On Thr Feb 17th @ 1:00PM Eastern Time US we will be hosting a webinar presentation about the Sierra Chart trading platform. Velocity Futures offers Sierra Chart for free to its customers, and will give details about that during the presentation. A technical …
Could you give us an update concerning your experience with Sierra Charts? I have done the same as you, a while back, but I am still struggling with SC (not Optimus). I do know, that for me anyways, SC is more stable - just having a hard time finding my way around.
Platform: Sierra Charts, Investor RT, Ninja Trader
Broker: VanKar
Trading: NQ
Posts: 527 since Sep 2009
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I really like SC. It took a couple of days to customize it. I did not like the default fonts and settings; it looked like something out of the 90's. However, I just kept poking around and figured out how to change all the settings. The charts to me look very much like a chart from NT. I have found I am able to customize just about everything, from the font, to a study setting, to anything on the chart. I really like the chart DOM feature and the way you can trade with it.
There have been only 2 issues with SC for me. I miss the analytical part for trades and I had a little trouble getting some symbols into the global symbol list. As to the analytics, it turns out since I have a lifetime license with NT, I can see the real money trades I do on SC when I open NT and thus I can use the NT analytics to look at my trades. For the symbols, I post on the SC support forum the symbols I need and SC support adds them for me.
The SC support has been fantastic. I posted a couple of weeks ago asking about use of SC with Ubuntu (a Linux OS). Based on my question and that of some others, SC is actually considering doing a native version for Linux.
My suggestion to you is to not open NT for a week or so, just play with SC. At the end of the week, you probably will not want to open NT.
Papa15
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Papa15: Thanks for the feedback. I find many similar things about SC that I enjoy over NT. Still getting the hang of it though. I like to trade and not spend a whole lot of time trying to figuring out how to program - it just doesn't feel intuitive to me - YET. I am sure most have no issue.
Which brings up a question: I have access to both a Rithmic and Trading Technologies data feed (for now anyway). When plotting the CL contract (Nymex- so it says) using the Rithmic, the right scale reads ##.## - When using the TT feed for CL (CME - only choice that I have been able to find), the right scale reads ####.# I can't seem to change the right scale in the TT feed to read ##.## Maybe I am asking too much, but I have been attempting to accomplish this for over 2 hours now.
Platform: Sierra Charts, Investor RT, Ninja Trader
Broker: VanKar
Trading: NQ
Posts: 527 since Sep 2009
Thanks: 583 given,
1,245
received
I can get SC to start and log in, but the Rithmic data engine will not start. SC posted last night they will not be doing a Linux version as it is not practical but they are investigating the Rithmic issue.
Papa15
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One thing that bugs the hell out of me is when the chart prints a new bar, the trendlines get messed up and I have to re-draw them. i have no idea why this happens but its just one of those things i hate. I'll have a trendline from days back, and the current high or low isn't in the picture, and when I zoom out it's not drawn right.
Site Administrator Swing Trader Data Scientist & DevOps
Manta, Ecuador
Experience: Advanced
Platform: My own custom solution
Trading: Emini Futures
Posts: 49,792 since Jun 2009
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Question for you TT guys. I trade CL as you know. My charts are fine, I changed the scale/multiplier so it has the proper decimal formatting. But no matter what I try, the DOM never works correctly (the separate DOM window). I can get it to display the price right (99.50 for example) but the price levels above/below are always screwed up, the depth graph won't work right, etc.
Anyone successfully have the volume depth graph + DOM working on CL with proper decimal formatting on TT, and can tell me their settings?
Mike, I don't see the problem you described. But I don't trade CL, not sure what you mean exactly. Please try the attached chartbook. The chartbook includes a 5m chart and a separate DOM.
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I am not sure whether this also affect the comparison of data feed made in another thread. I think it was concluded that TT feed is not good enough for bid/ask volume analysis.
Site Administrator Swing Trader Data Scientist & DevOps
Manta, Ecuador
Experience: Advanced
Platform: My own custom solution
Trading: Emini Futures
Posts: 49,792 since Jun 2009
Thanks: 32,326 given,
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OK, I am probably blind again.
Where exactly is the Sierra Chart reporting tool to show my total PnL for the day? I have two or three trades windows with executions, but no summary PnL. I took a lot of trades tonight with CL exploding, and I took them in SC, can't find the reporting tool, and the Velocity client portal is not refreshing my current PnL.... so I am not sure where I stand, lol.
Nope, the reporting is completely lacking IMO. I read this post and was less than enthusiastic about their response. I took it as lip service and that they didn't feel there was really a problem and so I added my two cents, but then they responded by saying they had plans to upgrade it, so hopefully they do.
For those doing volume studies SC's newest version includes bid/ask diff, bid/ask sum, and bid/ask net diff. at the bottom of the volume bar chart. Great additions. It should be simple to add cumulative differences given what they already provide. It may be more difficult to get them to add COT but hoping that they will add it soon.
All of my time based charts just became corrupt. It just shows a bunch of dashes, the tick charts still work. Tried restarting it, I'm not sure what is wrong.
Obviously, I was posting in case anyone else was having the problem, so they would know they are not the only ones. But thanks for the informative post, I appreciate it.
can somebody please tell me how to make the green and red rectangles in the background of the bid/ask ladder transparent or how to remove them ? I want to add profiles instead for each bar but first the rectangles have to go....
Tried posting a link but the sc image isn't coming up via the link. Anyway go to the sc home page, mouse over main, then user image gallery. Look at the 2nd image down on the right.
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somebody here knows how to remove the order confirmation in SC (see screenshot) ?
I really have to say SC with DTN works extremly well. I love it! The things can be so
easy without endless hours of programming NinjaScript to add the simplest things to your charts...
I currently enter my real trades still with Ninja but also do the same trades in SIM mode with SC to see how it works.
I hope I can remove Ninja as soon as possible...
I made it through all 44 pages and now find myself willing to invest the time on SC, so thank you.
To confirm, brokers Optimus and Velocity offer or include SC at no charge? I'm currently looking for a futures broker to begin this new stage, and would like to minimize my costs during this learning curve. Are there other brokers who provide SC, ideally ones who handle other instruments, besides futures?
I don't recall backtesting being mentioned much in this discussion. Does it not work well, or have short-comings?
I'm seeing this reality in quite a few things actually. Save here to pay there, so I understand. I appreciate you bringing this to my attention. It seems that I'd want the $26 SC package though, #3 I believe it is...
Big Mike, thanks for the confirmation. I've had a tab open for each of these brokers - Velocity and Optimus, trying to figure-out which is "best" for me, and will continue that analysis. Velocity provides it's commissions info, while I cannot find the same for Optimus. RT for the ES is $3.62, and that includes data...
I believe Optimus uses Rithmic and Velocity, TT; at least that is what someone shared earlier. I had read on the SC forum some issues with Rithmic, so maybe I should lean toward Velocity for SC.
Speaking of data, SC accepts the feed from TDA. I've read nothing about this data, maybe for good reason, but does anyone have input on TDA data, particularly for SC?
Velocity offers Sierra package 3 for free, a $26/mo value. One thing that sets Velocity apart is the client portal on their website that gives you access to balances, funds transfer, account settings, and trading stats. Their TT data is as good as Zenfire and commissions are lower, too. They only offer futures trading, however.
I also have a TDAmeritrade account that I access via Sierra. The data seems reliable. I don't trade intraday with it, however, so I don't watch it continually.
TDA now owns Think Or Swim, but you cannot get TOS data in Sierra, if you're thinking of trading futures with them.
aslan, that's great to hear, thank you. To be honest, I was really hoping for a broker that does more than just futures, like MBT as an example, but just don't see it happening... I guess just another broker for stock, options and FOREX.
tomgilb, I appreciate your input. I had a ToS paper account prior to TDA acquiring them, so I was happy about that. I just recently got futures and FOREX account through TDA, which was actually TOS, so good to know I won't get that data. All the more reason to get another broker...
So, between Optimus and Velocity... It would seem it's Rithmic from Optimus vs Velocity's client portal, being the key differentiators between the two?
If I recall correctly, if I were to get SC free via one of these, I will not have the choice to connect to another broker, correct? If true, then I won't be able to trade stocks and options through SC, and that would a deal breaker for me. I would probably still get SC, just source it directly myself, or try find another broker who offers it, but that also does more than futures. There seems to be none though...
Thanks for the link to the backtesting documentation. If you have been using it, have you been happy with the results?
Mike, being respectful of the topic, might you be able to briefly explain your reasoning for seeking-out another broker, even though IB handles it all?
More back on topic... I never realized it, but SC does not handle options, on stock or futures. If wrong, please correct me. It's my understanding that MC does. I actually like ToS quite a bit for options, but it was my hope to have the platform handle all instruments of interest. While I can accept not having one broker do it all, I'd much rather prefer not compromise that thinking with respect to the platform. Geez, this is not easy...
LukeGeniol, that is helpful, thank you. If you use SC to trade options (via TDA), please do share your experiences.
This seems to be another reason to keep TDA... I'm guessing no complex order entry would be possible though, but I clearly need to get this started. If I can make SC work for my options trading, I'd be quite happy.
I'm surprised TDA has not purchased SC yet. Sort of hope they don't...
I don't trade options and i don't know much to help you, anyway i think since SC is not a platform developed to trade options, you have to play with to see if you can customize it thru the tools it offers to see if you can make it works for your purpose.
Take your Pips, go out and Live.
Luke.
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I searched this 45 page thread for the word "portfolio", and got no hits. So maybe I'm not thinking of the right descriptive...
When I have a strategy, I like to backtest it against a basket of stocks / ETF's, one's that I have pre-qualified. I believe this is called portfolio backtesting, by some at least.
Is this currently available with SC? If it is not, are there plans to add such functionality? I also searched the SC forum, albeit somewhat briefly, and didn't find anything on this matter.
This form of backtesting is pretty important to me, so if not available on SC, the decision becomes an easy one.
That said, if SC is the platform for me, I'd most likely be going with Optimus Trading Group. "mattz" reached-out to me and got me squared away with a Rithmic connection to play with. Pretty cool.
From a pricing perspective alone, I was pulling for SC over MC. They each seem very worthy. Someone please tell me SC can backtest a group of stocks. I currently use Prodigio for this task...
Between options not being an integral part of SC and what seems to be no portfolio backtesting, I am at peace with making my decision. This discussion was most helpful and educational. Thank you.
Sierra Chart's Worksheet System For Trading and Worksheet System/Alert are chart studies that use MS Excel compatible worksheets to build auto-trading systems and complex alerts, respectively. The purpose of this thread is to share the difficulties …
I think @aslan and @tomgilb could be more informative than me on this.
In terms of IB, most people say run because their data feed is a POS. While that is true, IB is actually a good execution platform as it does handle all of the instruments, and I can trade multiple accounts from one TWS instance (i.e. regular accounts, ira, roth, wifes account, kids account, etc.). SC has the IB multiple account support in there, but I have not really played with it yet. At the end of the day, I have been happy with IB over the years, but do not use it for day trading or as a feed.
On the options front, I do not use SC for that. It is hard enough to find a single platform for futures, let alone stocks and options. As others have pointed out, SC may support options in some capacity.
each software is good for certain task. back testing TS, option TOS, equities/futures Esignal , future SC or Ninja. This is based on my own experience. You may also want to open accounts with Fidelity, Etrade, TDA and Schwab as they all try to be all thing to all people.
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Trading futures and options involves substantial risk of loss and is not suitable for all investors. Past performance is not necessarily indicative of future results. You may lose more than your initial investment. All posts are opinions and do not claim to be facts. Please conduct your own due diligence. Use only Risk capital when trading Futures.
1 800 771 6748 local 561 367 8686 email support@OptimusFutures.com
1) If you are not trading from different brokers concurrently, you can switch back and forth between brokers in the same instance of SC just by choosing the other broker in the Data/Trade Service Settings. SC remembers your parameters for each. SC also allows multiple instances for no extra charge so you could run 2 or more as needed.
Not sure if the broker-supplied SC will do all of this, but I prefer to have a separate account with SC, even though I could get it for free from Velocity, because I want the ability to ask SC Support for help on SC specific things. If you have the broker-supplied version, it is expected that most of your support for SC is through your broker, and I don't expect my broker to know the inner-workings of Sierra.
2) I have used SC's backtesting primarily for worksheet autotrading systems. It works fine, and you can set the replay speed up to 100,000 times normal. I've not used that speed because my computer video lurches at trying to keep up. Also, there is no way to skip over periods when your autotrading system is disabled, even though you need those sessions times for the indicators you are using. Overall, I'm happy with it.
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I could get free version of SC from Optimus, but I also pay for it myself because I want to know that I can do what I want when I want. I run 2-4 copies of SC depending what I am doing, and have no issues connecting to multiple brokers and feeds. At the end of the day, SC is so cheap its kind of a non issue. If you are starting out, by all means use the free version. Also, I do agree that you might get better SC support if you are a paying user vs a broker user, but that is when the quality of your broker matters.
BTW, all of those SC copies run in less memory and less CPU than POS 7.04.0.0B.2 ever did
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Your bring up good points. While it is nice to save some money getting the platform through a broker, this might not always be desirable. SC is a very appealing option and I must say that I feel good no matter decision I ultimately make here (SC vs MC). As far a support goes, I would think that between the forum here and that of SC's, almost all matters can be addressed, if the broker is ill-equipped to do so. Maybe I'm wrong on that though, but that would be my guess...
Here's a very general example of how I backtest and I'd be curious to know how SC would handle it, if at all. I have a list of about 500 stocks / ETF's that I've qualified as meriting my attention, but only under certain technical conditions, as spelled-out in the strat. So, if we are talking a daily strat, after mkt close, I'll run it against this "portfolio" of symbols to see if there any hits. The strat might be rather basic but could say, identify all that were oversold via RSI below 25, that just crossed above RSI 25, where Chaikin MF has been increasing. Possibly a bullish engulfing candle too... You get the picture. I'd run such a saved strat in the evening to id opportunities for possible stock and / or option responses. I currently do this in Prodigio. It has it's quirky problems though.
Would I be able to do something like this with SC?
I have just replied to MetalTrader under this Sierra Thread and did not want it to be under DDT discussion.
He was specifically addressing the way we quote prices all in on the Rithmic+Sierra discussion.
Trading futures and options involves substantial risk of loss and is not suitable for all investors. Past performance is not necessarily indicative of future results. You may lose more than your initial investment. All posts are opinions and do not claim to be facts. Please conduct your own due diligence. Use only Risk capital when trading Futures.
1 800 771 6748 local 561 367 8686 email support@OptimusFutures.com
I use SC and have no problems with it, and so would support it 100%.
Its cheap, stable, reliable etc;
(my only criticism is that I cannot effectively load equities (for most non USA markets), as its futures and USA focused)
However....as a note on portfolio backtesting....there seem to be very few true portfolio back testing systems available. While some systems claim they can do it, they may just be running through whats is effectively a daily scan and taking all the signals.
A true portfolio system allows you to have rules for which signals to take based on the exisiting portfolio and the days signals as they are given. Otherwise you are never taking into consideration such things as portfolio concentration and correlation issues. You need to be able to have rules for which signals to ignore if the portfolio is full, or which existing positions to replace.
example;
In reality you might have twenty long positions on - lets say your signals tell you to buy another twenty longs. Do you have the cash to do this, do you take them all even though your market exposure doubles? What is your over all exposure? how correlated are you?
For true portfolio testing this needs to be taken into consideration.
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I had not envisioned such a scenario to backtest. I see the value and understand. The backtesting that I want to perform, and currently do in Prodigio, is as described above. It seems that MC can tackle that well, but I seek confirmation...
Conceptually, Prodigio is pretty cool, dragging and dropping indicators, connecting with arrows, including "if" "and" "or" statements and the like and backtesting against a universe of stocks over a year or greater is worthwhile for me. It's a little quirky at times, but has promise (and I think limitations) with no languge for the user to input.
Thanks much! From what I've read, SC is not horsing-around and constantly improving. I have more to read. Thanks again.
Site Administrator Swing Trader Data Scientist & DevOps
Manta, Ecuador
Experience: Advanced
Platform: My own custom solution
Trading: Emini Futures
Posts: 49,792 since Jun 2009
Thanks: 32,326 given,
97,628
received
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