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New Trader, Trust Issues.

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  #1 (permalink)
Pi0neer
St. Louis, United States
 
 
Posts: 4 since Oct 2014
Thanks: 1 given, 2 received

Hi everyone. So the last week I've been studying hardcore, mainly because I got re-interested after finding Tim Sykes. The only stuff i found before that was just "put it in an ira and take it out when youre 65" type of stuff which isn't what im interested in. I was studying on researching pennystocks and such and learning how to short them, as Tim does. Then I started wondering about shorting, since the only brokerage I could use would be suretrader and apparently shorting is difficult. If i understand correctly, basically when a shitty company spikes, you can guarantee it's going back down, so you short it. I cant tell however if this is still viable or if im missing something.

So then I looked into supertrades, and apparently he is worse off than Tim. I actually trust Tim, as he does have a good track record and such. I dont think he would be pushing transparency so hard if he himself wasn't actually making at least decent money trading. He says it all the time however, he's a shitty trader. supertrades has been accused of hiding his losses etc.

So then i looked at DayTradingAcademy, and found here, that it's largely a scam with shady as hell marketing and costs more than nothing (implies that it's free.) The e-mini futures concept was interesting, although I don't really know anything about them. But it's more interesting to me because it seems easier to day trade than penny stocks, but I havent looked into it much as im going to sleep.

Any point in the right direction would be great. Im tired of all these schemes. I just want to actually learn how to trade. I spent hours watching and taking notes on dvd's and such but now im questioning if it's still viable. Still interesting in emini futures though, possibly.

Any guidance would be great. Im 20 and I have some small savings ($5k+) ive been waiting to use for trading. Thanks all

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  #3 (permalink)
 bourgeois pig 
asheville north carolina USA
 
Experience: Beginner
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Hi Pioneer, I am fairly new to this also. I spent a lot of times reading books, and simulating. I read broad based books about the markets in general along with a few specifically about the Emini's and currencies. While a lot of the info I processed was invaluable and some was useless. I came to the conclusion that the true driver to my potential success was my interest and passion for the subject. From one rookie to another I reccomend that you spend a lot of time researching. Spend a lot of time on this forum and a lot of time on google. Forget about finding the Holy Grail. The only true path to sucess lies within your self. When researching, remain objective, as thee is a lot of bullshit (and Bearshit out there). There is however a lot of great ino out there and also on this Forum. I like INVESTOPEDIA to explain terms and indicators. THere are a lot of links to free webinars and stuff too. Usally they are a sales ploy but you can usally milk some info out of them. I don't really want to share the ones that i have found because for all I know they could be batshit crazy and i don't want to inadvertantly lead oyu down a wrong path. Also some brokers will allow you to simulate for free for a a month or more or less without having to commit to them. KNOW THIS THOUGH! When you switch to a realtime account, the first time you enter the market everything is out the window and the psycological aspect of trading that you will read a lot about ...hopefully ...will take on a whole new meaning! I learned that the hard way. I had to take a step back and re assess, I have made many good trades in the DEMO and many good mental trades watching real time. But I have made some stupid trades in real time. Rules i had set for myself and strategies I had intended seem to be distant memories when i first entered the market. However, I am determined to be successful and a love learning about the world of trading. If you do not know much about the Emini's or index trading I suggest you spend a lot of time researching and simulating. move from broker to broker. That way you can try out different paltforms.
Most brokers will start you with a lrge sum of imaginary $$$ in the DEMO. While it is valuable to pratice scaling and multiple contract strategies you also need to spend a lot of time just playing one contract or 2, because when finally do hit the real time you need to have visions of grandeur expelled from your expectations least you blow your account. I read a lot of posts by guys who state that they blew up a few accounts before they became successful. If you can afford to blow up an account then godspeed. If not tread carefully and lightly.One of the most important things that I believe you have to keep in mind is that the market will always be there. I forced my hand by thinking I had to play now and i got burned a few times. I thought And I was going to be a natural! But NOTTT. What could be more rewarding than earning your own way? Setting your own hours? Making bank from the privacy of your own home sporting a 5 oclock shadow wearing a robe and bunny slippers? Not having to answer to some jerk ass roboboss? THe sky is the limit in this game. But the ground is never to far if you are not careful. So start researchin. Google. You Tube. Big Mikes forum. Investing.com, Market watch. Seeking Alpha. Million dollar trader. Investopedia, wikipedia. Bloomberg. Wiley and Sons. THe list is endless. SOme brokers with Demos: Ameritrade, ATC, Ninja, OEC, GO Futures, Cannon....and if you look around there are many more.Watch out for the sharks and con artists, There is no holy grail trading system. THere is only you and the BID and the ASK and the MARKET and the LIMIT, The FOK and the GOC, and the ICEBERGS and the FLIPPERS and the INSTITUTIONS and the OCO's and the OSO's and the MARKET MAKERS and the ECN's and the IB"S and the FCM's and the algos and the ETC ETC ETC......
GOOD LUCK! and remember.... THE MARKET WILL ALWAYS BE HERE THERE and EVERYWHERE. No need to rush! Take it from someone who learned the hard way! I have included a chart with mental notes i screensaved sometime ago to send to a friend who was interested in this stuff. As you will notice the market has twisted me into a blabbering pretzel!!

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  #4 (permalink)
 tturner86 
Portland, Oregon
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: F-16CM-50
Trading: GBU-39
 
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Posts: 6,172 since Sep 2013
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Pi0neer View Post
Hi everyone. So the last week I've been studying hardcore, mainly because I got re-interested after finding Tim Sykes. The only stuff i found before that was just "put it in an ira and take it out when youre 65" type of stuff which isn't what im interested in. I was studying on researching pennystocks and such and learning how to short them, as Tim does. Then I started wondering about shorting, since the only brokerage I could use would be suretrader and apparently shorting is difficult. If i understand correctly, basically when a shitty company spikes, you can guarantee it's going back down, so you short it. I cant tell however if this is still viable or if im missing something.

So then I looked into supertrades, and apparently he is worse off than Tim. I actually trust Tim, as he does have a good track record and such. I dont think he would be pushing transparency so hard if he himself wasn't actually making at least decent money trading. He says it all the time however, he's a shitty trader. supertrades has been accused of hiding his losses etc.

So then i looked at DayTradingAcademy, and found here, that it's largely a scam with shady as hell marketing and costs more than nothing (implies that it's free.) The e-mini futures concept was interesting, although I don't really know anything about them. But it's more interesting to me because it seems easier to day trade than penny stocks, but I havent looked into it much as im going to sleep.

Any point in the right direction would be great. Im tired of all these schemes. I just want to actually learn how to trade. I spent hours watching and taking notes on dvd's and such but now im questioning if it's still viable. Still interesting in emini futures though, possibly.

Any guidance would be great. Im 20 and I have some small savings ($5k+) ive been waiting to use for trading. Thanks all

Pennystocks are not allowed to be discussed here at futures.io (formerly BMT). I would run as far away from any trading 'educator' as possible.

With $5k I would look to trade spot FX. Take about $500 open an account and learn how to trade. That way you don't risk your entire savings, you will not make a lot of money but you will also not lose a lot of money either. The key in the beginning is to not lose all your money while you learn how to trade.

Also I would look at becoming an elite member here so you can get access to a lot of content and indicators that you can't get otherwise. The best trade of my life has been the $100 for a elite.

Other then that, I would click on the webinars tab up above and view the getting started videos.

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  #5 (permalink)
 Fritzk 
North America
 
Experience: None
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Borrowing this from Big Mikes sig ..... great advice
5) Where to start as a trader? Watch this webinar and read this thread for hundreds of questions and answers.

Head up and keep your stick on the ice!
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  #6 (permalink)
 bobwest 
Site Moderator
Sarasota FL
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: Sierra Chart, NinjaTrader
Trading: ES, YM
 
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It looks like you need some basic knowledge of markets and trading before you should put anything at risk.

Don't buy anyone's trading method or advice. That's money thrown away, and it will probably be followed by more money lost in trading. If someone's method were any good, would they be selling it to you, or just trading with it?

Suggestions:

- Get some basic knowledge of what markets and trading vehicles are about. Look into general reference material, even Wikipedia for this. Branch out in your reading as you learn more. Remember not to accept anyone's special method for getting rich quick. (Unless you want to help them get rich quick )

- As was mentioned above, take a hundred bucks and get an elite membership at futures.io (formerly BMT). Then read everything you can get your hands on here, and watch the videos. (PS - many of them will disagree with each other. That's good. See if you can figure out what you think.

- Ask questions, interact, make use of the resources here.

It's possible to do well in the markets, but if it were easy, everyone would be a millionaire, wouldn't they?

Good luck.

Bob.

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  #7 (permalink)
Pi0neer
St. Louis, United States
 
 
Posts: 4 since Oct 2014
Thanks: 1 given, 2 received

Lmao I find it ironic everyone says dont throw money at an educator but buy an elite membership for this site for our videos.

And I do believe there are some people that also want other people to be successful lol. But I don't follow blindly.
But I use thinkorswim and I've been paper trading. Ive made $200. 140 in normal and 60 in forex. But Im going to look at some more webinars and whatever.

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  #8 (permalink)
 tturner86 
Portland, Oregon
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: F-16CM-50
Trading: GBU-39
 
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Posts: 6,172 since Sep 2013
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Pi0neer View Post
Lmao I find it ironic everyone says dont throw money at an educator but buy an elite membership for this site for our videos.

And I do believe there are some people that also want other people to be successful lol. But I don't follow blindly.
But I use thinkorswim and I've been paper trading. Ive made $200. 140 in normal and 60 in forex. But Im going to look at some more webinars and whatever.

There is a difference between paying $100 for elite and paying someone $100/mo or $5000 for a trading system. Everyone's comments so far have been trying to help you and save you some money.

Also paper trading will never equal real trading. There is different emotions and issues you have to deal with live that SIM doesn't capture.

The content of this site can help you to become a better trader and learn how to create your own system. An educator will never provide that. And if you are around most long enough you will learn that if you lose money it is because your aren't trading their system 'correctly'. The only educator I have spent money on is Al Brooks (because $250 to learn Price Action 101 is cheap). But most wouldn't like that because he doesn't have the flashy marketing that others like Sykes does. No orange lambo.

The 2 biggest issues you will face shorting OTC or pennystocks is finding shares and then finding a buyer to get out of your trade.

Also if you think trading will lead you to making millions in a few months you have a rude awaking coming. Most traders lose money.

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  #9 (permalink)
Pi0neer
St. Louis, United States
 
 
Posts: 4 since Oct 2014
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tturner86 View Post
There is a difference between paying $100 for elite and paying someone $100/mo or $5000 for a trading system. Everyone's comments so far have been trying to help you and save you some money.

Also paper trading will never equal real trading. There is different emotions and issues you have to deal with live that SIM doesn't capture.

The content of this site can help you to become a better trader and learn how to create your own system. An educator will never provide that. And if you are around most long enough you will learn that if you lose money it is because your aren't trading their system 'correctly'. The only educator I have spent money on is Al Brooks (because $250 to learn Price Action 101 is cheap). But most wouldn't like that because he doesn't have the flashy marketing that others like Sykes does. No orange lambo.

The 2 biggest issues you will face shorting OTC or pennystocks is finding shares and then finding a buyer to get out of your trade.

Also if you think trading will lead you to making millions in a few months you have a rude awaking coming. Most traders lose money.

I know. But someone said to start paper trading. Just saying I am checking out a few trades when I see them pop up. Dont know why you think im trading because i think it's a way to get rich quick. My plan is to use a very small amount once i get into real trading so I dont lose (or make) much money. Even if i just made $100 dollars a month, i would be ecstatic, because the fact would be I made that money on my own.

I'm going to make sure to be cutting my losses quickly and not holding and hoping, and like i said, using a very minimal amount when i first start real trading. In the sim, im keeping my trades to under $2k.

Also just throwing it out there, I think Tim is more successful than most 'gurus' because of his marketing. It's not really marketing it's just showing proof, yeah I have a lamborghini, and a big house, etc, so you know he does make what he says. Most people i've seen claim to have useful information and good tips yet they don't make a lot or don't have proof. Not that Tim is the only one making money, I could care less about Tim, but Im just saying lol. It's the proof.

And yes, i do appreciate all the posts helping me out and would love more. Hopefully you can see where Im coming from. Especially when researching forexing trading, I saw pretty much nothing at all except for "buy this program" "buy this" buy that" with nobody showing proof of a working system other than easily faked screenshots or whatever. It's depressing lol.

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  #10 (permalink)
 tturner86 
Portland, Oregon
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: F-16CM-50
Trading: GBU-39
 
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Pi0neer View Post
I know. But someone said to start paper trading. Just saying I am checking out a few trades when I see them pop up. Dont know why you think im trading because i think it's a way to get rich quick. My plan is to use a very small amount once i get into real trading so I dont lose (or make) much money. Even if i just made $100 dollars a month, i would be ecstatic, because the fact would be I made that money on my own.

I'm going to make sure to be cutting my losses quickly and not holding and hoping, and like i said, using a very minimal amount when i first start real trading. In the sim, im keeping my trades to under $2k.

Because you first post here is about Sykes. And typically everyone who wants to trade his system thinks they will make millions quickly.

Paper trading is a good start. Just realize that performance in SIM isn't the same a real. Use SIM to get on your feet, learn your platform, and then move to trading live quickly. (As small as possible to risk the least amount of money). Too many people spend years in SIM to go Live and have no clue what is in store.

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 tturner86 
Portland, Oregon
 
Experience: Intermediate
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Pi0neer View Post
I know. But someone said to start paper trading. Just saying I am checking out a few trades when I see them pop up. Dont know why you think im trading because i think it's a way to get rich quick. My plan is to use a very small amount once i get into real trading so I dont lose (or make) much money. Even if i just made $100 dollars a month, i would be ecstatic, because the fact would be I made that money on my own.

I'm going to make sure to be cutting my losses quickly and not holding and hoping, and like i said, using a very minimal amount when i first start real trading. In the sim, im keeping my trades to under $2k.

Also just throwing it out there, I think Tim is more successful than most 'gurus' because of his marketing. It's not really marketing it's just showing proof, yeah I have a lamborghini, and a big house, etc, so you know he does make what he says. Most people i've seen claim to have useful information and good tips yet they don't make a lot or don't have proof. Not that Tim is the only one making money, I could care less about Tim, but Im just saying lol. It's the proof.

And yes, i do appreciate all the posts helping me out and would love more. Hopefully you can see where Im coming from. Especially when researching forexing trading, I saw pretty much nothing at all except for "buy this program" "buy this" buy that" with nobody showing proof of a working system other than easily faked screenshots or whatever. It's depressing lol.

Just keep in mind no one will sell a winning system. If it works they will trade it till it doesn't, then they will sell it.

Also trading is a game of losing the least amount of money, not how much you make. You can make millions but if you lose millions and end up with $5 that isn't a good trading.

Most of your trading issues will be within your head. And only you will be able to deal, fix, or overcome them.

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Pi0neer
St. Louis, United States
 
 
Posts: 4 since Oct 2014
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tturner86 View Post
Just keep in mind no one will sell a winning system. If it works they will trade it till it doesn't, then they will sell it.

Also trading is a game of losing the least amount of money, not how much you make. You can make millions but if you lose millions and end up with $5 that isn't a good trading.

Most of your trading issues will be within your head. And only you will be able to deal, fix, or overcome them.

Yes the point of trading is to gain and lose money, just have to gain more. I think im going to look into emini futures though and move away from............. pennystocks

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 Zxeses 
San Francisco CA
 
Experience: Intermediate
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Broker: CQG
Trading: ES
 
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Pi0neer View Post
Lmao I find it ironic everyone says dont throw money at an educator but buy an elite membership for this site for our videos.

And I do believe there are some people that also want other people to be successful lol. But I don't follow blindly.
But I use thinkorswim and I've been paper trading. Ive made $200. 140 in normal and 60 in forex. But Im going to look at some more webinars and whatever.

Added note, dont think of the 100$ as payment, think of it as a donation for a good cause. Big Mike is still in the Red every month to keep this site open for us and its made a world of difference for me.

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 Cloudy 
desert CA
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NT7, SC, ToS
Broker: AMP, DT, TDA
Trading: CL,NQ,YM
 
Posts: 2,135 since Jul 2011
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Pi0neer View Post
I know. But someone said to start paper trading. Just saying I am checking out a few trades when I see them pop up. Dont know why you think im trading because i think it's a way to get rich quick. My plan is to use a very small amount once i get into real trading so I dont lose (or make) much money. Even if i just made $100 dollars a month, i would be ecstatic, because the fact would be I made that money on my own.

I'm going to make sure to be cutting my losses quickly and not holding and hoping, and like i said, using a very minimal amount when i first start real trading. In the sim, im keeping my trades to under $2k.

Also just throwing it out there, I think Tim is more successful than most 'gurus' because of his marketing. It's not really marketing it's just showing proof, yeah I have a lamborghini, and a big house, etc, so you know he does make what he says. Most people i've seen claim to have useful information and good tips yet they don't make a lot or don't have proof. Not that Tim is the only one making money, I could care less about Tim, but Im just saying lol. It's the proof.

And yes, i do appreciate all the posts helping me out and would love more. Hopefully you can see where Im coming from. Especially when researching forexing trading, I saw pretty much nothing at all except for "buy this program" "buy this" buy that" with nobody showing proof of a working system other than easily faked screenshots or whatever. It's depressing lol.

You have realistic concerns. So much of stuff shown publicly could be faked screenshots or what not. I don't have a good opinion of Sykes after having personally tried one of his "seasonal" programs, big mistake, at least they gave me a refund after much effort and where I proved my sim losses on TOS. (all the calls were losers, unless it was an intentional reverse "pump and dump"; some positions were regular longs; also very very hard to find and able to do suggested shorts on TOS; some literally little volume) And there is more stuff talked about him on elitetrader about how his organization makes money not necessarily by actual trading. Also his organization is a sponsor of investimonials.com along with Jason Carter. Investimonials used to have some real reviews now I think it's overrun by vendor fakes. Another review site is forexpeacearmy.com

story on early Sykes


You could try following some of the trading journals here to see some examples. I think Masood's new ATM(alpha trading method originally j.d. Neeman) is a good one as they are currently discussing setups using basic and free indicators , and exploring the details openly.

The tons of webinars here have some good learning info some from famous in the trading world. Learning about terminology and such, you could try one of the price action intros, i.e. Brook's, PATs keeping in mind it's just learning about day trading and not really necessarily a working method. A good book is "Mind over Markets"/"Markets in Profile" just to learn about futures markets in general. And some have developed their own systems after many years of struggle and perhaps thousands wasted on vending. Those systems are not just going to be given away etc. Trading profits(and losses) are a business with some kind of income/loss, at least recognized by the IRS.

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chaim
new york
 
 
Posts: 5 since Nov 2014
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some good indicators you can find on bigmike like footprint

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