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The Tax Thread
Updated: Views / Replies:40,680 / 222
Created: by Big Mike Attachments:3

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The Tax Thread

  #131 (permalink)
Membership Temporarily Revoked
Portugal, Viana do Castelo
 
Futures Experience: Intermediate
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Big Mike View Post
I'd like to start a new subject on Tax Avoidance (legal).

As many of you know, I am looking to move out of the country soon and "retire". Retirement is more a state of mind and financial independence, as I plan to continue to trade and would never imagine not trading.

I've been trying to do homework on how to minimize taxes as a US Citizen but living in, and trading from, another country. I am hitting a lot of roadblocks.

There has to be a lot of people here in a similar situation, so I'm looking for some suggestions to point me in the right direction before I hire a professional.

Mike


Hi Bigmike,

There is a guidebook online that is called the International Trust Guidebook you can find it here:
International Man ?Trust Guidebook? | Casey Research

Iam looking for a free version

Iam a Portuguese citizen and looking for a way to avoid tax in a legal way and here in Portugal it is like in the US, you have to pay taxes on all the income that you or any business that you own, make, so simply forming an offshore structure is considered tax evasion but there are some loop holes. A trust formation is an unknown form here in Portugal so the way to do it is with a trust formation and then with that Trust you form an offshore company and you can trade under the name of that offshore company.

I do not know how you can do it in the US but I think you will find valuable information in that guide book.

Good trading,
JJ

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  #132 (permalink)
Trading Apprentice
Orlando+Florida/USA
 
Futures Experience: Intermediate
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jsengxx2 View Post
Hi Bigmike,

There is a guidebook online that is called the International Trust Guidebook you can find it here:
International Man ?Trust Guidebook? | Casey Research

Iam looking for a free version

Iam a Portuguese citizen and looking for a way to avoid tax in a legal way and here in Portugal it is like in the US, you have to pay taxes on all the income that you or any business that you own, make, so simply forming an offshore structure is considered tax evasion but there are some loop holes. A trust formation is an unknown form here in Portugal so the way to do it is with a trust formation and then with that Trust you form an offshore company and you can trade under the name of that offshore company.

I do not know how you can do it in the US but I think you will find valuable information in that guide book.

Good trading,
JJ

This book you have a link to, on there website they state "Find out how to take advantage of this strategy before the government outlaws it (they're already working on it)." Last year when the US changed the banking laws they didn't state this new law, is for new US citizen, wanting to open a bank account outside the USA. The new laws applied to ever US citizen and every bank in the world.
I think it all comes down to how much profit you make each year trading

Where do you live? Portugal? It so, north, south what city is close to you?
Thanks LD

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  #133 (permalink)
Membership Temporarily Revoked
Portugal, Viana do Castelo
 
Futures Experience: Intermediate
Platform: ninjatrader
Favorite Futures: 6e
 
Posts: 358 since Sep 2011
Thanks: 187 given, 343 received



lawdam View Post
This book you have a link to, on there website they state "Find out how to take advantage of this strategy before the government outlaws it (they're already working on it)." Last year when the US changed the banking laws they didn't state this new law, is for new US citizen, wanting to open a bank account outside the USA. The new laws applied to ever US citizen and every bank in the world.
I think it all comes down to how much profit you make each year trading

Where do you live? Portugal? It so, north, south what city is close to you?
Thanks LD

Hi,

I live in a small city called Viana do Castelo.

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  #134 (permalink)
Elite Member
Kirkland, WA/United States
 
Futures Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NinjaTrader
Broker/Data: Optimus/Vision/Rithmic
Favorite Futures: Futures
 
LightWeight's Avatar
 
Posts: 138 since Jul 2012
Thanks: 138 given, 42 received

Hey everyone, it's getting to tax time so I had a few questions if anyone might know:

This was my first year trading (futures only), and I obviously had expenses -- new computer and monitors, lifetime Ninja license, software, etc. Am I able to deduct all those as an individual trader, with no business license or anything?

Also, do I need to get a CPA, or because I only traded futures (and only have 1099's from two brokers), would it be easy enough to do them on my own? I also have a day job, which is also 1099. It SEEMS like it all shouldn't be that complicated, but having not been through this before I'm not sure if that's accurate or not, especially if I'm looking to deduct things.

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  #135 (permalink)
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London + UK
 
Futures Experience: Advanced
Platform: Proprietary Analytics
Broker/Data: Multiple broker + Multiple feed
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sands's Avatar
 
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Any opinions on UK corporate structures for futures trading, to help reduce tax liabilities?

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  #136 (permalink)
Elite Member
Porto Alegre RS/Brazil
 
Futures Experience: Advanced
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Posts: 6 since Mar 2014
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What happens when I trade SP500 futures and DAX futures on a broker (mirus for example) and I am brazilian?

Do I have to pay taxes to USA on SP500 fututres and Germany on DAX futures?

Or I don`t pay any taxes to USA and Germany?


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  #137 (permalink)
Elite Member
Porto Alegre RS/Brazil
 
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blessedone View Post
What happens when I trade SP500 futures and DAX futures on a broker (mirus for example) and I am brazilian?

Do I have to pay taxes to USA on SP500 fututres and Germany on DAX futures?

Or I don`t pay any taxes to USA and Germany?


Just discovered.

You don`t have to pay for USA or Germany. You have to pay on Brazil 15% on capital gains if not daytrading.

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  #138 (permalink)
Elite Member
Valdosta, GA. U.S.A
 
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2014 Taxes

I found this Article that may be interesting to check out:

False Tax Claims

I gather from this Article that our Tax for the Long term Capital Gains would now be 20% .
I calculate if Trading Futures in 2014, and looking at the 60/40 split, as 60 is calculated now at 20% Long Term Capital Gains, and
the 40 is still calculated at your Regular rate.


Last edited by sandptrader; July 21st, 2014 at 09:42 AM.
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  #139 (permalink)
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Munich, Germany
 
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Revisiting the Roth IRA option


MWinfrey View Post
I do not have a separate business set up to trade in. I trade in a joint account and only trade futures. I get a single 1099 at the end of the year from my broker. This 1099 simplifies things considerably and as such is a single taxable event regardless how many trades I place during the year. I am taxed on the amount of profit/loss reported on that 1099 and that's it. Very simple.

My plan for the near future is to trade from a Roth account. When I turn 59 1/2, I will be able to withdraw from my Roth account without penalty. By definition as I understand the tax laws is that proceeds from a Roth account are not taxable. Only contributions made to the Roth account are taxable at the time of the contribution. So, being as I will be trading from an existing Roth account, any money made trading futures will not be taxed when I withdraw the money. Further, because I don't any other form of income from a "real" job, proceeds from my Roth account will not effect my ability to draw social security.

Anyone with experience or knowledge contrary to what I've outlined is very welcome to comment.

Hello MWinfrey & All.

I am curious as to whether anyone here has pursued this avenue. I have been doing a little research on tax law as it relates to Roth IRAs, and have a cunning plan. Here is what I have found:
  • Contributions made to an IRA may be withdrawn at any time without tax or penalty, as the tax burden on that money has already been fulfilled. (This is a very important point for may plan)
  • A person may have multiple IRA accounts, but total contributions to those accounts are limited to the annual contribution limit set by the IRS. (i.e. If your limit is $6,000 a year and you have 3 Roth IRAs you could contribute $2,000 to each, or divide it up any way you choose, as long as the total is not more than $6,000)
  • Earnings (dividends and interest) on a Roth IRA cannot be withdrawn without penalty and interest until 5 years have passed from January 1st of the year in which the first contribution is attributed (5 year rule).
  • For anyone having more than one Roth IRA the 5 year rule is considered satisfied for all accounts once it has been satisfied for one of them. (This is also important for my plan)
  • Earnings also cannot be withdrawn without penalty and/or interest until the age of 59, except for certain "qualified reasons."
  • As the IRS views multiple Roth IRA accounts as one account for tax purposes, withdrawls can be made from any account, subject to the rules above.

So this is my plan:

I have been contributing to a Roth IRA for many years. I am 56 years old so have 3 years before I can withdraw any earnings. My plan is to open up a second Roth IRA as a trading account. I will fund it with part of my 2014 contribution, and will forgo that part for my regular Roth IRA for this year. As of 2015 I will continue making full contributions to that account. That way, except for this year's exclusion, my trading will in no way affect my retirement account.

Hopefully the 2nd Roth IRA will grow from my trading. Once it has grown to the point where I want to make withdrawls, I am allowed to withdraw up to what I have contributed to both Roth IRAs. As I have been contributing to the 1st one for many years, that's a good bit of change. And it would certainly see me through the next 3 years.

Of course this is all predicated on me doing well trading, and that remains to be seen. But it avoids all taxes, and the hassle of reporting profit/loss, and the need to set up an LLC or some such entity.

Any thoughts? The question is, where can I find a broker who will allow me to trade through a Roth IRA? I use the NinjaTrader platform so it has to be one of the brokers they work with. That list has shrunk since they have started their own brokerage. I have a call in to them to see if they will allow it.

I appreciate any feedback on this. Thanks!

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  #140 (permalink)
Elite Member
Valdosta, GA. U.S.A
 
Futures Experience: Advanced
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Posts: 479 since Sep 2010
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What Tax Bracket am I in


"What Tax Bracket Am I In?" -- "It's Complicated."

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