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Scalping in paper trade mode TO EASY?! I need the opinion of an established trader.
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Scalping in paper trade mode TO EASY?! I need the opinion of an established trader.

  #31 (permalink)
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kevinkdog View Post
it is pretty accurate!

I'm sure it was Mark Twain...

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  #32 (permalink)
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kevinkdog View Post
Honestly, I would say you have about a 5% chance of actually making money doing what you are doing. No one I know can scalp successfully for any period of time, and I know some fantastic traders. Most traders who I know make money have a longer term view (usually days to weeks).

You are not the first person to be tantalized by sim success, and I think it is great that you are questioning it.

Maybe the best thing for you is to try a real money test. Just use 1 contract. It might cost you a couple hundred bucks, but that may be cheaper than spending a lot more time on a method that may only work in sim.

I assume yourt talking about the "market maker" scalping I was doing. The buy and immediate sell. That being said, the other strategies I was using ...the bull/bear flags and and the Al Brooks failed break out stratgies are pretty standard stuff isn't it? I think those would have a better than 5% success rate...no?

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  #33 (permalink)
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ratfink View Post
I'm sure it was Mark Twain...

When Al Gore delivered the Gettysburg Address he invented scalping. I'm pretty sure.

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  #34 (permalink)
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donovanshane View Post
I only keep the trade on for a few minutes. Risk management was my number one concern.

It's great that you've got risk front and center in terms of importance. However you (like almost every single new trader out there) is mistaking trading small time frames and scalping, for reduced risk. In fact it's quite the opposite.

If you haven't already watched the following, it will be well worth your time:
https://futures.io/webinars/jan14_2012/where_to_start_part_1/

I think Mike talks about instrument and timeframe selection at some point if I recall correctly.

In the end nothing anyone sais here is going to change your mind if you believe that scalping is a low risk way to test out the futures market. You'll have to just experience it yourself. But you really are choosing an incredibly difficult path. The risk:reward and as a result the required win percentage is extremely difficult to achieve.

You should be starting on micro forex or micro futures (eg: M6E) and position day trading. So I would suggest spend more time on the Al Brooks stuff (if that resonates with you) and forget the scalping.

As I have found in my own trading journey, we can read all the theory and advice in the world but we will still make every mistake in the book. For some reason good solid trading knowledge generally can't just be read or listened to. It has to be experienced first hand. The only hope is that there is still enough capital at the end of the learning curve left to start actually being profitable.

Sorry for the ramble at the end there. good luck.

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  #35 (permalink)
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i think we have the same approach

hi, i was very happy to find your job as scalper (it is difficult to find a scalper, and everybody recommend to not do it), i think it is very similar to my job, and could be very interesting to share and work toguether, you can check on my journal, i started to try to ride a wave from bottom or top, entry with minimal risk, 3 tick and tr to trail or go to the swing hi or low, but was very difficult because most time the waves are only 2 or 3 tick wide, then i tested 3lot strategy targets2l+11lot+2
and 4lot strategy +1 2lot +2 1lot +3 1 lot
and the results look like 3lot are better, now i am testing 4lot startegy 2l +1 and +2lot +2 to compare with the first 4lot +1 +2 +3

the diffeent approach is i start with 20 trades, reduce to 10 trades and now i want to put max 5 trades, because i do not want to overtrade and get nervous, and it is difficult to journaling in hft

a go little by little, and my goal was to get something consistency, to start working with the process of my mind in the execution, the focus is if i can do it live and with what size.

i select zn, for reduce risk, and it is easy to read and more manageable because go in slow play, and mucj more smooth than others, also less comissions for scalping (1.86 RT for non members)

we keep in touch

alejo

La lucha es de igual a igual contra uno mismo
The fight is fair against oneself
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  #36 (permalink)
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donovanshane View Post
I assume yourt talking about the "market maker" scalping I was doing. The buy and immediate sell. That being said, the other strategies I was using ...the bull/bear flags and and the Al Brooks failed break out stratgies are pretty standard stuff isn't it? I think those would have a better than 5% success rate...no?

No, probably not. "pretty standard stuff" means most everyone knows it, so any edge that might have been associated with those patterns has likely long been exploited away. Just my opinion.

If you have any questions please send me a Private Message or use the futures.io "Ask Me Anything" thread
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  #37 (permalink)
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donovanshane View Post
... That being said, the other strategies I was using ...the bull/bear flags and and the Al Brooks failed break out stratgies are pretty standard stuff isn't it? I think those would have a better than 5% success rate...no?

Even if everyone 'knows' what to do once they spot these patterns unless they have the self-mastery achieved through practice it is very difficult to to do in real-time.

I think this applies to all strategies in trading, even those with a proven edge.

In fact that is why Edwards and Magee is still relevant, nevermind HFTs or any other 'excuses'.

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  #38 (permalink)
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Scalping in paper mode is much easier not for one reason or another but for countless reasons.

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  #39 (permalink)
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How have you been doing with your strategy since you started this thread?

I forgot to mention, here is a thread that might clear up the confusion with the fills on NT
https://futures.io/elite-trading-journals/29780-day-trading-es-s-p-500-futures-contract-pats-style-1-point-time-29.html#post376768


Last edited by Itchymoku; December 24th, 2013 at 06:24 PM.
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  #40 (permalink)
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I have always used TOS and it is true that on a limit order price must pass through before you
get filled on a market order you will give up a tick, commission are a big deal keep track and you will
see that it adds up very fast. I was introduced to futures trying to scalp with one or two ticks. I
think I would have been better taught to learn to trade for more value . Sounds like you are doing good so
the best advice would be to try it live for awhile . I can not comment on ninja trader but there is big
difference between live and paper on TOS

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