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Is it Worth It!!!
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Is it Worth It!!!

  #31 (permalink)
Legendary market donator
Indianoplace, IN
 
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navionpilot View Post
Thank you for your reply.

How come this industry is so negative towards beginners? I guess that why i cant decide if i should down this path. It's like you here everywhere that you can't trust anybody or you cant trust anybody to teach you, you can't trust anybody's course, you have to learn on your own (Which I think is totally crazy since there are so many experienced traders out there that could show you how to succeed.) I mean if you want to be a Doctor the first place you go is to Collage. You don't go to youtube and learn on your own. It's just crazy to me.

That's just it... nobody can show you how to succeed. A snippet of a post I made elsewhere, but relevant I think...

"That's the problem with being a self-directed, self-instructed trader; there's no clear path for a beginner to follow and we're all left to our own devices to get it figured out. Quite nearly every other career path has a formal educational process behind it that ensures the knowledge fundamental to success is achieved... but trading is like the wild west.

A lot of guys (myself included) start out thinking that if they can just find someone's successful method and emulate it, they will be on their way to success and riches. Nothing could be further from the truth. You really do have to put forth the effort in understanding how it all works so it makes sense to you and fits your personality. Along the way, you will cull bits and pieces of information and methodology from others and be able to incorporate it into your own style, but ultimately you must make it your own.

One thing that has really helped me "fill in the cracks" in my own foundation was going through Adam Grimes' free video course. His book, The Art and Science of Technical Analysis, is of extremely high value (it's not free, but goes way more in-depth about the concepts and ideas presented in the video course.) https://www.marketlifetrading.com/ "

FYI I'm not a shill for the guy, I was directed to the course by other traders here, but I believe he does a great job of going over the basics and at least giving you a good idea of the fundamental aspects you will need to know.


Last edited by Rrrracer; January 5th, 2018 at 03:18 PM.
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  #32 (permalink)
Legendary market donator
Indianoplace, IN
 
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Platform: SierraChart
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Posts: 1,863 since Feb 2017
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You'll not find another business more chock full of snake oil salesmen, scammers and people willing to promise you everything under the sun in order to separate you from your money, so it is right that you question everything and everybody.

I see you have plunked down the $100 on elite membership here... IMHO that is likely the best money you might ever spend on trading. There is so much value here it's insane, and I bet most of what you would need to succeed is contained within.

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  #33 (permalink)
MERIDIAN MS/USA
 
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Rrrracer View Post
That's just it... nobody can show you how to succeed. A snippet of a post I made elsewhere, but relevant I think...

"That's the problem with being a self-directed, self-instructed trader; there's no clear path for a beginner to follow and we're all left to our own devices to get it figured out. Quite nearly every other career path has a formal educational process behind it that ensures the knowledge fundamental to success is achieved... but trading is like the wild west.

A lot of guys (myself included) start out thinking that if they can just find someone's successful method and emulate it, they will be on their way to success and riches. Nothing could be further from the truth. You really do have to put forth the effort in understanding how it all works so it makes sense to you and fits your personality. Along the way, you will cull bits and pieces of information and methodology from others and be able to incorporate it into your own style, but ultimately you must make it your own.

One thing that has really helped me "fill in the cracks" in my own foundation was going through Adam Grimes' free video course. His book, The Art and Science of Technical Analysis, is of extremely high value (it's not free, but goes way more in-depth about the concepts and ideas presented in the video course.) https://www.marketlifetrading.com/ "

FYI I'm not a shill for the guy, I was directed to the course by other traders here, but I believe he does a great job of just going over the basics.


Thank you so much for all the information that you have shared with me. I really appreciate it.

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  #34 (permalink)
Chantilly, VA 20152
 
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Its like life

Don't know until you try. A life perspective.

There are so many variables to a successful "career" like trading or anything in life. There is no answer.

If you step back and treat it like any life occurrence of yours so far, things usually happen randomly. How you born, where you go to school, the jobs you had and the type of cars you pick. There were no simple pattern/explanation how and why they occurred. In this big picture level, it can or it won't.

Trading as a career like any career usually happens to a person instead of a person actively choose it at the very beginning. Many of things happen in a life, some latch on and many don't. Many people from whatever reason come across trading to a deeper level than the rest of the people in the world.

The choice in front of you is easy, do what your heart tells you when you read Al Brooks and paper trade your account. The path you need to take is well known.

Is this the best decision you have made at the end of life? No one knows including yourself. But it will be part of your life, you can't disown it even you try.

Bear in mind, people here are the active trader. Those were not, were long gone.

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  #35 (permalink)
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navionpilot View Post
How come this industry is so negative towards beginners? I guess that why i cant decide if i should down this path. It's like you hear everywhere that you can't trust anybody or you cant trust anybody to teach you, you can't trust anybody's course, you have to learn on your own.

I think that a good degree of this cynicism comes from each retail trader's own path and history with the markets. I'd guess that most retail traders start out winning a little and losing a little, and then slowly but surely drain at least one account. People are probably "negative towards beginners" because they remember the loss and emotional pain from their own starting phase. I paid for many different trading rooms and software and indicators and gurus and I definitely wouldn't recommend for somebody to go through the same process. There are many misleading websites and people in the trade education world. I would guess it's because beginners are chomping at the bit to start making millions of dollars, and they'll pay whatever the asking price is to unlock supposed secrets of the market.

There are no secrets in the market. The 10 EMA isn't objectively better than a Pivot Point, the flag formation isn't always more profitable than the shooting star candle, and scalping isn't necessarily more profitable than swing trading. If you decide to pursue trading, you will not have to learn on your own. You'll have to learn how to create your own method, but there are thousands upon thousands of resources for learning to trade out there. I've listened to countless webinars from a variety of folks here on Futures.io. There are always one or two tidbits that stick with me after I'm done listening to them, and I would encourage you to do the same and see if something resonates with you.

It's a long process. It's a hard process. Above all, keep your risk low to stay in the game long enough to take that next trade.

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  #36 (permalink)
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Is it worth it? Well it does as long as you do it right, the problem is that a very small tinny percentage of the trades do it right.

And If you want to have fun and excitement than I would advise you to go to brothel or a stripper club and get some vodka or beer! Trading is a lot of work, hard work and commitment and you have to treat it like any other business. Trust me you wont find it fun and excited when things is not going your way.

It will take you years, between 3 to 5 I would say and you will need good understanding of price, volume and volatility combine with discipline, focus and patient and a couple of others things such as avoid all the bullshit and bullshitters out there simply because “everybody” is selling you something or trying to sell you something.

And be in mind that success is not guarantee in this business, nothing is guarantee in life only death and taxes as “they” said but even taxes is not guarantee because there are infinite way to dodge taxes, so only death is guarantee in life.

Also if you are not a programmer do not even bother to learn programming to trade, learn how to trade first, than after you can learn programming if you want and not the other way around, in other words be a discretionary trader first. If you are a programmer and know how to code than you may want to backtest some systematic trading ideas if not, stick with a discretionary approach.

Yeah books can be good as long as you read the right books, but be in mind that books do not trade for you. The same with webinar, videos and forum etc, yes they are good and valid and you are on the right place, but be remember at the end of the day you will have to place trades yourself. And you will have to deal with your own mind and mindset yourself.

Day trading futures is not easy in reality is it not advisable for beginners but you can and I think you should join One Up Trader: https://oneuptrader.com/ or Top Step Trader: https://www.topsteptrader.com/, it is not perfect per se but it is a very good stating point if you want to become a day trader, apart from that you are getting in the business knowing exactly how much you are going to loose.

That is that.


Last edited by mrphr; January 5th, 2018 at 04:27 PM.
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  #37 (permalink)
Market Wizard
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navionpilot View Post

How come this industry is so negative towards beginners?

Negative?
People are making an effort to write and to be honest with you so you can have input with credible variables for you to consider. I call that honesty.

Matt Z
Optimus Futures

There is a substantial risk of loss in futures trading. Past performance is not indicative of future results.

PM with any questions about optimusfutures (800) 771-6748 (561) 367 8686. THERE IS A SUBSTANTIAL RISK OF LOSS IN FUTURES TRADING.
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  #38 (permalink)
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Navionpilot,
The advice here is incredibly helpful ... I wish I had found FIO when I started trading 2.5 years ago. I know it would have saved me time and money. I have not found any other forum like it.
Particular to this thread that you started, read the valuable posts over and over again... deeply consider what these traders are saying. Combined, there are decades of experience and sacrifice.
A few points from me:
Spend the time and energy in finding a trading style and timeframe that suits you.
Be patient. Don't try to be making positive returns as soon as possible. The markets have been around for a long time and will continue to do so.
My finding is that trading is unlike anything else you will ever try.


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  #39 (permalink)
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mattz View Post
Negative?
People are making an effort to write and to be honest with you so you can have input with credible variables for you to consider. I call that honesty.

Matt Z
Optimus Futures

There is a substantial risk of loss in futures trading. Past performance is not indicative of future results.

While I thank each and every "Honest input" that each of you has laid out for me, I have yet to see anyone of you (except for a few) suggest anything to me on how a beginner like myself should start. If I wanted to learn it. It's like everything is negative about trading but yet everyone is doing it. Everything so far has just been "Its Hard" and "Good Luck". That's what I mean by "Negative". I would more than love to hear from an experienced trader say "Hey trading is Hard work. It can take years to learn but if you want to learn here is what you need to do. First, you need to know how to do this, Then you need to read this." That's the kind of information that I need to hear. Not "Its Hard, Good Luck"

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  #40 (permalink)
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There is no structured path like a university degree unfortunately.

What is considered useful information by one is disregarded by another.

Here is a starting point I would take if I knew before hand, go and watch Adam Grimes webinars in the Elite section. And consider buying his book, Art and Science of Technical Analysis.

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