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Is MBT dealing or non dealing desk Forex broker?
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Is MBT dealing or non dealing desk Forex broker?

  #1 (permalink)
Trading Apprentice
vilnius
 
Futures Experience: Beginner
Platform: Multicharts
Favorite Futures: forex
 
Posts: 5 since May 2011
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Is MBT dealing or non dealing desk Forex broker?

Hello,
I was one step from opening a live forex account at MB Trading, but after careful reading of their disclosures I am in doubts now. At MBT page they say that they provide Non-Deal Desk Forex Trading. But the Risk Disclosures Statement at the application documents describes forex trading as trading between client (me) and MB Trading:

(1) TRADING IS NOT ON A REGULATED MARKET OR EXCHANGE—YOUR DEALER IS YOUR
TRADING PARTNER WHICH IS A DIRECT CONFLICT OF INTEREST. BEFORE YOU ENGAGE IN
ANY RETAIL FOREIGN EXCHANGE TRADING, YOU SHOULD CONFIRM THE REGISTRATION
STATUS OF YOUR COUNTERPARTY.
The off-exchange foreign currency trading you are entering into is not conducted on an
interbank market, nor is it conducted on a futures exchange subject to regulation as a
designated contract market by the Commodity Futures Trading Commission. The foreign
currency trades you transact are trades with the futures commission merchant or retail
foreign exchange dealer as your counterparty. WHEN YOU SELL, THE DEALER IS THE BUYER.
WHEN YOU BUY, THE DEALER IS THE SELLER. As a result, when you lose money trading, your
dealer is making money on such trades, in addition to any fees, commissions, or spreads the
dealer may charge.


For me that sounds like deal desk trading. Hoe to understand the situation?
Thanks.

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  #2 (permalink)
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  #3 (permalink)
Membership Permanently Revoked
 
Futures Experience: Intermediate
 
Posts: 1,176 since Nov 2009
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all aggregators have dealing desks... just that their book is electronic and so is their order execution, they are the ones quoting you... but realistically, there is still a group of traders sitting there looking at the orders resting on their book and working that book to ensure you get the "best fills" and they make some $$$ while doing it... such is the nature of retail access to FX...


koni View Post
Hello,
I was one step from opening a live forex account at MB Trading, but after careful reading of their disclosures I am in doubts now. At MBT page they say that they provide Non-Deal Desk Forex Trading. But the Risk Disclosures Statement at the application documents describes forex trading as trading between client (me) and MB Trading:

(1) TRADING IS NOT ON A REGULATED MARKET OR EXCHANGE—YOUR DEALER IS YOUR
TRADING PARTNER WHICH IS A DIRECT CONFLICT OF INTEREST. BEFORE YOU ENGAGE IN
ANY RETAIL FOREIGN EXCHANGE TRADING, YOU SHOULD CONFIRM THE REGISTRATION
STATUS OF YOUR COUNTERPARTY.
The off-exchange foreign currency trading you are entering into is not conducted on an
interbank market, nor is it conducted on a futures exchange subject to regulation as a
designated contract market by the Commodity Futures Trading Commission. The foreign
currency trades you transact are trades with the futures commission merchant or retail
foreign exchange dealer as your counterparty. WHEN YOU SELL, THE DEALER IS THE BUYER.
WHEN YOU BUY, THE DEALER IS THE SELLER. As a result, when you lose money trading, your
dealer is making money on such trades, in addition to any fees, commissions, or spreads the
dealer may charge.

For me that sounds like deal desk trading. Hoe to understand the situation?
Thanks.


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  #4 (permalink)
Membership Permanently Revoked
 
Futures Experience: Intermediate
 
Posts: 1,176 since Nov 2009
Thanks: 221 given, 844 received

btw, IMO... MBT has taken some rather strange steps lately that make me personally wonder about them trading quite often against one... for FX I prefer OANDA... and I have been looking at PFGFX (but only because it works with tradevec) ... but I have not done much with it yet..

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  #5 (permalink)
Trading Apprentice
Road Town
 
Futures Experience: Intermediate
Platform: MetaTrader4
Favorite Futures: EUR/USD
 
Posts: 3 since Aug 2011
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forex4you cent ndd

Hi

Regarding no dealing desk. Which broker offers best conditions for NDD? When I was browsing in google I found ads where Forex4you advertising their new cent account with no dealing desk. What do you thin about this account type? Spread from 1 pip, commissions 0.1 USD for lot, minimum lot 0.01 and low starting capital etc.

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  #6 (permalink)
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Feli View Post
Hi

Regarding no dealing desk. Which broker offers best conditions for NDD? When I was browsing in google I found ads where Forex4you advertising their new cent account with no dealing desk. What do you thin about this account type? Spread from 1 pip, commissions 0.1 USD for lot, minimum lot 0.01 and low starting capital etc.

the reality is that everyone has a dealing desk, it just comes down to if they interfere with your orders or not ... but please realize that retail has no true access to Interbank rates...

with that said, OANDA is IMO the best of the bunch out there...

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  #7 (permalink)
Trading Apprentice
Road Town
 
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Favorite Futures: EUR/USD
 
Posts: 3 since Aug 2011
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sysot1t View Post
the reality is that everyone has a dealing desk, it just comes down to if they interfere with your orders or not ... but please realize that retail has no true access to Interbank rates...

with that said, OANDA is IMO the best of the bunch out there...

So then what about STP and ECN? Because NDD brokers are either STP or ECN+STP. Dealing desk can't be ECN or STP!

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  #8 (permalink)
Elite Member
New York, NY
 
Futures Experience: Advanced
Platform: NinjaTrader, Multicharts
Favorite Futures: ES, CL, 6E, Bunds
 
Posts: 125 since Apr 2010
Thanks: 68 given, 108 received

@sysot1t - what do you like so much about Oanda? I've heard great things about them but never used them and am seriously considering them. How is their execution during faster (non news) markets? For example how was your average execution today?

FYI, PFG Best is very shaddy - they are horrible to open with, they show you amazing spreads on demo and give you very wide spreads live and have a very old school broker mentatility in which they feel you should be happy to be with them...

Another broker I can recommend above any broker i've used is ATC - they are basically FXCM AT which is the old Hotspot R but with a 5k min (i think) vs a 50k min (FXCM AT min) (They have some white label agreement which lets them do this). They are a commission broker but the fills are incredible which more than makes up for everything. Even during fast markets. I used them for a while and loved them but hated you couldn't plug Ninja into it. As a result I ended up going with MBT which I am sad to say into my 2nd week (and after dropping cash for Ninja) that I am not happy with them at all. Their execution engine is useless, there were times today my order sat out in the market for 5-10 seconds. Any honest broker would fill you or kill you but not hold you out there for that long and it happened more than a few times this week..

Does anyone have any other suggestions which have Chart Trading abilities?

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  #9 (permalink)
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I didnt trade FX today, I am still on my trades from last week, nothing indicates that I should exit, at least not to me... I am still long EUR/USD and AUD/USD, and short USD/CHF... so my FX trading is really, well... longer term that I dont always have to close a position during market events... I just havent had any issues with them, and I like the fact that I can setup subaccounts to trade each pair that I care about, or even to trade strategies that I am not too sure about that I want to automatically close if something goes against me completely and a stop just doesnt work... things like that make it worthwhile to me... you figure out a strategy, take your position, decide on the risk and just fund that specific account with what is needed plus what you are willing to tolerate and then let it be...

I havent funded the PFGBest account yet, and I dont think I ever will ... I was able to trick their risk management on their demo, so that scared me quite a bit... specially when I was told the rules where the same... so I am not doing anything with them any longer because of that...



philhm View Post
@sysot1t - what do you like so much about Oanda? I've heard great things about them but never used them and am seriously considering them. How is their execution during faster (non news) markets? For example how was your average execution today?

FYI, PFG Best is very shaddy - they are horrible to open with, they show you amazing spreads on demo and give you very wide spreads live and have a very old school broker mentatility in which they feel you should be happy to be with them...

Another broker I can recommend above any broker i've used is ATC - they are basically FXCM AT which is the old Hotspot R but with a 5k min (i think) vs a 50k min (FXCM AT min) (They have some white label agreement which lets them do this). They are a commission broker but the fills are incredible which more than makes up for everything. Even during fast markets. I used them for a while and loved them but hated you couldn't plug Ninja into it. As a result I ended up going with MBT which I am sad to say into my 2nd week (and after dropping cash for Ninja) that I am not happy with them at all. Their execution engine is useless, there were times today my order sat out in the market for 5-10 seconds. Any honest broker would fill you or kill you but not hold you out there for that long and it happened more than a few times this week..

Does anyone have any other suggestions which have Chart Trading abilities?


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  #10 (permalink)
Elite Member
New York, NY
 
Futures Experience: Advanced
Platform: NinjaTrader, Multicharts
Favorite Futures: ES, CL, 6E, Bunds
 
Posts: 125 since Apr 2010
Thanks: 68 given, 108 received


Thanks sysot1t!

I may open a small 1k account with them to see how it executes before making my decision.. Glad to hear all is going well.

And yes stay away from PFGBest.. I can smell their business practices a mile away. I just wish i would have picked up on MBT's prior to funding as well.. but no harm done, just annoying paperwork.

Phil


sysot1t View Post
I didnt trade FX today, I am still on my trades from last week, nothing indicates that I should exit, at least not to me... I am still long EUR/USD and AUD/USD, and short USD/CHF... so my FX trading is really, well... longer term that I dont always have to close a position during market events... I just havent had any issues with them, and I like the fact that I can setup subaccounts to trade each pair that I care about, or even to trade strategies that I am not too sure about that I want to automatically close if something goes against me completely and a stop just doesnt work... things like that make it worthwhile to me... you figure out a strategy, take your position, decide on the risk and just fund that specific account with what is needed plus what you are willing to tolerate and then let it be...

I havent funded the PFGBest account yet, and I dont think I ever will ... I was able to trick their risk management on their demo, so that scared me quite a bit... specially when I was told the rules where the same... so I am not doing anything with them any longer because of that...


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