PFGBest Accounts Frozen (PFG scandal big thread) - Reviews of Brokers and Data Feeds | futures io social day trading
futures io futures trading


PFGBest Accounts Frozen (PFG scandal big thread)
Updated: Views / Replies:126,020 / 859
Created: by liquidcci Attachments:82

Welcome to futures io.

(If you already have an account, login at the top of the page)

futures io is the largest futures trading community on the planet, with over 90,000 members. At futures io, our goal has always been and always will be to create a friendly, positive, forward-thinking community where members can openly share and discuss everything the world of trading has to offer. The community is one of the friendliest you will find on any subject, with members going out of their way to help others. Some of the primary differences between futures io and other trading sites revolve around the standards of our community. Those standards include a code of conduct for our members, as well as extremely high standards that govern which partners we do business with, and which products or services we recommend to our members.

At futures io, our focus is on quality education. No hype, gimmicks, or secret sauce. The truth is: trading is hard. To succeed, you need to surround yourself with the right support system, educational content, and trading mentors – all of which you can find on futures io, utilizing our social trading environment.

With futures io, you can find honest trading reviews on brokers, trading rooms, indicator packages, trading strategies, and much more. Our trading review process is highly moderated to ensure that only genuine users are allowed, so you don’t need to worry about fake reviews.

We are fundamentally different than most other trading sites:
  • We are here to help. Just let us know what you need.
  • We work extremely hard to keep things positive in our community.
  • We do not tolerate rude behavior, trolling, or vendors advertising in posts.
  • We firmly believe in and encourage sharing. The holy grail is within you, we can help you find it.
  • We expect our members to participate and become a part of the community. Help yourself by helping others.

You'll need to register in order to view the content of the threads and start contributing to our community.  It's free and simple.

-- Big Mike, Site Administrator

Reply
 82  
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
 

PFGBest Accounts Frozen (PFG scandal big thread)

  #321 (permalink)
Site Administrator
Manta, Ecuador
 
Futures Experience: Advanced
Platform: My own custom solution
Favorite Futures: E-mini ES S&P 500
 
Big Mike's Avatar
 
Posts: 46,238 since Jun 2009
Thanks: 29,350 given, 83,220 received


Big Mike View Post
Just need to email the CFO and get it in writing.

Mike

I have sent an email to the CFO, and if I get a response I will share it here.

Mike

Due to time constraints, please do not PM me if your question can be resolved or answered on the forum.

Need help?
1) Stop changing things. No new indicators, charts, or methods. Be consistent with what is in front of you first.
2) Start a journal and post to it daily with the trades you made to show your strengths and weaknesses.
3) Set goals for yourself to reach daily. Make them about how you trade, not how much money you make.
4) Accept responsibility for your actions. Stop looking elsewhere to explain away poor performance.
5) Where to start as a trader? Watch this webinar and read this thread for hundreds of questions and answers.
6)
Help using the forum? Watch this video to learn general tips on using the site.

If you want
to support our community, become an Elite Member.

Reply With Quote
The following 4 users say Thank You to Big Mike for this post:
 
  #322 (permalink)
 Vendor: www.traderwerks.com 
Taipei Taiwan
 
Futures Experience: Advanced
Platform: NinjaTrader
Broker/Data: Optimus
Favorite Futures: TW
 
Posts: 693 since Jun 2009
Thanks: 440 given, 440 received


Big Mike View Post
Except the title of the page is "Safety of funds for Futures Traders". Just need to email the CFO and get it in writing.

Mike

Yes it does.

I guess I am just too cynical when it comes to brokers.

I hope the email to the CFO can clear this up.

Math. A gateway drug to reality.
Reply With Quote
 
  #323 (permalink)
Elite Member
Houston,Tx
 
Futures Experience: Advanced
Platform: NinjaTrader
Broker/Data: Mirus Futures/Zen-Fire
Favorite Futures: TF
 
ThatManFromTexas's Avatar
 
Posts: 2,302 since Feb 2010
Thanks: 1,208 given, 4,293 received



karoshiman View Post
They talk about "loss of securities and/or cash" and not only "securities". And the margin in your futures account is essentially cash.

They have some further info on this site about safety of funds:

Safety of Funds for Futures Traders | TradeStation

There they state:

Your TradeStation equities accounts are further protected with SIPC insurance. SIPC insures your equities accounts up to $500,000, including $250,000 for cash. Beyond this, TradeStation has arranged for additional protection through Lloyd's of London, insuring all accounts up to an aggregate limit of $300 million.

This together with the statements by the TS reps (whether they understand the situation or not), would make it difficult for them to argue differently in case of a law suit (which hopefully will never happen). They've made their customers believe, that there is protection for futures accounts as well (up to the amount described above).

Though I see the points of TMFT and there might be a risk with Lloyd's as well, my concern is more about the conditions of the excess insurance, i.e. the cases which are covered by this excess insurance (bankruptcy, fraud, etc.?). I've sent them an email 2 days ago and asked about it and got the link above from them. Unfortunately, there they don't answer this question so I've sent them my question again, stating that this question is not answered on that page. See, what they will come up with...

By the way, that "safety of funds" page includes a lot of blah blah about regulation, separate accounts etc. which we know now does not mean anything. But, what I like is the fact that they are not involved in proprietary trading. This is one risk aspect less ...


traderwerks View Post
I read the safety of funds page, and I don't see the same thing you see.

It says "Securities accounts" and "equities accounts".

It seems pretty clear to me that they are not talking about futures accounts. It does not matter if it is cash or not, it is the type of account.

I agrees with @ThatManFromTexas and @djkiwi

The customer service reps can say whatever they want, the courts will go with what is written on the contract you signed when you opened the account.




Securities accounts - Held at TradeStation Securities, Inc.

Brokerage firms are required to follow certain rules that are designed to minimize the chances of financial failure and, more importantly, to protect customer assets if they do fail. For example, the SEC's Rule 15c3-1 — the "Net Capital Rule"— requires brokerage firms lo maintain certain levels of their own liquid assets. The minimum net capital a firm must have on hand depends on its size and business. As of December 31, 2011, TradeStation Securities, Inc. had net capital of approximately $54.7 million, which was approximately $52.2 million in excess of its required net capital of approximately $2.5 million.
In addition, the SEC's Rule 15c3-3 — the "Customer Protection Rule" — requires brokerage firms that have custody of customer assets to keep those assets separate from their own accounts. In other words, customers' cash must be placed in a special, separate "reserve" account; and fully paid customer securities must be kept separate from firm and customer margin securities. As of December 31, 2011, TradeStation Securities, Inc. had approximately $1.02 billion of customer funds reserved and segregated in bank accounts clearly identified as customer funds in accordance with Rule 15c3-3. The amount required to be segregated is computed every week and any shortage needs to be deposited before 10:00 a.m. of the following business day. As an additional safety, TradeStation maintains approximately $10 million in excess of the required amount to be segregated from its own proprietary funds.

Your TradeStation equities accounts are further protected with SIPC insurance. SIPC insures your equities accounts up to $500,000, including $250,000 for cash. Beyond this, TradeStation has arranged for additional protection through Lloyd's of London, insuring all accounts up to an aggregate limit of $300 million. For more information on SIPC coverage, we encourage you to visit the SIPC website.

Everything in the above section refers to equities.

Everything in the below section refers to Futures.


Futures accounts - Held at TradeStation Securities, Inc

TradeStation Securities Inc., as a Futures Commission Merchant (FCM) that carries customer accounts, is subject to the Customer Protection Rule requirements of the Commodity Futures Trading Commission (CFTC) Rules 1.20 and 30.7. These rules state that the company is required to maintain enough cash and cash equivalents in special reserve accounts, and identified as such, to cover at all times the required segregation reserve amounts. The reserve requirement must be calculated daily and filed electronically through the National Futures Association's (NFA) web based WinJammer system. Additionally, the company must also properly segregate these funds from any other proprietary bank account of the company. As of December 31,2011 TradeStation had $451.3 million segregated in accordance with the above CFTC requirements.


Let's hope no Tradestation customer has to find out the hard way

I'm just a simple man trading a simple plan.

My daddy always said, "Every day above ground is a good day!"
Reply With Quote
 
  #324 (permalink)
Trading for Profit
Munich, Germany
 
Futures Experience: Advanced
Platform: TradeStation
Favorite Futures: Equity Index Futures
 
Posts: 285 since Apr 2012
Thanks: 121 given, 116 received


ThatManFromTexas View Post

...


Yes, I am not 100% happy with the phrasing as well as it obviously leaves room for interpretation as one can see from this discussion here.

Mike's idea with the CFO is great.

I've sent the following message to client services and posted this also in the aforementioned TS community thread which I've started over there:

Hi,

Contacted client services and received a link to that website:

Safety of Funds for Futures Traders | TradeStation

However, on that site as well as in the aforementioned paragraph which I've quoted initially from your website regarding Account Security, it is not clearly phrased that "futures accounts" are covered by that excess SIPC insurance as well.

Given the current situation in the futures industry, it should be of high interest for TradeStation's future/futures business, to be clear in this regard or otherwise one can only suspect that futures accounts are not secure at TradeStation.

Hence, I suggest to change such official statement and include a sentence that explicitly states that futures accounts are protected by the excess SIPC insurance, i.e. mention the words "futures account" in that sentence and do not use any wishy-washy phrasing which leave room for interpretation.

Regards,
k

Reply With Quote
 
  #325 (permalink)
Market Wizard
Cleveland Ohio/United States
 
Futures Experience: Advanced
Platform: Tradestation
Broker/Data: various
Favorite Futures: futures
 
Posts: 2,388 since Jul 2012
Thanks: 1,138 given, 4,387 received
Forum Reputation: Legendary


ThatManFromTexas View Post
Securities accounts - Held at TradeStation Securities, Inc.

Brokerage firms are required to follow certain rules that are designed to minimize the chances of financial failure and, more importantly, to protect customer assets if they do fail. For example, the SEC's Rule 15c3-1 — the "Net Capital Rule"— requires brokerage firms lo maintain certain levels of their own liquid assets. The minimum net capital a firm must have on hand depends on its size and business. As of December 31, 2011, TradeStation Securities, Inc. had net capital of approximately $54.7 million, which was approximately $52.2 million in excess of its required net capital of approximately $2.5 million.
In addition, the SEC's Rule 15c3-3 — the "Customer Protection Rule" — requires brokerage firms that have custody of customer assets to keep those assets separate from their own accounts. In other words, customers' cash must be placed in a special, separate "reserve" account; and fully paid customer securities must be kept separate from firm and customer margin securities. As of December 31, 2011, TradeStation Securities, Inc. had approximately $1.02 billion of customer funds reserved and segregated in bank accounts clearly identified as customer funds in accordance with Rule 15c3-3. The amount required to be segregated is computed every week and any shortage needs to be deposited before 10:00 a.m. of the following business day. As an additional safety, TradeStation maintains approximately $10 million in excess of the required amount to be segregated from its own proprietary funds.

Your TradeStation equities accounts are further protected with SIPC insurance. SIPC insures your equities accounts up to $500,000, including $250,000 for cash. Beyond this, TradeStation has arranged for additional protection through Lloyd's of London, insuring all accounts up to an aggregate limit of $300 million. For more information on SIPC coverage, we encourage you to visit the SIPC website.

Everything in the above section refers to equities.

Everything in the below section refers to Futures.


Futures accounts - Held at TradeStation Securities, Inc

TradeStation Securities Inc., as a Futures Commission Merchant (FCM) that carries customer accounts, is subject to the Customer Protection Rule requirements of the Commodity Futures Trading Commission (CFTC) Rules 1.20 and 30.7. These rules state that the company is required to maintain enough cash and cash equivalents in special reserve accounts, and identified as such, to cover at all times the required segregation reserve amounts. The reserve requirement must be calculated daily and filed electronically through the National Futures Association's (NFA) web based WinJammer system. Additionally, the company must also properly segregate these funds from any other proprietary bank account of the company. As of December 31,2011 TradeStation had $451.3 million segregated in accordance with the above CFTC requirements.


Let's hope no Tradestation customer has to find out the hard way


Thanks for the great discussion, everyone.


I wonder what Lloyds of London believe they are insuring?

Tradestation Customer Service and even the CFO (if Mike gets a response) might believe one thing, but as anyone who has ever dealt with an insurance company knows, what a policyholder believes/thinks is never the same as what a policywriter believes/thinks!

Reply With Quote
The following user says Thank You to kevinkdog for this post:
 
  #326 (permalink)
Student Of The Markets
New York
 
Futures Experience: Intermediate
Platform: Sierra Charts, TOS
Favorite Futures: E-mini S&P 500
 
Posts: 753 since Aug 2010
Thanks: 448 given, 433 received


kevinkdog View Post
Thanks for the great discussion, everyone.


I wonder what Lloyds of London believe they are insuring?

Tradestation Customer Service and even the CFO (if Mike gets a response) might believe one thing, but as anyone who has ever dealt with an insurance company knows, what a policyholder believes/thinks is never the same as what a policywriter believes/thinks!

Kevindog is right about that. I worked for John Hancock and Prudential back in the 80's and 90's and you would have no idea how many claims were escalated because of misunderstandings of all types of policies from auto, life and annuities.

Reply With Quote
 
  #327 (permalink)
Trading for Profit
Munich, Germany
 
Futures Experience: Advanced
Platform: TradeStation
Favorite Futures: Equity Index Futures
 
Posts: 285 since Apr 2012
Thanks: 121 given, 116 received


kevinkdog View Post
Thanks for the great discussion, everyone.


I wonder what Lloyds of London believe they are insuring?

Tradestation Customer Service and even the CFO (if Mike gets a response) might believe one thing, but as anyone who has ever dealt with an insurance company knows, what a policyholder believes/thinks is never the same as what a policywriter believes/thinks!


Drat! There is another risk...

Reply With Quote
 
  #328 (permalink)
Elite Member
Houston,Tx
 
Futures Experience: Advanced
Platform: NinjaTrader
Broker/Data: Mirus Futures/Zen-Fire
Favorite Futures: TF
 
ThatManFromTexas's Avatar
 
Posts: 2,302 since Feb 2010
Thanks: 1,208 given, 4,293 received


kevinkdog View Post
Thanks for the great discussion, everyone.


I wonder what Lloyds of London believe they are insuring?

Tradestation Customer Service and even the CFO (if Mike gets a response) might believe one thing, but as anyone who has ever dealt with an insurance company knows, what a policyholder believes/thinks is never the same as what a policywriter believes/thinks!


itrade2win View Post
Kevindog is right about that. I worked for John Hancock and Prudential back in the 80's and 90's and you would have no idea how many claims were escalated because of misunderstandings of all types of policies from auto, life and annuities.


karoshiman View Post
Drat! There is another risk...

Come on guys... you have enough real issues to worry about without inventing stuff ....

As my daddy always said, "No sense borrowing trouble"

I'm just a simple man trading a simple plan.

My daddy always said, "Every day above ground is a good day!"
Reply With Quote
 
  #329 (permalink)
Trading for Profit
Munich, Germany
 
Futures Experience: Advanced
Platform: TradeStation
Favorite Futures: Equity Index Futures
 
Posts: 285 since Apr 2012
Thanks: 121 given, 116 received


ThatManFromTexas View Post
Come on guys... you have enough real issues to worry about without inventing stuff ....

As my daddy always said, "No sense borrowing trouble"


Hey, didn't you come up with the topic, that Lloyd's itself is a risk?

Reply With Quote
 
  #330 (permalink)
Market Wizard
Cleveland Ohio/United States
 
Futures Experience: Advanced
Platform: Tradestation
Broker/Data: various
Favorite Futures: futures
 
Posts: 2,388 since Jul 2012
Thanks: 1,138 given, 4,387 received
Forum Reputation: Legendary



ThatManFromTexas View Post
Come on guys... you have enough real issues to worry about without inventing stuff ....

As my daddy always said, "No sense borrowing trouble"


I'm confused. You brought up 5 issues with the Lloyd's policy in the first place...

Reply With Quote

Reply



futures io > > > > PFGBest Accounts Frozen (PFG scandal big thread)

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search



Upcoming Webinars and Events (4:30PM ET unless noted)

Linda Bradford Raschke: Reading The Tape

Elite only

Adam Grimes: TBA

Elite only

NinjaTrader: TBA

January

Ran Aroussi: TBA

Elite only
     

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Frozen Application Windows aslan Tech Support 21 June 25th, 2015 03:27 PM
Miscellaneous Statistical Analysis (the big thread) trendisyourfriend The Elite Circle 29 July 15th, 2013 01:51 PM
Multicharts with PFGBEST guppy MultiCharts 3 February 27th, 2012 08:57 AM
Great frozen pizza Tundi Off-Topic 6 June 10th, 2011 11:47 PM
FF allows the THREAD STARTER to ignore posters so they can NOT post in their thread. TheRumpledOne Off-Topic 2 September 19th, 2009 01:53 AM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 04:09 PM.

Copyright © 2017 by futures io, s.a., Av Ricardo J. Alfaro, Century Tower, Panama, +507 833-9432, info@futures.io
All information is for educational use only and is not investment advice.
There is a substantial risk of loss in trading commodity futures, stocks, options and foreign exchange products. Past performance is not indicative of future results.
no new posts
Page generated 2017-12-12 in 0.17 seconds with 20 queries on phoenix via your IP 54.163.210.170