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New Here -- from Swing Trading Stock Options to Scalping Forex Futures Currencies

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New Here -- from Swing Trading Stock Options to Scalping Forex Futures Currencies

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  #1 (permalink)
Knoxville, TN
Experience: Beginner
Platform: NT7
Trading: SPY
lllusion's Avatar
Posts: 34 since Dec 2012
Thanks: 12 given, 22 received

Hey everyone! I found this forum after searching for some details within Ninjatrader and was very attracted to the friendliness and the wealth of good information offered, so I figured I'd sign up because (formerly BMT) seems like a kickass place.

My background:

I started trading options in the stock market May 2012, so it hasn't even been a full year of trading yet, but I feel like I've learned A LOT so far for such a seemingly small amount of time. I began by learning some basic technical analysis and stock market options stuff through a beginner program that taught the strategy of trading ABC correction patterns in trends, then I needed charting software so I grabbed Advanced GET by eSignal. Seeing that Advanced GET came with its own strategy and indicators, I started trading that. It's mostly an Elliot Wave counter with special rules (based on indicators) on entry, reward to risk, and etc. I managed decently, but I found myself getting stopped out a lot because even though all the indicators gave a green light, the Elliot Wave pattern usually wasn't done retracing yet. That and the nature of options and waiting at least a day for your trade started to get to me. (I like action and fast paced stuff.) I also didn't like how there wasn't much thinking involved with it. It was just trading based off what their indicators said, which granted little room for creativity in different scenarios. That said, I'm sure there are plenty of people who use that platform + options in the stock market successfully and are fine with what works for them.

It was around that time I met a currency futures scalper who showed me how he likes to trade for a living. I got a futures account and used NinjaTrader as a demo and then I realized I really prefer daytrading and not holding positions overnight; it just goes with my trading psychology better. I didn't like having to wait overnight with options worrying in the back of my mind about what the S&P/VIX and etc. was going to do to my position. I prefer the in-and-out, in-and-out type of trading.

So here I am practicing simulator trading in Ninjatrader scalping the 6E while watching the DX. I'm currently reading YTC Price Action Trader and am wanting to read a few of Al Brooks' books as well. I know a few of you aren't the biggest fans of scalping due to commissions and slippage, but hey, if I can make more money than I lose trading in a way that goes with my trader psychology I am a happy man. I usually trade from 8:00-11:30 or so EST while keeping an eye on news events via forexfactory. Honestly I have to say I'm not doing too bad and I feel like I'm on the right track. I just need to get more screentime, an extremely thorough understanding of price action, and confidence in my own intuition. My biggest issue now is trying to manage my stops most effectively -- because those can hurt pretty bad. Gotta have lots and lots of little wins while not getting smacked in the face too hard.. haha... Right now I'm going back and forth on deciding whether I should have Advanced GET open as well when I'm trading to get a bigger Elliot Wave style picture of 6E and the DX. Plus there are a few easy to use Gann tools in the program that can be nice. Also there's the fact that I blew $3k on it, so I am wanting to find some use for it. I guess I'll keep practicing and see. A big thing for me is I know that every extra indicator or tool you have running affects your thought process and can cause cognitive dissonance and slow you down, so I'm trying to make sure I'm not too cluttered.

Anyway, that's my quick story. If anyone wants to point me to some resources for what I'm trying to achieve I'd be extremely grateful. Or if anyone has a similar strategy and wants to talk I'd love that too.

A few lessons I've learned (some more obvious than others):

-If you keep jumping from one strategy or program to the next, you're going to have a really hard time mastering any of it.
-Knowledge, experience, and intuition of price action is more important to me than finding the latest and greatest strategy or indicator(s).
-Don't get overly concerned about hitting a certain profit level each day. Go for improved statistics on your strategy, and then profit will come naturally once you get everything tweaked correctly.
-Whenever entering a trade always think, "what are some ways this market can screw me?" And be willing to accept that risk and hopefully minimize it if you can.
-Learn as much as you can from experts. Cling to people who are already successful and learn from them (this goes for any business).
-If you're looking at this as some kind of part-time gig and not giving it your all, you're gonna struggle.

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  #3 (permalink)
desert CA
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NT7, TOS, CQG-trader
Broker: AMP, DT, TDA
Trading: CL,NQ,YM
Posts: 2,130 since Jul 2011
Thanks: 2,372 given, 1,710 received

Welcome to (formerly BMT). Sounds like you've learned well in your first year. My path was a little similar in that I started trying option spreads based on Fontanills' old book. Then I heard dubious things about Optionetics and Advanced Get. I also read Miner's book "High probability trading strategies". I would recommend Miner's book for the course in elliot wave just for the education, but NOT to trade based off his methods or the DT system and software he tries to sell in the book. Same with anything Fontanills, just use his material to learn about options, not any tradeable strategies.

Basically from what I've heard wave 4 and 5 are much harder to trade in today's market. It may have been easier a decade ago. But now with all the electronic trading and HFT I've heard it's like 20% chance one can ever see those full 5 wave patterns anymore. I went the YTC route too; now I've left it completely. Too many details, cliched information, and fuzzy strategies and setups led me to be dubious about it.

Definitely Al Brooks is the best way to go if one goes through it meticulously. Every page and example, and re-rereading specific pages if necessary. I really believe reading through it and studying the examples can substitute for many hours of screen time. You come out with about a handful of generalized patterns which combined with a good indicator system for confirmation can work just fine for daytrading. An example is VinceVirgils "Cl Trades" and "CL trades light" journals where he substantially uses Al's ideas in his own price action trading examples using only a 20 ema and price action. Personally I need more than a single ma. But BPA is the foundation to start out with imo. Basically it all segues together. Wave 2,3 is really just the same as looking for a continuation first retrace entry that many systems refer to. And a failure of 1-2-3, is a failure of a continuation where one can enter in the other direction.

The recent webinar by Corey Rosenbloom covers a complete daytrading intro. Probably one of the best intro webinars I've seen and better than a lot of dubious paid vendor "intro courses" out there. The table of determining type of trading day is a great screenshot. Good luck and have fun.

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  #4 (permalink)
Knoxville, TN
Experience: Beginner
Platform: NT7
Trading: SPY
lllusion's Avatar
Posts: 34 since Dec 2012
Thanks: 12 given, 22 received

I really like Lance's YTC info. I am only reading his market analysis stuff right now and haven't read his strategy stuff (which might have been the material that turned you off a little), but he is very good at teaching the why as opposed to "here's the rule and that's just how it is" when it comes to price action. For example, he goes into detail about support and resistance and the reasons why the mass market sees those swing highs and swing lows as important areas. He goes in depth about things that contribute to the bullish or bearish orderflow sentiment of the market. I appreciate that over prior teachings I've had that just say, "this swing low is support and this swing high is resistence" with no picture or reasoning underneath it. I don't get that overhyped fluff material vibe from him. He seems to be a very "tell it like it is" trader who isn't here to sell you some amazing omgwtfsuperdooper millionaire strategy but rather to help guide you to get a better feel for the reality of the market. Stuff like that is useful to someone new like me, and his strategies that may or may not work well for me I see as an added bonus.

Anyway, you're making me really want to get into Al's stuff and those trade journals by Vince as well. I've seen his trade journals recommended before and I've seen how big they are. Tons of great info in there I bet... just gotta keep taking little bites of the elephant for now though, or else I'll get the infamous paralysis by analysis. Really really can't wait to read some price action stuff by Al for sure.

And yeah, those webinars look amazing. I've watched parts of a few of them so far and I mean to watch all of the ones that are relevant to what I'm trying to do. Will watch Corey's soon. Love the wealth of information and the overall attitude of this forum. Thanks for the welcome friend! May have to consider some CL swing trading as well in the future.

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January 14, 2013

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