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Inverse correlation between school education and trading?
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Inverse correlation between school education and trading?

  #11 (permalink)
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Another Myth

It is a myth related to the American dream that traders do not need education.


Education helps

The Turtles: Famous dispute between Bill Eckhardt and Richard Dennis, whether traders are born or can be educated. The turtle breed proved successful, as the trading relied on a simple set of rules. Out of

But now face reality:

Bill Eckhardt has a PhD in mathematics of the University of Chicago in mathematical logic. When Richard Dennis and Bill Eckhardt screened their applicants, they searched for extreme intelligence, because they had over 1,000 applications for 10 trainnes. They recruited:

- a guy with a Ph.D. in lguistics from the University of Chicago
- a grain trader from Cargill, who had been the Massachussetts state chess champion
- a professional blackjack and backgammon player

etc.

Also famous hedge fund manager Edward O.Thorpe is a professor of mathematics, blackjack player and inventor of the first wearable computer: http://monet.cs.columbia.edu/courses/mobwear/resources/thorp-iswc98.pdf

George Soros has a degree from the London School of Economics and was a student of Karl Popper.

If you are a systems trader, education definitely helps.


Floor Traders

I believe that the skill set required for floor trading was much different. A floor trader mainly relied on relationships with the brokers and other locals. This was not an academic game and I believe that there is even a negative correlation between education and success.


Monkeys

Some traders rely on their good luck only, but how do you estimate the probability that they make money?

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  #12 (permalink)
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Harry are you trying to defend your status ?

There are good and bad examples on both sides, main point in my opinion education helps not only in trading but life as well.

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  #13 (permalink)
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redratsal View Post
Harry are you trying to defend your status ?

There are good and bad examples on both sides, main point in my opinion education helps not only in trading but life as well.

My point was that it is difficult to become a good trader without appropriate education or training. Of course you do not need to have a university degree to become successful, as long as you have the skill set required for trading.

Of course no education can guarantee that you will make it as a trader. But if you want to make it big, then you can not forego mathematics, as you need to understand risk and money management.

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You need a good education ... so you can get a high paying job ... to earn enough money ... to keep opening trading accounts after you have blown up all the previous accounts ... and pay your mortgage ... and pay child support from the marriage that blew up along with your trading accounts ... and enable you to buy good liquor to drown your sorrows in wondering why you have wasted your life ... until you stumble across futures.io (formerly BMT) ... get advice from @Fat Tails and @redratsal ... and start making major bucks....

I'm just a simple man trading a simple plan.

My daddy always said, "Every day above ground is a good day!"
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  #15 (permalink)
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well
1. You should ask the traders with little education what they think about your question - They'll probably say
to get a degree in something that interests you, not necessarily trade related. Plus, investigate whether these people really made the money they say or if they're just exaggerating a temporary gain. Some traders really have inflated egos

2. See if the people who do have a degree who are trading have any special circumstances attached to their inability - like for example they could just be an exception where lets say they are so stressed with their job they decided to take the easy way out thinking trading will make them more money in less time without realizing the potential time investment or unforeseen learning curve so they force it.

3. Don't decide to make a living trading unless you know you can make a living trading. Don't trade away the money you've saved to go to college lol. 100% of retail traders who make a living at it have blow up an account, if you meet a trader who didn't ask them to mentor you personally.

4. If you do make a living trading you'll probably have a lot of free time to start other ventures, and you'll probably
want to compensate for the monotony of trading with perhaps taking some courses in something interesting to keep your mind sharp.


Last edited by Itchymoku; August 22nd, 2012 at 07:47 AM.
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  #16 (permalink)
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This correlation...

you mention is purely anecdotal. BUT I do have a similar hallucination. I believe that the conclusion is not mono-elemental, rather multiple traits and attributes contribute, with what you mention being the most visible underlier.

Have to get paid here so if anyone wants examples, just say so. DB

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Fat Tails View Post
It is a myth related to the American dream that traders do not need education.


Education helps

The Turtles: Famous dispute between Bill Eckhardt and Richard Dennis, whether traders are born or can be educated. The turtle breed proved successful, as the trading relied on a simple set of rules. Out of

But now face reality:

Bill Eckhardt has a PhD in mathematics of the University of Chicago in mathematical logic. When Richard Dennis and Bill Eckhardt screened their applicants, they searched for extreme intelligence, because they had over 1,000 applications for 10 trainnes. They recruited:

- a guy with a Ph.D. in lguistics from the University of Chicago
- a grain trader from Cargill, who had been the Massachussetts state chess champion
- a professional blackjack and backgammon player

etc.

Also famous hedge fund manager Edward O.Thorpe is a professor of mathematics, blackjack player and inventor of the first wearable computer: http://monet.cs.columbia.edu/courses/mobwear/resources/thorp-iswc98.pdf

George Soros has a degree from the London School of Economics and was a student of Karl Popper.

If you are a systems trader, education definitely helps.


Floor Traders

I believe that the skill set required for floor trading was much different. A floor trader mainly relied on relationships with the brokers and other locals. This was not an academic game and I believe that there is even a negative correlation between education and success.


Monkeys

Some traders rely on their good luck only, but how do you estimate the probability that they make money?

Please register on futures.io to view futures trading content such as post attachment(s), image(s), and screenshot(s).

This sums up the debate, right?


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  #18 (permalink)
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People that are Executives in powerful positions are used to being right. They are used to getting their way. Overall, this is not a good fit as a trader.

Blue collar workers are used to following directions. This is a better fit for trading.

This mimics what I've heard, read, and experienced directly. A lot of C-level people are the worst performers in trading, because they are not used to being wrong and have a hard time accepting it. The cardinal sin of trading...

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  #19 (permalink)
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Out of curiousity, how many here in futures.io (formerly BMT) has a Mathematics or Engineering degree or even Phds? This requisite seems to be the norm nowadays if you want to be recruited as a IBank trader..For starters, I have an engineering degree, from an Ivy League school no less, heck, even traded in an IBank..Thought I knew a lot when I first started daytrading, but was soon brought down to earth, I really know nothing about what trading is...untill I found futures.io (formerly BMT)

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YJ78 View Post
Out of curiousity, how many here in futures.io (formerly BMT) has a Mathematics or Engineering degree or even Phds? This requisite seems to be the norm nowadays if you want to be recruited as a IBank trader..For starters, I have an engineering degree, from an Ivy League school no less, heck, even traded in an IBank..Thought I knew a lot when I first started daytrading, but was soon brought down to earth, I really know nothing about what trading is...untill I found futures.io (formerly BMT)

Some knowledge of mathematics or an engineering degree is something like a prerequisite for quantitative (non-discretionary) trading. A prerequisite is just something that should facilitate the learning process as a trader.

But then there are other skills that are required and must be learned (I believe that it can be learned, see example of the turtles). Those other skill include discipline, flexibility when the market does the opposite of what you expected, accepting losses as part of the business .....

Learning those skills is not related to school education. There is probably no correlation. But there is a positive correlation, if you have a good teacher.

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