Advice from traders with 5+years experience - Traders Hideout | futures io social day trading
futures io futures trading


Advice from traders with 5+years experience
Updated: Views / Replies:16,721 / 91
Created: by jsd45 Attachments:2

Welcome to futures io.

(If you already have an account, login at the top of the page)

futures io is the largest futures trading community on the planet, with over 90,000 members. At futures io, our goal has always been and always will be to create a friendly, positive, forward-thinking community where members can openly share and discuss everything the world of trading has to offer. The community is one of the friendliest you will find on any subject, with members going out of their way to help others. Some of the primary differences between futures io and other trading sites revolve around the standards of our community. Those standards include a code of conduct for our members, as well as extremely high standards that govern which partners we do business with, and which products or services we recommend to our members.

At futures io, our focus is on quality education. No hype, gimmicks, or secret sauce. The truth is: trading is hard. To succeed, you need to surround yourself with the right support system, educational content, and trading mentors – all of which you can find on futures io, utilizing our social trading environment.

With futures io, you can find honest trading reviews on brokers, trading rooms, indicator packages, trading strategies, and much more. Our trading review process is highly moderated to ensure that only genuine users are allowed, so you don’t need to worry about fake reviews.

We are fundamentally different than most other trading sites:
  • We are here to help. Just let us know what you need.
  • We work extremely hard to keep things positive in our community.
  • We do not tolerate rude behavior, trolling, or vendors advertising in posts.
  • We firmly believe in and encourage sharing. The holy grail is within you, we can help you find it.
  • We expect our members to participate and become a part of the community. Help yourself by helping others.

You'll need to register in order to view the content of the threads and start contributing to our community.  It's free and simple.

-- Big Mike, Site Administrator

Reply
 2  
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
 

Advice from traders with 5+years experience

  #21 (permalink)
Elite Member
Bala, PA, USA
 
Futures Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NinjaTrader
Broker/Data: Mirus, IB
Favorite Futures: SPY, Oil, Euro
 
monpere's Avatar
 
Posts: 1,858 since Jul 2010
Thanks: 300 given, 3,276 received


Cloudy View Post
Good points about scalping side effects Big Mike. I've noticed I have a harder time going for and holding out for bigger targets and how to trade runners since I've been habituated on scalping the last 6 months. And this is a hurdle I need to work on as well as exposing weakness in entry and setup recognition since a scalper tends to trade off of a much smaller focus on the charts of the smallest time frames. I probably stand corrected in that maybe it's better for most new student traders to learn how to trade for at least 10, 15 ticks depending on instrument, and learning to adjust risk/reward ratio and getting confident that way before learning to scalp so as not to be limited as much by the habits formed from scalping alone. I'm not a 5+ year daytrader, more an almost 2 year, so just my personal experience.

Scalp and non scalp trading are 2 different ball games. The same rules don't apply to both. Most higher time frame traders are trading S/R levels, trying to capitalize on market participant behavior, attempting to anticipate where other market participants will react. If that is your mindset, you are going to fail hard at scalping, because these market phenomena are meaningless in smaller time frames.

Scalpers generally are pattern traders trading the observed statistical percentages of specific market technical patterns. These patterns generally occur due to the natural side effects of the normal technical day to day workings of the markets, and such they cannot be traded in the same way as S/R levels anticipation, etc. If this is your mindset, you may succeed at higher time frame trading after you've gone through the pattern identification, and statistical analysis prep work for the higher time frame data. But there various other reasons you may still fail.

Higher time frame trading requires and understanding of the markets, the behavior of market participants, and flexible and adjustable execution. Scalping requires an eye for pattern recognition, statistical data analysis, and strict methodical execution. Applying the wrong approach to either of these different styles will most often mean categorical failure. Understand who you are, and what approach will fit your personality best, then apply the appropriate methodology.

You will be a god among men, if you can combine the two.


Last edited by monpere; March 7th, 2012 at 01:27 PM.
Reply With Quote
The following 15 users say Thank You to monpere for this post:
 
  #22 (permalink)
Elite Member
Bala, PA, USA
 
Futures Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NinjaTrader
Broker/Data: Mirus, IB
Favorite Futures: SPY, Oil, Euro
 
monpere's Avatar
 
Posts: 1,858 since Jul 2010
Thanks: 300 given, 3,276 received

Trade proactively rather then reactively, so that you become a stalker. Determine in advance exactly what the market has to do for you to enter or act on a trade. Get to the point where you know ahead of time, several bars in advance, several minutes in advance where you will, enter, exit, or adjust. If the next bar does this, I will enter here, if price comes down here and does this, I will exit there, if price does this, I will do that...

Reply With Quote
The following 12 users say Thank You to monpere for this post:
 
  #23 (permalink)
Banned: trolling
NYC + NY / USA
 
Futures Experience: Advanced
Platform: "I trade, therefore, I AM!"; Theme Song: "Atomic Dog!"
Favorite Futures: EMD, 6J, ZB
 
kronie's Avatar
 
Posts: 798 since Oct 2009
Thanks: 216 given, 498 received



jsd45 View Post
I graduated college and have been trading for about 7 months....For the more experience traders, what are somethings you did as rookie trader that you look back on and wish you hadn't? Any other advice would be greatly appreciated to...

are you consistently profitable?

what classes or subject matter studied in collegiate course work, do you attribute as having made a substantial contribution to our trading, whether good or bad?

do you engage in vigorous inter-rogatories?, know the significance they have towards reaching higher trading levels?

these questions (please answer them, or pm me) are those.

that's how you succeed!

you take stock, inventory, reassess and find solutions beyond what you have identified as faults (if you have identified any).

seek professional help!
actually as funny as that seems, its a compliment, and that's what you're doing by participating on these threads...
seeking professional help

ready for lesson 2?

Reply With Quote
 
  #24 (permalink)
Membership Revoked
DetroitMIUSA
 
Futures Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NinjaTrader
Favorite Futures: ES
 
Posts: 193 since Feb 2012
Thanks: 26 given, 58 received

Bench mark. Who set it?


Quoting 
Do not trade cash until you're consistently profitable on SIM

Who determined this? How long do/did they trade on sim and what is CP? 1 month 2 3 4? Strictly 3 trades a day. Win Lose or Scratch? What? Help me out here.. Who exactly started this up? Is this info for just newbie's who are not skilled enough to be trading IRM?

Reply With Quote
 
  #25 (permalink)
Membership Revoked
DetroitMIUSA
 
Futures Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NinjaTrader
Favorite Futures: ES
 
Posts: 193 since Feb 2012
Thanks: 26 given, 58 received


Quoting 
Make sure you're well capitalized.

I will ask again. Who thought this up. If a trader wants to trade he is going to trade. Being under capitalized in the live market is a sentence for doom and a set up for faliure/blow out. However. Who set the magic number for a new or any trader for that matter to go in there live? What is it? 3k 5k 10k 100k?

The thing that gets traders in bigggggggg trouble is trading size on an account that is not capitalized for it. 10 cars on 20 large? Keep that up and you ARE doomed!

Reply With Quote
 
  #26 (permalink)
Elite Member
La Jolla, CA
 
Futures Experience: Master
Platform: Sierra Chart, X_Trader Pro, OptionsCity
Broker/Data: Advantage, Trading Technologies, OptionsCity, IQ Feed
Favorite Futures: CL, NG
 
Private Banker's Avatar
 
Posts: 1,040 since Jul 2010
Thanks: 1,713 given, 3,759 received


PowerBroker View Post
I will ask again. Who thought this up. If a trader wants to trade he is going to trade. Being under capitalized in the live market is a sentence for doom and a set up for faliure/blow out. However. Who set the magic number for a new or any trader for that matter to go in there live? What is it? 3k 5k 10k 100k?

The thing that gets traders in bigggggggg trouble is trading size on an account that is not capitalized for it. 10 cars on 20 large? Keep that up and you ARE doomed!

I thought this up. Your comments are aimless though.

I've been trading for a long time and have seen a lot of people fail. My intent in writing that was to help aim new(er) traders from ruin, including you (I read your journal). CP = consistently profitable and that would depend on what type of trader we're talking about of course. Example intra-day vs. swing trade. But for the intra-day trader being the majority here, I would think at least 60% profitable at a minimum.

As for trading with live cash and being well capitalized, a trader should be in the market that is best suited for their account size vs. what they can afford to risk (not make). If you have a small account of say $5,000, maybe trade the micro currencies to start out to get a feel for trading live. I would think $10,000 per full size contract is a good, safe way to start out. You aren't utilizing your firm's BS margin and allowing for plenty of room for mistakes without complete ruin.

But in all honesty, the questions you've asked are completely fair. Maybe it's just the way you've worded them that is such a turn off to respond. I take it you're new to trading and looking for some direction? If so, this site is a great resource.

Best of luck!

Reply With Quote
The following 7 users say Thank You to Private Banker for this post:
 
  #27 (permalink)
Banned: trolling
NYC + NY / USA
 
Futures Experience: Advanced
Platform: "I trade, therefore, I AM!"; Theme Song: "Atomic Dog!"
Favorite Futures: EMD, 6J, ZB
 
kronie's Avatar
 
Posts: 798 since Oct 2009
Thanks: 216 given, 498 received

PB (Private Banker)
... I find the avatar refreshing, seeing Gordo Gecko in his younger years, just before he said: (what? - for the trivia experts?)

ok, answer: "I just wired $800,000, I made in Hong Kong Gold (last night), .... spread it around, and put some on those dog ---- stocks you mentioned...."


PB,

waiting until one has $10,000 margin per contract will keep exactly 99.8% of the traders on these threads out of the market forever. Evidently, you really were on a live desk, with live funds.

When I was same, I noticed better capitalized traders blow through their $25,000 (and higher) accounts faster than 2 months, diligently following the house's instructions (at that time it was Bright Brothers in Las Vegas home office)

there's more to this equation, and the biggest hurdle is "realization". I noticed that most traders or prospective traders, fantasized about being in some Hollywood glory role as a trader on a desk, profitable, arrogant and everything working for them. They thought, when they would drive to work in the morning, they would catch every green light, just as they arrived at the intersection. They remained in that delusional world long enough to waste every dime and become under-capitalized.

They just simply, dusted off their seats, and yelled: "NEXT", and in some cases, had to call the janitor over to clean up the mess and let the chair dry out until the next day, before yelling: "NEXT". So, that was the outcome.

The reason so many former stock traders, have migrated over to the Emini format are the more reasonable risk management features and rewards of Emini(s).

Just think, for $500 per contract, and $5,000, a maximum of 10 cars (not advised, just for sake of this discussion), this was a pretty powerful draw.

One quickly learns that sim trading is the best friend they could possibly have (not a dog, as Gordo would say), and if they implement this simple strategy of:

A) 3 cars on (of course, using a reasonably determined stoploss and never trading without a stoploss), peeling 1 off at a fixed profit interval; peeling 2nd off at a higher interval and letting remaining run to a higher interval that they:

B) usually were profitable by days end, and were able to manage the remaining 1 car, whenever it went against them and took back earlier earned profits

C) so, for an average $1,500 (3 cars) of a $2,500 or $5,000 account, one could participate, perhaps turn profitable, and in the least, manage their risk, especially when things went against them

with that discipline, when one turns over from simulated to live, one usually has success and is off to a reasonable start.

there will be reversals, but that's the basis and evolution taught by ohh so many vendors our here too

Reply With Quote
The following 2 users say Thank You to kronie for this post:
 
  #28 (permalink)
Elite Member
La Jolla, CA
 
Futures Experience: Master
Platform: Sierra Chart, X_Trader Pro, OptionsCity
Broker/Data: Advantage, Trading Technologies, OptionsCity, IQ Feed
Favorite Futures: CL, NG
 
Private Banker's Avatar
 
Posts: 1,040 since Jul 2010
Thanks: 1,713 given, 3,759 received


kronie View Post
PB (Private Banker)
... I find the avatar refreshing, seeing Gordo Gecko in his younger years, just before he said: (what? - for the trivia experts?)

ok, answer: "I just wired $800,000, I made in Hong Kong Gold (last night), .... spread it around, and put some on those dog ---- stocks you mentioned...."


PB,

waiting until one has $10,000 margin per contract will keep exactly 99.8% of the traders on these threads out of the market forever. Evidently, you really were on a live desk, with live funds.

When I was same, I noticed better capitalized traders blow through their $25,000 (and higher) accounts faster than 2 months, diligently following the house's instructions (at that time it was Bright Brothers in Las Vegas home office)

there's more to this equation, and the biggest hurdle is "realization". I noticed that most traders or prospective traders, fantasized about being in some Hollywood glory role as a trader on a desk, profitable, arrogant and everything working for them. They thought, when they would drive to work in the morning, they would catch every green light, just as they arrived at the intersection. They remained in that delusional world long enough to waste every dime and become under-capitalized.

They just simply, dusted off their seats, and yelled: "NEXT", and in some cases, had to call the janitor over to clean up the mess and let the chair dry out until the next day, before yelling: "NEXT". So, that was the outcome.

The reason so many former stock traders, have migrated over to the Emini format are the more reasonable risk management features and rewards of Emini(s).

Just think, for $500 per contract, and $5,000, a maximum of 10 cars (not advised, just for sake of this discussion), this was a pretty powerful draw.

One quickly learns that sim trading is the best friend they could possibly have (not a dog, as Gordo would say), and if they implement this simple strategy of:

A) 3 cars on (of course, using a reasonably determined stoploss and never trading without a stoploss), peeling 1 off at a fixed profit interval; peeling 2nd off at a higher interval and letting remaining run to a higher interval that they:

B) usually were profitable by days end, and were able to manage the remaining 1 car, whenever it went against them and took back earlier earned profits

C) so, for an average $1,500 (3 cars) of a $2,500 or $5,000 account, one could participate, perhaps turn profitable, and in the least, manage their risk, especially when things went against them

with that discipline, when one turns over from simulated to live, one usually has success and is off to a reasonable start.

there will be reversals, but that's the basis and evolution taught by ohh so many vendors our here too

Thanks! I'm a huge fan of that movie and it was my inspiration for getting into the biz and working on the Street.

Great trivia question, you should've at least let me give a crack at it before you answered, lol! I was actually thinking this: "Oh, jeez, I wish you could see this … the lights coming up. I've never seen a painting that captures the beauty of the ocean in a moment like this. I'm going to make you rich, Bud Fox, rich enough you can afford a girl like Darien. This is your wake up call, pal. Go to work." Lol!

I agree with what you said about using good money management such as having multiple targets. I'm a firm believer in your success rate greatly increases when trading with multiple contracts. I break my positions into 1/3's and it really allows for removing risk as the trade progresses while ensuring a profitable or BE trade depending on how you structure your targets.

Obviously my $10,000/contract is extremely conservative and really just aimed at complete new traders that have zero trading experience. If someone has a relatively high probability set up coupled with sound money management like we just mentioned, I'm sure someone could trade with far less capital. And you're right, sometimes having too big of an account creates a false sense of security. I've seen guys blow through 6 figures like nothing. It's usually the guys that don't use stops or add to their losers on a strong trending market.

Anyway, great post!

Cheers,
PB

Reply With Quote
 
  #29 (permalink)
Membership Revoked
DetroitMIUSA
 
Futures Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NinjaTrader
Favorite Futures: ES
 
Posts: 193 since Feb 2012
Thanks: 26 given, 58 received

Thanks for the repsonse

PB I appreciated it.

I can say that going in the live market unprepared is a set up for failure for sure. I can be trasparent here I think and say that both times I went in there it was with 3 large. Under capitalized at best and not realistic at all in what I was trading in. That being CL and GC. But "no no I got this". And then there was a big ginormous red candle in GC that said guess what dude no you don't. BOOM just like that. It wasn't catastrophic but going down $700 on one candle was enough for moi. I was out. Again.

Don't get me wrong I wanted to trade live and know what it felt as far as the psychology of it. I knew full well that I could potentially lose money. Hell even all of it. So there I am after clicking the buy button on my very first trade. Like a dork newbie (no no I got this as it were) I play 5 cars on a 3k account.. NOT very smart. SO there I am with my right hand physically shaking and my heart feeling like it is going to come right out of my chest cavity. Yikes!! I made $900 and thought I was GG for god's sake. Holy cow how one can be rudddddely awaken on the very next trade(s)..

Now my risk mgt and MM are more in line with what I WILL be doing once I return to the live market. When that is is TBD. Gotta work now this season and do what I AM an expert at. LOL If you don't have the risk mgt and the MM down as I always say "Trade smart OR JUST DON"T TRADE"!!!

Now I just toil everyday to become more and more CP. Always learning my instrument more and more. I do think that you only have to trade 1-2 instruments at a mastery level to make a good living in the live market. I now am aiming to do just this. Hell I make a good living now and have 6 months a year off and all the freedom I want. BUT I LOVE MONEY!!!! LMAO

Reply With Quote
The following user says Thank You to PowerBroker for this post:
 
  #30 (permalink)
Elite Member
La Jolla, CA
 
Futures Experience: Master
Platform: Sierra Chart, X_Trader Pro, OptionsCity
Broker/Data: Advantage, Trading Technologies, OptionsCity, IQ Feed
Favorite Futures: CL, NG
 
Private Banker's Avatar
 
Posts: 1,040 since Jul 2010
Thanks: 1,713 given, 3,759 received



PowerBroker View Post
PB I appreciated it.

I can say that going in the live market unprepared is a set up for failure for sure. I can be trasparent here I think and say that both times I went in there it was with 3 large. Under capitalized at best and not realistic at all in what I was trading in. That being CL and GC. But "no no I got this". And then there was a big ginormous red candle in GC that said guess what dude no you don't. BOOM just like that. It wasn't catastrophic but going down $700 on one candle was enough for moi. I was out. Again.

Don't get me wrong I wanted to trade live and know what it felt as far as the psychology of it. I knew full well that I could potentially lose money. Hell even all of it. So there I am after clicking the buy button on my very first trade. Like a dork newbie (no no I got this as it were) I play 5 cars on a 3k account.. NOT very smart. SO there I am with my right hand physically shaking and my heart feeling like it is going to come right out of my chest cavity. Yikes!! I made $900 and thought I was GG for god's sake. Holy cow how one can be rudddddely awaken on the very next trade(s)..

Now my risk mgt and MM are more in line with what I WILL be doing once I return to the live market. When that is is TBD. Gotta work now this season and do what I AM an expert at. LOL If you don't have the risk mgt and the MM down as I always say "Trade smart OR JUST DON"T TRADE"!!!

Now I just toil everyday to become more and more CP. Always learning my instrument more and more. I do think that you only have to trade 1-2 instruments at a mastery level to make a good living in the live market. I now am aiming to do just this. Hell I make a good living now and have 6 months a year off and all the freedom I want. BUT I LOVE MONEY!!!! LMAO

Thanks for sharing that! Like I mentioned earlier, you really should trade a market that is suitable to your account size with regards to the amount of risk you can feasibly handle. Trading a market like Gold or Crude Oil requires a lot more risk to be taken because of the wild volatility that takes place. Your stops need to be a lot larger than say a lower vol market. Don't think about how much you can make, it's really about how much you can afford to lose. Once you hit buy or sell, that money may be gone or you may make money but the proper thing to do is focus on your risk and trading well. The moment you get caught up in how much money you made or are currently making on a trade is the moment when you need to stop and collect yourself. The same goes for losing. Focus on taking your set ups and trading well while keeping the emotional aspect out of the situation.

Reply With Quote
The following 4 users say Thank You to Private Banker for this post:

Reply



futures io > > > Advice from traders with 5+years experience

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search



Upcoming Webinars and Events (4:30PM ET unless noted)

Linda Bradford Raschke: Reading The Tape

Elite only

Adam Grimes: TBA

Elite only

NinjaTrader: TBA

January

Ran Aroussi: TBA

Elite only
     

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Advice - joke kbit Jokes 0 June 10th, 2011 01:01 PM
High-Frequency Traders Elbow Aside Day Traders – What do you think about this? Arpad Traders Hideout 7 December 17th, 2010 11:42 PM
Experience with Beyond Traders Private Trading (www.beyondtraders.com) Alan Trading Reviews and Vendors 1 November 23rd, 2010 10:56 PM
Retail traders vs professional traders jonc Psychology and Money Management 19 November 11th, 2010 12:28 PM
Experience points Big Mike Feedback and Announcements 0 October 17th, 2009 08:58 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 10:59 PM.

Copyright © 2017 by futures io, s.a., Av Ricardo J. Alfaro, Century Tower, Panama, +507 833-9432, info@futures.io
All information is for educational use only and is not investment advice.
There is a substantial risk of loss in trading commodity futures, stocks, options and foreign exchange products. Past performance is not indicative of future results.
no new posts
Page generated 2017-12-11 in 0.20 seconds with 20 queries on phoenix via your IP 54.145.16.43