Minimum starting funds to learn to trade - Traders Hideout | futures io social day trading
futures io futures trading


Minimum starting funds to learn to trade
Updated: Views / Replies:12,352 / 106
Created: by Big Mike Attachments:8

Welcome to futures io.

(If you already have an account, login at the top of the page)

futures io is the largest futures trading community on the planet, with over 90,000 members. At futures io, our goal has always been and always will be to create a friendly, positive, forward-thinking community where members can openly share and discuss everything the world of trading has to offer. The community is one of the friendliest you will find on any subject, with members going out of their way to help others. Some of the primary differences between futures io and other trading sites revolve around the standards of our community. Those standards include a code of conduct for our members, as well as extremely high standards that govern which partners we do business with, and which products or services we recommend to our members.

At futures io, our focus is on quality education. No hype, gimmicks, or secret sauce. The truth is: trading is hard. To succeed, you need to surround yourself with the right support system, educational content, and trading mentors Ė all of which you can find on futures io, utilizing our social trading environment.

With futures io, you can find honest trading reviews on brokers, trading rooms, indicator packages, trading strategies, and much more. Our trading review process is highly moderated to ensure that only genuine users are allowed, so you donít need to worry about fake reviews.

We are fundamentally different than most other trading sites:
  • We are here to help. Just let us know what you need.
  • We work extremely hard to keep things positive in our community.
  • We do not tolerate rude behavior, trolling, or vendors advertising in posts.
  • We firmly believe in and encourage sharing. The holy grail is within you, we can help you find it.
  • We expect our members to participate and become a part of the community. Help yourself by helping others.

You'll need to register in order to view the content of the threads and start contributing to our community.  It's free and simple.

-- Big Mike, Site Administrator

Reply
 8  
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
 

Minimum starting funds to learn to trade

  #31 (permalink)
Elite Member
Como, Italy
 
Futures Experience: Advanced
Platform: Tradestation, IB
Broker/Data: Tradestation, IB
Favorite Futures: ES
 
Posts: 158 since Aug 2014
Thanks: 236 given, 228 received


FABRICATORX View Post
How did you start?

it's a long story, anyway to make long story short, when I sold my internet based company that I co founded with an initial capital of just 5k, I founded a prop trading company. I worked with some top level traders that taught their way of working. When that kind of working was starting not to work anymore, one of them asked me to run on a company account some automated strategies he had developed on futures, just to try something new.
Those strategies worked very well for two years so I started developing some myself. When I closed the company I continued working in that direction and I still do.

Reply With Quote
The following user says Thank You to montanajtt for this post:
 
  #32 (permalink)
Trading for Fun
Geelong Victoria
 
Futures Experience: Advanced
Platform: Dealbook 360/ Trader Workstation
Broker/Data: I-Deal, Interactive Brokers
Favorite Futures: Index Futures & Options
 
Posts: 113 since Jan 2015
Thanks: 45 given, 88 received


Zentrader2010 View Post
Hi,
this may be a controversial subject, but let;s assume a few facts, and then ask the same question, how much capital do you need?

a. If you lost MOST of your capital through trading something and it didn't work?
For instance, I lost about 3 K trading OIL not long ago ( never traded it before).....my account was down to about $400.
b. Then, let's say that ( due to necessity), you decided you were absolutely going to WIN back that stake no matter what !!! What if you made that statement and meant it.
c. Then you traded something you were more familiar with, and you were using a very rational, common sense approach - which the HUGE loss helped you STICK TO, and you followed rules because you HAD TO.

d. The CHALLENGE then is - could you do it in 1 month???

I did it......and now I'm happy to really GO FOR IT because I realised something in this Big loss, BIG win scenario....
you'll never get rich trading 2% of your account size. And why should you trade 2 % anyway? What beginner trader has 50 K? It's an oxymoron to assume that, because lots of traders are hugely under-capitalised in relation to their trading vision ( I will make a living from trading etc). If you have 5 K, my challenge shows you don't need 50 K to get win enough to start trading.....

e. If you lost $400 trying to make $3000 in a month, how may times could you do that, month after month before you threw the towel in? ( If you lose the $400, you can't trade until the next month)......
My answer is .....I would never give in....it's such a small amount compared to my day job income, it's totally worth the small risk, and the challenge.....why ? because
1) I'm not risking 50 K to start and pretending I'm not scared, and thus trading only 2 % and pretending that if I lose 2 % It wouldn't hurt me psychologically. Why? because, who makes $1000 per day? Not many, that's why.
It wouldn't matter how long it took to make 50 K. It hurts to lose it for most mortal beings here ( be real please).
2) If I lose $400, that's my average daily takings from my day job, not bad you say? Well I think it sucks. That's why I would part with such a small morsel of funds and barely blink ( god knows the tax man takes more than that per week in Australia !)......If it meant gaining financial freedom through trading for a living.....If you can make 3 K from $400.....in 1 month, I'm sure you could make 40 K in a year. I don't care what anybody says on this site....

Just take the challenge yourself.........I've already proven to myself I can do, and I did it with the worst kind of stress, trying to get your losses back.....but that's my point in the thread.......ANYBODY can win their stake back IF THEY ABSOLUTELY MUST DO IT......well, if you have even some small ability trading......If you don't, you can't hide behind 2 % money management risk saving rules........why not prove to yourself you even have what it takes to be a successful trader and stop pussy footing around for years and years procrastinating.....

Sorry, I just say what I think........scold me? I don't care.....just take my challenge...prove it to yourself.

To answer your original question, yes I can recover blown accounts, I have done so several times in the past. But, it is always smarter to not get into that position in the first place, generally it occured because I was simply pushing too hard/ overtrading.
Cheers John

Reply With Quote
The following 2 users say Thank You to Johno1 for this post:
 
  #33 (permalink)
Site Administrator
Manta, Ecuador
 
Futures Experience: Advanced
Platform: My own custom solution
Favorite Futures: E-mini ES S&P 500
 
Big Mike's Avatar
 
Posts: 46,240 since Jun 2009
Thanks: 29,357 given, 83,237 received


Refreshing this thread with a new poll:

How much money do you need to trade futures successfully?

Total votes: 1110
 


Please vote and discuss.

Mike

Due to time constraints, please do not PM me if your question can be resolved or answered on the forum.

Need help?
1) Stop changing things. No new indicators, charts, or methods. Be consistent with what is in front of you first.
2) Start a journal and post to it daily with the trades you made to show your strengths and weaknesses.
3) Set goals for yourself to reach daily. Make them about how you trade, not how much money you make.
4) Accept responsibility for your actions. Stop looking elsewhere to explain away poor performance.
5) Where to start as a trader? Watch this webinar and read this thread for hundreds of questions and answers.
6)
Help using the forum? Watch this video to learn general tips on using the site.

If you want
to support our community, become an Elite Member.

Reply With Quote
The following user says Thank You to Big Mike for this post:
 
  #34 (permalink)
Elite Member
Canada
 
Futures Experience: Beginner
Platform: NinjaTrader
Broker/Data: InteractiveBrokers
Favorite Futures: NQ
 
SoftSoap's Avatar
 
Posts: 594 since Aug 2015
Thanks: 347 given, 1,223 received

I voted $10-$50k for 2 reasons:
  1. This is where I fit
  2. But most importantly, it's sufficient enough to trade the market and see if you have an edge or not.

Adding money to an account is easy (2nd job, sell assets, TST, etc.), but what good is a big account if you don't have an edge?

edit- I should add that with an account that small, you should not expect to take money home until you grow your account. It's just useful for determining whether or not you have an edge.

Yesterday's excellence is today's standard and tomorrow's mediocrity
Reply With Quote
The following user says Thank You to SoftSoap for this post:
 
  #35 (permalink)
Hi Mom!
Bridgeport, Ct
 
Futures Experience: Intermediate
Platform: Sierra
Favorite Futures: Gold, Oil
 
TheShrike's Avatar
 
Posts: 365 since Jun 2012
Thanks: 1,029 given, 472 received

I feel the higher end of the 10k-50k range is ideal to begin. Any more than that and I feel you'd be setting yourself up for a big loss if you don't know what you're doing. Any less and it's difficult to have a position with a proper stop or to be able to add effectively to it. Just my thoughts.

Reply With Quote
 
  #36 (permalink)
Elite Member
Memphis TN
 
Futures Experience: None
Platform: ToS
Broker/Data: TDA
Favorite Futures: None
 
Pariah Carey's Avatar
 
Posts: 592 since Jan 2014
Thanks: 142 given, 1,410 received

The new poll is quite a different issue than the original poll and title of the thread. I think first one has to define what "trade successfully" means. To me it means trading as my sole or primary source of income, providing for my family, and building wealth for retirement (something I'm a long ways away from now). That's going to take at least 750,000 in trading funds. Preferably a lot more.

If you're skilled and can realize, say, a 20% annual return after taxes, that's 150,000 salary. Pretty good, but still basically working for a living. Keep in mind that your standard of living is going to keep rising, especially if you have children. Buying a home, health care, school tuition--it's all going to keep going up. Skyrocketing in some cases.

For all the people that voted such low amounts (10k, really?) I'd like to know what their definition of successful trading is. Making beer money? Being consistently profitable? I'm consistently profitable now, but nowhere near calling myself a full-time trader.

Someday, and that day may never come, I'll call upon you to do a service for me.

Last edited by Pariah Carey; October 26th, 2016 at 01:55 AM.
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users say Thank You to Pariah Carey for this post:
 
  #37 (permalink)
Elite Member
Cincinnati Ohio
 
Futures Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NinjaTrader
Broker/Data: Futures Broker
Favorite Futures: AUD
 
Silver Dragon's Avatar
 
Posts: 1,597 since Feb 2011
Thanks: 3,860 given, 3,318 received

It depends if you have an edge and dicipline. Give @Rory or @Inletcap who have both five grand and I would bet they could quadruple it in a short amount of time. Give a inexperienced or average trader with no edge/dicipline 250 grand and they would blow it up in a month or two.

In this case, size does not matter.

Robert

nosce te ipsum

You make your own opportunities in life.
Reply With Quote
The following 4 users say Thank You to Silver Dragon for this post:
 
  #38 (permalink)
Elite Member
Canada
 
Futures Experience: Beginner
Platform: NinjaTrader
Broker/Data: InteractiveBrokers
Favorite Futures: NQ
 
SoftSoap's Avatar
 
Posts: 594 since Aug 2015
Thanks: 347 given, 1,223 received


Pariah Carey View Post
The new poll is quite a different issue than the original poll and title of the thread. I think first one has to define what "trade successfully" means. To me it means trading as my sole or primary source of income, providing for my family, and building wealth for retirement (something I'm a long ways away from now). That's going to take at least 750,000 in trading funds. Preferably a lot more.

If you're skilled and can realize, say, a 20% annual return after taxes, that's 150,000 salary. Pretty good, but still basically working for a living. Keep in mind that your standard of living is going to keep rising, especially if you have children. Buying a home, health care, school tuition--it's all going to keep going up. Skyrocketing in some cases.

For all the people that voted such low amounts (10k, really?) I'd like to know what their definition of successful trading is. Making beer money? Being consistently profitable? I'm consistently profitable now, but nowhere near calling myself a full-time trader.

Glad you brought up this.

For me, I find that 'trading successfully' means I can trade just as I want to, in order to prove my edge. Meaning I'm not passing up on setups that look good simply because the risk would be too high for my account.

Will I make enough $ to sustain my lifestyle? Absolutely not! But as someone who is in the early stages of their trading career and has potentially 30+ years left in their trading career, I don't need to be making 'take home' money right now.

As you prove your edge, you can find ways to add $ to your trading account. Get a second job, beat the TST, sell assets, etc. As time goes by, and if you have an edge, you will eventually have enough $ in your account to be able to live off of it.

Additionally, if you can prove you have an edge of let's say 40-60% annual ROI consistently, and a methodology that is scalable. You shouldn't have a problem finding investors who are willing to place some bets on you to beat the S&P and the bigger hedge funds, assuming you have a decent amount of business understanding of course.

Yesterday's excellence is today's standard and tomorrow's mediocrity
Reply With Quote
 
  #39 (permalink)
Elite Member
Philadelphia
 
Futures Experience: None
Platform: corded black telephone
Favorite Futures: ticker tape
 
Itchymoku's Avatar
 
Posts: 2,892 since Apr 2012
Thanks: 1,681 given, 3,622 received

Trade futures successfully?

Does that mean for a living without another job? If so, it requires taking into consideration your living expenses.

Either way, no amount of money is enough if you're not a consistent trader.

If you are a consistent trader you could probably stay profitable with the amount of money 10-20 trades worth of losses would cost before hitting margin. Even then you might have to refund or have money to live off of while waiting through uncertain times.

Trading without a second source of income isn't the smartest idea be it 10,000 or 10,000,000 unless you really know what you're doing.


Last edited by Itchymoku; October 27th, 2016 at 10:46 PM.
Reply With Quote
 
  #40 (permalink)
Market Wizard
London UK
 
Futures Experience: Beginner
Platform: CQG
Favorite Futures: Futures
 
xplorer's Avatar
 
Posts: 3,060 since Sep 2015
Thanks: 6,587 given, 4,840 received
Forum Reputation: Legendary



Big Mike View Post
Refreshing this thread with a new poll:



Please vote and discuss.

Mike

I just voted, and I found myself voting 'something else'.

The reason is, I think asking the question "how much do you think is needed to trade x successfully" can be misleading.


As someone else pointed out, if you know what you're doing (which needs to be broken down into experience, discipline, execution, etc.), then the amount it takes may be relative.

The other component can be your trading strategy. If you have a strategy that is successful but is subject to significant drawdowns, then the capital at play needs to take that into account.



So, to me, it's more of a question of approach than of capital.



Hope makes sense.


BTW @Itchymoku love ur Outrun avatar

Reply With Quote
The following 3 users say Thank You to xplorer for this post:

Reply



futures io > > > Minimum starting funds to learn to trade

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search



Upcoming Webinars and Events (4:30PM ET unless noted)

Jigsaw Trading: TBA

Elite only

FuturesTrader71: TBA

Elite only

NinjaTrader: TBA

Jan 18

RandBots: TBA

Jan 23

GFF Brokers & CME Group: Futures & Bitcoin

Elite only

Adam Grimes: TBA

Elite only

Ran Aroussi: TBA

Elite only
     

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
What should a beginner learn to trade first? 1steve1 Beginners and Introductions 97 August 28th, 2012 07:13 PM
Minimum tick movement vs 1 contract value gracepips Commodities Futures Trading 21 April 5th, 2011 06:23 PM
Minimum tradable expectancy? solom113 Traders Hideout 2 January 29th, 2010 02:37 AM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 10:55 AM.

Copyright © 2017 by futures io, s.a., Av Ricardo J. Alfaro, Century Tower, Panama, +507 833-9432, info@futures.io
All information is for educational use only and is not investment advice.
There is a substantial risk of loss in trading commodity futures, stocks, options and foreign exchange products. Past performance is not indicative of future results.
no new posts
Page generated 2017-12-18 in 0.16 seconds with 20 queries on phoenix via your IP 54.226.113.250