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new Emini hours problems!!!


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new Emini hours problems!!!

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  #1 (permalink)
 Volt 
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Now that the ES emini has taken over and there is no longer officially an S&P500 pit I was wondering what most are using for trading hours on charts? The emini ( all times Eastern time) opens at 9:30 for the day session as it always has but closes at 5 pm...no more shut down to settle at 4:15 etc... then reopens at 6pm. So it takes a one hour break between 5 and 6 pm. The CME establishes the settlement at 4 pm like they always have but the close is actually 5 pm. On think or swim charts for example their day session still ends at 4:15. Everything else is considered after hours to them.

So for those of us who use indicators based on highs and lows and closes ( Like pivot points) or market profile etc what is being used as the "Day session" and what is considered the "Evening" session. Can't use 4:15 because it doesn't close anymore at that time. Do we use 5 pm for a day session close even though the cash market has settled an hour before? Confused on this and CME has been no help to chartists!

Volt

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 trendisyourfriend 
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I consider both the 5PM close or last price and Settlement price. For pivots which i don't use i'd use the settlement price.

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 Volt 
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that interesting but so many indicators are based on closing price so even though you don't use pivots per se what about all the other bazzilion indicators out there ? We can't be running two sets of all these indicators. It seems we need to pick one. Like last Thursday in ES there was a 6.5 point difference between settlement and closing price. So far I am leaning towards closing price but keep a watch when the cash goes from red to green or changes direction especially if I am trading a gap fill trade or something like that. thanks
trendisyourfriend View Post
I consider both the 5PM close or last price and Settlement price. For pivots which i don't use i'd use the settlement price.


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 tr8er 
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I now use 9:30 am ET - 4:00 pm ET for the day-session (instead 4:15 pm ET, because of the new settlement) and of course no change in the over-night or 24h-chart or ETH or however you want to call it (because there is no change)

so if you want to use PP or Volume-Profile just for the day-session it is ok if you use (9am to 4pm) otherwise special for PP most traders I know, use the 24 h-charts (and there is no change it is 6pm to 5pm)

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 matthew28 
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Agree with Volt and Tr8er.
I use RTH Market Profile and now have it running till 4pm rather than 4:15pm. I just look at that chart so the RTH high and low are my references though I do also note the ETH high and low in my journal just to see whether the yesterday's RTH and ETH highs/lows coincide or are markedly different.
If I was using indicators that referenced the close I would carry on with them as they are using the new slightly later close.

I have just watched a Jim Dalton Market Profile webinar recording from a few weeks back and in that he mentioned that he now marks on his chart the settle and the close from the previous day as he thinks the market is now paying more attention to the closing price. He was talking about the ES.

I think you could probably make an equally valid argument for choosing either 4pm, or 5pm, (but not so much anymore for the Think or Swim close at 4:15pm)

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 Volt 
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Did Dalton happen to say how he deals with gaps and if he is letting it run until 5 pm EST ? reason I ask is because if you look at last Thursday as an example the market had a 6 - 7 point run up into the 5 pm close and left single prints . Yesterday we tested that high but if you cut off your session early then you would not see the gap fill. Here is part of it


matthew28 View Post
Agree with Volt and Tr8er.

I have just watched a Jim Dalton Market Profile webinar recording from a few weeks back and in that he mentioned that he now marks on his chart the settle and the close from the previous day as he thinks the market is now paying more attention to the closing price. He was talking about the ES.


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 tr8er 
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No idea how Dalton handles it, but I would say you have to find your own style.

I use for MP just the day-session-levels (9:30 am ET - 4:00 pm ET)
for VP I use the 24h-chart, also for PP I use the 24h-chart

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 Volt 
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yeah, I can understand finding the high and low volume areas with the 24 hour chart but my brief use of the 5 pm close and pivots gives much better results then the 24 hour chart but it's too soon to tell. Previous use of just day session pivots yields better results then all session. That is from a two decades use of comparing the two but if it works for you then use 24 hour.
tr8er View Post
No idea how Dalton handles it, but I would say you have to find your own style.

I use for MP just the day-session-levels (9:30 am ET - 4:00 pm ET)
for VP I use the 24h-chart, also for PP I use the 24h-chart


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 trendisyourfriend 
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This is the default template within Ninjatrader for the RTH session:


I think if the CME removed the previous 3:15PM CT that was certianly to remove some of the confusion. For profiling i use the above template and draw a line for the settlement just to be sure i consider all options.

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 Volt 
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yeah, I think if the CME is using 16:00 as a closing time then so should we. Until I see something different , my charts will run for the day session from 8:30 - 4 pm CST. Thanks for all the input
trendisyourfriend View Post
This is the default template within Ninjatrader for the RTH session:


I think if the CME removed the previous 3:15PM CT that was certianly to remove some of the confusion. For profiling i use the above template and draw a line for the settlement just to be sure i consider all options.


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