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AMP Futures and Mirus (NinjaTrader Brokerage as of June 30 2014), which one is better
My opinion is quite the opposite. The bigger and older clearing firm is safer, particularly when removed from the broker. As I think I've made clear, Mirus' reach into client assets held elsewhere is non-existent, so the insinuation made that they could be involved in an MF Global type scam is just plain silly. Frankly, I don't care if Mirus is involved in prop trading as long as they have no ability to put my assets at risk there. It's just irrelevant propaganda spread by amp. Look at the FCM financial data. That's cold hard data that doesn't lie.
Amp as a clearing firm looks like it's run out of somebody's garage. $30 million in client assets is a bad joke, as is $800K in excess liquidity. You think you know what they're doing with your money? I don't see an explicit statement anywhere concerning the issue. Is it in the bank, t-bills, repos, what? Again contrast that with the explicit statement from the front page of the RCG site. If you want to trade your $1k account at amp, be my guest. If you're trading real money, I think you'd be smart to look elsewhere. Bottom line, just doing the math, is with what Amp is listing as client assets under management, they would have at most say 300 clients my size as their complete client base. This isn't a place where well-capitalized traders are trading. They are tiny.
Can you help answer these questions from other members on NexusFi?
Yes. That is precisely what I was referring to. Transparency.
Nothing analogous at amp.
The situation at MF Global was a complete lack of transparency, combined with prop trading and in-house clearing. That gave them the incentive and means to do what they did. At least 2 of those 3 conditions exist at Amp. They say they aren't involved in prop trading, but in reality, who knows...
I don't like AMP either but rafiqtrader has got a point, or rather technical points that makes AMP much better offer than Mirus
"technology: AMP = CQG Mirus = zenfire
speed; i need some help with this one
price: amp is cheaper
margins: same
available markets: amp has more
trading back up : not sure what mirus has - AMP has CQG realtime portal
trade desk: never used"
However you both present an argument about MF Global in a very naive way. If you get the last CEO of their futures division to run AMP or RCG then your money will be gone if he decides to do so. No amount of transparency will save your funds from the swindle. If they can get away with the crime they committed without being even put to the court they will be doing it again and again.
My point is rather simple. With in-house clearing there isn't one additional check before a wire can be sent using your funds to satisfy a corporate obligation. Thus, prop trading at Mirus doesn't worry me. If they cleared their own stuff as Amp does & they did prop trading, very different story. The very ability to carry out an MF Global type theft would be very questionable. For that to happen at Mirus, you'd need two people acting in collusion, one at Mirus, the other at RCG. It's not merely a matter of John calling up Frank & saying, "we need the clients money to save the firm. do the wire.".
Go ahead & use amp. See if I care. Everything I saw as a client & after makes me think they are awful & risky. But hey, what do I know. For 3 months I was running the same trades, same volumes, same instruments and same times at the two brokers. I would suggest to anybody who doesn't accept the results of my experiment, go ahead & reinvent the wheel doing the same with half your account at each. Then decide. You can make these stupid lists about this or that, but until you work them side-by-side, get discourtesy, aggravation, and hypertension at one and angels & harp music at the other, you'll never really know. And look at the FCM financial data on RCG, Dorman, and AMP at the cftc site as well.
I agree that AMP sucks despite some technical points that you discussed. There is a public ignorance about MF Global and their customers probably did not think that could have happened to them - having their money in segregated accounts. 1.6 B is missing and our friend does not know where it went?? Someone had to call someone else to move the money before the public announcement and the call was not about saving the firm. They got their bonuses and the customers went broke. If you feel your funds are safer here but not there - read more about the case and question everything.
Thanks - no need to respond.
I am officially out of there!!! I feel like such a sucker. After i got pissed about them offering to pay new customers $500 credits to transfer in to them, i did a simple google search on all the ninja brokers mention in this forum. all of them cheaper, at least 25 cents cheaper and lower from the very 1st trade. add to it, not on them have inactivity fees.
Mirus-Zenfire - ES $4.22 CL $4.84 and $25 inactivity fee
Optimus-Rithmic- ES $4.00 CL $4.34
Velocity-TT- ES $3.82 CL $4.44
AMP-CQG- ES $3.62 CL $4.24
and for what? Zenfire? the same as rithmic. Zenfire better than TT or CQG. I doubt it...i do not see any professionals talking about zenfire. Zenfire is just another marketing play by mirus...just like the $500 credit to lure newbie traders into over playing for commissions.
Learn from my ignorance, shop around and treat your trading as a real business.
Yes, inactivity fee is ridiculous and hateful even if it's easy to beat at moment, but Zenfire is oriented to ask 40 R/T as a minimum. This will sound very unpopular. If I trade a couple of days in a month I risk to pay this hateful fee. Isn't this an ovetrading encouragement ? I hope that Mirus and Zenfire read this forum ...
