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From paper money to real money?
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From paper money to real money?

  #1 (permalink)
Houston, TX
 
 
Posts: 131 since Jun 2018
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From paper money to real money?

How long did it take you to switch from trading paper money to trading real money? Some say that one should trade paper for at least three months. Most brokers (systems) limit demo to two weeks. There is a possibility to continue but how long will they allow one to keep doing so?

One also hears that it takes 9 years to become a professional trader and that every pro lost an initial deposit at least once, so it makes sense to trade with an amount that one is okay to lose. Thoughts, ideas, suggestions, and philosophies are all welcome!

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  #2 (permalink)
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  #3 (permalink)
Legendary Market Wizard
Columbus OHIO
 
Trading Experience: Intermediate
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MiniP's Avatar
 
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Your going to get 1000 different answers and most will be correct but you need to figure out what works for you.

When I first started trading ( FX) I jumped straight in with a decent size account and rode the emotional roller coaster for a few years. If you're going to sim trade make your account the same exact size your intend to use,trading a $100,000 account when you will fund yours with 1k will set you up for nothing but issues. Trade sim exactly like you would real money get attached to that sim number, trade the same lot size, trade the same exact way nothing can change.

I think sim is very useful and can teach you a lot I'm currently back on sim until I complete a few things then will be going back.There's nothing wrong with trading sim the markets aren't going any where anytime soon so don't rush it. Some people here have spent years upon years sacrificing for trading so 9 years might not be enough or you could be an all-star and do it in 2 it all depends on the person.

And you can fund an account with $500 or $1000 to get unlimited sim though ninja I believe. The exact number is on the site.

-P

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  #4 (permalink)
Houston, TX
 
 
Posts: 131 since Jun 2018
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Thanks, MiniP! In many ways, sim account is a playground to try and test different strategies and do regain confidence after a sell-off.

Also thanks on the heads up on funding Ninja with a minimum. It makes sense to froze a bit of money to keep playing the sim.

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  #5 (permalink)
Paris France + Dresden Germany
 
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Palais Brongniart's Avatar
 
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Calming View Post
How long did it take you to switch from trading paper money to trading real money? Some say that one should trade paper for at least three months. Most brokers (systems) limit demo to two weeks. There is a possibility to continue but how long will they allow one to keep doing so?

One also hears that it takes 9 years to become a professional trader and that every pro lost an initial deposit at least once, so it makes sense to trade with an amount that one is okay to lose. Thoughts, ideas, suggestions, and philosophies are all welcome!

Don't know if it takes 9 years, but yes, some years.

I lost my initial deposit ages ago. I am profitable since then. So I guess, nearly everyone loses his account at least once. Heard that often from my peers, too.

Yes, only trade an account you can afford to lose. BECAUSE YOU WILL PROB LOSE IT. Trade the least capital at risk possible per trade.

Don't expect to be a millionaire short term. Stories about ppl who took 10k to 100k in a month are made up (99%). If some of these stories were real, the next month they were broke. Because of the high risk they took in order to achieve a 1000% gain, at some moment in time their luck was gone. Trading is doing it with small sums over and over again. On and and on and on you trade. Don't shoot at the big home run. You lose, you win, winning points exceed losing points. Then one day compound growth locks in and you're made as a trader.

Start trading real as soon as possible. The learning curve steepens because you feel the pain. (Unless you're an automated trader, then you have to paper trade until your algo works. Then go online with real money)

Keep a diary. Keep the traded charts, study why you lost or won. Exchange your charts with the like-minded. Find a peer group via Internet.

Don't fear to admit you've been wrong. Discuss it.

LEARN THE FUCKING MONEY MANAGEMENT FIRST. THE TRADING EDGE COMES LAST.

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  #6 (permalink)
Legendary Guesser
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Calming View Post
One also hears that it takes 9 years to become a professional trader and that every pro lost an initial deposit at least once, so it makes sense to trade with an amount that one is okay to lose. Thoughts, ideas, suggestions, and philosophies are all welcome!

Philosophy:
You are going to fit right in here
Everyone trys to outsmart the market at first. The real lesson will start when your patience has been eroded to the point where you question everything you think you know. If you are comfortable losing X and you lose it...what have you learnt about yourself? (I contend nothing of value)

This gig will catch you no matter how crafty you think you are being It is humbling.

Start a journal here.
All the very best.


Last edited by Grantx; June 15th, 2018 at 11:51 AM. Reason: Answer to what have you learned.
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  #7 (permalink)
Houston, TX
 
Trading Experience: Intermediate
Platform: TOS, Ninja, Tradestation
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Calming View Post
How long did it take you to switch from trading paper money to trading real money? Some say that one should trade paper for at least three months. Most brokers (systems) limit demo to two weeks. There is a possibility to continue but how long will they allow one to keep doing so?

One also hears that it takes 9 years to become a professional trader and that every pro lost an initial deposit at least once, so it makes sense to trade with an amount that one is okay to lose. Thoughts, ideas, suggestions, and philosophies are all welcome!

Paper money is only to learn to use a trading software. Dont waste valuable time playing with useless paper money. Trade real money if you want to become a trader. If you are afraid of losing you are not there yet. Only way to get out of that fear of losing is by losing. Do not even get into this business unless you have enough money to lose.

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  #8 (permalink)
Houston, TX
 
 
Posts: 131 since Jun 2018
Thanks: 111 given, 71 received


Palais Brongniart View Post
Keep a diary. Keep the traded charts, study why you lost or won. Exchange your charts with the like-minded. Find a peer group via Internet.

Don't fear to admit you've been wrong. Discuss it.

LEARN THE FUCKING MONEY MANAGEMENT FIRST. THE TRADING EDGE COMES LAST.


Thanks for the ideas! Already subscribed to FIRE and practicing money and risk management. Can you recommend how to keep a diary and, most importantly, where to find a peer group?

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  #9 (permalink)
Legendary Market Wizard
Columbus OHIO
 
Trading Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NinjaTrader
Broker/Data: NinjaTrader Brokerage
Favorite Futures: ES,
 
MiniP's Avatar
 
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Calming View Post
Thanks for the ideas! Already subscribed to FIRE and practicing money and risk management. Can you recommend how to keep a diary and, most importantly, where to find a peer group?

https://futures.io/trading-journals/222-benefits-creating-journal-forum.html

read this, there's thousands of traders on FIO send someone a PM or follow there journal most people are willing to help you after you prove you will put in the work and you're not looking for a handout.



-P

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  #10 (permalink)
Chicago, IL
 
Trading Experience: Intermediate
Platform: SierraChart
Favorite Futures: /ES /CL
 
Posts: 15 since Mar 2018
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I will say that ultimately paper trading/sim trading is great for two things:

1. Learn your platform.
2. Master your strategy/method.

The two things above paper trading will help you out with, however, as many others have said you must trade your paper trading account as if you were trading a real account. Therefore if you start out with 1k you must manage your risk as if it were a 1k account (Regardless if your paper-trading account size is 100k or 500k for that matter). Otherwise paper-trading will not be of much help to you.

After a period of paper trading, I would say a couple of months and you prove to be profitable, only then I would go and start trading with real money. But remember and this has been mentioned thousands of times on here, you must treat your paper-trading account as if it were a real account, stick to your strategy and your money management plan(s), in other words trade your plan otherwise you will be setting yourself up for failure down the line when you go live.

-bofh

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