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Lets talk about Windows 7 and 10 and other things.

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  #1 (permalink)
 mrphr 
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Hi there guys I do not post for ages but lately I have been reading posts here on and off, so let’s talk about Windows 7/10 and others things.

Are you guys running Windows 7 or 10 at the moment on your current setup?

Are you happy with you current version of Windows in a way that it does not give you any problems [like updates that slow you down] and you are happy with Microsoft policies and tactics specially regarding Windows 10? What are your experiences with Windows 10?

If your current platform/data provider offer you a solution to switch to Linux let’s say Debian or openSUSE [known for being stable distros, and I can confirm that as I am running openSUSE Leap 42.2 with GNOME 3 extentions without problems] or even macOS which is Unix-Like would you still be using Windows on you current setup? [It appears Sierra Charts is serious working on a version of SC that is going to run natively on Linux and Macs]

Quote from their web site: “Sierra Chart is a stand-alone software program for Windows operating systems. We are working to add native support for Mac OS and Linux. This is an ongoing task.”
And there are quotes from them on their own forum and here about that as well that they are working on it. Now I do not use SC but as I heard and read good things about them so good impression and as long I am able to convert my custom studies to SC it would be a no-brainer switch for me.
It would be really nice to hear from @SierraChart

Do you guys think Windows is going to be the way forward for serious traders and other financial professionals, since financial exchanges around the would are running on Linux of course on the server side but still; CME, NYSE, NASDAQ, and London Stock Exchange which runs on SUSE Linux…

I think in my opinion there is a huge business opportunity here for platform/data feeds providers, developers/programmers etc where they could capitalize from those who are not happy with Microsoft monopoly, on a more retail side of trading as the exchanges and financial institutions already have their solutions. As long as they offer robust and stable solution on their end for retails traders.

I know that that are a lot of people including some and or even a lot of you of you guys are running Windows 7 and are reluctant to upgrade to Windows 10 for many reason

I am asking simply because I run into problems after I re-format my machine which I do every two years or so, in not only one copy of genuine MS Windows 7 but two copies, Windows 7 could not update, the updates was running forever like I tried for over 3 hours until I started to research and found out that that is in fact a well known problems with Windows 7 updates that keeps saying that is up dating but never updates. I colleague of mine @ABCTG who does some coding for me said that he thinks that they do that on purpose and the same thing happened to his machine but he had more luck than me and luckily was able to solve the problem.

I have tried loads of things recommended on Microsoft support forums and on You Tube for basically two days, and nothing really worked or worked only partially, because of opportunity cost and I do not want to work on this trying to fix computer like that as my time is valuable to me I did not want to spend another week trying to fix it and I decide to buy a copy of Windows 10 from Amazon and upgrade to Windows 10.

I am sick and tired because this upgrade was forced upon me and, because I just want to get on with work and get things done I had to surrender to Windows 10. Windows 10 for you to have a idea if you do not already know, even when you turn all the parameters off, after MS updates that you have no choice you have to do it the updates will turn your settings it on again.

There are other things that I would like to talk about Microsoft as well but I will try to keep this thread sort as it is getting a bit long now; Like I got a copy of Office 2013 now I am not interested in Office [Excel/VBA] anymore [prefer to learn and invest in Python and use within LibreOffice instead] and I am stuck with it call Microsoft support and they say it is not possible to “un-link” your copy of Office key from your account and give it to someone else, unbelievable.

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 SoftSoap 
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I built my PC at the end of 2015 with Windows 10 which was relatively new at the time. I haven't had any problems whatsoever, and this PC has been running pretty much 24/7 since (with a few exceptions).

For reference, I almost always run the following:
  • Trader Work Station
  • NinjaTrader 7 (with 9 tabs)
  • Powerpoint
  • Excel (3-7 spreadsheets)
  • Outlook
  • Snagit
  • MindManager
  • Google Chrome with 6-20 tabs
  • 3 monitors
  • Sometimes Evernote

I have not had any problems, not even once. However, this computer is strictly used for trading and trading-related stuff.

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 xplorer 
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mrphr View Post
Hi there guys I do not post for ages but lately I have been reading posts here on and off, so let’s talk about Windows 7/10 and others things.

Are you guys running Windows 7 or 10 at the moment on your current setup?

Are you happy with you current version of Windows in a way that it does not give you any problems [like updates that slow you down] and you are happy with Microsoft policies and tactics specially regarding Windows 10? What are your experiences with Windows 10?

If your current platform/data provider offer you a solution to switch to Linux let’s say Debian or openSUSE [known for being stable distros, and I can confirm that as I am running openSUSE Leap 42.2 with GNOME extentions without problems] or even macOS which is Unix-Like would you still be using Windows on you current setup? [It appears Sierra Charts is serious working on a version of SC that is going to run natively on Linux and Macs]

Quote from their web site: “Sierra Chart is a stand-alone software program for Windows operating systems. We are working to add native support for Mac OS and Linux. This is an ongoing task.”
And there are quotes from them on their own forum and here about that as well that they are working on it. Now I do not use SC but as I heard and read good things about them so good impression and as long I am able to convert my custom studies to SC it would be a no-brainer switch for me.
It would be really nice to hear from @SierraChart

Do you guys think Windows is going to be the way forward for serious traders and other financial professionals, since financial exchanges around the would are running on Linux of course on the server side but still; CME, NYSE, NASDAQ, and London Stock Exchange which runs on SUSE Linux…

I think in my opinion there is a huge business opportunity here for platform/data feeds providers, developers/programmers etc where they could capitalize from those who are not happy with Microsoft monopoly, on a more retail side of trading as the exchanges and financial institutions already have their solutions. As long as they offer robust and stable solution on their end for retails traders.

I know that that are a lot of people including some and or even a lot of you of you guys are running Windows 7 and are reluctant to upgrade to Windows 10 for many reason

I am asking simply because I run into problems after I re-format my machine which I do every two years or so, in not only one copy of genuine MS Windows 7 but two copies, Windows 7 could not update, the updates was running forever like I tried for over 3 hours until I started to research and found out that that is in fact a well known problems with Windows 7 updates that keeps saying that is up dating but never updates. I colleague of mine @ABCTG who does some coding for me said that he thinks that they do that on purpose and the same thing happened to his machine but he had more luck than me and luckily was able to solve the problem.

I have tried loads of things recommended on Microsoft support forums and on You Tube for basically two days, and nothing really worked or worked only partially, because of opportunity cost and I do not want to work on this trying to fix computer like that as my time is valuable to me I did not want to spend another week trying to fix it and I decide to buy a copy of Windows 10 from Amazon and upgrade to Windows 10.
I am sick and tired because this upgrade was forced upon me and, because I just want to get on with work and get things done I had to surrender to Windows 10. Windows 10 for you to have a idea if you do not already know, even when you turn all the parameters off after MS updates that you have no choice you have to do it the updates will turn your settings it on again.

There are other things that I would like to talk about Microsoft as well but I will try to keep this thread sort as it is getting a bit long now; Like I got a copy of Office 2013 now I am not interested in Office [Excel/VBA] anymore [prefer to learn and invest in Python and use within LibreOffice instead] and I am stuck with it call Microsoft support and they say it is not possible to “un-link” your copy of Office key from your account and give it to someone else, unbelievable.

Since Nadella took on the reins at Microsoft, things have gone from bad to worse for Windows. The latest policy attempts to shove Windows 10 down everybody's throat have not gone down well (forgive the pun) for many people, including myself. Also, as you point out, the forced regular updates, as well as Windows 10 privacy intrusion mean I am likely to never upgrade to that system, which makes looking for an alternative a priority when Windows 7 goes completely out of support.

You're right that trading platforms have an opportunity with Linux and MacOS, I just hope people realize that and move towards that direction.

As for the update issues with Windows 7 an ex-colleague of mine theorised that Microsoft is sabotaging the update process on purpose to encourage people who have not yet upgraded to upgrade.

I have to say, I believe him.

The reason is not because he said it. It's because I regularly have updates issues myself and every time there's something different to fix. One month is a registry key, the next month is a folder clean-up, the month after something gets corrupted.... IT systems don't work this way: normally if a system stops working you identify the source of the problem, sort it out and the system resume its function. But you just don't have a myriad of problems with no apparent root cause.

I love the better stability and reliability of Linux and MacOS and would love to think that I will be able to move to either in the future.

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 Big Mike 
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xplorer View Post
Since Nadella took on the reins at Microsoft, things have gone from bad to worse for Windows.

I believe Satya has done a remarkable job of re-energizing and re-focusing Microsoft, for the best.

Windows has simply moved to a rolling distribution type of model, something made popular by Linux years ago. I personally think it's great.

People in general dislike change. I don't know anyone that is reluctant to update to Windows 10, unless they have really old hardware, or don't have good backups of their data. In both cases, it is easy to solve. Maintaining modern hardware is a prerequisite of a trader.

Linux is unlikely to be a serious desktop alternative for regular professional use anytime in the next 10 years, or maybe ever. Don't misunderstand me, I am a huge fan of Linux and all of my servers run Linux. I've also tried switching to Linux for desktop use countless times in the last 20+ years, but it never works out for serious use. For a hobby, it can be fun to tinker, but at some point you just need it to work, and therefore need Windows.

Short version: Just install Windows 10 already. If you don't want to upgrade your old machine, just buy a new one.

Mike

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 bobwest 
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Big Mike View Post
Short version: Just install Windows 10 already. If you don't want to upgrade your old machine, just buy a new one.

Mike

To add in my cent or two, I have been running Windows 10 since early September 2015, on a five-year-old (or so) laptop, and have had very few problems. I simply ran the downloaded conversion from Windows 7; it took a while, but completed without incident, and I've had very little since.

The only issue I remember was with an audio driver for my headphones, and the fix was fairly easy (I just got a USB audio out gadget and bypassed the whole problem.... I think the age of my hardware was likely a part of that.)

I remember Windows 7 with affection, but not nostalgia. 10 has been solid, has given me no problems in getting used to it, and runs fine.

I completely agree with @Big Mike about the subscription model. My first version of Windows was Windows 3.0, in 1990 I believe, so I have been through a lot of versions and have done a lot of installs. I am very happy with the present way of updating and do not want to go back.

At some point, Windows 7 or 8 will no longer be supported, and other software will eventually not be written for it, so there's no future in not upgrading, unless you are willing to just go to the Mac or a Linux variant, and give up all the software that is Windows-only.

This may be worth a cent and a half, but it is my experience after more than a year of using 10.

Bob.

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 mrphr 
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@Big Mike

Do you really think that a operational system that spy on it users as Windows 10 is very well known for is really “re-energizing and re-focusing” where you disable all the known trackable features [apart from the hidden ones of course] then on the next update Windows 10 will enable back all your setting that you turn it off? Do you really like the idea of Microsoft spying on your intellectual property? To do God knows what, or even use against you and your family one day?

Watch this specially at 30:50:


If people are no reluctant to switch to Windows 7 why is still Windows 7 is the mostly widely used Windows in the World at the moment even after 16 months after Windows 10 release even if the upgrade was “free” [it was free simply because MS wanted to use it users as a testers or guinea pigs] and Windows 10 hardware requirement is fairly the “same” for Windows 7 and identical to Windows 8.1 according to MS.

Not sure who you have been talking to, to came up with “I don't know anyone that is reluctant to update to Windows 10” which is quite ironic as comparing to not one but the mean of three sources in relation to total users [Windows 7, 36% x Windows 10, 22%]; And countless people who I talked to from senior management from the City of London to Phd in the Financial to traders and the typical pc home user everybody is very skeptical and reluctant.

“Linux is unlikely to be a serious desktop alternative for regular professional use anytime in the next 10 years, or maybe ever.” 10 years in the tech world is a life time in fact even not in the tech world 10 years is a life time to say such thing; However I do agree that the focus of most distros well mainly the serious one are on the server side of things, where a distro like Debian focus more towards systadmins but openSUSE not in they own worlds “the makers' choice for sysadmins, developers and desktop users” so they are clearly pushing Linux as a desktop use and really are.

I have been reading some of your post in the past do not know exactly from when and I saw that you like Ubuntu, well what Ubuntu does it is basically take the Debian stable and make it unstable and add spyware on the top and through their marketing makes people "buy" into it. So obivious it is not a serious desktop alternative… Now Linux apart, but then Macs would be a really serious alternative, I mean native without this virtualization thing.

As I said there is a huge business opportunity here for platform/data feeds providers, developers/programmers etc where they could capitalize from those who are not happy with Microsoft monopoly and spying tactics by making their products available to run nativelly on Mac and Linux.

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 Hulk 
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I know I will not live to see the day when linux becomes popular on corporate desktops - especially trader's desktops. Not going to happen for a long long time.

I run both Windows 10 and 7. The only reason I run Windows 7 is because the hardware I used for my latest build does not support Win 10 otherwise there is no reason to stay on Windows 7.

There are no forced updates in Win 10 - everything has a setting. The biggest problem facing Windows 10 right now is lack of documentation. For instance, the local group policy allows a number of changes you can make to how windows updates are handled. You need to have Win 10 Pro or Enterprise though. The 5th one down the list (Configure Automate Updates) is what you are looking for to get Windows 7 like options.



I know about the Windows Update in Win 7 hanging. This is what you need to follow exactly to fix it. I did this literally a week ago when I downgraded from Windows 10 to 7 for my latest build:

https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/forum/windows_7-update/windows-7-update-problems-read-this-first/28147a5f-b0b0-480b-bed9-834a2da7a375.

Bottom line is that Windows is going to stay the default OS for desktops at trading firms for a while. My advice would be to stick to it.

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 Hulk 
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bobwest View Post
My first version of Windows was Windows 3.0, in 1990 I believe, so I have been through a lot of versions and have done a lot of installs.



Same here. Numerous install over the years. I started with Win 3.1 in 1993-94 I think.

Here's a video that will refresh those memories:


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 Big Mike 
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Who here remembers optimizing QEMM-386 to get that extra 100k of base RAM, so DesqView would run? That was my start...

I love Debian, dislike Ubuntu. I recommend Linux Mint for desktop use in a Linux environment. But Windows 10 on my primary workstations that just need to work 24/7. As of course, Debian on all my servers.

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 xplorer 
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Big Mike View Post
I believe Satya has done a remarkable job of re-energizing and re-focusing Microsoft, for the best.

Windows has simply moved to a rolling distribution type of model, something made popular by Linux years ago. I personally think it's great.

People in general dislike change. I don't know anyone that is reluctant to update to Windows 10, unless they have really old hardware, or don't have good backups of their data. In both cases, it is easy to solve. Maintaining modern hardware is a prerequisite of a trader.

Linux is unlikely to be a serious desktop alternative for regular professional use anytime in the next 10 years, or maybe ever. Don't misunderstand me, I am a huge fan of Linux and all of my servers run Linux. I've also tried switching to Linux for desktop use countless times in the last 20+ years, but it never works out for serious use. For a hobby, it can be fun to tinker, but at some point you just need it to work, and therefore need Windows.

Short version: Just install Windows 10 already. If you don't want to upgrade your old machine, just buy a new one.

Mike


Quoting 
I believe Satya has done a remarkable job of re-energizing and re-focusing Microsoft, for the best.

I don't disagree - That's why I specifically mentioned Windows. Microsoft is expanding in other directions and that's good. What they're doing for Business Intelligence for example is remarkable. I also think their Azure business model is promising.

But as for Windows, they keep lagging. Their lack of innovation means they always tend to copy others. That didn't work with Windows 8 and I believe they just copied Apple's model for the updates for Windows 10. The problem is, Microsoft is not Apple and they tend to screw up every time they copy someone else.


Quoting 
Windows has simply moved to a rolling distribution type of model, something made popular by Linux years ago.

In terms of rolling updates just like Linux, you can decide in Linux what to upgrade and what not to update. You are no longer afforded that luxury in Windows 10. This can potentially cripple systems with a bad update which poses a significant headache for sysadmins everywhere.



So no, I am not going to update to Windows 10 any time soon. But it's concerning that you mention the fact that Linux is not a 'serious' option at the moment for trading. I was hoping it was.

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 bobwest 
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Big Mike View Post
Who here remembers optimizing QEMM-386 to get that extra 100k of base RAM, so DesqView would run? That was my start...

Those were the days....

I remember when the 386 was an exciting new chip. The first computer I had in my office was an IBM AT with a 286 and a hard drive! (It was a hand-me-down from a secretary, who had upgraded to a PS/2. Secretaries were the computer users then (they did the typing.) The other managers could not understand why I wanted a computer in my office anyway....)


xplorer View Post
But as for Windows, they keep lagging. Their lack of innovation means they always tend to copy others. That didn't work with Windows 8 and I believe they just copied Apple's model for the updates for Windows 10. The problem is, Microsoft is not Apple and they tend to screw up every time they copy someone else.

Windows started out as a copy of the Mac, and they have continued the tradition. The thing is, they just keep grinding away, making their small improvements and keeping it squarely in the middle of both the consumer and the business space. I would say, in the consumer space because it's in the business space: the computer you have at home probably will be like what you have at work, after all. Whether for good or ill, I think the huge installed base is what's keeping it there.

And bottom line, if you're not really into computers, if you're just a business (or trading) type, do you care? You just want to get your work done, so you go with what has the applications you need. For that matter, if you're writing applications, what do you write for? What most of your customers have. This sort of goes around and around.

Whether this is good or bad, it's kind of the present reality.

Bob.

Edit: actually, I think that first PC probably was a PC XT, with an 8088 chip. I remember the hard drive was an amazing 10 MB, and it was a big deal to even have one. Times do change.... I wonder how many who read this even know what I'm talking about....

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 mrphr 
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I think you guys are really underestimating those in the computer world who can not swallow Microsoft and while I can not quantify I know the number is extremely huge and growing, growing even exponentially.

Do not you think that would be amazing to see let’s say Sierra Chart for example as they said they are working to add native support for MacOS and Linux, and have all the choices and possibility in your hands to chose from and decide and not this like vendor lock-in sort of thing where you are stuck with one monopolist.

I know it would be amazing to see that, because not many providers are doing that right now the right way, a way that is viable and reliable for retail traders and they could definitely capitalize on that and grow revenue.

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 mrphr 
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Hulk View Post
I know about the Windows Update in Win 7 hanging. This is what you need to follow exactly to fix it. I did this literally a week ago when I downgraded from Windows 10 to 7 for my latest build:

https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/forum/windows_7-update/windows-7-update-problems-read-this-first/28147a5f-b0b0-480b-bed9-834a2da7a375.

Mate I tried that and I said I tried loads of things and did exactly as I was told to do, in fact there was one method that it did work but then again when I tried to install new recommended updates then it got stuck for another 3 hours and I gave up, because life is to short for that. Do you really think people want to expend their time dealing and fixing computer like that or their want to be productive, do some work and create stuff with it? Specially when you paid for it, and it meant to work [well or not so].


Big Mike View Post
I love Debian, dislike Ubuntu. I recommend Linux Mint for desktop use in a Linux environment. But Windows 10 on my primary workstations that just need to work 24/7. As of course, Debian on all my servers.

Yes Linux Mint is Ubuntu done right and they are doing a great job on pushing Linux as a desktop and their focus is very driven by their community and not a hidden corporate agenda however Linux Mint is just another Ubuntu makeover that comes with bugs. In my opinion the way to go with Linux Mint is LMDE witch is based on Debian not on Ubuntu, it is less mainstream and supported but still, however my distro of choice at the moment is openSUSE Leap.

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 bobwest 
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mrphr View Post
I think you guys are really underestimating those in the computer world who can not swallow Microsoft and while I can not quantify I know the number is extremely huge and growing.

Do not you think that would be amazing to to see let’s say Sierra Chart for example as they said they are working to add native support for MacOS and Linux, and have all the choices and possibility in your hands to chose from and decide and not this like vendor lock-in sort of thing where you are stuck with one monopolist.

I know it would be amazing to see that, because not many providers are doing that right now the right way, a way that is viable and reliable for retail traders and they could definitely capitalize on that and grow revenue.

I had a long thing written out, now deleted, which I think strayed beyond the topic. So I chopped it back some. Here's what I wanted to say:

Let me just say that you may well be right, but as of now it would be an uphill climb for Linux on the desktop, just because of the penetration Microsoft already has.

But yes, it would be cool if Sierra Chart or anyone else came out with versions for the Mac or Linux. Competition is good, and is what decides these things in the end.

Bob.

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Indeed, market saturation and also regulatory compliance (some of which is the NSA etc.) in business are very steep hills. I've had a long IT career and at least until a couple of years ago was well versed in security, bank, police networks etc.

If security is really a concern. When asked what would it take to make any office network genuinely completely secure (OS or vendor) we used to half-jokingly reply "mechanical typewriters".

Not so surprising:

Kremlin security agency to buy typewriters 'to avoid leaks'.

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Rory View Post
If security is really a concern. When asked what would it take to make any office network genuinely completely secure (OS or vendor) we used to half-jokingly reply "mechanical typewriters".

Not so surprising:

Kremlin security agency to buy typewriters 'to avoid leaks'.



May be the wave of the future....

Bob.

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 mrphr 
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@bobwest I was actually quoting you previous post that was edited...

Times has changed and people should wake up for new possibilities, do not believe me? One of my house mates is senior manager of one the biggest asset management/mutual fund in the World in the City of London and he said that Macs are everywhere inside the firm. [there are only few and/or certain specific application for Windows that do not run on Macs this days, of course games is a different history]

“no more than a passing familiarity with the Mac, so my technical knowledge is about zero on this question.” You do not need to have any familiarity and technical knowledge to deal with Macs it is just simple and it just works contrary to Windows that can blow in your face any moment and good luck trying to fix it because they do not offer support unless you pay extra $$$$$$$$$$, although Macs are not bullet proof but they do offer good free support.

I wound definitely not say the same for Linux but why not try it, like buy say a $100 machine from Ebay and install it it, is free and you can do whatever you please with it and see for yourself, you would be surprise.

As you pointed out about the average trade and business guy etc, the reason why they do not switch away from Windows is probably because the average trader or average business guy etc do not know any better and has never use anything else in is life that is why, and people tend to do not think outside of the box in fact most people do not even know there is a box.

As for now I use all the three main OS at the moment and this is my short impression for far.

[1] Mac for those who like stability, simplicity and a computer that just works, and good technical support that comes with it.

[2] Linux for the IT, geeks and nerd types as people have already stereotyped, but for those who likes “freedom” from proprietary stuff and vendor lock-in. [as you could go completely free and open source]

[3] Windows for those who likes or do not mind Microsoft spying on their lives and intellectual property and are happy to try to fix the computer when it explode on their face.

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mrphr View Post
@bobwest I was actually quoting you previous post that was edited...

Times has changed and people should wake up for new possibilities, do not believe me? One of my house mates is senior manager of one the biggest asset management/mutual fund in the World in the City of London and he said that Macs are everywhere inside the firm. [there are only few and/or certain specific application for Windows that do not run on Macs this days, of course games is a different history]

“no more than a passing familiarity with the Mac, so my technical knowledge is about zero on this question.” You do not need to have any familiarity and technical knowledge to deal with Macs it is just simple and it just works contrary to Windows that can blow in your face any moment and good luck trying to fix it because they do not offer support unless you pay extra $$$$$$$$$$, although Macs are not bullet proof but they do offer good free support.

I wound definitely not say the same for Linux but why not try it, like buy say a $100 machine from Ebay and install it it, is free and you can do whatever you please with it and see for yourself, you would be surprise.

As you pointed out about the average trade and business guy etc, the reason why they do not switch away from Windows is probably because the average trader or average business guy etc do not know any better and has never use anything else in is life that is why, and people tend to do not think outside of the box in fact most people do not even know there is a box.

As for now I use all the three main OS at the moment and this is my short impression for far.

[1] Mac for those who like stability, simplicity and a computer that just works, and good technical support that comes with it.

[2] Linux for the IT, geeks and nerd types as people have already stereotyped, but for those who likes “freedom” from proprietary stuff and vendor lock-in. [as you could go completely free and open source]

[3] Windows for those who likes or do do not mind Microsoft spying on their lives and intellectual property and are happy to try to fix the computer when it explode on their face.

I'm happy with your points, and as I said, I really have no stake in this game.

The only thing I would say pertains to point 3 -- While on both Windows 7 and now on Windows 10, I have spent no time at all -- zero -- on trying "to fix the computer when it explode on their face," except, as previously mentioned, for the issue I had with Windows 10 not recognizing my headphone jack, I assume due to a driver issue which I just sidestepped with a USB audio gadget.

I know you have had different experiences, but those are mine. Since Windows 7 in particular, not much to report, really. I never had the update issues you have, either.

Which in itself may not mean much, but there are other experiences, is all I mean.

As far as "Microsoft spying on their lives and intellectual property," I am going to pass on that one. I took a quick look at that a while back, decided I didn't feel that was really going on, and decided to not go there. I know some people feel otherwise. That's fine with me. In that case, then you shouldn't go to Windows 10, as you say. Simple enough.

Bob.

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 xplorer 
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mrphr View Post
Times has changed and people should wake up for new possibilities, do not believe me?

But it's not that people have not woken up to new possibilities. Since the advent of mobile computing with tablets and smartphones, many people have stopped buying PCs altogether and mainly use a mobile device. So some trend are definitely changing.

Windows keeps controlling the PC market though because it's well established and so people are going to stick to what's already mainstream (smaller learning curve from Win7 to 8 or 10 than to a different system).





Quoting 
As you pointed out about the average trade and business guy etc, the reason why they do not switch away from Windows is probably because the average trader or average business guy etc do not know any better and has never use anything else in is life that is why, and people tend to do not think outside of the box in fact most people do not even know there is a box.

I think people don't switch away because developers, as Bob said, would rather build apps for what people are likely to buy, which compounds Windows dominance. So the main problem is lack of availability on alternative platforms. If they coded my trading platform for Mac or Linux I'd switch tomorrow.


Quoting 
[3] Windows for those who likes or do do not mind Microsoft spying on their lives and intellectual property and are happy to try to fix the computer when it explode on their face.


I'd like to point out that Windows/Microsoft is not the only one 'spying'. I'd also like to say, I don't necessarily think they are spying per se. They just see that people's data is where the big money is now, in terms of where digital advertisement is going, so they're trying to capitalize on that, in the same way Facebook, Apple, Amazon and others are doing.

The problem I have with Windows 10 is, as your earlier video pointed out, they are being really nasty and do not care much for users concerns about privacy. All apps have default access to my caller list? No thank you.



bobwest View Post
I'm happy with your points, and as I said, I really have no stake in this game.

As far as "Microsoft spying on their lives and intellectual property," I am going to pass on that one. I took a quick look at that a while back, decided I didn't feel that was really going on, and decided to not go there. I know some people feel otherwise. That's fine with me. In that case, then you shouldn't go to Windows 10, as you say. Simple enough.

It all depends on how much you value your own privacy Bob. This TechRepublic article opens with

Windows 10 violates your privacy by default, here's how you can protect yourself
Upon installation, Windows 10 defaults to some pretty serious privacy invasions. Here are some steps you can take to keep your personal data private.


and, you know, it's not necessarily the big providers I am mainly worried about. A big hack of Facebook is probably a question of when, not if. What is going to happen when data for 1 billion+ users is going into the wrong hands, in the same way it already happened with Yahoo and LinkedIn?

Another even more shocking example: already today you do not need to hack anything. You can just browse thousands of people on FB and similar platforms who simply use the tool, with no appreciation for privacy settings and no idea they are being browsed. You can see all of their connections. How much effort does it take for some bot to take advantage of that and build maps of relationships for sale to the highest bidder?

But I digress. My point is, Windows 10 is simply capitalizing on all of the above, f**k user concerns. Can't blame Nadella to try to keep Microsoft in business!

Unfortunately their business in the 21st century is you, me and our information.

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Rory View Post
If security is really a concern. When asked what would it take to make any office network genuinely completely secure (OS or vendor) we used to half-jokingly reply "mechanical typewriters".

You say half-jokingly, but the harsh reality of security is (and has always been) nothing is 100% secure. Whenever there is a safe, there must be a way to open that safe. A key can be duplicated. A combination can be hacked.

All we can do is just assess what the risk is, and act accordingly.

Typewriters may not be a bad idea....

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bobwest View Post
But yes, it would be cool if Sierra Chart or anyone else came out with versions for the Mac or Linux.

Cool yes. But think of the resources involved for them to make such a thing work, and they are targeting what... maybe 1% of the market? Even being generous and saying 5%, those resources are better spent elsewhere.

For those of us who prefer to tinker, keep your Linux stuff as you wish but just run a damn emulator inside because at some point, you simply need Windows. If you like Sierra Chart or whatever and you like Linux, the best option is to use a seamless window virtual machine so it is running on Windows but transparently on your linux desktop.

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mrphr View Post
[3] Windows for those who likes or do not mind Microsoft spying on their lives and intellectual property and are happy to try to fix the computer when it explode on their face.

I suggest you not use the internet, because basically you are tracked every step of the way.

Can you link me to an article about Microsoft stealing intellectual property via Windows 10? Hadn't heard that one before.

You should try looking at things differently in my opinion. Data usage statistics are anonymously gathered, and help make Windows a better product. You can argue that Microsoft shouldn't be allowed to make money, and should be a non-profit or whatever, but capitalism exists and right now Microsoft is for profit. So, in order to strengthen Microsoft, they need to make money. And a stronger Microsoft delivers a better product.

Google is another great example. Who wants to live in a world without Google? Yes, "it" has access to my email, my calendar, my search history. It isn't blackmailing me, it's using this stuff to offer a better experience to me. Because I gave it permission to read my email, Google Trips automatically puts all my travel plans on my calendar. Because I gave it access to my contacts on Android, I can call, email or text anyone by simply speaking to my phone.

And because Google is allowed to make money from this, they offer some of the best user-facing tools available in the world. Who wants to go back to Yahoo mail instead of gmail? Who wants to go back to Mapquest instead of Google Maps?

The world we live in has cameras everywhere. You are being recorded every time you leave your house. Red light cameras, ATM cameras, security cameras at every mall or fast food joint. Cars are now equipped with cameras. Police have cameras. Everyone in the world has a cell phone.

I for one am glad we live in this world, and not one from 100 years ago. I enjoy technology.

Mike

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Big Mike View Post
Cool yes. But think of the resources involved for them to make such a thing work, and they are targeting what... maybe 1% of the market? Even being generous and saying 5%, those resources are better spent elsewhere.

For those of us who prefer to tinker, keep your Linux stuff as you wish but just run a damn emulator inside because at some point, you simply need Windows. If you like Sierra Chart or whatever and you like Linux, the best option is to use a seamless window virtual machine so it is running on Windows but transparently on your linux desktop.

Mike

@Big Mike

You have a very narrow mind by saying stuff like that and are not thinking ahead and all possibilities and benefits that it could bring for all, through consumer choices and not monopolist tactics. [of course no for the monopolist]

Apart from sort of bad business "karma" for Sierra Chart as well... I wish @SierraChart success on their Mac and Linux project and I really hope they can capitalize on it and generate good revenue.

The market share of Mac and Linux is way above 5% specially when you compare the mean of say three or more sources, and you will find that it is betewen 10% and 15%, of course more Macs than Linux [Wikipedia can give you some clues], the market share of Windows 10 is about 20%/25% so [100% - let's say 25% - let's say 10% = 65%], about 65% is where other Windows version user's are and this is the potential Windows users that could very well move to Mac and Linux, because at some point they will have to move to another OS and that may not be Windows, because the odds of them not being satisfied with MS way of doing business is very high, and so on and so and so forth.

So you conclusion, business model and numbers does not add up and is very flawless.

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Big Mike View Post
I suggest you not use the internet, because basically you are tracked every step of the way.

Can you link me to an article about Microsoft stealing intellectual property via Windows 10? Hadn't heard that one before.

You should try looking at things differently in my opinion. Data usage statistics are anonymously gathered, and help make Windows a better product. You can argue that Microsoft shouldn't be allowed to make money, and should be a non-profit or whatever, but capitalism exists and right now Microsoft is for profit. So, in order to strengthen Microsoft, they need to make money. And a stronger Microsoft delivers a better product.

Google is another great example. Who wants to live in a world without Google? Yes, "it" has access to my email, my calendar, my search history. It isn't blackmailing me, it's using this stuff to offer a better experience to me. Because I gave it permission to read my email, Google Trips automatically puts all my travel plans on my calendar. Because I gave it access to my contacts on Android, I can call, email or text anyone by simply speaking to my phone.

And because Google is allowed to make money from this, they offer some of the best user-facing tools available in the world. Who wants to go back to Yahoo mail instead of gmail? Who wants to go back to Mapquest instead of Google Maps?

The world we live in has cameras everywhere. You are being recorded every time you leave your house. Red light cameras, ATM cameras, security cameras at every mall or fast food joint. Cars are now equipped with cameras. Police have cameras. Everyone in the world has a cell phone.

I for one am glad we live in this world, and not one from 100 years ago. I enjoy technology.

Mike

Mike

@Big Mike

Did I say spying or stealing can you show me where did I said stealing? Spying is a totally different world than stealing so do not put worlds in my mouth.

I appreciate your suggestion to how not to use or how to use the internet but I do not really need your suggestion regarding this matter but thank you.

For me you sound pretty much like a Microsoft share holder even thought you may not be one and I am just guessing, I am sorry but I do not wave flags and cheerleader like that. Capitalism yes, but there are other ways to make money other than deceptive monopolist tactics that is MS Windows and other than spying on peoples lives.

No Google is not a great example simply because I create this thread to discuss about OS, the major OS [Windows, Mac and Linux] on a desktop environment and others things related to trading not to talk about Google services, and if you like being track and spied by Google as well that is your decision and that is good for you, I know I do not.

Again I create this thread to talk about the major OS [Windows, Mac and Linux] on a desktop environment and others things related to trading and not about Google, Yahoo, Amazon, Facebook, Android, mobile phones, tablets, red light cameras, ATM cameras, security cameras, cars etc... So show some respect.

Do not get me wrong I honestly appreciate what you have done for the trading community and I really do but again if you want my honest opinion and it is just my personal opinion and no offense but I think you have a very narrow mind.

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bobwest View Post
But yes, it would be cool if Sierra Chart or anyone else came out with versions for the Mac or Linux. Competition is good, and is what decides these things in the end.

Bob.


Big Mike View Post
Cool yes. But think of the resources involved for them to make such a thing work, and they are targeting what... maybe 1% of the market? Even being generous and saying 5%, those resources are better spent elsewhere.

For those of us who prefer to tinker, keep your Linux stuff as you wish but just run a damn emulator inside because at some point, you simply need Windows. If you like Sierra Chart or whatever and you like Linux, the best option is to use a seamless window virtual machine so it is running on Windows but transparently on your linux desktop.

Mike

I do agree with this, of course. The rest of my point was that competition, which means the market, will decide. I was surprised to read that they were working on a version for Linux or Mac, precisely because the market share is so low.

As for me, I don't run Mac or Linux and don't plan to, on the desktop.

I had a longer post that I decided to delete that went into this. I think the Mac is a niche market and Linux is big on servers but nowhere else, so I don't see where the developer payoff is.

But if they want to do it, fine, the market will decide. (So far, I think it has, in favor of Windows. )

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mrphr View Post
Do not get me wrong I honestly appreciate what you have done for the trading community and I really do but again if you want my honest opinion and it is just my personal opinion and no offense but I think you have a very narrow mind.

Do not get me wrong I honestly appreciate all the posts in this thread and I really do but if you want my honest opinion and it is just my personal opinion because I really do have no stake in this debate and should know better at my age but it's in-between Christmas and New Year and I need a beer and no offence but I really think that anybody who thinks that somebody with different opinions is narrow minded might just be being narrow minded.

We saw a lot of pointlessly antsy debates in all areas of life in 2016, let's at least recognize that we are living in a highly complex world with a huge number of successfully different opinions.

Cheers and Best Wishes for 2017

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Do not get me wrong I honestly appreciate all the posts in this thread and I really do but if you want my honest opinion and it is just my personal opinion because I really do have no stake in this debate and should know better at my age but it's in-between Christmas and New Year and I need a beer and no offence but I really think that anybody who thinks that somebody with different opinions is narrow minded might just be being narrow minded.

We saw a lot of pointlessly antsy debates in all areas of life in 2016, let's at least recognize that we are living in a highly complex world with a huge number of successfully different opinions.

Cheers and Best Wishes for 2017

I also should know better than to get into operating system disputes. There's never a future in it.

Everyone should use what they want. If it works for them, great. I'll do the same.

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ratfink View Post
Do not get me wrong I honestly appreciate all the posts in this thread and I really do but if you want my honest opinion and it is just my personal opinion because I really do have no stake in this debate and should know better at my age but it's in-between Christmas and New Year and I need a beer and no offence but I really think that anybody who thinks that somebody with different opinions is narrow minded might just be being narrow minded.

We saw a lot of pointlessly antsy debates in all areas of life in 2016, let's at least recognize that we are living in a highly complex world with a huge number of successfully different opinions.

Cheers and Best Wishes for 2017

You do have stake in this thread unless you are not running no OS at all or Windows other than 7 or 10 and you could have contribute by stay on topic and not giving moral lessons, I am sorry but I do not need “moral lessons”. I just do not appreciate when people try to take worlds from my mouth and come up with sarcastic suggestions, ironic comments and conclusions that does not add up. And the fact that I said @Big Mike has a narrow mind is not due to difference of opinions but due to his attitude towards the discussion.

You too have a great new year.

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At 40:25, Linus Torvalds the guy himself just say Microsoft/Windows is full of shit, and everybody claps!


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mrphr View Post
At 40:25, Linus Torvalds the guy himself just say Microsoft/Windows is full of shit, and everybody claps!


It would be interesting to see the same video with Bill Gates saying MS is full of sh...
You can like it or hate it but there's not a lot of options and Windows is unavoidable in many cases.
As a former Unix system admin I'm not a big fan of Windows but all is not black or white. For example who never had a boot problem after a new Linux kernel installed, or never find the right Wifi driver for a laptop, or bugs with ReiserFS?

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EU privacy gurus peer at Windows 10, still don't like what they see

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Windows 10 keylogger: How to stop Microsoft from tracking everything you type - International Business Times, UK Edition
https://apple.news/AKkOqR_7GSTmegNezKaYsFw

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xplorer View Post
Windows 10 keylogger: How to stop Microsoft from tracking everything you type - International Business Times, UK Edition
https://apple.news/AKkOqR_7GSTmegNezKaYsFw

Thank you!.... this is now off on 3 machines...

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For those who are concerned about the excessive intrusions of privacy that products such as Windows 10 present, I have recently come across something interesting

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wine_(software)
Wine is a free and open source compatibility layer software application that aims to allow applications designed for Microsoft Windows to run on Unix-like operating systems. Wine also provides a software library, known as Winelib, against which developers can compile Windows applications to help port them to Unix-like systems.

I'm not going to investigate or spend too much time on this right now, but I wanted to put it out here as a bookmark for future reference.


https://www.winehq.org/

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 sam028 
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For those who are concerned about the excessive intrusions of privacy that products such as Windows 10 present, I have recently come across something interesting

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wine_(software)
Wine is a free and open source compatibility layer software application that aims to allow applications designed for Microsoft Windows to run on Unix-like operating systems. Wine also provides a software library, known as Winelib, against which developers can compile Windows applications to help port them to Unix-like systems.

I'm not going to investigate or spend too much time on this right now, but I wanted to put it out here as a bookmark for future reference.


https://www.winehq.org/


It's (unfortunately) not working with a lot of Windows apps (see here and here for example).
It would have been great to have the pros of Linux with all Windows applications libraries but it won't work. Here too, when it looks too good to be true, well, there's a problem somewhere .

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 xplorer 
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Put down your coffee and admire the sheer amount of data Windows 10 Creators Update will slurp from your PC

[...]

Now

Windows 10 Home and Pro has, right now, two levels of data collection, Basic and Full. When a computer is in Basic mode, Microsoft says Win 10 takes a note of the state of your hardware and its specifications, your internet connection quality, records of crashes and hangs by software, any compatibility problems, driver usage data, which apps you've installed and how you use them, and other bits and pieces.

In Full mode, shedloads more is sent over. It includes everything at the Basic level plus records of events generated by the operating system, and your "inking and typing data." Engineers, with permission from Microsoft’s privacy governance team, can obtain users' documents that trigger crashes in applications, so they can work out what's going wrong. The techies can also run diagnostic tools remotely on the computers, again with permission from their overseers.

And next

In the Creators Update, aka Windows 10 version 1703, all this information will be collected in Basic mode. A lot of it is to help Microsofties pinpoint the cause of crashes and potential new malware infections, although it includes things like logs of you giving applications administrator privileges via the UAC, battery life readings, firmware version details, details of your hardware down to the color and serial number of the machine, which cell network you're using, and so on.

Then there's the information collected in Full mode, which includes everything in Basic plus your user settings and preferences, your browser choice, lists of your peripherals, the apps you use to edit and view images and videos, how long you use the mouse and keyboard, all the applications you've ever installed, URLs to videos you've watched that triggered an error, URLs to music that triggered an error, time spent reading ebooks, text typed in a Microsoft web browser's address and search bar, URLs visited, visited webpage titles, the words you've spoken to Cortana or had translated to text by the system, your ink strokes, and more.


Full article on The Register

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Reeve
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I absolutely can't stand windows 10, I use custom software on NT8, Every time 10 updates itself NT8 goes for a loop, after finally getting everything sorted and turning updates off, 10 updates itself again. I had my it guy go into the registery , he can't get 10 to stop updating but he can now give me the option of deciding if I want the update, the previous update removed this option. My NT8 has again gone from working to not working and Ninja help does not want to know your issues as the software is custom. Nt8 did not update, 10 did so why should NT8 go for a loop, Ninja says it my custom software and I know its not as it was 100% before the 10 update, where do you turn to for help now I ask? GATVOL OF WINDOWS 10

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 bbilotta 
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I recently "upgraded" to a new machine. As I've been told by the PC builder I buy machines from, chip builders are now required to produce their chipsets to only work on Win10. There are no Win7 drivers for some of these new chipsets, mine included. MS definitely wants us all moving towards Win10. Hell, they were giving it away just to get us to switch. And i'm sure they don't want to continue to support any more operating systems than they have to.

And folks like Big Mike have a point. We must continue to upgrade. Which is why, when my Win7 machine began to fail, I was willing to upgrade to Win10. I figured it's been out for a while now, and they've probably got most of the kinks worked out.

My SierrChart worked fine for the first several weeks. This week however, things changed. I began getting "unknown exception" errors. Support at SC has attributed this to a Windows 10 problem, but has yet to elaborate any further on exactly what is causing SC to generate "Message 15" when it "Caught an unhandled exception". According to MS, "unhandled exception" could mean just about anything.

MS support says they can't help because they have no idea what the SC program is referring to when it says "unhandled exception". SC isn't providing any more info other than to say I should roll back my machine to Win7 - which of course I can't do because it's a brand new machine; or that they hope MS is aware of the issue and they hope it will get fixed.

I loved XP. I wish i could still be operating on it. But the reality is I can't. Win7 was fine also. And the thing is, I'm not a programmer, and I have enough hobbies. I would be bogged down in a Linux build for months - and I don't need another hobby. I would have stayed on Win7, but didn't mind moving to 10. But now I'm stuck. My trading machine is unstable, my software provider is pointing their finger at MS, MS is pointing back at SC.

As an end user / trader I want two things - A stable platform, and a responsive software provider. Right now, unfortunately, I have neither.

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 cory 
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bbilotta View Post
...
As an end user / trader I want two things - A stable platform, and a responsive software provider. Right now, unfortunately, I have neither.

good point, a new machine is needed to keep up with the latest update, my 5Y old laptop is running the latest Win10 however Toshiba has no plan for its BIOS update so I can't get to its BIOS anymore (no F key to select when it boost up).

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 LDog 
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bbilotta View Post
I recently "upgraded" to a new machine.
...
As an end user / trader I want two things - A stable platform, and a responsive software provider. Right now, unfortunately, I have neither.

I'm curious, has anyone has suggested trying Windows Compatibility Mode for SC's startup shortcut? (and to make sure it's running as an Administrator)

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 TradeTheLevel 
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The issue with Windows 7 is the security flags. Hackers are able to hack your computer lightning fast with them. Every since that NSA leaked file coupled with some other one. Windows 10 had to do a structural redesign to fix that problem. Just read a full article on it.

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 bbilotta 
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LDog - Yes, i have tried compatibility mode. It didn't seem to make any difference at all. It certainly didn't fix the problem.

As a followup however, I would add that SC has been working on it with me. They've put in a lot of hours developing several new "pre release" upgrades in an effort to fix the problem. I know this thread is about platform preference, but I did want to mention SC's efforts.

I view MS as an 80/20 type of corporation. They will strive to produce products that work well for 80% of their customers. Some of their initial offerings on operating systems didn't even make that mark (IMO). Some like NT & XP probably exceeded. Windows 8 fell short and initial offerings of 10 seem to be met with mixed experiences.

Like I said earlier, for me, I just need it to be stable. I'm not looking for fancy. And perhaps that's the issue with some of this. Some of us would just like a down-and-dirty OS that doesn't have all the bells and whistles they're trying to incorporate into 10. A tank vs a lambo.

So there's a question for you: If MS offered a stripped down OS that was rock solid but with limited features - was fast and efficient, but not flashy - An OS that simply let the client's software do the job and didn't try to become the main focus. Would that interest you? I think it would interest me.

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Pedro40
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The issue with Windows 7 is the security flags. Hackers are able to hack your computer lightning fast with them.

I kind of doubt that. W 7 is still the most used OS, every other computer has it. 49% market share.

https://www.neowin.net/news/windows-7-loses-market-share-in-latest-reports

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Reeve
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This just means that we will have the option to delay it for 35 days, what happens after 35 days?

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 xplorer 
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Reeve View Post
This just means that we will have the option to delay it for 35 days, what happens after 35 days?

Well spotted Reeve, I had missed that! I will remove the link to the article given it does not say what I thought it said


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Reeve
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I jumped on it eagerly, hoping it was a fix, This windows 10 update story is driving me crazy. I have done my best to stop it including searching the web and speaking to the gurus, There is software out there that will interrupt the download should it start, however after 35 days, if the update is not done, certain packages stop working correctly, think word excel ect ect. It is so WRONG of Microsoft to do this. I am not tech savvy and have to pay to have someone fix my PC when things go wrong. I am in a permanent webinar with my trading and have a headset with a mike as well as a set of separate speakers plugged in. After every update, something goes haywire, either the mike does not work or the sound only comes out the speakers and not the headset, every now and again, its the cameras turn and that goes on the blink. Why should I have to pay every 5 minutes to have something repaired that is not of my doing?

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 bobwest 
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Reeve View Post
I jumped on it eagerly, hoping it was a fix, This windows 10 update story is driving me crazy. I have done my best to stop it including searching the web and speaking to the gurus, There is software out there that will interrupt the download should it start, however after 35 days, if the update is not done, certain packages stop working correctly, think word excel ect ect. It is so WRONG of Microsoft to do this. I am not tech savvy and have to pay to have someone fix my PC when things go wrong. I am in a permanent webinar with my trading and have a headset with a mike as well as a set of separate speakers plugged in. After every update, something goes haywire, either the mike does not work or the sound only comes out the speakers and not the headset, every now and again, its the cameras turn and that goes on the blink. Why should I have to pay every 5 minutes to have something repaired that is not of my doing?

Sorry to hear about your problems with updates.

Until I got to the point in your post where you started detailing the things that have gone wrong, I didn't think there was a real problem, but the fact that you do have these issues obviously is important and I can't blame you for not wanting them any more.

Still, I'll just toss in my update experience, which is essentially the opposite.

When Windows 10 first came out I did have some issues with peripheral equipment, specifically sound, as you do. Sometimes it would work OK with one update and then stop with the next. I fiddled around with some hardware workarounds and eventually it all settled down (I think not because of what I did, which was minimal, but because they finally started getting it right.) Other than that, I have had literally zero issues with any update for the past several years. And this is an old, old PC, too, much older than Windows 10, and it's running it OK with each update.

I do understand your being frustrated when something that should be simple and routine doesn't work. Unless I'm very mistaken, I think your experience may be unusual. If you have to pay for someone to fix things (which I have never done), then I wonder if you may have hardware issues that can be fixed by changing the hardware. I can't make any remote suggestions (and I'm not a hardware guy anyway), but if you were to ask around I think you might find some alternatives. I don't think you have to put up with this any more. Unless I'm very wrong, I don't think many people do.

Now we'll probably hear from a lot of others who do have issues, which is a good thing if there are in fact a lot who do.... But I still think it is probably not that common, which is good news for you because it would mean there is a way out of your issues.

Good luck. I know you must be fed up, and I think/hope you can find a good, permanent solution.

Bob.

--------------

Update: As I recall, I switched all my sound stuff, which includes external speakers and headphones/microphone, from the PC's native sound port to USB ports. I got a cheap gadget that plugs into a USB port and provides regular sound jacks and that let me plug in my speakers, and I got a USB headphone/microphone. This may not help you, but I think Windows was gagging on my PC's old sound jack or its drivers or something, and the more modern USB stuff worked with it better.

Just a thought.

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 cory 
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I maintain literally a fleet of win 10 machines without any any problem, I don't even install any extra virus software. I still have 1 win 7 left out of abundance of caution but its days is number. I probl will turn it into Linux machine.

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 centaurer 
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Good luck. I know you must be fed up, and I think/hope you can find a good, permanent solution.

KDE


I can't imagine how anyone can use KDE for a month and go back to Windows. Linux use to be for repressed nerds with nothing better to do than work on their OS.
In 2019 Ubuntu is just so much cleaner and easier to install than Windows. Everything just works out of the box. Windows 10 is a disgrace. KDE feels like Windows 30.

You don't even know how bad your computer runs on Windows 10 until you install KDE.

You have to be crazy to not try Kubuntu or KDE Neon. You don't even have to install and can boot off a thumb drive.

If you have an Android too you have to install KDE Connect on your phone. I send files back and forth from my table and phone to computer over wireless. KDE sees my phone and tablet like it is any other harddrive without any wires.

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 Rrrracer 
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LOL @centaurer, now you got my gears turning... personally I have little issue with W10, but have always been intrigued by Linux... looks like it can run Sierrachart lol...

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 centaurer 
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LOL @centaurer, now you got my gears turning... personally I have little issue with W10, but have always been intrigued by Linux... looks like it can run Sierrachart lol...

It really is more KDE than linux for me I would say. If you like Windows KDE is just such an upgrade. I literally don't know any Unix commands.

Of course you do give up a bunch of trading software. That is the downside but it is easy enough to dual boot.

My uptime is 28 days right now so I haven't bothered to go into Windows in almost a month. For browsing I would never browse in Windows, that just seems crazy.

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 xplorer 
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From Howtogeek


Quoting 
When you set a connection as “metered,” Windows 10 won’t automatically download updates on it. Windows 10 will automatically set certain types of connections — cellular data connections, for example — as metered. However, you can set any connection like as a metered connection.

So, if you don’t want Windows 10 automatically downloading updates on your home network connection, just set it as a metered connection. Windows 10 will automatically download updates when you connect your device to an unmetered network, or when you set the network it’s connected to as unmetered again. And yes, Windows will remember this setting for each individual network, so you can disconnect from that network and reconnect all you like.

I haven't tried this as I'm not on W10 but I thought it might be useful.

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 bobwest 
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I empathize with anyone who has trouble with W10 updates, and I do know how aggravating unexplained (and unfixed) computer problems are.

Here's why everyone should always make sure they have the most up-to-date version of either Windows or whatever system they are using.

Quick summary: there is a tool called "EternalBlue" that the US National Security Agency developed for spying that somehow got released into the world by a group that apparently didn't approve of NSA. It exploits a problem in Windows that NSA found (and didn't report to Microsoft, since they wanted to use it, not to have Microsoft fix it ) that allows a hacker to break into any Windows computer. A neat trick if you're a bad guy or a spy.

When the tool got out, NSA quietly told Microsoft about the issue and Microsoft fixed the vulnerability that allowed the tool to work. All computers that got the subsequent update are protected.

Once the thing got out into the wild, the bad guys started using it. Right now the city government of Baltimore is all tied up because their computers don't work, and the bad guys are demanding a ransom to untie them. If city government had taken the elementary step of making sure all their computers stayed up to date, they would not have this problem.

It went world-wide in the "WannaCry" attack, which affected entire countries. (Ones where the governments and/or major businesses hadn't bothered to be sure they were updated.)

The main reason I want to take every update is not that I am excited by the idea of Microsoft giving me some great new functionality -- usually they don't. I am excited about getting the latest bug fixes (not everyone realizes that all complex software always has bugs, some of which last for years) and especially the fixes to whatever virus/hacker-related issues that the virus research community has uncovered.

This is not only a Windows problem. Windows has more hackers working on it because more people use Windows -- hackers go where the market is. No operating system, no matter how designed, would withstand the concentrated efforts of the hacker community if there were some money in it (or excitement or challenge or whatever turns them on). Those guys are good. (Even though they are bad .) Some of the hackers work for governments (some for the NSA, for instance....)


Quoting 
The NSA eventually warned Microsoft after learning about EternalBlue’s possible theft, allowing the company to prepare a software patch issued in March 2017,[12] ....Many Windows users had not installed the patches when, two months later on May 12, 2017, the WannaCry ransomware attack used the EternalBlue vulnerability to spread itself.[17][18] The next day, Microsoft released emergency security patches for the unsupported Windows XP, Windows 8, and Windows Server 2003.[19][20]

In February 2018, EternalBlue was ported to all Windows operating systems since Windows 2000 ....

By the end of 2018, millions of systems were still vulnerable to EternalBlue. This has led to millions of dollars in damages due primarily to ransomware worms. Following the massive impact of WannaCry, both NotPetya and BadRabbit caused over $1 billion worth of damages in over 65 countries, using EternalBlue as either an initial compromise vector or as a method of lateral movement. [22]

In May 2019, Baltimore struggled with a cyberattack by digital extortionists using EternalBlue. The attack froze thousands of computers, shut down email and disrupted real estate sales, water bills, health alerts and many other services.

Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EternalBlue

Moral: do the updates.

Bob.

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 cory 
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In the Windows 10 May 2019 Update,
>Cortana will be separated from the search box in the taskbar.
5 stars, I always turn it off any way.

>Microsoft’s native browser will now be Chromium-based.
4 stars, I use chrome not IE so MS has seen the light.

>The Windows 10 May 2019 Update will allow people using Windows 10 Home edition to pause Windows updates
for a set number of days.
1 star, 7 days is not enough

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 bobwest 
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cory View Post
In the Windows 10 May 2019 Update,
>Cortana will be separated from the search box in the taskbar.
5 stars, I always turn it off any way.

>Microsoft’s native browser will now be Chromium-based.
4 stars, I use chrome not IE so MS has seen the light.

>The Windows 10 May 2019 Update will allow people using Windows 10 Home edition to pause Windows updates
for a set number of days.
1 star, 7 days is not enough

Cortana: ignored it from the beginning. I don't care what it does.

Browser: didn't know this, but then I have ignored MS browsers for a long time too.

Updates: I do want the updates. I agree that having control is better; sometimes I can't give the machine over to MS when they want me to.

Bob.

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  #56 (permalink)
Soundkung
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Windows 7 is too old,Windows 10 is too unstable,and Windows 8 is rubbish.
So which version of Windows is the best.

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 kareem40 
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Soundkung View Post
Windows 7 is too old,Windows 10 is too unstable,and Windows 8 is rubbish.
So which version of Windows is the best.

Hi Soundkung,
I have resisted 10 for a long time, but now that I have it, I actually like it. I have not had any issues at all.

Thanks,
K

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 Rrrracer 
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Soundkung View Post
Windows 7 is too old,Windows 10 is too unstable,and Windows 8 is rubbish.
So which version of Windows is the best.

Not sure what you're talking about when you say W10 is unstable. I'm not some uber Microsoft fan but it's been pretty damn reliable for me. W7 was awesome and I actually like it better than 10 but yeah, it's basically deprecated. 8.1 was never... ever... good lol. W10 is a vast improvement. Seems the choice is obvious

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  #59 (permalink)
 matthew28 
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Soundkung View Post
Windows 7 is too old,Windows 10 is too unstable,and Windows 8 is rubbish.
So which version of Windows is the best.

Windows 7 support ends January 2020, you don't like Windows 8 so gets Windows 10. Seems pretty obvious to me.
I have never had any problems with Windows 10, any update issues that were reported never happened to me.
Either that or go and buy a Mac, or run Linux, and then have to buy some Windows emulator software to run the trading software you presumably want to use that in almost all cases will only work on Windows.

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Soundkung
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Windows 7 is the best of them,i can't believe it is over.For Windows 8,i forgot it existed.As for Windows 10,it is hard to beat Windows 7.

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  #61 (permalink)
 Eunluner 
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Will Windows 7 really retire in 2020?

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  #62 (permalink)
 Cloudy 
desert CA
 
Experience: Intermediate
Platform: NT7, SC, ToS
Broker: AMP, DT, TDA
Trading: CL,NQ,YM
 
Posts: 2,135 since Jul 2011
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I can't believe time has flown by. I was used to using Windows 7 when I first started trading. And I'm happy with still using a Windows 8.1 laptop as I can run nt7 fine on it. (Now, Vista, that was a real slog and forgettable win nt) I don't mind too much time standing still or slow with some MS products. Like MS Flight Simulator X lasted a good decade and longer until now the recent announcement trailer of what looks like a true successor since the wrong turn of MSFlight which is all but forgotten.

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  #63 (permalink)
 Big Mike 
Site Administrator
Swing Trader
Data Scientist & DevOps
Manta, Ecuador
 
Experience: Advanced
Platform: Custom solution
Trading: Futures & Crypto
 
Big Mike's Avatar
 
Posts: 50,030 since Jun 2009
Thanks: 32,487 given, 98,346 received

Ugh, Windows 8? Please upgrade to 10 asap.
Cloudy View Post
I can't believe time has flown by. I was used to using Windows 7 when I first started trading. And I'm happy with still using a Windows 8.1 laptop as I can run nt7 fine on it. (Now, Vista, that was a real slog and forgettable win nt) I don't mind too much time standing still or slow with some MS products. Like MS Flight Simulator X lasted a good decade and longer until now the recent announcement trailer of what looks like a true successor since the wrong turn of MSFlight which is all but forgotten.

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SamuelColby
Opole+Poland
 
 
Posts: 5 since Feb 2020
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Windows 7 is retired on my computer,it has been replaced by Windows 10,but i am confused about a problem with Windows 10.How to use Ophcrack on Windows 10 computer?Does it work for Windows 10?

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SamuelColby
Opole+Poland
 
 
Posts: 5 since Feb 2020
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Windows 7 is retired on my computer,it has been replaced by Windows 10,but i am confused about a problem with Windows 10.How to use Ophcrack on Windows 10 computer?Does it work for Windows 10?

Ok,i got what i wanted,i typed" How to use Ophcrack"on Google then i got some solutions.And I found a software that is easier to use than Ophcrack,like the Kon-boot and Cain & Abel.

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futures io Trading Community Off-Topic Tech Support > Lets talk about Windows 7 and 10 and other things.


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