Being able to interpret news: humans are very bad at this task, otherwise russian propaganda would never have existed, at least in Europe (in Italy millions of people think the war is staged).

Anyway...

QUestion: What else is required aside from market knowledge, money management, and emotional discipline?

Answer: Luck.

I think even guys like Michael Burry have been very lucky in their speculations, the successful ones occurred before the disastrous ones (e.g. the big short on Tesla).

I have seen many posts of guys who have dedicated 5-10+ years of their lives trading and still are not profitable despite all their efforts.
I guess some would even agree that had they taken some other path towards success they would be in a much better state in life.

What I've heard from other traders is that the '95% of traders' who are not profitable don't have the required technical knowledge, don't have any proper money management rules, and let their emotions get in the way.

I'd say traders who have many years of experience aren't lacking in the knowledge department, would have learned the importance of money management as well after all this time, and after trading for so many years, they probably would have become desensitized to the thrill/fear of making/losing money.

So why aren't these people profitable then? What are they missing? What else is required aside from market knowledge, money management, and emotional discipline?

I have seen many posts of guys who have dedicated 5-10+ years of their lives trading and still are not profitable despite all their efforts.
I guess some would even agree that had they taken some other path towards success they would be in a much better state in life.

What I've heard from other traders is that the '95% of traders' who are not profitable don't have the required technical knowledge, don't have any proper money management rules, and let their emotions get in the way.

I'd say traders who have many years of experience aren't lacking in the knowledge department, would have learned the importance of money management as well after all this time, and after trading for so many years, they probably would have become desensitized to the thrill/fear of making/losing money.

So why aren't these people profitable then? What are they missing? What else is required aside from market knowledge, money management, and emotional discipline?

Is this one of those "asking for a friend", type questions?

My own thoughts from my own struggles:

Practical things: The market can only go up or down, how hard can it be. Then they realise it is very hard but feel they are close to being profitable, unfortunately that feeling of being just 'almost there' can last a very long time.

They focus on trying to cut out losses and get a very high win rate and look for 'Holy Grail' indicators and never find it. They continuously go back to in effect starting again and again by frequently changing everything they do or use. Also purchasing new methods and system to the same effect.

In built psychological traits: Trading is counter intuitive, animals and humans are most comfortable following the pack yet the Buffett quote “Be Fearful When Others Are Greedy and Greedy When Others Are Fearful” can result in much better risk to reward. Instinctive following the herd is frequently chasing momentum and that can produce lots of little profits but quick large losses when price suddenly reverses in a squeeze. But people like high win rates because we don't like being wrong seeing it as a reflection on our own analysis rather than a probabilities game.

We are uncomfortable with uncertainty so wait for lots of confirmation which can result in worse trade location and poor Reward/Risk. Often the best trades are the hardest to take because they are going against current momentum.

People try to cope with their emotions high jacking themselves by telling themselves they need to trade like a machine which is impossible so they can't. They can't beat a machine for being able to follow a rules based system and the only advantage they have over a machine is that they do have emotions.
They might benefit from listening to their empathy and emotions because a lot of other traders will be feeling what they are feeling which means that it can be a window on what the 'competition' is feeling, eg, I strongly want to chase the market higher as it keeps legging up without me, I can barely resist pressing the buy button, a lot of other people are probably doing the same so looking for a short after what looks like their final capitulation flush higher could be a much better trade. Probably better to listen to your emotions rather than trying to suppress them in fear of being caught up in them and acting impulsively.

Traditionally people get jobs that pay them for turning up and doing something. With trading you can turn up and at the end of the day, you're down money and are often angry with how you performed. Paying to be kicked in the b*ll*cks on a regular basis isn't anybody's idea of a dream job which can make it hard to inspire the motivation to work on improving.

The markets can be different every day and results are inconsistent and some days can just be lucky.

Focusing on probabilities, performing well and ignoring the day to day results and concentrating on the long term expectancy. Unfortunately we prefer instant gratification and are not good with waiting for long term results to play out.

So basically I think trading well can be uncomfortable and go against our natural instincts which makes it very hard to do in real time, yet at the end of the day we think it is very clear what we should have done, or what the market was going to do so we try again the next day. Unfortunately that is frequently ingraining the bad habits instead of trying to produce new learning habits and behaviours.

Retail versus professional: And lastly, retail traders are often trading in a vacuum with only online strangers of indeterminate ability and unknown truthfulness for reference.
Professional traders on the other hand have a support system where they can see people being successful using the same equipment and tools that they have which provides motivation. They are expected to behave professionally and work hard at improving with pre-market analysis, extensive post trade journaling of things they did badly and things they did well (from what I have read, I have no first-hand experience). Writing down how they can work to improve or reduce the things that went badly, and also focus on and continue to do the things that work well.
They set goals and measure their results in achieving those goals. It is serious work whereas retail traders can often see it as an easy get rich quick hobby, side gig, part-time job. The ones who succeed are the ones who don't just work hard (often traders who are losing money are working very hard to improve too), but they are systematically working to improve themselves: 1. Identify a trading problem. 2. Develop a solution. 3. Determine how I will implement the solution. 4. Measure the effectiveness of the solution. Repeat.

(A selection of thoughts, probably some more valid than others IMHO)

I have also heard the statistic that 95% of traders loose money. But i am always curious to know? what is considered a trader? Is a trader a person who places a single trade? Or is it a trader that opens a brokerage account?
This is important because if you consider a person who places a single trade a trader, then I suspect the number on unsuccesful traders will be much bigger than 95%.....

Been trading for 10 yrs . And still have a problem with greed. If i make $500 yesterday and i only make $300 i consider that not good. I have a great trade plan but the rest is all mental .

If you can muster the patience to read for 20 minutes, here is a very worthwhile read about the personality traits that make up the core of human beings. It is widely accepted in general psychology, though the link is to a site geared specifically toward traders. If you have ever taken a Myers/Briggs evaluation, that is what this link is about. Everyone should understand their personality type, recognize that there is no right or wrong one, but that certain personality traits are better suited to certain activities. You may find some benefit in finding out what your core is and then pursue a suitable career. It sounds like Medical may be a better fit. There is nothing wrong with that! But, as someone with a degree in Ultrasound technology, healthcare is very labor intensive, even at the technician level. If patience is a problem, medicine may not be the answer.

https://www.vantharp.com/trading/personality-type-and-trading/

Granted, he is also hoping to profit from people interested in trading for a living, but the science of personality traits that his teaching is based on is well-established and peer reviewed.



I'm guessing you've never started your own business? It's not easy. It usually requires working 60-80 hours a week for a couple years, investing and losing tens of thousands of dollars with no guarantee for success or even a salary, and unless you buy a franchise doesn't really come with ready made strategies for you to just start enjoying a lucrative income. Even franchises usually take time to become profitable. Many or most business self-started, fail.

I'm guessing you're in your twenties. If so, I get it. You're frustrated. There are fewer and fewer opportunities than what my generation had. The price of education has soared, even if you're one of the lucky ones to be accepted into a good school. The price of housing and car??? Forget about it. You have to be rich to be 18 years old to stand a chance.

Maybe try starting a youtube channel? You definitely have the requisite qualities of being well spoken and strongly opinioned. Seems to be about all the opportunity available to young adults these days. I don't exactly see people university courses for how to start a youtube channel either, but maybe there is.

Whatever you decide, I wish you the best of luck and much peace.

Seth, no more.

If you did not read my post, read it now.

You made your point. At another time it could be interesting to discuss. But not in this context. Let it go, please.

Bob.