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I have no "edge" - Should I throw in the towel?


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I have no "edge" - Should I throw in the towel?

  #91 (permalink)
 
danimal7777's Avatar
 danimal7777 
Verona, KY
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: jigsaw, sierra, TWS
Trading: ES, currencies
Posts: 5 since May 2019
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Try Adam Grimes free trading course at MarketlifeTrading. It is built around the concept of "finding edge". You won't be sorry, IMO.

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  #92 (permalink)
 
SMCJB's Avatar
 SMCJB 
Houston TX
Legendary Market Wizard
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: TT and Stellar
Broker: Advantage Futures
Trading: Primarily Energy but also a little Equities, Fixed Income, Metals and Crypto.
Frequency: Many times daily
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YogaTrading View Post
Please dont take that as a slight, I laughed hard when I read it, its real
Ahhh...the difference between passion and desire and.... just the want

Cheers....

From another thread, very similar to this


SMCJB View Post
Okay I'll say what nobody else seems to have said.

Even though you'd love this to work have you ever considered that maybe this isn't for you and that you should move on?

I'd love to be an NFL Middle Linebacker but it ain't ever going to happen no matter how much I love it or how matter I try.


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  #93 (permalink)
 jgilmo 
Largo Florida USA
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: Ninjatrader
Trading: ES
Posts: 26 since Apr 2016
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Look there are ways you can use just ten ticks if trading the Naz you can up it to 20 here is my Edge using Fibonacci fans different color lines for different setups using ABC patterns and pivots I placed the arrows on the trades so you can see there are ways... NQ today
Capture.PNGNAZTODAY

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  #94 (permalink)
 
YogaTrading's Avatar
 YogaTrading 
Las Vegas, Nevada, USA
 
Experience: Beginner
Platform: NinjaTrader
Broker: Dorman Trading
Trading: ES
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SMCJB View Post
From another thread, very similar to this

You are a realist and there is a lot to said for knowing when you cant be an NFL linebacker
I was 6' 3" 260 but was not mean enough to be in the NFL...

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  #95 (permalink)
Rustic
Bucharest
 
Posts: 26 since Mar 2020
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Edges in the markets are very small and elusive, you can only tell if they work after years of trading.
I encourage you to listen to Adam Grimes' interviews on "Chat with traders" where he dissects this important subject.

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  #96 (permalink)
 Avant 
Brisbane Australia
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: Ninjatrader
Trading: SPI and Emini futures
Posts: 11 since Nov 2012
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tonybravo View Post
I have no edge. I don't know what my edge could be. I'm trading blind. Today I lost $50 by over trading and just being wrong

I started with just $1000 near the end of April. I'm down by $280.

I can't seem to get this right. I go long, I'm down 10 ticks. I go short, then the contract moves 10 ticks upwards. Once in a while I'll get lucky and catch a 20 tick move but then it's back to getting it wrong constantly.

I'm trading the mes contracts. 1 at a time.

Should I just withdrawal and go home or do I keep trying to get better?

It just seems that no matter what direction I choose I have it wrong.



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My two cents worth .... get to know market structure ---- movement on the Emini is mostly between Support and Resistance areas .... when there is a move to a resistance area the price will cross the 10 period ema as it moves to the resistance zone (I use a 5 minute chart) .... the MA will act as a trailing stop. Enter above the MA 'at market and place an MIT two or three ticks below the support line .... same thing when price moves to support .... try to capture one to two points and then wait for the next move ....

Buy double or triple bottoms and sell double or triple tops ... with tight stops ... and re-enter if necessary ... the other two patterns that are useful are 'triangles and flags ... these patterns provide price targets and you can use the same system as above

Thesis for this style of trading ... price always respects support and resistance levels ...

I never use angular trend lines ... only horizontal price levels ... and the 10 period ema.

When the market is trending ... buy or sell on pullbacks ... until the trend is broke'

Never buy at resistance and never sell at support ..... I never trade breakouts on the emini but wait for pullback and then start the above process all over again

Before the trading day make sure you prepare by identifying the support and resistance levels. Know these areas before trading and mentally rehearse possible trading these levels ... never trade on payroll data day ... on the day ... wait ..

Stops ... I use tight stops and then re-enter if I need to .... the 10 period ema and support and resistance areas are important to my trading .... but most importantly preparation is the key

Never try to pick direction on the emini it is far too volatile ... that is a losing game ... stick to rules ... buy above 10 period ema and sell below

That is it .... and good luck ... and never be greedy

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  #97 (permalink)
 ARoses 
Singapore
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: Tradestation
Broker: Tradestation
Trading: ES, GC, CL
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You need a trading plan, based on a trading system with clearly defined conditions for setup, entry trigger, position sizing and exit algorithm etc. Then paper trade or backtest this trading plan to see if it statistically makes money. Then do some forward testing in a demo account. Once you see that the trading system is profitable you should be ready to trade in your live account. Your trading plan should be a combination of edges. Plan the trade, and trade the plan. That should get you a long way.

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  #98 (permalink)
brunohassan
Curitiba, Parana/Brazil
 
Posts: 3 since May 2017
Thanks Given: 3
Thanks Received: 1


tonybravo View Post
I have no edge. I don't know what my edge could be. I'm trading blind. Today I lost $50 by over trading and just being wrong

I started with just $1000 near the end of April. I'm down by $280.

I can't seem to get this right. I go long, I'm down 10 ticks. I go short, then the contract moves 10 ticks upwards. Once in a while I'll get lucky and catch a 20 tick move but then it's back to getting it wrong constantly.

I'm trading the mes contracts. 1 at a time.

Should I just withdrawal and go home or do I keep trying to get better?

It just seems that no matter what direction I choose I have it wrong.



Sent using the NexusFi mobile app

Ok.
First: Thank you for sharing your difficulties. Admitting and looking for help is the most healthy way to improve. Congrats!

Now answering your question. If you think you have no edge, then you definitely don't have it. So, STOP TRADING RIGHT NOW! Go to simulation. I don't know If you are flow trader, chartist or spread trader. Neither if trade scalp, trade location or day trade. It's tricky to help without knowing what are you looking for.

Let me say this: Edge is an advantage over the market. A pattern you perceive that gives you a probability of capitalize your margin.
For its own nature, an edge is at same time objective and subjective. Objective because must be measurable (or falsifiable in science method). Subjective because it depends of the human mind and then influenceable by human emotions.

Your edge must be learned. And demands time and effort. It's not possible for one person to put 1k into the broker and starts to taking profits. It is not that easy. Personally, I have two years of watching price ladder (I am a price ladder scalper) in one specific market and now I can say I am finding my edge. And it was very hard and frustrating to developing it.

But also, I must say, the edge is only 30% of your trading process. 70% is about to risk management. When you enter in a trade you must know where it you probable gain and your probable loss. And you have to manage it. You must know you likehood of hit your gain before hit you loss. Also, you must have distinct Value At Risk. For each trade, daily, weekly and monthy. And you must stick on it.
You said you lose 28% of your capital (1k), and lost 5% in one trade. You should be more conservative on your loss. Some say you should never risk more then 2% of capital each trade. I suggest 0,2%. So, to you lose 50 USD, you should have 10k into broker. And never lose more then 2,5% a Day. This is a more reasonable approach.

Everytime I enter in a trade, I ask these questions to myself: "Why I am entering this trade?"; "Where is my most probable positive gain?";"Where is my tinyest stop loss if I am wrong?";"Are the odds in my favour?"; "What must be happen to I remain in this trade?".

Sorry for beeing too long. This is an extensive topic. Hope it helps

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  #99 (permalink)
 itrader46 
Manchester, UK
 
Experience: Beginner
Platform: Ninja Trader
Trading: Emini, Currency Futures
Posts: 28 since Sep 2017
Thanks Given: 11
Thanks Received: 19

It looks like you need to learn order flow, to improve your entries. It's not easy, but this is the only way. Don't rely blindly on indicators and levels. You need to see what's happening at the level before entry. Check out Axia Futures YouTube channel or even better, enrol for the Career Course online, or better still do the In-House course if you can afford

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  #100 (permalink)
 
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 tigertrader 
Philly, Pa
Legendary Market Wizard
 
Experience: Master
Platform: NinjaTrader
Trading: ES, ZB
Posts: 6,482 since Jul 2010
Thanks Given: 6,662
Thanks Received: 36,258


I find it ironic, but not surprising that this thread is currently the most active thread on the forum. In the almost 10 years that I've been a member, (and @Big Mike will attest to this fact) we've gone through many, many, iterations of discussions on this very topic. It's almost a cyclical phenomenon. Another generation of aspiring traders embarking on what they think is going to be a walk-in-the-park, until they discover that achieving success in trading isn't quite as easy as they had envisioned.

Most of them are under-capitalized, and the majority of them don't know the difference between a stock and a bond. A lot of them believe the market owes them a living, and will blame the market for their lack of success, when in fact they lack the self-determination to succeed. There is nothing novel about this phenomenon. And, there is certainly nothing surprising about the response it is generating.

Other aspiring traders are eager to offer their advice. What's ironic is most of these traders are experiencing the same problems, and are incompetent at trading themselves. Incompetent traders are at a double disadvantage, since they are not only incompetent, but they are unawre of it. Almost 1/2 of them couldn't even pony up the $ to become elite members, most are on SIM and have no skin in the game, and I truly wonder how many of the others are consistently profitable to the point, where they can actually support themselves and a family, from their trading. Yet they are crawling all over themselves to tell-like-it-is; to explain how they have reinvented the wheel, and found the answer to the eternal question.

Their advice is a panoply of retail aphorisms and urban trading myths that have been propagated over the years, and regurgitated to the newbie masses. And, it's the same worthless garbage every time. You have to find your edge! Trade your plan! Find what suits you and makes you comfortable. Find a nice indicator you can settle down with and crank out 4 tics at a time. I haven't heard one expert that was offering advice say, "learn how the markets work" before you attempt to trade it.

What's ironic, Is that you'll never see these "experts" participating in threads about the markets and trading, because they really have little knowledge of how markets function, and little idea of what it really takes to make consistent and scalable profits. But they are very inclined to tell a newbie how to trade, and dispense advice with no uncertainty, blissfully ignorant of their own ineptitude. This only serves to perpetuate the cycle of retail mis-information, and re-cycle uninformed, unprepared traders that provide the winners their fresh and unknowing counterparts.

Most people are unlikely to think highly of anyone whose views they oppose. So when the newbie thinks about which person to listen to, whose advice to respect, and where to get his information, it’s likely that he will choose the one that parallels his views, even though it may not be in his best interest. There have been countless times that @Big Mike and I have tried to steer people in the right direction, but people hear what they want to hear and disregard the rest. And what's sad, not ironic, is that these words will probably fall on deaf ears, or not really be comprehended nor believed, and most assuredly, they will be ignored by most.

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Last Updated on July 19, 2020


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