How do you know they are showing live trades? Do they post their DOM?

rubberduck 

I've noticed in the chat room that Gary and Charles are starting to show their live trades, and surprisingly enough they are profitable. But neither of them seem follow the viper rules. If Gary sees the DX go up or down quickly, he takes a 6E/6B trade in the opposite direction, with no regard to the viper line, swings, pivots or support/resistance lines. Charles gets into the trades late and gets out early. But from what they show, both of them are profitable. When Charles marks up the days chart, he shows the ideal entry and exit, unfortunately his live trades are much less profitable. I wonder why Gary says that Charles taught him everything he knows because Gary's live trades are much better than Charles'. A couple more Charles comments...why does he have to talk over Gary? Why does he scream so much? He loves to hear his own voice I suppose. Charles is so condescending too, yelling out, "this is a no brainer, everyone should be in this trade." But it's after the move has happened and he probably missed it too. He also explained why he's always late to the chat room, it's because he doesn't like to trade from 9:30 to 9:45.

Gary shows his chart trader with his live account number in the account box while he's in the trade.

Charles shows his chart after the trade with the text and markers visible with his live account in chart trader.

Anyone trading NT should know that you do not have to show a DOM in order to see a live trade. If you are using Chart Trader you can also see a live trade.

rubberduck 

Gary shows his chart trader with his live account number in the account box while he's in the trade. Charles shows his chart after the trade with the text and markers visible with his live account in chart trader.

How many contracts do they trade? Let me guess: ONE.

Let me remind everyone that you can create a new account group in NinjaTrader and give it any naming convention you want, ie to simulate a naming convention of a real Mirus/Zen, IB etc account, yet it still be sim.

Not at all saying that is what is happening here, I have no clue, have never used these people or been in the room. But I just wanted to make sure you guys knew it is technically possible to do this.

Mike

Big Mike 

Let me remind everyone that you can create a new account group in NinjaTrader and give it any naming convention you want, ie to simulate a naming convention of a real Mirus/Zen, IB etc account, yet it still be sim. Not at all saying that is what is happening here, I have no clue, have never used these people or been in the room. But I just wanted to make sure you guys knew it is technically possible to do this. Mike

Given the horrendous feedback on the marketing tactics of Viper principals by members at the mypivotsdotcom site, I say Charles and Gary are odds-on-favorites to do exactly what Mike pointed out.

I think that, but am not sure, a sim account defaults the chart trade box to dark grey for all naming conventions.

These guys are not trustworthy--they seek your money.

Hello Zoethecus;

I have read all your posts on this subject, and it is obvious that you have a personal vendetta with these people. I have also read the posts on mypivotsdotcom, where I beleive you also star. There are hundreds of companies that are doing the exact same, of which I can name many. It is a free economy, supply and demand, and as long as you have this you have companies offering their services and knowhow and you have people who are prepared to pay for this service.
You have not shown anywhere, that their system is not feasibly tradeable - and here I am not refering to the Autotrader, but the pure Viper System of trading. There are hundreds of people offering Autotrading but that is a totaly different story.
If you yourself are so proficient a trader, I would like to see a months trading journal of your live account to see just how successful you are at trading, and not just blasting others on a personal basis. I would also like you to dismask yourself and instead of hiding behind a psuedo name of Zoethecus, write you full name and address, so that we know who you are. I for instance write here under my full name, not behind any curtain.
Let me make it clear, that I do not know these people, but have enough experience of 40 years in the business, to see when someone attacks others on a non professional basis.
Mikes board is a fantastic achievement for the interaction of ideas, and the flow of information, but I do beleive that you have strayed from this objective.
Please see this as a contructive piece of advice and not a personal attack on yourself.

perryg 

Hello Zoethecus; I have read all your posts on this subject, and it is obvious that you have a personal vendetta with these people. I have also read the posts on mypivotsdotcom, where I believe you also star. There are hundreds of companies that are doing the exact same, of which I can name many. It is a free economy, supply and demand, and as long as you have this you have companies offering their services and knowhow and you have people who are prepared to pay for this service. You have not shown anywhere, that their system is not feasibly tradeable - and here I am not referring to the Autotrader, but the pure Viper System of trading. There are hundreds of people offering Autotrading but that is a totaly different story. If you yourself are so proficient a trader, I would like to see a months trading journal of your live account to see just how successful you are at trading, and not just blasting others on a personal basis. I would also like you to dismask yourself and instead of hiding behind a psuedo name of Zoethecus, write you full name and address, so that we know who you are. I for instance write here under my full name, not behind any curtain. Let me make it clear, that I do not know these people, but have enough experience of 40 years in the business, to see when someone attacks others on a non professional basis. Mikes board is a fantastic achievement for the interaction of ideas, and the flow of information, but I do beleive that you have strayed from this objective. Please see this as a contructive piece of advice and not a personal attack on yourself.

You are entitled to your opinion. And if you want to enrich the Viper owners be my guest. We'll be waiting here to learn about your success or lack thereof.

It is not up to me to prove their indicators are tradeable--that is their burden or anyone else who wants to defend them and can prove their claims. Nothing I say about these people is personal, it is all business and borne out by others who were paying members. In addition, I'm not selling anything and, therefore, have no need to disclose my trading records. Your logic is cockeyed. This is about Viper, not me.

And by the way, there is no "pure Viper system of trading." Viper is a hodgepodge of non-proprietary indicators that are no different than most others that give lagging information for DISCRETIONARY trading. All one has to do is spend 15 minutes in the Viper room to see that.

P.S. Just because there are hundreds of companies who sell pie-in-the-sky dreams to aspiring traders doesn't make it right.

Zoethecus 

You are entitled to your opinion. And if you want to enrich the Viper owners be my guest. We'll be waiting here to learn about your success or lack thereof. It is not up to me to prove their indicators are tradeable--that is their burden or anyone else who wants to defend them and can prove their claims. Nothing I say about these people is personal, it is all business and borne out by others who were paying members. In addition, I'm not selling anything and, therefore, have no need to disclose my trading records. Your logic is cockeyed. This is about Viper, not me. And by the way, there is no "pure Viper system of trading." Viper is a hodgepodge of non-proprietary indicators that are no different than most others that give lagging information for DISCRETIONARY trading. All one has to do is spend 15 minutes in the Viper room to see that. P.S. Just because there are hundreds of companies who sell pie-in-the-sky dreams to aspiring traders doesn't make it right.

All traders use some sort of a system. They can be be made up from different types of indicators (all are a hodgepodge of indicators). On this forum you have many many different systems being offered. You have to explain HOW to use the system with your specific indicators. Even after explaining some traders can work with it and some cannot - thats the name of game, if you have ever traded before. Not all systems work for everybody.
My contention, is that you are vemnonous on a personal level and not on a professional level. Any decent professional would tell you why some system will not work, and explain his reasoning. You just discredit people on a personal level without any backup.

Use you efforts and energy to be constructive and not destructive. I would love to see your system of trading, as I am open to learning from all. Maybe you have something that none of us traders have - why not share it with us !!!!

perryg, good luck with your Viper trading.

If you have success with it, please return here and post your results--you'll probably be the first one--and Charles and Gary will be very pleased.