this is quite functional and quite pleasing even though it's not set up right yet. Looking forward to paying for it all in the session tomorrow.


Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #568 (permalink)
 WarEagle 
Birmingham, AL
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: SierraChart
Broker: DDT/Rithmic
Trading: TF/ZN/CL
 
WarEagle's Avatar
 
Posts: 30 since Apr 2010
Thanks: 56 given, 25 received

Ha, nice!

What size screens are you using? Did you get a wall mount or desk mount stand?

Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #569 (permalink)
 indextrader7 
Birmingham, AL
 
 
Posts: 1,065 since Apr 2012


WarEagle View Post
Ha, nice!

What size screens are you using? Did you get a wall mount or desk mount stand?

They're 20" widescreen monitors. Looked at some bigger ones, but I'm just using 1 chart per screen so the 20's work plenty well.

Desk stand is on the way. Right now it's a books stand.

Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #570 (permalink)
 indextrader7 
Birmingham, AL
 
 
Posts: 1,065 since Apr 2012

Today was one of those frustrating days where it seems like most everything goes against you. I kept losses under 1%, but it was just one of those days.

Video recap to follow.

Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #571 (permalink)
 indextrader7 
Birmingham, AL
 
 
Posts: 1,065 since Apr 2012

Sorry it cut off at 5min, but you get the gist of it. Frustrating day. Pretty much comes down to not asking myself the right questions throughout the day such as "where is the market structure? trending? range?"

Bottom line though, you can't win every day (at least I can't), and I'm fine with that. I keep my averaging winning day larger than my average losing day, and I win on more days than I lose. That's a good combination.

Here's the video recap:
Screenr - indextrader7: 8-10-12 trade recap

Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #572 (permalink)
 indextrader7 
Birmingham, AL
 
 
Posts: 1,065 since Apr 2012


Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #573 (permalink)
 indextrader7 
Birmingham, AL
 
 
Posts: 1,065 since Apr 2012

I just realized that yesterday I went 4 for 14 on my trades and was only down 0.8% I'm so pleased with the risk management aspect of the trading.

Today, risk management saved me too. After my first 11 trades I was down, had a nice 20 tick winner for the last trade and brought the day +7 ticks (average tick p/l per contract).

Looking at the trading in hindsight, I missed two very good opportunities today due to me messing around with a countertrend trade both times. I'll cover this more in the video recap to follow.

Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #574 (permalink)
 indextrader7 
Birmingham, AL
 
 
Posts: 1,065 since Apr 2012

Screenr - indextrader7: 8-13-12 recap

Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #575 (permalink)
 indextrader7 
Birmingham, AL
 
 
Posts: 1,065 since Apr 2012

1st half of the day was absolutely horrible trading. Chasing the market all over the place.




2nd half of the day was more like it. Put on a main position, and scaled in and out of it for the rest of the major swing.


Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #576 (permalink)
 indextrader7 
Birmingham, AL
 
 
Posts: 1,065 since Apr 2012

Pretty good trading today. Although could have really improved my 6th trade by waiting for some confirmation to enter. Overall +25 ticks on the day.


Screenr - indextrader7: 8-16-12 recap

Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #577 (permalink)
 traderwerks   is a Vendor
 
 
Posts: 693 since Jun 2009
Thanks: 434 given, 464 received

Why did you switch from the 250Tick chart to the 1 minute chart ?

Preference or maybe summer trading ?

Math. A gateway drug to reality.
Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #578 (permalink)
 indextrader7 
Birmingham, AL
 
 
Posts: 1,065 since Apr 2012

I really dunno man. I was just frustrated with some things as of late, and made a few slight changes like the color of my charts, haha. I love the 250 and will probably bring it back soon.

Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #579 (permalink)
 tihfa 
detroit, mi
 
Experience: Beginner
Platform: TradeStation
Trading: SPY
 
Posts: 72 since Nov 2011
Thanks: 1,461 given, 77 received


indextrader7 View Post
Pretty good trading today. Although could have really improved my 6th trade by waiting for some confirmation to enter. Overall +25 ticks on the day.


Screenr - indextrader7: 8-16-12 recap

would you say that holding on "too early trades around 9:06am" mark was beyond your normal stop loss zone? or the the stops in previous trades were a bit more tight than usually?

thanks,
tihfa

Visit my futures io Trade Journal Reply With Quote
The following user says Thank You to tihfa for this post:
 
(login for full post details)
  #580 (permalink)
 futuretrader 
Como Italy
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: Ninjatrader, customized
Trading: ES
 
Posts: 526 since Feb 2010
Thanks: 471 given, 642 received


indextrader7 View Post
I really dunno man. I was just frustrated with some things as of late, and made a few slight changes like the color of my charts, haha. I love the 250 and will probably bring it back soon.

Not a huge difference in swing size, but the 1 minute is definitely faster:




Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #581 (permalink)
 indextrader7 
Birmingham, AL
 
 
Posts: 1,065 since Apr 2012


tihfa View Post
would you say that holding on "too early trades around 9:06am" mark was beyond your normal stop loss zone? or the the stops in previous trades were a bit more tight than usually?

thanks,
tihfa

It looks like from the first (worst) entry I went through a 12 tick MAE. This is within acceptable risk tolerances for the size I was trading.

I suppose I do go through different ways of managing losing trades. Sometimes I don't allow it to hardly print a candle against me before exiting. Sometimes I allow it to print a swing against me as in the trade we're talking about. I guess it depends on market structure, conviction/confidence, etc.

Maybe I would be better off sticking with the tighter method. I don't know... Exits are a funny thing. You can't ever do the right thing 100% of the time. Take profits and it might run, don't take profits and it might turn sharply on you. All you can do is what you feel is best for the given structure of the market. Range = take more profits sooner/at targets, trend= opportunity to let it run. The main deal is never being frustrated with less than perfection, cause it's all we have to work with.

Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #582 (permalink)
 indextrader7 
Birmingham, AL
 
 
Posts: 1,065 since Apr 2012


futuretrader View Post
Not a huge difference in swing size, but the 1 minute is definitely faster:

Thanks for the stats there. Could you give a bit of a written explanation? I'm having a bit of trouble knowing for certain how to read those tables. I take it that it's a distribution of respective candle lengths in points?

Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #583 (permalink)
 futuretrader 
Como Italy
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: Ninjatrader, customized
Trading: ES
 
Posts: 526 since Feb 2010
Thanks: 471 given, 642 received


indextrader7 View Post
Thanks for the stats there. Could you give a bit of a written explanation? I'm having a bit of trouble knowing for certain how to read those tables. I take it that it's a distribution of respective candle lengths in points?

Sure, happy to oblige - it's thanks to you that I've got back into playing with Excel.

Doing tables of swing size distribution is an idea from @FuturesTrader71 (he talks about it in one of his webinars, and has posts about it on his website).

Basically, you take your chart of choice, apply your zigzag of choice, output the data and then paste it into Excel. So the study isn't of candle size but of swing size in points.

Then you just set up the bins for swing size, and count the number of occurences in each. The most frequent size (what would be called the POC in a volume profile) is colored red, green marks the limit of the first standard deviation, and yellow the second. So you have a pretty good idea of what constitutes a normal rotation, what sort of 'tail' you might reasonably anticipate before getting a swing pullback, etc.

As you can see, there's almost a 3 tick difference in average swing size between the 250 tick chart and the 1 minute, and the main distributions shift about 2 ticks.

Reply With Quote
The following user says Thank You to futuretrader for this post:
 
(login for full post details)
  #584 (permalink)
 Surly 
denver, colorado
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NT
Trading: ZS
 
Surly's Avatar
 
Posts: 704 since Mar 2011
Thanks: 628 given, 1,258 received


futuretrader View Post
Sure, happy to oblige - it's thanks to you that I've got back into playing with Excel.

Doing tables of swing size distribution is an idea from @FuturesTrader71 (he talks about it in one of his webinars, and has posts about it on his website).

Basically, you take your chart of choice, apply your zigzag of choice, output the data and then paste it into Excel. So the study isn't of candle size but of swing size in points.

Then you just set up the bins for swing size, and count the number of occurences in each. The most frequent size (what would be called the POC in a volume profile) is colored red, green marks the limit of the first standard deviation, and yellow the second. So you have a pretty good idea of what constitutes a normal rotation, what sort of 'tail' you might reasonably anticipate before getting a swing pullback, etc.

As you can see, there's almost a 3 tick difference in average swing size between the 250 tick chart and the 1 minute, and the main distributions shift about 2 ticks.

Don't want to distract from this thread too much but could you post a "recipe" for doing this? I use NT and would love a list of specific instructions - specifically I don't know how to "output the data". I'd like to do this for some other markets I trade. Feel free to PM but I thought I'd ask on the thread so all can benefit. Thanks in advance!

Seek freedom and become captive of your desires. Seek discipline and find your liberty. - Frank Herbert
Visit my futures io Trade Journal Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #585 (permalink)
 indextrader7 
Birmingham, AL
 
 
Posts: 1,065 since Apr 2012


futuretrader View Post
Basically, you take your chart of choice, apply your zigzag of choice, output the data and then paste it into Excel. So the study isn't of candle size but of swing size in points.

As you can see, there's almost a 3 tick difference in average swing size between the 250 tick chart and the 1 minute, and the main distributions shift about 2 ticks.

Did you limit the time for this? As in, I would like to see the data from only 8:30AM CST to 11:00AM CST. AKA only the relevant swings for my normal trading session. I would think that if you simply did it for all 24 hours, you would get some real scewed data comparing 250tick vs 1min (1 min flattens out much more since it's time based).

Again, would love to see data only from the aforementioned session.

Great work, and keep it up!!

Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #586 (permalink)
 futuretrader 
Como Italy
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: Ninjatrader, customized
Trading: ES
 
Posts: 526 since Feb 2010
Thanks: 471 given, 642 received


Surly View Post
Don't want to distract from this thread too much but could you post a "recipe" for doing this? I use NT and would love a list of specific instructions - specifically I don't know how to "output the data". I'd like to do this for some other markets I trade. Feel free to PM but I thought I'd ask on the thread so all can benefit. Thanks in advance!

IRT and I think Sierra have that built in; unfortunately with NT you have to modify the indicator.

I think there's a version of the ZigZagUTC floating around that does this. I modified the PriceActionSwing indicator. I can upload it if you like.

Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #587 (permalink)
 futuretrader 
Como Italy
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: Ninjatrader, customized
Trading: ES
 
Posts: 526 since Feb 2010
Thanks: 471 given, 642 received


indextrader7 View Post
Did you limit the time for this? As in, I would like to see the data from only 8:30AM CST to 11:00AM CST. AKA only the relevant swings for my normal trading session. I would think that if you simply did it for all 24 hours, you would get some real scewed data comparing 250tick vs 1min (1 min flattens out much more since it's time based).

Again, would love to see data only from the aforementioned session.

Great work, and keep it up!!

I agree about the overnight, it would be a pointless comparison. Those were stats from 9:30-16:15 EST, with 90 days loaded. My guess is that if you also eliminate the RTH volume extremes, both high and low, they would converge quite a bit.

I'll run the morning session and post the results - maybe I'll even figure out how to automate the Excel part a bit more.....

Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #588 (permalink)
 futuretrader 
Como Italy
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: Ninjatrader, customized
Trading: ES
 
Posts: 526 since Feb 2010
Thanks: 471 given, 642 received

OK, here's the morning session for the 1 minute and 250 tick charts. I forgot to say how I defined the swing; it's 2 bars lower/higher on either side of the pivot bar.

Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	TF_250T_Morning.png
Views:	72
Size:	14.5 KB
ID:	85796   Click image for larger version

Name:	TF_1_Minute_Morning.png
Views:	63
Size:	14.7 KB
ID:	85797  
Reply With Quote
The following user says Thank You to futuretrader for this post:
 
(login for full post details)
  #589 (permalink)
 Nicolas11 
near Paris, France
 
Experience: Beginner
Platform: -
Trading: -
 
Nicolas11's Avatar
 
Posts: 1,071 since Aug 2011
Thanks: 2,232 given, 1,755 received

Hi,


futuretrader View Post
maybe I'll even figure out how to automate the Excel part a bit more.....

With some platforms, you can write some lines of code to show the distribution directly within the platform, as an indicator, which allows to avoid the Excel step.
And you can change the parameters (250 ticks --> 2 min), and the distribution is automatically updated.

I have done it with Sierra Chart, but I do not know if it is possible with Ninja Trader.

The idea is to code an indicator.
This indicator will only work on the last bar of the chart.
On this last bar, it will analyze all bars, and count the number of swings in each "bin".
And the indicator will show this distribution.

My point here is just to indicate you this possible way to get rid of Excel in the process.

Nicolas




Visit my futures io Trade Journal Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #590 (permalink)
 indextrader7 
Birmingham, AL
 
 
Posts: 1,065 since Apr 2012

Solid trading today, and TF was a great market to be trading today. Hope you all bagged some pips.

Here's the video recap of the trades (not much to it today, really straightforward):

Screenr - indextrader7: 8-21 recap

Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #591 (permalink)
 indextrader7 
Birmingham, AL
 
 
Posts: 1,065 since Apr 2012

I admit that I haven't been as candid with my trading lately as I have been in the past. It's because I've been struggling. You can probably tell from some of the videos how I've been overtrading and doing other rookie-esque things. I went 27 straight trading days in a row without making more than 10 average ticks per contract in a day. Wow, but since August 16 I've broken that streak. During the streak I lost 229 ticks. This doubled my previous largest tick drawdown.



It's been to the detriment of people learning here and following a trading journey, as well as a detriment to myself that I haven't been more open about it. So:

Yes, I've been struggling, but I'm really building confidence back and getting into the swing of things lately. Yesterday and today have been really great days (not because they were positive days, but because they were days where I did the right things the vast majority of the time, made good trading decisions).

One thing to note is that I really cut down on position size for this struggling period. Although I doubled my tick drawdown, my $ drawdown was kept to roughly the same level. It's really counter intuitive and really not comfortable, but in hindsight it's really the best play. I always want to double up and make things back quickly, but cutting position size while in a struggle period is THE absolute thing to do. It takes some pressure off, and allows you to focus on getting your groove back. I think that's how Stella did it anyways...

Another thought is... what caused this? I think it's a combination of things but very much mainly:

I took a LOT of time away from trading. I was destroying markets almost every day for months, and then I went to California, lost internet for weeks, a couple beach trips, etc, etc. Then I hop back in the drivers seat and expect to just be a trading master again. Trading is too hard for that, especially given the flow/descretion that I use. I don't just follow some rules so I can sit back down and follow rules again easily.

One other thing to consider is that all traders have periods of underperformance. So, I have to take that into consideration as well.

So I would like to say I'm sorry for "letting you guys down" and not journaling through this difficult period, it has probably made it harder on me not to talk about it. We all know it was pride that got in the way, as well as fear of not being seen as a "good trader". I'm glad we had this conversation.

-IT7

Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #592 (permalink)
 indextrader7 
Birmingham, AL
 
 
Posts: 1,065 since Apr 2012

Here's a picture of my daily ticks p/l. I've highlighted the lackluster performance.


Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #593 (permalink)
 Traderwolf 
Raleigh,NC
 
Experience: None
Platform: Versatile and Stable
Broker: Reliable and Accurate
Trading: Money
 
Traderwolf's Avatar
 
Posts: 250 since Feb 2012
Thanks: 154 given, 1,028 received


indextrader7 View Post
So I would like to say I'm sorry for "letting you guys down" and not journaling through this difficult period, it has probably made it harder on me not to talk about it. We all know it was pride that got in the way, as well as fear of not being seen as a "good trader". I'm glad we had this conversation.

-IT7

IT7,

You haven't let anyone down.. Your journal has been a great with some solid ideas for other traders. The fact that you publicly admitted your trading was not up to par is a sign of a mature trader who has their ego in check. I can say I would have probably canned the journal in disgust and "disappeared" . You did not do that.

Hats off to you for your candid conversation. The fact that you have had it and will self assess what needs to change is a self fulfilling prophecy to change what is wrong in your trading.

Thanks again,

Wolf

Reply With Quote
The following 5 users say Thank You to Traderwolf for this post:
 
(login for full post details)
  #594 (permalink)
 WarEagle 
Birmingham, AL
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: SierraChart
Broker: DDT/Rithmic
Trading: TF/ZN/CL
 
WarEagle's Avatar
 
Posts: 30 since Apr 2010
Thanks: 56 given, 25 received

^^^What he said...^^^

Reply With Quote
The following user says Thank You to WarEagle for this post:
 
(login for full post details)
  #595 (permalink)
 indextrader7 
Birmingham, AL
 
 
Posts: 1,065 since Apr 2012

Continuing to fight back.


Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #596 (permalink)
 indextrader7 
Birmingham, AL
 
 
Posts: 1,065 since Apr 2012

Happy with the first two short trades taken. The 3rd and 4th trades were attempts to get long based on a gut feeling that the tail from the 9AM news announcement would hold prices and print the low for the day. I got stopped on the bottom tick of the day (as of now), ended up making the day profitable on a few scalped long positions that I added to when favorable and took profits a few times at resistance.

Not the best day, but happy with grinding out a profit. Not too happy with my intuition trade against the prevailing trend.


Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #597 (permalink)
 indextrader7 
Birmingham, AL
 
 
Posts: 1,065 since Apr 2012

PERFORMANCE RATIO (WIN:LOSS RATIO X WIN%)




THE INDIVIDUAL STATS THAT MAKE UP THE PERFORMANCE RATIO:



AVERAGE WINS AND LOSSES PLOTTED SEPERATELY, AND MY DRAWDOWN GRAPH (BEEN IN DD ALL MONTH)


Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #598 (permalink)
 indextrader7 
Birmingham, AL
 
 
Posts: 1,065 since Apr 2012

Here is a pic of the trades today. Pretty straightforward stuff, only area for improvement was trade 3 could have been scratched earlier once the hammer formed (bullish signal and I was short). I waited for my stop above resistance to get hit (still a valid play, but usually once I hate that I'm in a trade.... means I should just get out).

Completely pulled out of the extended drawdown I've been in after today's session. One of the best feelings I've had in a while... seeing hard work, focus, attitude, and the like, pay off.

Enjoy your weekends. If there's any questions on today's trades just ask.


Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #599 (permalink)
 indextrader7 
Birmingham, AL
 
 
Posts: 1,065 since Apr 2012

Quite ugly trading today. Went 1 for 8! I know for a fact that it has to do with the type of market movement today. The large swings. It puts my trend change level very far away, so I'm looking for pullbacks when in fact it's already turned around and headed the other way. Completely off from the cycles.

Good thing for very tight risk management. Only down 0.7% on the day even with 7 losers and 1 winner.

Review to come. I'm still trying to figure out things myself.

Reply With Quote
 
(login for full post details)
  #600 (permalink)
 tihfa 
detroit, mi
 
Experience: Beginner
Platform: TradeStation
Trading: SPY
 
Posts: 72 since Nov 2011
Thanks: 1,461 given, 77 received


indextrader7 View Post

Good thing for very tight risk management. Only down 0.7% on the day even with 7 losers and 1 winner.

.

pretty awesome to exercise tight risk management.

looking forward to your analysis.

thanks,
tihfa

Visit my futures io Trade Journal Reply With Quote
The following user says Thank You to tihfa for this post:


futures io Trading Community Trading Journals > Short term TF trading


Last Updated on June 9, 2013


Upcoming Webinars and Events
 

NinjaTrader Indicator Challenge!

Ongoing

NEW BlackBird Features + FOREX Support w/Jeremy Tang @ SharkIndicators

Elite only
 

Our 12-year anniversary w/ $$,$$$ prizes (check soon)

June
     



Copyright © 2021 by futures io, s.a., Av Ricardo J. Alfaro, Century Tower, Panama, Ph: +507 833-9432 (Panama and Intl), +1 888-312-3001 (USA and Canada), info@futures.io
All information is for educational use only and is not investment advice.
There is a substantial risk of loss in trading commodity futures, stocks, options and foreign exchange products. Past performance is not indicative of future results.
no new posts