Difference in simulator trading the ES and live trading with a small account>>> - Traders Hideout | futures io social day trading
futures io futures trading


Difference in simulator trading the ES and live trading with a small account>>>
Updated: Views / Replies:2,086 / 8
Created: by budfox Attachments:2

Welcome to futures io.

(If you already have an account, login at the top of the page)

futures io is the largest futures trading community on the planet, with over 90,000 members. At futures io, our goal has always been and always will be to create a friendly, positive, forward-thinking community where members can openly share and discuss everything the world of trading has to offer. The community is one of the friendliest you will find on any subject, with members going out of their way to help others. Some of the primary differences between futures io and other trading sites revolve around the standards of our community. Those standards include a code of conduct for our members, as well as extremely high standards that govern which partners we do business with, and which products or services we recommend to our members.

At futures io, our focus is on quality education. No hype, gimmicks, or secret sauce. The truth is: trading is hard. To succeed, you need to surround yourself with the right support system, educational content, and trading mentors Ė all of which you can find on futures io, utilizing our social trading environment.

With futures io, you can find honest trading reviews on brokers, trading rooms, indicator packages, trading strategies, and much more. Our trading review process is highly moderated to ensure that only genuine users are allowed, so you donít need to worry about fake reviews.

We are fundamentally different than most other trading sites:
  • We are here to help. Just let us know what you need.
  • We work extremely hard to keep things positive in our community.
  • We do not tolerate rude behavior, trolling, or vendors advertising in posts.
  • We firmly believe in and encourage sharing. The holy grail is within you, we can help you find it.
  • We expect our members to participate and become a part of the community. Help yourself by helping others.

You'll need to register in order to view the content of the threads and start contributing to our community.  It's free and simple.

-- Big Mike, Site Administrator

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
 

Difference in simulator trading the ES and live trading with a small account>>>

  #1 (permalink)
Membership Temporarily Revoked
Toronto
 
Futures Experience: Beginner
Platform: Sierra
Broker/Data: MB
Favorite Futures: ES
 
Posts: 313 since Jun 2013
Thanks: 182 given, 58 received

Difference in simulator trading the ES and live trading with a small account>>>

Hi there,

So I have been paper trading for the past couple of weeks and feel I would like to make the transition towards opening an account starting to actually trade (I have a strict trading plan).

My question is: What are the main differences when trading live as opposed to in simulation,
aside from the psychological aspect

Slippage? How bad is slippage in trading the ES in Ninja?

I am thinking of trading the ES using Ninja (is there a free version?).

Thanks,

BF.

Reply With Quote
 
  #2 (permalink)
Quick Summary
Quick Summary Post

Quick Summary is created and edited by users like you... Add FAQ's, Links and other Relevant Information by clicking the edit button in the lower right hand corner of this message.

 
  #3 (permalink)
Membership Temporarily Revoked
Toronto
 
Futures Experience: Beginner
Platform: Sierra
Broker/Data: MB
Favorite Futures: ES
 
Posts: 313 since Jun 2013
Thanks: 182 given, 58 received

sss


So I was doing more research and I came across this:

"In electronic futures trading, limit orders are filled on a “first come, first served” basis, meaning if there are currently 600 contracts trying to sell at 855.50 and you place an order to sell 5 at 855.50, 600 contracts need to get filled before you start to get filled. So depending on how many contracts trade at each 855.50 tick you may need to see several ticks at that price before your order is filled, in fact 605 contracts have to trade at 855.50 before all 5 of your contracts are filled."

I am surprised nobody mentioend this to me.

So if I placed an order at 855.25 and it hit 855.50, regardless of how many contracts there are they will fill my order right?

I really want to know what are the main differences between sim and live trading besides thewell discussed issue of psychological affect.


Last edited by budfox; July 5th, 2013 at 06:35 PM. Reason: dunnno
Reply With Quote
 
  #4 (permalink)
Elite Member
Pompano Beach, Florida, USA
 
Futures Experience: Beginner
Platform: S5 Trader, Ninja Trader
Broker/Data: Stage5/ IQfeed
Favorite Futures: M6E, M6A, 6E, 6A, ES
 
lifeguardsteve88's Avatar
 
Posts: 159 since Jun 2013
Thanks: 272 given, 115 received


budfox View Post
So I was doing more research and I came across this:



So if I placed an order at 855.25 and it hit 855.50, regardless of how many contracts there are they will fill my order right?


If there are already 600 limit oders pending when you place your limit order, there would have to a demand of 600 "market orders" to clear all of them before your order gets to the front of the queue, to be filled by the 601st "market order' purchase at that price. When there is a long queue like that it is common for the price to pull away before your turn in the queue comes up, thus you won't get filled if that happens. It could return to that price point once it pulls away, and if you are still in the queue (you haven't canceled your limit order once the price pulls away), you MAY get filled on the second (or third, or fourth) time it hits that price point.

I'm new to all this so if I'm wrong in my explanation I'm sure someone will kindly correct me.

Cheers!

Reply With Quote
 
  #5 (permalink)
Trade Wise, Trade Well!!
Des Moines IA USA
 
Futures Experience: Advanced
Platform: InverstorRT, NinjaTrader
Broker/Data: Mirus Futures/Zen-Fire
Favorite Futures: ES
 
MarketPilot's Avatar
 
Posts: 114 since Oct 2012
Thanks: 86 given, 109 received


budfox View Post
So I have been paper trading for the past couple of weeks and feel I would like to make the transition towards opening an account starting to actually trade (I have a strict trading plan).

My question is: What are the main differences when trading live as opposed to in simulation,aside from the psychological aspect

Do not under estimate the psychological side. For me this was a tough battle. I thought I had a decent trade plan but had to figure out how to take most all of the desecration out of my entries before I could beat my monkeys and not fall into bad trading.


Quoting 
Slippage? How bad is slippage in trading the ES in Ninja?

I feel slippage depends on where and how you are entering the market. When using Limit orders, the ES may not "back and fill" your entry.


Quoting 
I am thinking of trading the ES using Ninja (is there a free version?).

Ninja has a free version. And it can work good to get you started. The biggest drawback for me was I wanted OCO (one Cancels other) orders for Targets and Stops. I do not believe you can do these entries with the Free version. But do not let that stop you from trying the free version for initial sim trading.

Then you can decide if you want the OCO Profit and Target orders.

Trade Wise, Trade Well

John
Reply With Quote
 
  #6 (permalink)
Trade Wise, Trade Well!!
Des Moines IA USA
 
Futures Experience: Advanced
Platform: InverstorRT, NinjaTrader
Broker/Data: Mirus Futures/Zen-Fire
Favorite Futures: ES
 
MarketPilot's Avatar
 
Posts: 114 since Oct 2012
Thanks: 86 given, 109 received


budfox View Post
So if I placed an order at 855.25 and it hit 855.50, regardless of how many contracts there are they will fill my order right?

If you are a seller at 855.25 and the market prints 1 order at 855.50, you would be filled as all the order book at 855.25 has to all be filled before we can print any 855.50 orders.

Trade Wise, Trade Well

John
Reply With Quote
 
  #7 (permalink)
Membership Temporarily Revoked
Toronto
 
Futures Experience: Beginner
Platform: Sierra
Broker/Data: MB
Favorite Futures: ES
 
Posts: 313 since Jun 2013
Thanks: 182 given, 58 received


MarketPilot View Post
If you are a seller at 855.25 and the market prints 1 order at 855.50, you would be filled as all the order book at 855.25 has to all be filled before we can print any 855.50 orders.

So what you are trying to say, that if I take a short position....and buy back at 855.25, you have to sell my contract tothe buyers who want to buy at 55.25, before the ones who want to buy at 55.50?

Thanks for the reply

Reply With Quote
 
  #8 (permalink)
Membership Temporarily Revoked
Toronto
 
Futures Experience: Beginner
Platform: Sierra
Broker/Data: MB
Favorite Futures: ES
 
Posts: 313 since Jun 2013
Thanks: 182 given, 58 received


MarketPilot View Post
If you are a seller at 855.25 and the market prints 1 order at 855.50, you would be filled as all the order book at 855.25 has to all be filled before we can print any 855.50 orders.

How is the fill process different to the fill process of buying a stock (not futures)....or is it the same.

I notice that even in the simulator when price hits 1611 for a bit , my order isnt filled. Generally it is filled if price "sits there for a bit" (in the DOM).

Reply With Quote
 
  #9 (permalink)
Trade Wise, Trade Well!!
Des Moines IA USA
 
Futures Experience: Advanced
Platform: InverstorRT, NinjaTrader
Broker/Data: Mirus Futures/Zen-Fire
Favorite Futures: ES
 
MarketPilot's Avatar
 
Posts: 114 since Oct 2012
Thanks: 86 given, 109 received


budfox View Post
So what you are trying to say, that if I take a short position....and buy back at 855.25, you have to sell my contract tothe buyers who want to buy at 55.25, before the ones who want to buy at 55.50?

Thanks for the reply

Not exactly. I was trying to say when you place the order to short sell, you are at the back of the line to get filled. If the trend is down, the market may not retrace enough for you to get filled. See the example below

Please register on futures.io to view futures trading content such as post attachment(s), image(s), and screenshot(s).


Here I placed my order to sell 2 contracts at 1630.25. You can see that there are a total of 34 offers to sell at this price. I'm the last two (33 and 34) at the time I click in the order. It is possible that 34 or more market order Buys happen at 1630.25 and I get filled at this price without the market going higher. But as you stated, you see the market touch this price, but you do not get filled as a seller.

Usually the market will "go through" your price before you to get filled. See below.

Please register on futures.io to view futures trading content such as post attachment(s), image(s), and screenshot(s).


Here Buyers have driven the price up above your offer of 1630.25. So now your are filled and want the market to go back down to enable you to buy at a lower price.


budfox View Post
How is the fill process different to the fill process of buying a stock (not futures)....or is it the same.

I notice that even in the simulator when price hits 1611 for a bit , my order isnt filled. Generally it is filled if price "sits there for a bit" (in the DOM).

Buying is the same only in reverse. A limit order to buy may not get filled unless the market sells 1 tick lower than your purchase price. The process should be the same for futures or stocks.

Hope this helps.

Trade Wise, Trade Well

John
Reply With Quote
The following user says Thank You to MarketPilot for this post:

Reply



futures io > > > Difference in simulator trading the ES and live trading with a small account>>>

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search



Upcoming Webinars and Events (4:30PM ET unless noted)

Linda Bradford Raschke: Reading The Tape

Elite only

Adam Grimes: TBA

Elite only

NinjaTrader: TBA

January

Ran Aroussi: TBA

Elite only
     

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
BLUELINE DELIGHT >>>Intraday Trading Strategy Guide<<< Gabriyele The Elite Circle 407 May 30th, 2013 08:29 AM
CL > to unpredictable > computer trading Trader8s Commodities Futures Trading 1 December 10th, 2012 03:27 PM
[ASK] CUSTOM DMI indi from Metastock >too> Tradestation/Multicharts jacoGreeff MultiCharts 2 June 27th, 2012 01:53 PM
First Indicator programing, Text on graph >> Easy language / Multicharts arjfca The Elite Circle 2 September 22nd, 2010 10:05 PM
TIP : Search for free NinjaTrader Indicator on BMT ? >> How to use our searchtools ! max-td Beginners and Introductions 2 July 19th, 2010 07:16 AM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 01:17 PM.

Copyright © 2017 by futures io, s.a., Av Ricardo J. Alfaro, Century Tower, Panama, +507 833-9432, info@futures.io
All information is for educational use only and is not investment advice.
There is a substantial risk of loss in trading commodity futures, stocks, options and foreign exchange products. Past performance is not indicative of future results.
no new posts
Page generated 2017-12-11 in 0.13 seconds with 20 queries on phoenix via your IP 54.145.16.43