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Can Day Trading be profitable for retail?
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View Poll Results: Can Day Trading be profitable, consistently, for retail traders
Yes 72 72.00%
No 13 13.00%
Can't say 15 15.00%
Voters: 100. You may not vote on this poll

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Can Day Trading be profitable for retail?

  #1 (permalink)
edison new jersey
 
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Can Day Trading be profitable for retail?

My opinion is : No, It cannot be profitable. I have been backtesting, simulating, live testing for the last 5 years and my opinion is that given the commissions, slippage etc retail user cannot be profitable consistently. But if the same strategy is run by a broker (who does not pay commission on his own trades) it will be immensely profitable. Add co-location which further improves the chances of limit order execution and decrease slippage the profit increases further. Add reduced exchange fees (some brokers have this privilege) than profits increase further. What is your opinion? My observations are based on trading es and other index futures like nifty etc.

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  #2 (permalink)
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  #3 (permalink)
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jefforey View Post
Can Day Trading be profitable for retail?


Certainly. This forum has many members who are steadily profitable daytraders.

I'd agree that among aspiring traders (retail ones) the proportion who ever achieve steady, reliable profitability is probably lower with daytrading than is the case for most other "types" of trader - for the reasons you mention, among others - but very clearly it's possible.


Last edited by Tymbeline; January 22nd, 2018 at 10:28 AM.
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  #4 (permalink)
Thailand
 
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Can golf? Can tennis?

Not the way most people play it.

Check out the Jigsaw Trading Leaderboard.

"The mind is its own place, and in itself can make a heaven of hell, a hell of heaven." - Milton
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  #5 (permalink)
edison new jersey
 
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Anagami View Post
Can golf? Can tennis?

Not the way most people play it.

Check out the Jigsaw Trading Leaderboard.

Well, there maybe exceptions but I am yet to see a day-trader being consistently profitable for at-least, say, 5-years. In tennis or golf the ratio of professionals versus wannabes is 1:10000. That means for every tennis player making money from playing championships there are 10000 others who don't make any money from it. I am talking about Day-Trading as a means of earning a livelihood.

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  #6 (permalink)
Thailand
 
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jefforey View Post
Well, there maybe exceptions but I am yet to see a day-trader being consistently profitable for at-least, say, 5-years. In tennis or golf the ratio of professionals versus wannabes is 1:10000. That means for every tennis player making money from playing championships there are 10000 others who don't make any money from it. I am talking about Day-Trading as a means of earning a livelihood.

TST has 100s of profitable day traders that are funded and trading. I don't know if they have been around for 5 years or not.

The thing, when you have found your edge and you KNOW it... you don't need to ask anyone else, or try to prove or disprove if it's possible. You are profitable, and you know WHY you are profitable. That is professional confidence. Not merely making money but knowing why you do.

You just haven't found your edge. Don't give up bud. All the best.

"The mind is its own place, and in itself can make a heaven of hell, a hell of heaven." - Milton
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  #7 (permalink)
Market Wizard
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jefforey View Post
I am yet to see a day-trader being consistently profitable for at-least, say, 5-years. .


If I close my eye it goes dark outside

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  #8 (permalink)
edison new jersey
 
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Thankyou for the feedback guys. Please keep it coming. I want to be proved wrong. I want to believe that day-trading could be a bread-winner profession. Haven't seen any evidence that would suggest that but if you have then please share it here.

Also, I want to know if brokerages such Goldman Sachs pay commission, exchange fees on their prop trades?

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  #9 (permalink)
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"Can Day Trading be profitable for retail"?

It depends what is ones definition of day trading.

High Frequency Trading - No
Scalping - Maybe
Day Trading - Yes

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  #10 (permalink)
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jefforey View Post
My opinion is : No, It cannot be profitable. I have been backtesting, simulating, live testing for the last 5 years and my opinion is that given the commissions, slippage etc retail user cannot be profitable consistently. But if the same strategy is run by a broker (who does not pay commission on his own trades) it will be immensely profitable. Add co-location which further improves the chances of limit order execution and decrease slippage the profit increases further. Add reduced exchange fees (some brokers have this privilege) than profits increase further. What is your opinion? My observations are based on trading es and other index futures like nifty etc.

You're operating under a lot of false pretenses. Brokers don't engage in most of the things you've listed here. HFT trading firms probably yes, but those aren't the people you should be competing against anyway. You'll never win trying to beat them at ultra short term trading from your home office. It sounds like you've created a boogeyman as to why the things you've been testing haven't worked. Try expanding your time horizon and leaving the realm of short term trading/simulation/backtesting. Then you'll at least have a fighting chance.

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