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average number of trades per day

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  #1 (permalink)
 aquarian1 
Point Roberts, WA, USA
 
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Does someone know the stats for the average number of trades per day an ES trader makes? (Let's us say traders who have survived past the 6 month mark without blowing out their account)?
Thank-you

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  #3 (permalink)
 MetalTrade 
 
 
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I do now between 80 to 100 trades a day, but not only ES.

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 trendisyourfriend 
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I would say 5 to7 trades a day on the ES make sense more than that this is overtrading but it is possible. One thing that makes a difference is your time horizon. I presently work with a 12 ticks/bar interval. This way i avoid the ping pong game that can take place within such a range.

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 Fat Tails 
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MetalTrade View Post
I do now between 80 to 100 trades a day, but not only ES.

But have you survived the last 6 months without blowing your account? That was part of the question.

The answer depends on the trading approach and transaction costs. For most retail traders, more than 10 trades per day is probably overtrading.

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  #6 (permalink)
 Big Mike 
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It will really depend on your method. But I agree with @Fat Tails for the most part, >10 trades per day on a single instrument for most retail traders is overtrading. One single trade could of course be any lot size and have multiple entry and exit points.

I try to be done with my day with 3-4 trades, but sometimes it is 1 and I am happy, sometimes it is 10 and I am still not happy.

Mike

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  #7 (permalink)
 aquarian1 
Point Roberts, WA, USA
 
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Thank-you all for your feedback. I do appreciate it and sharing your individual experience.

This question arose in my mind from the following scenario:

A person had posed that they were unsure of using a trailing stop and that it often cost them a point.
I asked what sort of target they usually had - ans: about 3pts.
(I only trade for a 6 point profit potential - minimum - and I have noticed from chat rooms and forums that many traders are only trying for 1 to 1.5pts for their trading style).

Combined with this,was a quoted stat given at the beginning of a webinar from an instructor that 91.3% of new traders blowout their account in the first 3 months.

Usually you will lose the spread on the entry and exit (0.25 in and 0.25 out) or 0.50 of a point per round trip. When scalpers are looking at a chart and the range in the last 30 minutes is say 3 pts, they are aiming to enter close to the bottom and exit close to the top so 2.5pts of the 3pts. When you realize "the house" is taking 0.50 of the 2.50 "potential" you might see on the chart, or 20%, you have some serious odds against you.

So I Googled on the net trying to find the average number of trades - thinking there might be an industry stat on it -though no luck. (Lots of adds for make $1000 to $5,000 a day traing the ES though! LOL)

So if anyone finds a stat on the net that would be great

--------------------
As a somewhat related question:
If experienced day-traders (more than 2 years of full time trading) were to have a contest (for fun) with the following rules and trading on their sim account:
  • You must post your intended entry price prior to the trade and the stop you are using,
  • You must use a stop which cannot exceed 5pts,
  • You must post your targeted exit once in the trade -(you can a fixed amount if that is your style), They can change their exit from the intended target but they post the change
  • You must post your fills within (60 sec?) e.g "filled on 1 at 1234."
  • You cannot trade more than 3 eminis at any one time,
  • If your drawdown during the contest exceeds $2,500 you are limited to 2 contracts, and if it exceeds $5,000 you are limited to 1 contract - if it exceeds $7,500 you are out.
  • All trades must be opened and closed in RTH (8:30 - 15:15 CT) - if you don't close out your trade you are closed and the closing price for the day.

I wonder what they could achieve on average per day over say a one month contest, in pts per day?

Any thoughts?

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  #8 (permalink)
 anniebee321 
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hi aquarian,

right now i am on sim and i have purposefully decided to "overtrade" ie whenever i see a potential setup i jump in -- the reasoning behind this is that at the end of the day i examine each and every trade to see why it was or was not a good trade - so that hopefully in live conditions i will be able to recognise bad trade from good trade more readily

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  #9 (permalink)
 aquarian1 
Point Roberts, WA, USA
 
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anniebee321 View Post
hi aquarian,

right now i am on sim and i have purposefully decided to "overtrade" ie whenever i see a potential setup i jump in -- the reasoning behind this is that at the end of the day i examine each and every trade to see why it was or was not a good trade - so that hopefully in live conditions i will be able to recognise bad trade from good trade more readily

Hi Anniebee,

Tks for your input. I would interested in finding out how your experiment works out.

How many trades are you taking per day?
Are you entering with limit orders or market orders?
Are you trading 1 contract at a time?
Do you use stops?
Do you set a target - that is do you mentally say to yourself "it's at 1134 I think its going to 1137.5 so I'll sell at 1137.25? If, so do you enter your exit as a limit order right right after getting filled on your entry?
Do you have a written set of setup rules/conditions?

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  #10 (permalink)
 MetalTrade 
 
 
Posts: 1,081 since May 2010



Fat Tails View Post
But have you survived the last 6 months without blowing your account? That was part of the question.

The answer depends on the trading approach and transaction costs. For most retail traders, more than 10 trades per day is probably overtrading.


Yes. I have changed.

I have to say that I talked about TRADED contracts, I trade 3 cars at a time. but on 12 instruments. So that is back to around 2-3 trades a day on 1 instrument.

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  #11 (permalink)
 mattz   is a Vendor
 
 
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This sentence stuck in mind from the movie "Casino":
"In the casino, the cardinal rule is to keep them playing and to keep
them coming back. The longer they play, the more they lose. And, in
the end, we get it all"

Mathematically this is true for us as day traders. We need to quit at some point.
What does this mean for traders? Walk away when you reached your profit goal.
Trade more lots on good setups that worked for you, and don't try to find additional setup...that might not be there.
The more I learn price action, the more I see that 2-3 trades a day could be sufficient for most.

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  #12 (permalink)
 anniebee321 
london
 
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hi,

it varies betwwen 2 to 7 trades a day - all market orders, yes i use stops.
targets are not always easy to define -- am still very much in learning mode
the way i see the markets play out intraday exposing opportunities
one person may see while another may not - so am sure there are a multitude
of plans you can follow which is why it is not easy.......

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  #13 (permalink)
 vinceb 
Buffalo NY
 
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i keep tabs on about 7 instruments and usually have 10 trades on the day. i watch though only between 5 am and 12 noon est. it seems my method works best during that time frame.

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  #14 (permalink)
 cbritton 
Atlanta, Georgia
 
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I average 2-3, but there are days when I put on just 1 trade and there are days that I put on 5. Usually, I find that if I'm putting on a lot of trades, then I'm doing something wrong and I need to back off. Losing focus is never a good thing.

Regards,
-C

“Strategy without tactics is the slowest route to victory. Tactics without strategy is the noise before defeat.” - Sun Tzu
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