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Trading group for new MES traders


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Trading group for new MES traders

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  #1 (permalink)
Wilmington, NC
 
Experience: Beginner
Platform: Infinity Futures, TOS
Trading: ES, MES
 
Posts: 75 since Apr 2019
Thanks: 75 given, 91 received

Any new MES traders wanting to join together for support/advice? Share you experiences (frustrations as well as progress), things that are working well for you or challenges that you are finding with this new venture. Maybe we can help each other make it, because honestly there are many days where I just want to throw in the towel!

***Please keep this post exclusive for MES***

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  #3 (permalink)
San Francisco CA
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: NinjaTrader, TOS, Jigsaw
Broker: Dorman Trading
Trading: Micro ES, ZN, Stocks
 
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Posts: 132 since Apr 2019
Thanks: 168 given, 249 received



techa View Post
Any new MES traders wanting to join together for support/advice? Share you experiences (frustrations as well as progress), things that are working well for you or challenges that you are finding with this new venture. Maybe we can help each other make it, because honestly there are many days where I just want to throw in the towel!

***Please keep this post exclusive for MES***

I trade the MES for my live account, but still use ES for my charts and indicators. The reason being is that the volume data are not the same. Even though both of them are suppose to move in tandom, I still notice MES have a 1 tick slippage compared to the ES. i think the ES has more reliable information cause the institutions and prop firms trade them more than the MES, which was made more for beginning retail traders. The market depth data (or level 2) are completely different, and I find that the ES shows more use-able info.

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  #4 (permalink)
Wilmington, NC
 
Experience: Beginner
Platform: Infinity Futures, TOS
Trading: ES, MES
 
Posts: 75 since Apr 2019
Thanks: 75 given, 91 received


hen322 View Post
I trade the MES for my live account, but still use ES for my charts and indicators. The reason being is that the volume data are not the same. Even though both of them are suppose to move in tandom, I still notice MES have a 1 tick slippage compared to the ES. i think the ES has more reliable information cause the institutions and prop firms trade them more than the MES, which was made more for beginning retail traders. The market depth data (or level 2) are completely different, and I find that the ES shows more use-able info.

I do the same. Most of my charting is off of the ES (but I do enter based on MES one minute chart so that makes sense to sick with all ES charts - I'll try that) . To be honest, my biggest problem is following my plan. I go back to paper for a week or two and think I've got it, then totally blow it with real money. I was ready to throw in the towel last week so I just called my broker and had him block me from live trades. When I start on live again, I can have them set it for one contract at a time only so that may help. It's just so disappointing because I feel I am sabotaging my own chance to make it. I was hoping if some of the newer traders out there kind of encouraged each other along, maybe we could actually make it. Thanks for the suggestion!

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  #5 (permalink)
Dallas, TX
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NT, TS
Broker: IB, Oanda
Trading: ES, MES, MNQ, MYM
 
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Posts: 653 since May 2010
Thanks: 1,864 given, 872 received


techa View Post
I do the same. Most of my charting is off of the ES (but I do enter based on MES one minute chart so that makes sense to sick with all ES charts - I'll try that) . To be honest, my biggest problem is following my plan. I go back to paper for a week or two and think I've got it, then totally blow it with real money. I was ready to throw in the towel last week so I just called my broker and had him block me from live trades. When I start on live again, I can have them set it for one contract at a time only so that may help. It's just so disappointing because I feel I am sabotaging my own chance to make it. I was hoping if some of the newer traders out there kind of encouraged each other along, maybe we could actually make it. Thanks for the suggestion!

I think its very important to trade with some money on the line ( risk), otherwise you will never learn to trade properly. Don't demo, there is no value and it will never help you. I only demo-ed to make sure I know how to use a new platform. Micros, specially MES, is and will be the best tool to learn to be consistent/profitable. Trade on MES, one lot, for a month ( it takes 21 days to set a new habit) with no "making money" goal; just not lose any and you will be very surprised on how much you can improve. No new system or indicators needed.
Good trading
K

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  #6 (permalink)
Netherlands
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: NinjaTrader 8
Broker: IB, NinjaTrader Brokerage
Trading: Commodities, (crypto)currencies & equities
 
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kareem40 View Post
I think its very important to trade with some money on the line ( risk), otherwise you will never learn to trade properly. Don't demo, there is no value and it will never help you. I only demo-ed to make sure I know how to use a new platform. Micros, specially MES, is and will be the best tool to learn to be consistent/profitable. Trade on MES, one lot, for a month ( it takes 21 days to set a new habit) with no "making money" goal; just not lose any and you will be very surprised on how much you can improve. No new system or indicators needed.
Good trading
K

I agree with Kareem40. Also I think you should not trade too many setups, preferable 1, max 3.

For example:
1) a with-trend entry on a pullback in a trending market.
2) a mean reversion play from Valua Area High/Low back to VPOC in a ranging market.
3) a support/resistance breakout failure in a ranging market (or when the breakout is successful a with-trend entry on a pullback to test the breakout).

This is for intraday trading. When swing trading, do the same on a higher timeframe (30m, 60m, 240m).

Take care.
M.

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  #7 (permalink)
ljubljana slovenia
 
 
Posts: 3 since Aug 2015
Thanks: 5 given, 3 received


techa View Post
Any new MES traders wanting to join together for support/advice? Share you experiences (frustrations as well as progress), things that are working well for you or challenges that you are finding with this new venture. Maybe we can help each other make it, because honestly there are many days where I just want to throw in the towel!

***Please keep this post exclusive for MES***

What does it mean to be a MES trader?

Thanks

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  #8 (permalink)
Elite_Member
Wiltshire, United Kingdom
 
Experience: Beginner
Trading: US Equity Index Futures
 
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Posts: 957 since Sep 2013
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slofutures View Post
What does it mean to be a MES trader?

Thanks

The micro e-mini S&P 500 index futures. https://www.cmegroup.com/trading/equity-index/us-index/micro-e-mini-sandp-500.html

Trading, ideally structured, is a vehicle for expanding consciousness, not damaging it. - Brett Steenbarger
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  #9 (permalink)
Wilmington, NC
 
Experience: Beginner
Platform: Infinity Futures, TOS
Trading: ES, MES
 
Posts: 75 since Apr 2019
Thanks: 75 given, 91 received


Mich62 View Post
I agree with Kareem40. Also I think you should not trade too many setups, preferable 1, max 3.

For example:
1) a with-trend entry on a pullback in a trending market.
2) a mean reversion play from Valua Area High/Low back to VPOC in a ranging market.
3) a support/resistance breakout failure in a ranging market (or when the breakout is successful a with-trend entry on a pullback to test the breakout).

This is for intraday trading. When swing trading, do the same on a higher timeframe (30m, 60m, 240m).

Take care.
M.

I am still pretty new to all of this, but I have determined to focus on only one index (MES). So since February I have been studying exclusively that trying to learn the nuances. Those three setups mentioned seem to be mostly what I look at - intraday only at this point. I wouldn't have the stomach (or capitol at this point) to handle the swing trade...yet. Trending days tend to give me the most trouble as I keep expecting the reversal. At the end of the day I shake my head at how I could miss the obvious. Still so much to learn. Thanks for the suggestions!

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  #10 (permalink)
west palm beach fl usa
 
 
Posts: 3 since Aug 2019
Thanks: 2 given, 3 received


Looking for best site for free spread charts
also looking for inte rmarket spread margins initial & maintainance
between micro emini MES AND MNQ

also what is the best based online broker for these markets and round turn commission

Thnaks

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  #11 (permalink)
Wilmington, NC
 
Experience: Beginner
Platform: Infinity Futures, TOS
Trading: ES, MES
 
Posts: 75 since Apr 2019
Thanks: 75 given, 91 received


spreads777 View Post
Looking for best site for free spread charts
also looking for inte rmarket spread margins initial & maintainance
between micro emini MES AND MNQ

also what is the best based online broker for these markets and round turn commission

Thnaks

I am not the one to advise you with this. Under the Traders Hideout tab you can go read through the category: Emini and Emicro Index Futures Trading. There is a lot of info on different platforms, fees and comparisons of commission rates that might be helpful to you. Form what I have seen, there is no simple answer because a lot depends on what is most important to you. Some aren't tied to a brokerage firm and you have to have a separate broker. I'm using Infinity Futures with really high r/t commissions but the customer service is really good and I don't have to pay for a platform fee if I make 10 r/t trades a month. Also from what I have seen, different brokers have different margin requirements (some for the micros are only $50 per contract for day trading). Most places don't put all the info out there either so it makes it very difficult for new traders to just get started. Do your research (which for me is ongoing), pick one and at least get your feet wet. Wish I could be of more help. Good luck!

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  #12 (permalink)
Wilmington, NC
 
Experience: Beginner
Platform: Infinity Futures, TOS
Trading: ES, MES
 
Posts: 75 since Apr 2019
Thanks: 75 given, 91 received


techa View Post
Any new MES traders wanting to join together for support/advice? Share you experiences (frustrations as well as progress), things that are working well for you or challenges that you are finding with this new venture. Maybe we can help each other make it, because honestly there are many days where I just want to throw in the towel!

***Please keep this post exclusive for MES***

So just an update and maybe a word of encouragement for new traders to the Micro ES. I really struggled going from killing it in paper trading to the reality of real money on the line. I lost $1000 in 4 1/2 months. Twice I have called my broker and told him to cancel my account (he talked me out of it). I really do think 90% of trading is getting over the mental barrier. Still have a long way to go but I FINALLY have had two positive weeks in a row.

Some things that helped me:

-I realized I cannot do scalping with micros, I just could not do it with fees included.

-I began using what I call One Shot One Lot where I trade only ONE lot at the open of the market and once I am out I have to FORCE myself to log out of live so I am not tempted to trade again. and then I do usually log into my simulator. This method of only trading one lot a day really helps me see the times I am effective entering and exiting trades.

-For a while I would be killing it and not exit the trade because I thought it would go further, only to watch that trade reverse and lose it all. I started using the tpo profiles to give me an idea of the strong price areas and tighten up my stop when I get past 16 ticks. I have stopped trying to do runners but if I'm thinking that down the road I can try to do one runner at the end of several successful days.

-For market analysis I use daily and 4 hour trend to give me an idea of direction sentiment, TPO profile, watch for news announcements, and use fractal points on TOS. Even though I might have an idea of where the market will go for the day, I watch price action for the first 2-3 minutes or so to confirm it before entering the trade.

-I noticed I traded best at the open of the market so when I get confirmation of the market heading in the direction of a strong tpo area I enter one contract with a 5 point stop (20 ticks). Once price begins to move solidly in my favor I pull my stop up to break even +2. My target is set for 25 ticks but depending on where the top profile ranges are and the intensity of the moves, sometimes I will extend or shorten my target.

Hope this helps some other new trader. One thing I've learned is there are a million different ways to trade and you just have to find the one that works for you. I'm still finding mine but finally feel like I might finally be on the right path.

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  #13 (permalink)
new york,new york, usa
 
Experience: Beginner
Platform: Ninja, Esignal
Trading: es
 
Posts: 37 since Aug 2010
Thanks: 21 given, 17 received

Does anyone have any experience getting a 10 contract or higher resting LMT order filled on MES?

Thanks
thommy

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  #14 (permalink)
Bangor Maine
 
 
Posts: 25 since Nov 2018
Thanks: 16 given, 21 received


techa View Post
I do the same. Most of my charting is off of the ES (but I do enter based on MES one minute chart so that makes sense to sick with all ES charts - I'll try that) . To be honest, my biggest problem is following my plan. I go back to paper for a week or two and think I've got it, then totally blow it with real money. I was ready to throw in the towel last week so I just called my broker and had him block me from live trades. When I start on live again, I can have them set it for one contract at a time only so that may help. It's just so disappointing because I feel I am sabotaging my own chance to make it. I was hoping if some of the newer traders out there kind of encouraged each other along, maybe we could actually make it. Thanks for the suggestion!

I did the exact same thing when I first started trading so what you are going through is probably quite common . Learn to stick to your trading plan and let the trade come to you . If you just try to out smart the market you will usually lose . I hope you are not trying to scalp the MES or ES as a new trader , it can take years to master that , especially the ES . Don't give up as it will come with lots of patience .

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  #15 (permalink)
east bay n.s.
 
 
Posts: 9 since Jan 2010
Thanks: 6 given, 1 received


techa View Post
Any new MES traders wanting to join together for support/advice? Share you experiences (frustrations as well as progress), things that are working well for you or challenges that you are finding with this new venture. Maybe we can help each other make it, because honestly there are many days where I just want to throw in the towel!

***Please keep this post exclusive for MES***

I was sim trading the MES and happy with the results but then when I queried the broker on commissions, I was faced with a huge problem. The commissions were chewing up the majority of my profits. The fee was $1.37 per side per contract. Unless you manage to get really good runners, it'd be a losing proposition to be using this to scalp. The round trip on a standard emini ES contract for example is usually no more than $5.00. But if you want to match that with the equivalent MES 10 contracts, the fees are ridiculous. Work it out -- $1.37 + $1.37 times 10.

This is too bad because the MES is a great way to get into the market but unfortunately it appears you're not going to get much out of it. Novice traders generall haven't yet figured out how to get runners, unless by sheer luck, usually.

So I've moved to the ES in my sim trading as that's what I'm going to have to trade when I go live if I hope to make anything.

As a Canadian, I'm very limited in choice of brokers, so I can't shop around for better commission rates on the micros. Unless somebody has a suggestion, I'm feeling stuck.

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  #16 (permalink)
amsterdam
 
Experience: Master
Platform: NT
 
Posts: 21 since Oct 2010
Thanks: 42 given, 34 received

I think ib has low rates... Should check them out.. Also open for Canadians
tmaccorm View Post
I was sim trading the MES and happy with the results but then when I queried the broker on commissions, I was faced with a huge problem. The commissions were chewing up the majority of my profits. The fee was $1.37 per side per contract. Unless you manage to get really good runners, it'd be a losing proposition to be using this to scalp. The round trip on a standard emini ES contract for example is usually no more than $5.00. But if you want to match that with the equivalent MES 10 contracts, the fees are ridiculous. Work it out -- $1.37 + $1.37 times 10.

This is too bad because the MES is a great way to get into the market but unfortunately it appears you're not going to get much out of it. Novice traders generall haven't yet figured out how to get runners, unless by sheer luck, usually.

So I've moved to the ES in my sim trading as that's what I'm going to have to trade when I go live if I hope to make anything.

As a Canadian, I'm very limited in choice of brokers, so I can't shop around for better commission rates on the micros. Unless somebody has a suggestion, I'm feeling stuck.

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  #17 (permalink)
Bend, Oregon
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: Sierra Chart
Broker: IB
Trading: ES/MES
 
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Posts: 38 since May 2011
Thanks: 433 given, 59 received

MES with IB is 0.47 a side . . 0.94 RT.

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  #18 (permalink)
Toronto, Canada
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: Sierra Chart
Broker: AMP
Trading: ES/MES
 
Posts: 39 since Apr 2019
Thanks: 15 given, 30 received


tmaccorm View Post
I was sim trading the MES and happy with the results but then when I queried the broker on commissions, I was faced with a huge problem. The commissions were chewing up the majority of my profits. The fee was $1.37 per side per contract. Unless you manage to get really good runners, it'd be a losing proposition to be using this to scalp. The round trip on a standard emini ES contract for example is usually no more than $5.00. But if you want to match that with the equivalent MES 10 contracts, the fees are ridiculous. Work it out -- $1.37 + $1.37 times 10.

This is too bad because the MES is a great way to get into the market but unfortunately it appears you're not going to get much out of it. Novice traders generall haven't yet figured out how to get runners, unless by sheer luck, usually.

So I've moved to the ES in my sim trading as that's what I'm going to have to trade when I go live if I hope to make anything.

As a Canadian, I'm very limited in choice of brokers, so I can't shop around for better commission rates on the micros. Unless somebody has a suggestion, I'm feeling stuck.

I'm in Canada and trading with AMP. 0.78 RT. And that's including clearing fees.

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  #19 (permalink)
east bay n.s.
 
 
Posts: 9 since Jan 2010
Thanks: 6 given, 1 received


gigwam View Post
I'm in Canada and trading with AMP. 0.78 RT. And that's including clearing fees.

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Thanks for that. I was with AMP and unfortunately like a few others I've read about, they sent me an email one afternoon informing me that I was being booted out and couldn't trade with them anymore. They informed me in the email that there was no way I could respond or appeal as the decision was final and there was no room to negotiate. If I wanted to know why, they weren't going to tell me. Other traders have written about exactly the same thing happening to them.

I had cancer for five years and was undergoing treatment, 9 months in hospital, and several bouts of chemo, as well as three episode of sepsis. So I wasn't trading for five years, untilI was finally declared in remission. I was advised by the oncologist not to trade if it was stressful in any way. I came back on sim with AMP, had a technical glitch, which probably put me on their radar. So they probably cut me off because I hadn't been using them at all, although they continued to send me statements, and oddly enough, still do. But I can't trade through them.

For a Canadian, that means little other choice as the Canadian government doesn't allow futures brokers to serve us if they don't have some kind of presence in Canada. I've looked at IB but their platform is a dog's breakfast in terms of user friendliness. But maybe I'll take another look. Anyway, ironically, the day AMP gave me the boot, I was just about to press the send button to wire $5,000 in my account so I could get trading again.

Eventually, I hooked up with Global, who had arranged my account with AMP to begin with. So they've hooked me up with Ironbridge. Terrific serrvice, but the commissions for the micros is insane. OK for the minis but not the micros. So I've decided it's minis I'll be trading and not micros.

If anybody has any suggestions, I'd be happy to consider them. I've read where others have been advised to call AMP and take up my issue with them. Some have and got nowhere. Pretty draconian approach to customer service, although the broker I was hooked up with was great. Others have advised me to simply move on, business is business, and so on.

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  #20 (permalink)
Langley
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: IB
Trading: Futures
 
Posts: 252 since Mar 2020
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bob5e View Post
MES with IB is 0.47 a side . . 0.94 RT.

Yeup!

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  #21 (permalink)
Langley
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: IB
Trading: Futures
 
Posts: 252 since Mar 2020
Thanks: 285 given, 209 received

I love this! This is exactly the thread I was looking for.

I ONLY trade the micro S&P contract.

I am live and journaling and here to learn and help.

I am profitable after commissions and slippage... so far...

Here is my day today so far. I am in an open long position right now...

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  #22 (permalink)
Langley
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: IB
Trading: Futures
 
Posts: 252 since Mar 2020
Thanks: 285 given, 209 received


tmaccorm View Post
Thanks for that. I was with AMP and unfortunately like a few others I've read about, they sent me an email one afternoon informing me that I was being booted out and couldn't trade with them anymore. They informed me in the email that there was no way I could respond or appeal as the decision was final and there was no room to negotiate. If I wanted to know why, they weren't going to tell me. Other traders have written about exactly the same thing happening to them.

I had cancer for five years and was undergoing treatment, 9 months in hospital, and several bouts of chemo, as well as three episode of sepsis. So I wasn't trading for five years, untilI was finally declared in remission. I was advised by the oncologist not to trade if it was stressful in any way. I came back on sim with AMP, had a technical glitch, which probably put me on their radar. So they probably cut me off because I hadn't been using them at all, although they continued to send me statements, and oddly enough, still do. But I can't trade through them.

For a Canadian, that means little other choice as the Canadian government doesn't allow futures brokers to serve us if they don't have some kind of presence in Canada. I've looked at IB but their platform is a dog's breakfast in terms of user friendliness. But maybe I'll take another look. Anyway, ironically, the day AMP gave me the boot, I was just about to press the send button to wire $5,000 in my account so I could get trading again.

Eventually, I hooked up with Global, who had arranged my account with AMP to begin with. So they've hooked me up with Ironbridge. Terrific serrvice, but the commissions for the micros is insane. OK for the minis but not the micros. So I've decided it's minis I'll be trading and not micros.

If anybody has any suggestions, I'd be happy to consider them. I've read where others have been advised to call AMP and take up my issue with them. Some have and got nowhere. Pretty draconian approach to customer service, although the broker I was hooked up with was great. Others have advised me to simply move on, business is business, and so on.

Hello tmaccorm... fellow Canadian here!

I am with IB and I friggin love them!

Its true the platform took me MONTHS and MONTHS to get exactly the way I like but I couldn't go back now.

I absolutely love it.

.94 a side ALL IN.

Here is my setup (this chart is a few days old but thats my setup).

If theres anything I can do to help, if I can please ask.



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